First of all.. There are some on this site who believe that moderators should hold back on topics when they may post in a way that could offend anyone... I am going to RANT here and I want you to know before hand that these are my own thoughts and may NOT speak for any of the staff of abovetopsecret.com.. So if you want to complain.. complain to me here!

And to the mods of this forum... Hey if you want to move this.. warn me or anything .. no problem

I am pissed off... OK!!

I am a parent, I have watched the erosion of the education system in this country now for too many years... In my own ignorance I too believed it would in time fix itself.

Since we are about to vote for a new president of this country we call home... I have to ask... What about EDUCATION?

It is not just education.. It is the future of this nation that is at stake... And rather you believe it or not we are failing our children.

The public education system in the U.S.A. is a joke.. Though there is not one danmed thing funny about it. I have seen High School "grads" who cannot read beyond the 3rd grade level.. In some cases more than 47% of a graduating class!!

Some time ago my own child was suspended from school for arguing with a teacher.. The topic was the 20th century.. The teacher was telling the class that because it was 19__ that it was the 19th century.. My child argued and tried to explain that it was the 20th century.. but was suspended.. In the end I went to the school.. the teacher was removed.. But is this an example of our education system?

Actually it is only a minor thing... The books our children use are in some cases over 14 years old.. There is no time spent teaching.. really ... Don't believe me.. have a child and go to that child's school ... See it for yourselves!

This is bull#.. I don't know any other way to put it.. But it is a shame when we are falling behind the rest of the world in the education of our children.

There are still schools in this area that have no air conditioning... Yet within view the federal prisions are air conditioned... wtf?

Kids don't care.. because there is no motivation for them to do so!.. Teachers are there to preform a task and get through the day... Not to educate.

We can win at war.. we can create a grand economy.. we can claim to be the greatest nation on earth.. But one day it may all mean nothing.

They did a poll among the kids at my daughters school.. the question was what would you like to do after graduation..

Over 44% of the males wanted to be Rap Stars.. Most of the rest wanted to be football players

The Girls .. most of them want to be pop stars.. like 'Britney'

I know a lot of blame can be laid on the parents of these children... However it is not an excuse for the failure of our education system.

WE CAN AND SHOULD DO BETTER... But who gives a damn?

Really there are no secrets... Anyone with even limited skills can find the stats related to our current education system and see for themselves the failure that is, has been and continues... Don't take my word for it... LOOK.. see what you can find on your own.. Look for a long term trend... Go to the schools.. compare it to what you remember from your youth.. Tell me where we have improved.. Show me how we are working to fix these many problems.

George Bush..... John Kerry...... Forget the war.. Forget bashing each other.. take one sane moment and tell this nation what you plan to do the improve the education of our children!

But that will never happen.. Hell most people don't even give a #!

Gazz

PS... Sue me I am human.

[edit on 4-10-2004 by UM_Gazz]

Education/ Health and social security are all important factors in politics. Funny though that those who can afford it can send their kids to be educated privately and the same RICH folk run the country just a thought but i totally agree with you.

[spelling mistook soory poor education]

[edit on 4-10-2004 by Munro_DreadGod]

UM_Gazz...I have never read such a beautiful Rant my friend

I think you, for lack of better words, "hit the nail on the head." Educated children would have a higher probability of not repeating the mistakes of our forefathers, if the education system was reformed somehow. School is about Discipline and following the "rules", and passing standardized tests. Education and the spread of intellectualism are sorely missing from American schooling systems. Children are encouraged to be materialistic, conscious about their image, and to only care about themselves. Children look at school and "work" as boring and a waste of their time, which they hold onto throughout life and continue down a path of intellectual laziness. Learning should be fun and a pleasure to do, but a combination of teachers, parents, administration; and on a somewhat bigger level the national government are not doing their part to ensure future generation don't grow up "dumb".

School money is being placed into sports programs instead of buying needed teaching materials and resources, which leads to teacher apathy in many ways. I, like many others, love sports, but their comes a time when education must be put first. Instead, schools concentrate on the physical attributes of the children and promote rivalries within (ie...those good at sports, and those that are not).

Its sad, very sad indeed. What are we to do about it?

Well...It seems like nothing will be done about it because people care more about their own interests than that of the children. Sorry to sound so pessimistic, but considering the topic, I think its the only way I can look at it!

[edit on 4-10-2004 by Jazzerman]

I have been saying the same thing for quite some time, I have three children, one in High School, one in Middle and one in elementary school. Last year all three of them were learning about the pyramids. With the exception of titles and authors the books were identical. They cover the same subject over and over and barely touch on others, Two of my biggest peeves are the use of calculators (they are mandatory in my school district) The kids don't know how to do the math they just have to punch in the numbers.The other in phonetic spelling, first they teach them to read and spell incorrectly, then they get upset when the kids have a hard time converting to the right way. Teach them right in the first place! Try playing Trivial Pusuit or watch Jeopardy with a high schooler they don't have a clue, the education system is a joke!

I don't know my seven year old is doing some pre algebra. She started learning to read in kindergarten. I don't remember learning to read till sometime in second grade.
I'm afraid that I wont be able to help her with math by the time she's in sixth grade at the rate they are going now. AHHH so how I miss the days of recess but then again thats prob why I wont be able to help her for much longer!

But I hear ya... my wife, she works at Subway (eat fresh), and deals with high school grads who can't count change... and me, in and out of wood working factories for 10 years, have known kids who couldn't read a tape measure. It's all basic math, for god's sake!

Now, not to toot my own horn, but seriously, check out my site link in signature, and look under Education...

one thing id like to say is there are no doors in the bathroom stalls at my school......there is like graffiti like everywhere in the school cept the walls......they move good teachers out of the school and replacing them with new teachers that teach crap mostly things like....what is science?....what is a controlled experiment?....damn im in the 8th grade and i learned that when i was still in elementry school....theyve really got to teach us some real stuff.....im never going to get to a good high school with the rate they are teaching us.........and the tests for the high school is this month.....i seriously blame the government for not funding the education system more.....just look at english schools and compare me with another 8th grader theyd probably know more stuff than i do.....i dont care if im calling myself stupid....i can use myself as an example if thats the only way to get them to teach better....i want to make something out of myself not be a dumb person who work at mcdonalds even if its fun!...and i know exactly how much they make.....

[edit on 4-10-2004 by CookieMonster000]

Yet on one other side, if 80-90% of kids want to be porn... a... rap stars or football players, why do they need any advance education?

And on the other side, if you consider yourself one of those who want to be a genius and acheave lots and lots of things in your life, instead of working in a McDonalds, or if you want it for your children, maybe it would be wiser to take your or your child's education in your own hands???

If you think that school is makeing a moral cripple out of you, why do you go there? If you want to train creative thinking or intuition, then by all means do so, there are ways for that... instead of aksing "oh, why our school does not do it?" !

Why should it?
1. The school or goverments is not interested in haveing too many smart people, sheeps are easier to control.
2. They do not know how to truly make a personality out of one, instead of stuffing his head with some useless info.
3. Most of simple people want to be sheeps - McDonald workers.

Good Luck!

[edit on 6-10-2004 by bratok]

[edit on 7-10-2004 by MacKiller]

An applause to you.

I agree very much with you here. I've only experienced the Australian and Canadian school systems, and what I realised is that the probability of up to date resources sole heartedly depends on the budget of that school and the school board. I've been to some pretty dodgy schools, and some slightly better ones, nothing amazing. So in the end, it's all about the funding... well not really, it's probably about the cirriculum that's being used aswell. The school systems of the world need to be revised, updated, and applied to current times.

Ah the problems with our school system...

I just finished highschool not to long ago and it is true that the schools prepare you for nothing. I didn't have a strong grasp of grammer until I went into college. Which, I might add by the way, is pathetic. The reason why you learn nothing in k-12 schools is due to the simple fact that the dumb everything down to the lowest common denominator. In this I am not kidding. It's that no child lift behind mentallity... not bashing bushes policies... but I would have prefered a winner take all, you have to fight to be the best mentallity. In comparison to the accomplishment of average. There was never any incentive to do better. No one cares so why bother going that extra mile?

And the other thing that bothered me was the censorship of everything.

but in the end it did come down to funding for my school. How are teacgers expected to teach effectivly when their classes are jam-packed and there is no order? The community really let the school down on that one. Everytime they voted down raising taxes to build a very needed high school.

I say cultivate your children at home in addition to school. Expose them to your knowlege from an early age.

This is why my child goes to a private school and I work 2 jobs to send her there (I am definately NOT rich but I have my priorities).

She just started 2nd grade and is already doing "long term projects" like monthly reports on dinosaurs, compiling short essays in French (limited to the vocabulary that is being taught in class) and learning the difference between animal cells and plant cells. She has tons of homework and it creates a lot of work for me to work with her, but at least I know she is getting an education!

I don't believe that the public school system will ever get any better, and I feel it is deliberate. Not meaning to sound like a conspiracy nut, I think back to some books I have read in the past and have to say I agree with what was predicted in them. The Future Shock books by Alvin Toeffler went into a lot of detail concerning the intentional "dumbing down" of the general population in order to create a 2 caste system. 20 years ago I thought the author was nuts, but now I am starting to see it. William Bennett has also written some good books regarding the dumbing down of American Education.

My husband is college professor and frequently laments the fact that his students are not only illiterate, but also incapable of simple reasoning. If they haven't learned something by rote memorization, they are completely lost. He blames the NEA and PC run rampant and thinks it is simply a case of being misguided, but I think it is deliberate. Time will tell which one of us is right, and I am the woman so I am ALWAYS right

Gardenia

[edit on 7-10-2004 by Gardenia]

When a country spends how many billions on guns and 2.50 $ on schools thats exactly what you end up with... morons whos only hope in life is to join the army and create a need for more guns.. it's not pretty.

And then there are the parents who see school as a cheap child care system. You can dump 'em there for 6 to 8 hours a day and they are someone elses problem. Allows parents to avoid all the unpleasent duties of teaching 'em morals and social behaivour, even gets 'em out of the embarrassing questions on where babys come from.

The school system is clearly not about getting people to think or learn, its a little production-worker farm churning out good little worker-robots who obey orders and deadlines.


Edit: oh man that spelling of mine.. and after my rant on education tsk tsk.. {/

AARRGH EVEN SPELLED EDIT WRONG... (throws himself out of the window)

[edit on 7/10/2004 by Corinthas]

As to the "dumbing down" of the school system what do you expect? Its the natural result of the "forced equality" mentlity of the U.S. today. The idea is that if the school lessons are too hard for the dumbest students to learn you make the lessons easier rather than forcing those in the low end of the intelligence spectrum to work harder to catch up, after all its not fair that some children should get worse grades just because they don't happen to be as smart as others is it? Its the same attitude you can see present in the ideas of socialised healthcare, welfare and affimitive action. Rather than recognising that some people are smarter and therfore more worthy of good grades than others, we insure that every child regardless of how stupid can get an A. Just as the recent trend is to insure everyone regardless of qualifications can get a good job. The fact is that while all people are created equal not all people have equal capabillities, some peopl aren't qualified to do anything other than dig graves or collect garbage but if you say it then you are an elitist, or a bigot.

hay I agree with you totaly.

I am also wared about education. I think it important to becouse if you ddon't have a education then you can't get a job or anything else for that matter. I think that there shoud be more attention to education then anything. a good education comes first then a job then a house then your kids and around again like a big circule. If we loss site of that then the circle is brookin then all hell brack loss.

P.S if there is any missplead word please p2p me.

I agree with most everything that has been said. My son is now in first grade (should be in 2cd, but was held back in k). We were advised to hold him back a year because of his lack of "conforming." He had a special way of cutting and shaping his letters, he completed the projects, but because he didn't do it the way everyone else did he was marked down on his grades. Then I was told he had autism, now I'm told it's something else.

The fact of the matter is, there are too many students per classroom, the teacher's themselves need better education and higher pay, not enough focus on individual children and their needs. Not everyone learns the same.

I have been so angry with the school system. Now the school just does what it takes to make me happy (and not because I'm one of those irate parents, I'm been nothing but patient with them). My son had a D in math, I went to talk to the teacher about it, and after that I checked his grades she changed it to an A, just like that. Another thing, substitutes. One day the teacher had inservice and just had random parents come in to teach (my being one of them). People who are not qualified, let alone to know if they are criminals. That's when I had the first hand experience of the daily routine of a teacher. The problem was too many students, not enough time to spend helping them (and I had another parent helping me). I really didn't see how the teacher accomplished what she did, but I did learn why my son had trouble learning and finishing his work. Politicians don't spend enough time focusing on the education system and alot of people are so brainwashed they just "conform" to the ways of the school system (afterall they are the educators, who are we to question them).

We are raising a society of ignorance (not just educationally, but even common sense seems nonexistent). I think that is the overall plan. Someone in an earlier post stated that it was easier to herd the sheep, well put.

Also before I close let me point out another thing that has me angry. The obsession with weight. They weigh all the kids and put them into groups stating wether they are overweight, underweight, or right where they should be. They no longer allow snacks that have sugar in them. Since when did it become the school's job to make sure our kids aren't fat. Isn't that an issue to be addressed at home. Think about the kids who might fall into that "overweight" category, what do you think that does to their self-esteem?! That's about all I'm going to say for now.

to put it simply aimee, things are really f***ed up. school does not in measure your intellegence one bit. it only represents your work ethics, and how well you conform. if you do well in school, then you will do very well complying with a coorupt government in a system designed to test your patients and level of obidience. school is all about how well you follow orders (guiding hand of the illuminati) so when you grow up you can work your way through life in the very government controlled system, where people tell you what to do, and how to act. i myself was far beyond the system, above the system . breezed through middle school, and high school by way of cheating. being smarter then most of my teachers, i would exploit their every mistake. in fact i had the system so completely figured out, i played a gameboy which was neatly concealed next to my book nearly everyday in french class, and got a C+. C+, the perfect grade for the oh so average conforming young man. i worked them good, getting a final GPA of 2.8 with out lifting a finger. now i just learn at an independant level which i believe to be the best way of learning. everyone has a yerning in life, a passion, something so utterly fascinating to them it envolopes their brain! completing all the mundane tasks in school tottaly disregards any sense of indivuality of thought. that is wat i do now, follow what makes my soul content, the things my brain has a true passion for, these thing that are so readily available for me at my fingertips of this here keyboard. philosphy, science, technology, world politics. all learned at my own pace and own level of understanding, with out someone telling me my term paper is due tommarow. i know how to write damn it i dont need a peebrain conforming borg professor telling me what to write!

[edit on 9-10-2004 by sturod84]

I think the major problem with the educational system today is, they took discipline out of school and now the kids believe that since they can't be punished, they don't have to learn.

When things get to a point where the kids believe they don't have to learn and parents sticking by their kids "right" not to learn, it's no wonder that qualified teachers are hard to find. Here's an example of what teachers in this area teaches their pupils.

I was over at a friend of mines house a few months back helping him put some landscaping stone in his yard. There was a thunder cloud coming up and it had thundered a couple of times when he turned to me and asked did I know what produces thunder. I told him that lightening rapidly heats the air around the bolt, and the sound we hear is the shock wave produced by the air rapidly expanding from the super-heated air surrounding the bolt itself.

He laughed and told me that I was wrong and told me his son would tell me how thunder is produced. He called his son out of the house and asked him to explain to me how thunder is produced. His son replied, "Thunder is made when two clouds bump into each other." I asked where did he learn such a thing. He told me his teacher taught them that in class one day.

I stood there amazed that this teacher would even have the qualifications to even teach such non-sense. I told my friend that he needs to go to the school and complain about the ridiculous things this teacher is teaching the students.

It didn't do any good, he believed what the teacher said too, just because she was a teacher and I wasn't. I just shook my head in disbelief and continued working on the yard not bringing it up any more. Everytime I see this guy, I think "two clouds bumping" and wonder if he ever learned any different.

Well, not the teachers fault, they are told what to teach by the state, and if they don't want to be sent to an inner city school where they will be killed, they stick to the plan given to them by the state. Very rarely do you get a teacher that actually teaches his/her own class. I had one, it was the first year it was being done, America At War. He didn't have a plan given to him by the state, so instead of going over the 7 year war, Revolution War, and 1812, like we had been taught for the past 10 years(Never made it past 1812 in any history class) we went straight to the Civil War, for about 4 months, then a month on American-Spanish War, into WWI and WWII. Many people never knew we went to war with Spain. And why would they? They were never taught it in school, for the school plans never let the teachers teach it. But now he has a plan given to him by the state, and what is it you might ask? 7 Year War, Revolution War, 1812. But he made a way around it. 1 week on 7 year, 1 week on Revolution, 2 weeks on 1812. So in one month he can get rid of the state plan. But other then that, not the teachers fault. One teacher started my freshman year, before was in a city school, and since he stayed to the state plan they moved him up to a country school, one where you aren't killed for giving detention.

Anyways, yes, the dumbing down is also a problem. You have one dumbass in class, with 24 geniouses(spelling? lol) and what do they teach? 1+1=2. Sure it is the 11th grade, but that one dumbass means you CAN'T LEAVE HIM BEHIND! Blame Bush, his no kid left behind act makes it hell for the smart kids going over the same # they knew since elementary school but hey, that one dumbass in the 11th grade means everything is dumbed down and they learn nothing new except for what they teach themselves. Of course, it isn't like Bush has funded the No Child Left Behind Act, but still, it hurts the smart ones.

Originally posted by Gardenia
This is why my child goes to a private school and I work 2 jobs to send her there (I am definately NOT rich but I have my priorities).

She just started 2nd grade and is already doing "long term projects" like monthly reports on dinosaurs, compiling short essays in French (limited to the vocabulary that is being taught in class) and learning the difference between animal cells and plant cells. She has tons of homework and it creates a lot of work for me to work with her, but at least I know she is getting an education!

I don't believe that the public school system will ever get any better, and I feel it is deliberate. Not meaning to sound like a conspiracy nut, I think back to some books I have read in the past and have to say I agree with what was predicted in them. The Future Shock books by Alvin Toeffler went into a lot of detail concerning the intentional "dumbing down" of the general population in order to create a 2 caste system. 20 years ago I thought the author was nuts, but now I am starting to see it. William Bennett has also written some good books regarding the dumbing down of American Education.

My husband is college professor and frequently laments the fact that his students are not only illiterate, but also incapable of simple reasoning. If they haven't learned something by rote memorization, they are completely lost. He blames the NEA and PC run rampant and thinks it is simply a case of being misguided, but I think it is deliberate. Time will tell which one of us is right, and I am the woman so I am ALWAYS right

Gardenia

[edit on 7-10-2004 by Gardenia]

i wish i was your daughter or son cuz im a boy

and i have no idea how to move to another school because i am zoned there or whatever