Is this a Grey depicted in shamanic art from an extinct Californian Indian tribe?, page

So, I've developed an interest in shamanism the past couple years and have been slowly adding books on the subject to my library. Awhile ago, I came across one (in a public library's bargain bin - a buck a bag full!) called Shamans, written in 1991 by Wendy Stein, from the Great Mysteries: Opposing Viewpoints series (long out of print, it would seem). It's a short but fun and fairly comprehensive read.

Anyway, there's plenty of artwork featured throughout, but one piece in particular that caught my eye - here's a scan of the image:



Cast thine eyes to the upper right-hand corner. I'm not saying it's an alien, but...well, you know...

All I know about the photo is what it says in the caption, and that it's accredited to a guy named Timothy White, who was apparently the author of a book entitled Shaman's Drum (so I'm assuming he's the one who found the artwork and documented it).

One of the reasons it struck me (aside from its appearance) is that prior to seeing the image, I had read John Mack's Passport to the Cosmos, and three of the "contactees" featured in it are practicing shaman - one from Brazil, one from Africa, and a Native American (so they span the globe). I can't remember the exact details, but all of them describe having encountered what most of us would refer to as Grey alien beings. On multiple occasions, in fact. Some (or all three?) even said that these beings were well known by the rest of their tribe / the indigenous peoples.

I was able to find an interview with John Mack where he mentions the three shaman:

source: www.bibliotecapleyades.net...

VIVIENNE SIMON: You write in depth about three shamans, each from different traditions, and the ways in which they and their communities relate to alien contact.

What have you learned about the phenomenon from their stories?

JOHN MACK: I wrote about three men:

- a Brazilian shaman named Bernardo Peixoto
- Sequoyah Trueblood, who is Native American (below video)
- Credo Mutwa from South Africa

Now, it's interesting that each of these men has had more-than-average contact with Western culture, so they are all eager to communicate about their experiences to the West.

Two of them are, themselves, hybrids in a way; Bernardo and Sequoyah each has a Western/Caucasian parent, along with their other indigenous parent, so they are bridging figures.

Credo was raised in a Catholic school, even though he's a Zulu leader. They all have the advantage of being steeped in native traditions and understanding, and are also able to counter pose that to Western psychology and Western science. So together, we have wrestled with how to understand this.

None of them have any problem with the notion that there can be beings, ancestors, spirits, creatures, entities, animal spirits - you name it - that can manifest, materially, in this world.

That's something the Western mind has no place for. It can't be “proven,” therefore it doesn't exist. Well, for them this phenomenon is not remarkable from that point of view. I've learned from them, that the phenomenon widely exists.

Also, their understanding of it underscores the possibility of this being an interdimensional occurrence of some sort. Take for example, Sequoyah. He has had numerous experiences of spirits showing up in totally visible form. And light beams - kind of like the light beams that other Americans have talked about - which have been guides for him.

YouTube Link

Only once has he had an actual experience in which he recalls being taken up into a craft with the grays involved, but even that's no big deal.

And it hasn't been a big deal for any of the other shamans in this country, and I've talked with quite a few. It is such a big deal for this culture, this emergence from an unseen world into the physical world, this sort of crossing over.

But that is not a remarkable matter to any of the indigenous people that I have talked with.

In fact, the material world as we know it, and the unseen world, the world of spirit, are all one to them. They don't get all excited about the question of “are these spirit beings, or are these literally physical beings?”

That's a big story for us, but they see the gradations and subtleties of that as just commonplace, part of the way they think. Credo is interesting from this point of view, because he talks about these beings, and all sorts of other beings, how they come here and how they cohabitate with humans. And they've known this for years and years.

They rather resent them, but he doesn't fuss over whether anybody can prove that they're literally physically real. Of course they're real, and they happen and it's part of their lives.

In fact, along these tines, he kept urging me:

“Dr. Mack, get those Western scientists to stop quibbling about whether this is real or not. It IS real. Whether it is literally physically real, or it is some other way real, it is real. It's important. They're warning us. They're telling us that the planet is in danger, but it's like we quibble while the planet burns.”

As John Mack mentions, accounts of encounters with spirit animals and/or seemingly other-worldly beings are common within the shamanic community. And from what I gather, it's generally through the ceremonial use of sacramental substances (like tobacco or ayahuasca), rhythmic drumming/chanting, or a combination of both. Even others who have ingested ayahuasca or '___' (the active ingredient in ayahuasca) sometimes report encountering spaceships and/or (in Terence McKenna's words) "self-replicating machine elves." But these encounters don't seem to be occurring under such circumstances.

Despite the nod to Tsoukalos, I'm not trying to sensationalize or claim that OMGZ IT'S AN ALIEN, 100%PROOF!!! I even thought it might be a lizard at first, but since there are clear depictions of lizards I'm not so sure that's the case. I just wanted to post it because it came from this random book and seemed like a new find (unlike the type of artwork featured at io9 today: io9.com...), and to get other people's take on it, if any.

reply to post by deometer

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Considering that the top right has something that looks like a cross between a paramecium and a centipede with a diamondback pattern, and I just know that's supposed to be a rattlesnake? Nah, just a crappy artist, or a style that makes little sense to me.

The native aboriginals of Australia depict these spirits called the 'wadjina'. I've encountered them myself on a trip thru hyperspace, i can't say much more than that asides from that I myself am a shaman. Refer to my username for a hint. As I said, can't discuss further due to the rules here at ATS. Here's a link to some aboriginal art, don't you think they look suprisingly similiar? There are many more images of them. The 'halo' effect around them is what gives it away, I saw them in the exact same manner. They were tall, pure white and had long arms. No feet. Black rings around their eyes and a halo type thing around their head.

Wadjin as

reply to post by YouNeedMt

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Wow, fascinating! Gonna have to read up on them. I see what you're saying with the similarities. Thanks for the info and especially for sharing your experience!

nice blah blah op




Weird that in a torrent i recently got it had this video in it which talks about the very same things you say

shamans and greys and john mack

so cut to the chase say what you want to say about said video and dont present it like you own it

You would probably find 'Supernatural' by Graham Hancock interesting, if you haven't read it. The theory (that I definitely agree with) is that these are interdimensional beings, not 'aliens'. Similar beings were also reported by Rick Strassman in his clinical trials of '___'.

www.guardian.co.uk...

Hancock gathers evidence from other, later rock-artists - notably the San of southern Africa - to show the remarkable similarity between different art over millennia and vast distances. No one knows how long San culture existed before it was wiped out by white settlers - 10,000 years is a reliable estimate - nor how widespread it was. Yet throughout that time, San and related rock art depict the same animal-human forms. Although the neuropsychological theory of altered states of consciousness can account for this continuity, with its basic material "hard wired" into the psyche itself, Lewis-Williams rejects any notion that what prehistoric artists, and more recent rock-artists such as the Native American Coso of California (not to mention modern-day users of hallucinogens), saw in trance states was in any way "real".

Hancock, however, begs to differ. He argues that there is every possibility that the spirit worlds ancient shamans entered, and the beings they encountered there, were "real". These, he says, are "the ancient teachers of mankind". Whether you agree with him or not, Hancock links a wealth of material in this fascinating psychedelic detective story, from Amazonian ayahuasqueros to Francis Crick's theory that life was "seeded" by extraterrestrials (how many people realise he was on '___' when he discovered DNA?).

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