BREAKING: Leaked document reveals new power for multinational corporations, threatens US sovereignty

reply to post by iceofspades


Here's more updates on that leaked document....

gordoncampbell.scoop.co.nz...

Originally posted by Kali74
reply to post by KillerQueen

 

Kind of feels like the earth is shifting under your feet, doesn't it?

I honestly feel like it's 9/11 all over again.

It wasn't the shock of some buildings going down -- it was when I started peaking behind the curtain. Reading about the Lusitania. Finding out that the First Gulf War was no more legitimate than the second.

You tell me if it's worse that a trillion dollar military system that alleges to protect us, doesn't have cameras on their most important building, nor can it stop planes flying around for over an hour in our own country -- when it was designed to repel the entire Soviet Air Force -- of it they stood down and confused NORAD so something to justify another war and the Patriot Act (written well before 9/11) could take place.

Here we are again. Once again we are asked to believe the "trust us" version or the "we intended to do this" version of reality. Ultimately -- does it matter? Can't or won't just means that something is broken. An ignorant person can crash a plane as well as a malicious one. Seems to me that whatever the REASON the wrong person is flying the plane.

9/11 wasn't possible with a system that was actually functioning -- so ignore the worry of proving or disproving "conspiracy" -- it doesn't really matter. That event was stacked on top of a history of False Flags -- maybe this time we didn't cry wolf. Other than the War for Independence and WW II -- I question all military engagements we've been in. And if our military acts as a thug to get a better deal for Multinationals -- anyone with an ounce of curiosity can find out what happens in the 3rd world to people who stand in the way of progress.

This treaty -- as all international treaties -- would supersede US Law. It's basically saying; "America is a 3rd world Banana Republic" to all the multinationals. Of course there won't be any announcement on TV about that -- these are discussions at the closed door G8 summits after all.

>> So after 9/11 I started reading a bit. And I realized we've always been lied to. Not in every way -- just the big lies. Now the military is pushing for the right to push propaganda in our own nation. As confusing as things are now -- in a few years, nobody will have the facts to debate -- they'll just know who they like the least and they'll join a team. You can be sure that the wedge issues will leave about 6 people on one side and a half a dozen on the other and the rest of the people will be too numb to care.

We need a future without Mitt Romney and Barack Obama. Without the Democrats and without the Republicans. There is always going to be a government -- people who think you can have a complex society, roads, schools and power grids without some organization -- whatever you want to call it -- are in denial of history and common sense. And without rules and restrictions, commerce only becomes survival of the most powerful and the devil take the hindmost.

To be honest -- I really don't know what to do. I just feel in shock. I feel like I've learned that my war hero daddy was really a child molester -- that's how I felt after 9/11. And with Obama pushing this treaty (if we can believe the "leak") -- I'm starting to feel like my mom was an accomplice and covering for him.

>> I still have to wake up tomorrow. Try and do the best for my family. Honor the flag at the boy scout meetings. Eat. Sleep. And do it again. But there is no pride or sense of security here. My home is just a nice hotel that I'm occupying for a time.

I mean, it sounds silly and dramatic for just a rumor of a piece of paper being discussed 12,000 miles away. But that's how camels break their backs -- with one straw too many.


>> I'm going to have to chill for a while. Take a break from this. I need to realize that these machinations are nothing new in the world. There are people in Honduras who leave decent lives -- even though they live at the discretion of thugs, right? Life will go on. Times will change. We are just living in those interesting times that people make movies about -- and someone in the audience can't take the tension and says; "get out of the house -- it's gonna blow!"

reply to post by VitriolAndAngst


You're feelings about this aren't undeserved. Just like 9/11, this is an application of what Naomi Klein refers to as the "Shock Doctrine". We've seen it before in places like Bolivia and Argentina; where multinational corporations flood in and privatize essential services, sending utility rates skyrocketing and creating a mass of newly-destitute people.
It doesn't matter if they bombs or bribes, the result is the same. The people are no longer in control and unless they can unite and cast out the usurpers they will remain at the whim and will of outside powers.

I humbly submit that we need to reign in our passions for a moment.

I've read as much of the document as I could - and it seems to me that the first thing that is evident is that this is incomplete, and likely a draft. So it is likely that too much emphasis placed on minutiae might be later looked upon as crazy conspiracy talk once it is massaged in later versions.

Also, it is clear who the architects are.. or at the very least, who the architects are concerned with. As many have conjectured and stated already, this is a framework to serve as a foundation for an edifice which implicitly inches towards the absolution of national sovereignty as an externality of concern to transnational corporate enterprise. As someone has already pointed out, it is a robber baron's delight.

However, I am sensitive tot those of us who feeling this to be only the latest in a string of disappointing developments ushered in enthusiastically by the business interests we elected, or our heroes appointed to serve.

I offer a counter opinion; with no offense intended:

I disagree with the Rand's, the Paul's, and the rest who want us to play by the rules of social engineering, or political theater; I disagree with populist tendencies....

I refuse to allow myself to acquiesce to anthropomorphism when discussing corporations, governments, and institutions.

Such lyrical descriptions of systems and processes serve only to shed responsibility on the part of those gleefully playing along with the tragedy while there is benefit to be had for their own persons or ideals.

Things are not evil... people can be. Things are not corrupt... people can be. Institutions like the government and all her corporate appendages function according to those who lead. They take the form in society that the leadership directs, or allows.

Our problem centers around a new reality... that our leaders are not actually 'leaders' of anything - although they demand and receive the deference and perks associated with the job. The horrible truth is, we don't know who the real leaders are. Therefore they are unaccountable, and we have no venue for redress.... something most constitutions explicitly specify as a social contract between the government and the governed.

There are interests and agendas at work, using our resources, depending on our 'contribution' and demanding our "loyalty" ... only we aren't even aware of what they are.... "trade secrets" you see... the ultimate club-member classification, under which anything can hide; regardless of the gravity of the matter.

It was trade secrets that got us into the longest war in American history, it was trade secrets that spawned the toppling of democratically elected governments - using our national tools to seize the opportunity. It was trade secrets that killed the Shuttle program, determines energy policy, foreign policy, international treaties, and dilutes and subverts the purposes of our diplomats world-wide.

It is NOT the government, it is not the "capitalist doctrine" ... it's not even the politics (shamefully shallow as it is) that makes for the manifestation of evil in our midst... it's people... people who lie, cheat, steal, manipulate, and believe themselves the glorious repositories of 'global wisdom' expecting the 'stupid sheep' to accept their pronouncement as 'true and just' .... except their pronouncements have absolutely NOTHING to do with why our policies and actions take the form they do.

Our real problem has never been one of being incapable of creating process and policies to manage our national affairs... our problem has (since about a century ago) been that the people upon whose shoulder we lay the massively important task are not who they tell us they are, they are not as the 'press' markets them; and the rarely want anything other than for us to see them "looking good." To that end... just look at our nation... we would almost be better off if the election were a random draft....

Just as "Corporations" are NOT people... and therefore are only an illusion by which to deflect liability, the government is not a person either.... attributing personal qualities to it is part of the illusion that keeps us powerless.

S&F and apologies iceofspades! I just stepped on ya this morning with "When it rains it pours".

It's like walking around knowing you're being set up to fail, and not being able to do a damn thing about it. Like Carlin said "It's a big club ... and we ain't in it ..."

This is why I wish people would quit complaining about socialism and realize that the ultimate goal is corporatism.

reply to post by Maxmars


With all due respect I have to disagree Max. What have now are simply the appurtenances and trappings of government, it's but a hollow shell with live people filling the role of statues to render the appearance of what we are accustomed to seeing.

However, corporations and the governments now subsume people to an established order which allows for no dissent or even personal characteristics. The bottom line is: follow the program or you're out.

The American public would cry out if they thought this treaty were an open giveaway to China, which is why China is not a present signatory. But it does allow for other nations to join and that is the back door to give them control.

I believe a hidden aspect is the stabilization of the derivatives bubble which must continue at all costs. This is an attempt to insulate the derivatives market from the natural ebb and flow of so-called "free markets".

Note that Australia refuses to abide by parts of the agreement. You will see no such protest from the American representatives who are being paid to give away the candy store. This is all being done to satisfy Corporate interests and ensure their every whim is attended to. The real power of the treaty is the arbitration process where all disputes will be settled.

You know as well as anyone that vagaries in law are the open gates through which greed and criminal behavior flourish. This treaty will reduce the US to third world status by destroying competition, wages and benefits. It may also be the key to destroying the dollar as the worlds reserve currency. In the rush to remain "competitive" we are opening ourselves up to a literal invasion of foreign interests, cloaked in corporate personhood.

China is already building a city/factory in Idaho. They plan many more like it. This treaty ensures that they will receive access to all raw materials and attendant development of infrastructure - all covered by the domestic laws of the nation under which the corporation is based. Need to build a dam for power? - Screw the farmers and the salmon - it will be built. Displaced homeowners? - take it up with China.

Government is based upon a simple premise; that the people under said government have faith and trust in the institution. That has been our downfall at least since Reagan was President. the American people have been satisfied that government would attend their interests despite occasional instances of corruption and an overbearing emphasis on military might and intelligence agencies.

Our blind trust has allowed the destruction of nearly every right supposedly "guaranteed" by the Constitution. We might be able to freely speak our minds but only if the government decides to allow it. Anyone deemed a danger to their rule can be detained indefinitely without trial, without habeus corpus or even killed on "authority" of the President.

Why would they not allow our Congress to even see this treaty were it not something inherently detrimental to American values and expectations?

No my friend, there is no representative government for the people anymore. Only rule of the banks, by the banks, and for the banks. This treaty is a giant leap forward for corporate feudalism. They have abused our trust every step of the way and only acted to appease the public lest we rise up and end the reign of shadow government.

They pooh-poohed us when we said GATT and NAFTA would take American jobs and destroy domestic industry. Sure, glad that never happened. Yep, this is more crazy conspiratorial delusions alright.

reply to post by iceofspades


This is obviously another step in the great scheme for one world governance. Did you hear that recent one where the government were going to seize control of all the Media in the USA?

So I understand this. IF Apple decides they want their Headquaters in Mexico, they can then go on they new Chinese Tradefree Zone Property in Idaho and circumvent all our Federal Laws?

Am I understanding this correctly?

Originally posted by OrphenFire
This has all the markings of a strategic corporate takeover.

I foresee a future where corporations rule. A cyberpunk dystopia is what's in store for us all. Anon is set up to be a major opponent of corporate tyranny, so it might not be a bad idea to start acquainting yourselves with the art of hacking.

We are living in the cyberpunk dystopian future right now. The technology we use is really stuff that started as stuff we used and advanced in wars and trickles down to consumer level. All the ,smart phones, tablets iphones etc you see are things people in cyber punk universe would love to have since these are like tiny computers in your hand now.

Think of WW II as the example. Would we have jet fighters if we never needed faster planes, to fight in? Would we have cars that drive itself if there was not a need for it (google car) so old people can be picked up like a taxi driver by having the car take them shopping? The internet? This has allowed us to access things much faster. Would we have guns if people didn't think of better ways to fight than the primitive weapons of sword, bow shield?
Nothing wrong with the progress.

Corporations themselves are ok. It's just the idea that there is one set of rules for one group and another set of rules for the other group which is anti-competitive. The corruption is the thing we should be concerned of not the corporations.

The problem is the idea that we the tax payer absorb the risks when certain groups fail, and don't see any profits when they succeed.

The bad guys are the guys that want to privatise the profits (crying to us about how risky it is for them to have made their fortune and that they deserve a reward for hard work and taking risks) but then socialise the losses. (wanting corporate welfare which damages the public).

It's simply Good vs Evil:
-Bad guys do not take responsibility to damage they cause.
-Good guys honor the promise to let themselves fail if they couldn't survive without help from the public or changing laws around due to bad decisions or crap management. (no finger pointing to blame others).

What you have is socialists trying to tell america that "you need to change to soclialism" because they themselves want to get away from responsibility.
And on the other extreme side, the corrupt bad guys (corporations that are greedy or fail when they can't cheat) are saying: "we need new laws that benefit us, but not the public at large. New laws will fix it"

Both of these guys are bad. Both are irresponsible.

Good guys choose to take a loss if they did not succeed. They don't change the laws to benefit themselves. (like trying to use a cheat code in a videogame when times are tough for you) The only time corporations (the ones that are not corrupt) could be bad, is if they have a monopoly on something like food or vital resources which can allow them to kill or starve people (by raising the price of something out of range for the masses) or damage the world through their control over absolutely everything. (too big to not want to split it up)

It doesn't mean we should have cyber anarchy as a solution to that. Just never allow one corporation to have its way for too long and encourage consumers to please support the underdogs for the sake of future generations who will suffer the high prices caused by lack of competion in the market. (you see this in the IT industry where rival software makers can challenge the established brands - people will support non-MS made software if they think it will create competition, drive quality up as a result of avoiding the giant's products and supporting the superior smaller guy who offers better code and better value)

One thing that everyone needs to understand that so long as 'change' is constant it can be used as a weapon by the irresponsible to cheat the honest man. Whether it is the guy on the street who just wants others to pay for everything, or the greedy corporation trying to create laws that are not just and fair (anti competitive).....the change is how the corrupt keep the con going to rape the honest people. They adapt to the change so that whatever change is brought in, they can survie it while others can't survive. (and others not surviving is part of winning)

This is how the globalists cheat the nations of their wealth: Bringing in changes that benefits them in some way that rewards them no matter what system you try to change to (if they are losing they want bailout, if they are winning they want to rape the consumers and workers of value by minimising costs and cutting workers pay while pricing the products high but not increasing the quality, because they can)

If they were loyal to one system they would not try to break or change the system each time. Change is how they keep you losing.

Originally posted by kwakakev
Considering the legal shopping capabilities that multinational corporations have had for quite some time it is good to see some international accountability enter the scene. As for how much resources, objectivity and capability an international tribunal has time will tell. Just because multinational corporations are not subject to National law does not mean they are free from International law. A more common framework and simplification of standards and practice is needed to reign these massive self regulating entities in as they have had to many places and too much complexity to hide in.

I acknowledge the common fears that many posters have, but lets face it these multinationals own your ass. An international approach is needed to hold these bastards down and inject some common sense into them. I agree that it could back fire as even more power is given to these stateless entities, but as a concept it is worth a shot. Hopefully over time it will make a positive difference. The messy and endless legal and complex jurisdictional issues are only having a minor, if any impact.

edit on 14-6-2012 by kwakakev because: grammer

International Law can be unjust too. I don't think many people in australia are happy about carbon taxes which lets be honest is a tax on living, thought up by UN as part of their agenda to reduce the population in their crazy idea that earth can't sustain the human race. Globalists are evil. Period. Nobody wants to be part of an evil empire. As bad as the trade federation in star wars is, and as corrupt as government can be taxing people for things they don't agree with can be, the solution should not be to form a galactic/global empire with the sith lord as leaders. That's where the world is heading. There is more freedom when each nation has control over its own affairs. Fix the problems in all your own countries first. The rich just want to depopulate the world after using and exploiting all the humans and resources of the lands once the slaves' usefulness has expired.

You got to look at this as getting people to stop allowing evil to keep continuing. Not on changing stuff like taking away the basic rights of honest people so that the globalist can solve the problem by killing the people that complain about problems as the solution to the problem. Nobody should have to obey any law that is not just or fair. A fair system is one where no outside control freak can tell others what to do. The intent might be to help but that help should not be from outside source that is not loyal to the people who are being exploited.

You can tell there is evil intent because they have always tried to make these things as secret as possible. This is not the way people want it. It should be open and honest. People should be able to see it and criticise it and have it talked about before any agreement is done. If you don't agree, you only let those who agree with it to be part of it. (for instance with carbon tax only those who think the world is too polluted should pay the tax, and not those who don't see any evidence for it) The collectivist mindset is that everyone is part of a hive mind where the leader tells people what to do and just like bees you do it with no question. People should question the actions of leaders to get to the truth. If people do not care, then they will just get exploited by the con men. It is a self defence to care about freedoms of individuals affected by these laws.

As an example, what if in the future, an international body tells people that we should throw all weapons away and then suddenly an alien invasion happens and results in the death of billion of humans? (ie "war of the worlds" style) Just because something is 'international' does not mean 'fair'. There is a reason people have rights. If you disagree with the way something is run in a free world, you can freely go to a place that is better suited to your way of living. To have one system of doing things is going to be like living in a monarchy.The rulers have the divine right to be there no questions asked. This is bad for human progress. The people who gain by making all these changes are those trying to set up a system of world domination over all people and resources. And then slowly brainwash them all into believing that killing off people and their way of living is good for them using disasters or the threat of an external enemy to kill them off, as excuses to bring in unpopular changes. Some systems are just better than others. If leaders fail to represent the people the people should not pay the bill for anything. If stuff is done in secret ithout public awareness (there can be no secret laws, otherwise how would people be able to obey the laws if they can't see them in order to know how to not break them?) then nobody should care that they even exist, and they should have no power over you.

But the problem is there are still people that think of themselves as part of a hive due to brainwashing and voting for the puppets who just tell them all what they want to hear to get the votes, and not judging them by their actions. I remember how people thought of Obama as the anti-bush. No it is not as simple as that. They are working for the globalist agenda and they are staged to appear as enemies fighting against the bady guy much like the trade federation being use against the republic in star wars. (both have evil infiltrators inside working to unite all the power into one for a galactic dictatorship, ie science fiction version of the NWO. America is the republic, and the fall of the republic into the evil empire in star wars is the 'final solution' to bring 'peace'. UN is benefitting from the stuff like the global carbon tax and brainwashing us all into accepting them as the hero.)

Whether you support the "trade federation" (with its droid army) or "the republic" (mind controlled jedi knights who protect high taxes on people that are trying to make a living in a corrupt world and can only just barely get by) is not important as long as evil exists within both sides in the form of corruption and old fashioned sins like lying and stealing and murder. Fix the root of the problem not the symptoms. It's about morality. Since many of these people are control freaks, (they probably want to play god and see us all as cattle) there is little chance of changing anything until they admit to wrongdoing and people stop following in their example and multiplying the sins by modeling their own behavior off of them.

Originally posted by Germanicus
reply to post by iceofspades

 

It never ends with the American Governments Imperialism does it?

God I wish America would leave the Pacific alone and stop.

What the hell is wrong with them? Our part of the world finally becomes the new power and now the United States muscles in with its military and diplomats. Its sickening.

edit- I doubt anyone will have the guts to make an appeal because if they did, they know that they would go on the United States' # list. And people wonder why so many around the world have a problem with the United States. They even try to screw their 'friends'. This kind of thing is why so many South Koreans hate the United states Government for example..

edit on 13-6-2012 by Germanicus because: (no reason given)

This doesn't seem anything like American Gov't Imperialism to me. This reads as foreign (non-U.S.) Pacific nation-based multinational corporations being gifted with more unfair trade advantages, to benefit the super-rich (many of them U.S. Citizen stakeholders in those corporations) at the expense of the citizens of the United States. What's strange is that it is a Dem pushing a major piece of Rep agenda (aiding in outsourcing for the benefit of corporate masters.) don't get me wrong, both parties do it, but usually the Dems try to be more subtle about raiding U.S. Citizens.

reply to post by Snake Plisskin


You have a nice vision of the world, unfortunately we have the issue of self determination to contend with and how this does manifest in some very unpleasant ways. We all have the choice to lie, cheat, steal, bribe, corrupt, conspire, fight, kill and many other nasty things. Morality is an important part of what makes a person, but due to diversity and hardships it is not always present or only has a limited functioning.

It has been the role of government to help establish and enforce the guidelines of morality, but this too can be subject to the same problems of self determination. Government is also about organisation and is needed on many levels like local, national and international to help set a common standard. Without it we could not trade, move and communicate the way we do as our ability to relate, trust and understand each other is impeded.

Governments and large multinationals have a problem is that there is no one watching the watchers and have continued to extend themselves beyond reasonable limits. With no there to stop them, what will stop them apart from war, disasters and civil revolts. The UN has had many difficult problems to contend with and in time hopefully this will be another success that no longer needs body bags to fix. I do not expect much to happen overnight, but in time and if civilisation does continue to grow, global oversight and accountability of global entities will be one of many important parts.

Yep. Invasion without firing a single shot. Destroy America's bureaucracy and you own it with money. Seems like our elected officials are either dollar hookers or castrated by fear.

Here's one former American past-time that will now serve as China's propoganda slophouse:

edition.cnn.com...

Originally posted by bobs_uruncle

There are no ethics or morals in capitalism, there is only profit. Hence any businessman, it matters not which country they are originally from, will screw over both friend and foe. The only alliances are temporary and based on "how much do I get" at the time. So this is nothing new under the sun, just more blatant and flagrant presentation of reality and the corrupt psychopathic "ruling class."

Cheers - Dave

Obama and his entire administation, at leat most of them, are LEFTWINGERS... That first, second of all Capitalism is not the same as "CORPORATISM", and third of all socialist/communist nations have done worse, no only to their people and nation, but as well as the environment... Just look at China, and at India as examples...

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


So Left he's Right? You can redefine all you like but you are wrong in the end all the same.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse

Originally posted by bobs_uruncle

There are no ethics or morals in capitalism, there is only profit. Hence any businessman, it matters not which country they are originally from, will screw over both friend and foe. The only alliances are temporary and based on "how much do I get" at the time. So this is nothing new under the sun, just more blatant and flagrant presentation of reality and the corrupt psychopathic "ruling class."

Cheers - Dave

Obama and his entire administation, at leat most of them, are LEFTWINGERS... That first, second of all Capitalism is not the same as "CORPORATISM", and third of all socialist/communist nations have done worse, no only to their people and nation, but as well as the environment... Just look at China, and at India as examples...

edit on 18-6-2012 by ElectricUniverse because: (no reason given)

Did you notice that I didn't specify left or right, conservative or liberal, republican or democrat? There is a reason for that, scum comes in all flavors and it is particularly prevalent in the political arena, as in ALL of those @ssclowns. Why is it some people still, after all this time, believe that the **left** is at fault or the **right** screwed it up? Whether you want to call it capitalism or corporatism, means little, the end result is that "we" lose. The problems are global in nature across the entire political spectrum, I don't give flying f**** which way someone leans politically, it's wrong to lean politically in any direction. Both sides are controlled by the same bloody people, choice is an illusion and arguing the alleged virtues or alleged differences of a left/right paradigm is simply retarded.

The politicians are the problem, because they are controlled and paid off by lobbyists controlled by corporations and banks. Politicians have only one interest, getting and staying elected so that can continue to feed on the public trough. There ultimate goal is self-enrichment.

Lobbyists are the problem because they are parasites that trade in favors. They are like mercenaries in the military, they will screw anyone over and take the highest bidder, no ethics whatsoever.

Banks are the problem because they are trying to control everything and transfer all wealth, real or imagined, to their handlers, the Demarais', the Rockefellers, the Rothschilds, the Oppenheimers, etc, etc.....

There are no problems that fall on left or right ideological lines, the problems just are, they exist do to the nature of our political systems which are all seriously flawed.

Cheers - Dave

reply to post by Germanicus


wow, hate the U.S. much?... In fact this would give unlimited power to multinational companies/corporations to do their will IN THE UNITED STATES...

This is why China was allowed to buy the entire AMC theather chain, as well as owning an American bank they purchased recently, as well as other purchases they have made with the Obama administration...

Like some other members and I have said... Welcome to the One World Socialist/Fascist Government "under corporate mandates"...

The entire U.S. administration, including past administrations, and every politician involved in this should be tried for treason...

But of course this won't happen...

Despite much of the world being brainwahsed into hating the U.S., the U.S. was/is the last barrier before the socialists/fascists take complete control of the world...

reply to post by bobs_uruncle


What are you talking about?.. this has nothing to do with "capitaism/free market"... This is every socialist wet dream, just wait and see, socialists/communists everywhere are going to soon enough be cheering for this.

(not sure if you are socialist or not since in your avatar you seem to be implying Canada is socialist, but i am not sure if it is sarcasm or you actually believe it and like it)