Where were you before you were born....?

Originally posted by kat2684
reply to post by Prezbo369

 

That was just one small detail of many, including clothing and surroundings. I'm not trying to be special, or some exception to the rule ( I caught your condescending tone), I just think it was a odd detail. The same scenario played out in my dreams until I was 10, its specifically the only part I remember.

I wasn't even trying to go deep into this topic, but someone claimed I denied any other possibility, which I never claimed too. I had one belief, and all the debunkers want to pounce, the bottom line is, its what I think, and not what I know.

I know where you're coming from!

From as far back as I can remember (and I can remember sitting in my pushchair at around 2yrs old) I had dreams that I couldn't have possibly known, or got from anywhere - I was a small child in the early 1970's, and had a very strict Mother that would never have let me sit up late watching any TV, so even if we had have had the images that are on TV nowadays (which we didn't), I would never have had the opportunity to have seen them, even unconsciously.

As for being special? Are we not ALL special in our own way?

reply to post by GiodanoBruno


I'm glad I clarified that for ya

I'am the wife

reply to post by Nyree


Thanks Nyree,

I know I never saw these things then, and when I was little I remember we only had 19 channels, and Disney was always on. The fish flopping part was the only part that kept reoccuring, I just think for a child of 4 unless I saw it before, would be odd to dream up.

reply to post by kat2684


Being from the UK we only had 3 channels BBC1, BBC2 and ITV - till we got a 4th channel in the late 70's early 80's that only had a handful of programmes on

But the channels we did have at that time, when I got older and started to stay up later, used to go off at a certain time of a night, so there was either a blank screen or a "test card" - with a god awful ear piercing noise till the they started again the next morning!

I remember one time when I was around 3 or 4yrs old - I was in mid air, sort of doing a "swimming" motion, I "swam" towards some built in cupboards I had in my room, and I opened the doors, I noticed my favourite doll was missing, which made me turn to look around the room - as I turned around I could see myself lying in my bed!

It scared me so much, I sort of waved my arms and legs about then I "fell" into myself - and woke up with a bump!

The cupboard doors were still open, and my doll was still gone - the next morning I asked my Mum where my doll was, to which she told me I'd spoiled the surprise, as they'd given it to my Nans friend who was making some new clothes for her!

That incident/experience/dream was so real (to me) it has stayed with me almost 40yrs later, and is as fresh in my mind as it was when it first happened!

This is why I feel these experiences are far more than just dreams - or else we'd remember every single dream with the same detail.

Also a friend of mine had a similar dream/experience at around the age of 6, but she "swam" in mid air up to the top of a very old and very tall wardrobe, she remembered everything that was on top of the wardrobe - including a hair clip belonging to her sister that had gone missing, she told her Mum who climbed up on some step ladders to find it there, along with everything else she'd seen.

So many things have happened during my life, some can be explained with I suppose "rational" explanations - but some can't - some experiences I was alone, but many I was not.

reply to post by Nyree


Sounds like you were doing quite a bit of astral traveling back then. Whats amazing is how your experience was confirmed the following day.I remember as a kid, and into adulthood astral traveling across landscapes just speeding over the air on top of trees.

When I was very young, an infant some of my memories I fully comprehend what was happening, even in my dreams. So its hard for me to think we come here as blank slates, being a child that was relatively new, it would seem that everything should of been difficult, just like crawling and walking.

reply to post by kat2684


Exactly Kat, it's as if we're born with a certain knowledge about certain things that could only have come from somewhere else.

One small and quite unimportant example I can give from my personal experience, was food and ingredients, the UK especially back then was well known for being bland in the food department! And even more so by my Mother, even though by her own admission was not a very good cook, but did all the "cooking" when I was growing up, due to my Dad working etc - food back then in the UK, couldn't have been more unadventurous if it had tried

But even more so where my Mother was concerned, she wouldn't have even looked a mushroom or a bulb of garlic if her life had have depended on it! It was either a plain Sunday roast, sausage and mash, or egg and chips Also we lived in a small village, then a small town - that didn't have fancy restaurants etc. (I know I lead a sheltered life )

I almost felt ungrateful, as I was "bored" by the food that we had the choice of, as I knew I had a taste for something more!

I left home at 16, and got my own place - and even though I'd not been taught anything, I instantly had a knowing about food, I somehow knew that dill would go with eggs or fish - just by smelling it, that rosemary would go with lamb, and I also seemed to know what food I'd not tried before would taste like - I was making my own recipes with ingredients, herbs and spices that people I knew thought was "outragious" - but when they tasted it they thought it was delicious.

How could I have known? Not only was I not brought up around it, let alone taught it- but neither was most of the country!

I've since read that the types of ingredients and food a person can be drawn to, can indicate past lives - the foods I was instantly drawn to indicated a few, one of them being Romany - but who knows? All I know is, it came natural to me.

It's all very fascinating that's for sure!

reply to post by Nyree


LOL, You mentioned dill.

I just made some squash seasoned with fresh dill yesterday, I love it!
You obviously developed your knack for cooking, seasoning and love of spices somewhere. It also makes me wonder why some people are very skilled naturally, or drawn to certain clothing or customs. Besides cooking, are you drawn to Romany culture in general? I often wonder if pastlives can influence differences in our genetics, like why two parents can have children with extremely different looks.

My mother loves England, she would decorate our home very victorian, and paintings with English country sides, and tea sets and all that. My father lived in Spain and Morrocco for work in the 70's, he brought back a beautiful rug and other fancy items . Well there was the big battle, Dads rug ruined my Mothers little English cottage. Now that my Dad passed, my mom has went oveboard.

Some people have odd dislikes, I remember a friend who was American of Irish descent, he hated Ireland, all he did was talk trash, I asked him why one day, he said he never liked Ireland since he could remember. No one had influenced him, he would also die his hair dark (to get out reddish undertones).

My children are very, very intresting too. My daughter would be traumatized by this bridge we used to go over, it had rumble strips and on the tires would make a odd noise. Ever since she was a baby, until about 3 we had to pass over the bridge. My daughter would go hysterical, and she rarely ever cried, but she would freak out over this bridge, once she vomited from being so worked up.

I talked with my mother in law one afternoon, she said my husbands grandfather was in WWI he lost both his legs on a explosion over a bridge. She claimed when he was alive, he would never cross this same bridge, without crying hysterically. Now this bridge has changed since the 60's when he passed, but the similarities are odd.

Another funny coincidence, his grandfather knew my family he lived the house behind my grandmother and aunt. My grandmother knew this man too, she said people would bring him food and that everyone knew what happened to his legs, and that he was scared of the bridge.

I really enjoy these provocative questions. So, first, thanks for this great post Rival.

Regarding this particular part, '....Where did you come from?
Were you something before? Or did you, and your consciousness simply coalesce at this particular time, in this particular place, on this particular little blue ball...in the middle of nowhere?', it is seems generally assumed in modern developments of western Christianity that the spirit is created at the moment of physical conception.
But a historical review of ancient religious texts and interpretations from both the Abrahamic religions of the east (especially Judaism and Islam with some Christian) and even some Native American oral traditions, reveals a common thread pointing to a concept of a premortal existence.
Even in the per-Abrahamic period, pagan religions carried variations of this theme in the mention of the generations of the 'procreating gods', suggesting an existence in some other state prior to one in a material plane.
I also find it rather fascinating that some aspect of this paradigm emerges in the frame of considering extraterrestrial life. That the universe is composed of a cosmic hierarchy from the most primitive life forms to advanced alpha civilizations empowered by a quantum science that gives them command over environmental forces and that they seeded human evolution with genetic manipulation. In this cosmic version, we all exist in various physical and spiritual states within the universal mind or consciousness.

reply to post by kat2684


Yes I am very drawn to the Romany way of life, we have a new TV show here about Romany travelers - I am addicted to it! Also, since leaving home 26yrs ago, this is the longest I've settled (just over 6yrs) - Before living here I had lived in 9 other places up and down the country!

Although I doubt I'd leave here, as I enjoy a more laid back life now this is a small 2 bed cottage in the Yorkshire dales, It's so small we have to use the second bedroom for storage - these little English cottages are not very practical

Although on the upside, we do have lots of gardens where I can grow as many herbs as I want

Your poor Daughter! I can totally relate to her! I said in my first post on here about empty swimming pools that have no water in - I think I'd have a break down if I came close to one, thankfully not many homes here have swimming pools! So to have something that fills her with such fear that is a part of regular life, must be awful!

Makes me wonder though, could your daughter be in some way an incarnation of your Grandfather? Or perhaps she was around in a previous life when he had his accident?

I've just remembered the other thing that has always filled me with an awful feeling - I can't abide anything around my neck, even when I used to have to wear my school uniform, I was always in trouble for undoing my top button on my blouse and taking me tie off! I don't even like the bed cover up to my neck.

I believe though that one day it will all become clear

reply to post by g2v12


Thank you...it is an honor being your first post

I think there is an underlying hierarchy to life that is not apparent to science--something that we have not yet
perceived. In nature there is evolution, growth, an improvement on the past.

Nature seems to favor this meme...

I think it would be likely that metaphysical nature would follow this same meme as well.That consciousness
would somehow grow, that consciousness is a viable and interactive part of the universe, and subject
to the laws of physics that we have perceived so far.

It could be that we do cease to be conscious at death, but what a waste.

Whew...I get so lost trying to communicate things which defy my ability to describe.

Hard science will tell you that your conscious is nothing more than electrical impulses firing off
in your brain. That your mood is controlled by well understood chemical releases, your thoughts
are the products of stimuli, your creative process is the result of conscious or subconscious
information retrieval reorganized into something new, etc...

But what of the curious nature of why consciousness exists. Why, in this brief span of
30 thousands days we call a life, would each of us somehow well-spring a singular self-awareness
from nothing but a few cells of bio-material...The question is bigger than the answer, and its
implications can only lead me to believe that what is apparent about this life span...is not the
complete answer.

As for aliens seeding or manipulating life on this planet, I have long pondered our SUDDEN rise
in intellectual ability. We humans have been around for tens of thousands of years and our recorded
history is woe-fully short.

I've always wondered why I was never taught very much about human origins in school....history yes,
I know useless dates and names of explorers and landing sites and wars, but very little is ever
said about what we know of our origins....because they isn't very much.

The planet has been around for five billion years, life for 3 billion, multi-cellular life for less than that....
and in the space of five thousand years we have gone from worshiping the sun and believing the
earth was flat to visiting the moon. And in just a few more years we will have succeeded in cloning
and manipulating life on a grand scale, perhaps even learning how to turn of the little clock
in each of our cells that restrict our lifetimes....

....Yes, I think an alien or two had their hand in our human cookie jar.....seems obvious to me....

I think there is an underlying hierarchy to life that is not apparent to science--something that we have not yet
perceived. In nature there is evolution, growth, an improvement on the past.

Nature seems to favor this meme...

I think it would be likely that metaphysical nature would follow this same meme as well.That consciousness
would somehow grow, that consciousness is a viable and interactive part of the universe, and subject
to the laws of physics that we have perceived so far.


What you describe reminds me of an ancient teaching, that today is called the Universal Mind (UM). It basically means that our minds are connected with some nondescript cosmic medium that responds to our thoughts, attitudes and so forth, in that it brings to reality our best desires and greatest fears. If you've ever read anything by successful people like Norman Vincent Peal, and many others, they all believed in the UM and taught from it through their lectures and books.

Even the prophets understood this paradigm of how our thoughts are like blue prints that lay the foundation for our individual destinies. They used terms like 'Holy Ghost' (UM) and 'faith' (belief in goals, etc.) to represent how our thoughts are manifest in the material world. There is even a quantum theory that thoughts could have solidity and weight.

Man tends to mystify himself when expressing simple truths through complex esoteric terminologies, such as that of religion with so many variations. I can't explain it, I just know how it works and I learned about it from others.

One of the best books I have ever read concerning this topic is, The Secret by Rhonda Byrd. In it, several successful individuals explain the UM through their own experiences and perceptions. It is a unique glimpse into the eye of procreational theory. For someone like yourself, it would be a great way to fine tune your path of discovery.

Originally posted by kat2684


I talked with my mother in law one afternoon, she said my husbands grandfather was in WWI he lost both his legs on a explosion over a bridge. She claimed when he was alive, he would never cross this same bridge, without crying hysterically. Now this bridge has changed since the 60's when he passed, but the similarities are odd.

Another funny coincidence, his grandfather knew my family he lived the house behind my grandmother and aunt. My grandmother knew this man too, she said people would bring him food and that everyone knew what happened to his legs, and that he was scared of the bridge

Amazing this gentleman lived so close to the warzone in which he lost both his legs.......was he a native to western Europe? was he a local called up to fight who then chose to then live in the same area he lost his legs or was he a regular soldier that just happened to find himself fighting in the area he lived in? or did he choose to live in this area once the war was over?

Nothing about this story makes sense, and whenever a story doesn't make sense, its usually not true........

reply to post by rival


To answer your question the word " where" denotes space. Only physical things can exist in space. Question should have been, were you a physical thing before you were born? The answer could only be no. Material things can never cease to exist. They just change form. The smiple truth is that there is no where you could be before you were born unless you were reincarnated,which I dont subscribe to,or incarnated.regardless we all must have existed in a spiritual state without any knowledge.

Originally posted by Theophorus
reply to post by rival

 

To answer your question the word " where" denotes space. Only physical things can exist in space. Question should have been, were you a physical thing before you were born? The answer could only be no. Material things can never cease to exist. They just change form. The smiple truth is that there is no where you could be before you were born unless you were reincarnated,which I dont subscribe to,or incarnated.regardless we all must have existed in a spiritual state without any knowledge.

What about the existence of the conscious mind prior to birth in a physical body? What about the birth of the conscious mind? We haven't identified the energy or subatomic character of thought. Whose to say that it doesn't exist within its own sphere and is expressed through animate flesh, bone and neurons?

Space could be host to refined energies we haven't discovered. There could be a pre-mortal existence in a two dimensional world of ethereal intelligences.

Originally posted by g2v12

What about the existence of the conscious mind prior to birth in a physical body?

to be conscious of something is to have knowledge of that which we are conscious to.I believe that before birth we have no conscious mind.All knowledge that the mnd aquires is after birth.

What about the birth of the conscious mind?

I believe this happens when we as humans take our first breath.

We haven't identified the energy or subatomic character of thought.

thought is more so related to 'mind' 'spirit' than to 'physical' 'material' man lives in a material world and unless we can develop tools to measure spiritual things we will never prove these things.

Whose to say that it doesn't exist within its own sphere and is expressed through animate flesh, bone and neurons?

this is where it gets tricky.I believe that when spirit and body merge into one it is held together by the soul,which animates a body.

Originally posted by Theophorus

Originally posted by g2v12

What about the existence of the conscious mind prior to birth in a physical body?

to be conscious of something is to have knowledge of that which we are conscious to.I believe that before birth we have no conscious mind.All knowledge that the mnd aquires is after birth.

What about the birth of the conscious mind?

I believe this happens when we as humans take our first breath.

We haven't identified the energy or subatomic character of thought.

thought is more so related to 'mind' 'spirit' than to 'physical' 'material' man lives in a material world and unless we can develop tools to measure spiritual things we will never prove these things.

Whose to say that it doesn't exist within its own sphere and is expressed through animate flesh, bone and neurons?

this is where it gets tricky.I believe that when spirit and body merge into one it is held together by the soul,which animates a body.

edit on 20-6-2012 by Theophorus because: (no reason given)

edit on 20-6-2012 by Theophorus because: (no reason given)

I think we might be saying some of the same things using different languages. I believe in the spirit, which I would also define as an autonomous consciousness, with some understanding of itself and the environment from which it was formed.

And I do believe that our spirits and consciousness existed way before birth, perhaps before the creation of what we would call the physical universe. Somehow, it seems much harder to imagine how the conscious mind of a human being might be suddenly created at the moment of conception. If consciousness were formed millennium before its union with a physical body, then it would allow the mind to develop from another perspective and in preparation for another phase of existence. Certainly living in a physical body is a valuable lesson in patience and an experience unlike anything else.

Perhaps you could share your vision of the force behind the creation of one's consciousness at the moment of conception and why you think it might be that way, as opposed to another.

reply to post by rival

did you, and your consciousness simply coalesce at this particular time, in this particular place, on
this particular little blue ball...in the middle of nowhere?

I don't know. Why not? Creation is an ongoing thing is it not? Creation of suns and galaxies on a grand scale. As well as life on the small microscopic scale and everywhere between, We are born and we die. Bur really there is only change. So from this moment on, I am me. I continue if I want to and I earn the right to.

If you are asking where do all the souls come from that are in 6 or 7 billion people now, why do they have to come from anywhere? Why can't they be made new as needed? And fly off into the void like so many Dandelion seeds?

They could even be planted in other fertile places and grow up to make baby dandelions all over again.

The neatest thing I heard on more than one occasion, was from women who failed to carry their babies to term in vitro. Some swear that later they meet their unborn children in dreams and talk to them. The weird thing is they are adults and have names. So 'splain that.

Mysteries unseen.

I know many other souls came from same planet in Milky Way.