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Israeli, Palestinian negotiators quietly meet

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posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 09:02 AM
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Originally posted by Citybig
I bet you watch the Holocaust footage and get a kick out of it, right? It is beautiful to watch every enemy of Israel collapse as they always do.


This is just as hateful and paranoid on the pro-Israeli side of the fence, as a lot of the anti-Israel statements I see around here are, in that respect.

The problem with this sort of opinion, is that it causes the person to hold it, to assume that their own side is always the victim, and is always inherently right.

So you could watch the Israeli government commit whatever attrocity it wanted to, and you'd be cheering it on; because it's non-Israelis who are dying. Yet if any other country on the planet were to do that to Israel, you'd be talking about the Holocaust happening all over again.

The Holocaust having happened to the Jews, did not give them the moral right to behave in precisely the same manner to anyone else.




posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 09:06 AM
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Originally posted by Peruvianmonk
reply to post by Citybig
 





So, because these entities no longer exist, they are not relevent? However, had these entities not existed in the first place, so-called Palestine may well have been an actual nation. So, I ask you again, why do you not pour scorn on the Turks or the British for their actions? Is it because you simply don't like Jewish people? Is it that you resent the way Jewish people have survived every attempt to wipe them out? Which one is it, because there is no reason other than simple anti-semetism and a hatred for the Jews.


You are such a hateful moron.

I wrote my dissertation on the British mandate in Palestine and am writing my Masters dissertation on violent and non violent resistance in Palestine against the occupation by both the British and the Israelis. What research have you done? The reading of Dershowitz and ADL approved texts?

I debate with my Jewish friends over Israeli actions, most of which they disapprove of. They don't fall for your bull# antisemitic, libelous slurs in regards to criticisms of the Israeli occupation of Palestinian land.
How many Jews do you actually know and who would follow your pointless ideological backing of all Israeli government actions?

I hope you get yourself into a situation one day where you push the antisemitic button one to many times and end up getting sued for defamation, the same defamation you attempt to pour on other well meaning members on this site.





edit on 11-6-2012 by Peruvianmonk because: Spelling


I love the way you call me hateful whilst using such abusive language, stands to reason, Palestine is just another word for hypocrisy. Note please, that I have not used abusive language on this thread, you seem to be very full of hatred.
edit on 11-6-2012 by Citybig because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 09:14 AM
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I'm going to post this question for a third time. It would be nice to get an answer instead of abuse.

Why is it that you never lament and rage over the Turkish Ottoman Empire taking over so-called "Palestine", or the British Empire taking over so-called "Palestine"? Surely you would feel just as angry at these entities taking up residence there, no?



And here is a second question, again, I'd like you to answer it and not simply revert to abusive hate filled language such is the backbone of your misplaced beliefs.

During what period of time has a state called Palestine, inhabited by Palestinians, ever existed as an independent nation state in the Middle East?




posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 09:16 AM
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reply to post by Citybig
 





Don't worry, you can rest assured that Israel will always exist as the Jewish homeland, no matter how much you or your Anti-Semetic Nazi friends try to eradicate it.


Yes no abusive language there at all, just referring to a member as an antisemitic nazi. Labeling you a "hateful moron" seem pretty accurate to me.

Look you can try and deflect from you ignorance all you want. All I can suggest is you do some actual reading from well researched academics on this subject, you may come out the other side a new person.



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 09:18 AM
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reply to post by Citybig
 


Someone did answer you - those empires do not exist anymore. Your response was nonsensical - the Roman Empire doesn't exist anymore either but by applying the logic you used in your response, we should all still have a problem with Italy for conquering us and taking millions of slaves?

However, in answer to your other question, Arabs do not really like Palestinians either (per say). They instead use Palestine as a stick to beat Israel with (deservedly often but not always).



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 09:18 AM
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Originally posted by Peruvianmonk
reply to post by Citybig
 





Don't worry, you can rest assured that Israel will always exist as the Jewish homeland, no matter how much you or your Anti-Semetic Nazi friends try to eradicate it.


Yes no abusive language there at all, just referring to a member as an antisemitic nazi. Labeling you a "hateful moron" seem pretty accurate to me.

Look you can try and deflect from you ignorance all you want. All I can suggest is you do some actual reading from well researched academics on this subject, you may come out the other side a new person.


There are two questions above your post. Answer them.



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 09:29 AM
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Originally posted by Peruvianmonk
Look you can try and deflect from you ignorance all you want. All I can suggest is you do some actual reading from well researched academics on this subject, you may come out the other side a new person.


Is this yet more pro-Paliestinian hypocrisy? I'm not the one deflecting from anything, but all you pro-paliestinian folks seem to be avoiding answering two very, very simple questions.



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 09:43 AM
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Originally posted by petrus4

Originally posted by Citybig
Hopefully the talks will result in the "Palestinians" returning to their actual lands of origin in Syria, Jordan and Egypt and the liberation of the areas stolen from Israel by the Arabs.


You have the distinction of being probably the only pro-Israel poster on this forum.


there's more pro-Israel posters...



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 09:44 AM
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reply to post by Citybig
 


If you like to use the Lie insertion on Palestine, don't get angry when others insert hell to Israhell



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 10:05 AM
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Originally posted by uesvaje
reply to post by Citybig
 


If you like to use the Lie insertion on Palestine, don't get angry when others insert hell to Israhell


The difference being there has never been a "Palestine" or "Palestinians", both of these things are completely fictional entities created by the Arab nations to have a justification for the attempted (failed) and ongoing attempts to destroy Israel, this is not simply rhetoric, but the words of a Mr Zahir Muhsein, a PLO executive committee member:



The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct “Palestinian people” to oppose Zionism


Yasser Arafat is also known to have made numerous statements along these lines.

Palestine does not exist, it was entirely created to have a central maypole from which to promote Anti-Semetism.



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 10:06 AM
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reply to post by uesvaje
 


or "Israeliean" or even "Is are Ill"



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 10:07 AM
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Hope this isn't off topic.. Just... IMO, even if they spilt the land directly in two, opened the borders freely, neither side would be happy still.



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 10:12 AM
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reply to post by CALGARIAN
 


Yeah, but still, there is a side that would be happy even to that. Everyone know which side, it just they dont want to acknowledge it, after all its free land grab.



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 10:15 AM
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reply to post by petrus4
 


1 hopes they find PEACE within CANAAN* please set example for that region.



(Northwest Semitic knaʿn; Phoenician: 𐤊𐤍𐤏𐤍; Biblical Hebrew: כנען / knaʿn; Masoretic: כְּנָעַן / Kənáʿan; Arabic: كنعان‎ / Kan‘ān) is a historical Semitic speaking region roughly corresponding to the Levant (modern-day Israel, Palestinian territories, Lebanon, and the western parts of Jordan and Syria). Canaan was of geopolitical importance in the Late Bronze Age Amarna period as the area where the spheres of interest of the Egyptian, Hittite Empire and Assyrian Empires converged. Canaan is historically attested throughout the 4th millennium BC; the later Amarna Letters use Kinaḫḫu, while sources of the Egyptian New Kingdom mention numerous military campaigns conducted in Ka-na-na.[1] In modern usage, the name is often associated with the Hebrew Bible, where the "Land of Canaan" extends from Lebanon southward to the "Brook of Egypt" and eastward to the Jordan River Valley.

Much of the modern knowledge about Canaan stems from excavation in this area. Canaanite culture apparently developed in situ from the Circum-Arabian Nomadic Pastoral Complex, which in turn developed from a fusion of Near Eastern Harifian hunter gatherers with Pre-Pottery Neolithic B (PPNB) farming cultures, practicing animal domestication, during the 6200 BC climatic crisis.[2] Linguistically, the Canaanite languages form a group within the Northwest Semitic languages; its best-known member today is the Hebrew language, being mostly known from Iron Age epigraphy. Other languages in the Northwest Semitic Canaanite group include; Ugaritic, Amorite, Moabite and Edomite. The various Canaanite nations of the Bronze to Iron Ages are mentioned in the Bible, Mesopotamian (Assyrian and Babylonian), Hittite and Ancient Egyptian texts. The Late Bronze Age state of Ugarit (modern Ras Shamra in Syria) is considered quintessentially Canaanite archaeologically,[3] even though its Ugaritic language does not belong to the Canaanite group proper.


Its understood part of that LAND was promised to Israelite but can the @ factions of the species of sapiens sapiens find a BALANCE. I used to get confused a sa youth wondering WHY if this is NEAR the BIRTHPLACE of the LAMB why is it so WA torn Then I was updated that if infacte this is the region then the BEAST wll have its way with the land and people there. I hope they can go over the past issues and learn to co exist bette rthen now. ANdI sometime think the LAMB LORD JESUS CHRIST is hybrib Israelite,Canaanite.



Promised Land (Hebrew: הארץ המובטחת‎, translit.: Ha'Aretz HaMuvtahat) is a term used to describe the land promised or given by God, according to the Tanakh (the Hebrew Bible), to the Israelites, the descendants of Jacob. The promise is firstly made to Abraham (Genesis 15:18-21) and then renewed to his son Isaac, and to Isaac's son Jacob (Genesis 28:13), Abraham's grandson. The promised land was described in terms of the territory from the River of Egypt to the Euphrates river (Exodus 23:31) and was given to their descendants after the Exodus. (Deuteronomy 1:8)

The term should not be confused with the expression "Land of Israel" which is first used in 1 Samuel 13:19, when the Israelite tribes were already in the Land of Canaan. The term is also used in the Book of Mormon, in which it refers to the American continent.




NAMASTE*******



edit on 6/11/12 by Ophiuchus 13 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 10:45 AM
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Originally posted by Citybig
I love the way you call me hateful whilst using such abusive language


You are hateful. You're not going to believe that, of course, for reasons I've already explained; but the point is that that argument can be made, without needing to resort to abusive or profane language at all.



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 10:49 AM
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Originally posted by Citybig


The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct “Palestinian people” to oppose Zionism


Islamist imperialism vs. Zionist imperialism, in other words. The sad part is that you honestly expect other people to view either alternative as desirable.

Sometimes I wish the rest of the species could just stand back and allow the two of you to embark on a war of mutual extinction, if you are so adamant to do so. The only reason why that cannot be allowed in the case of Israel, is because it is a nuclear power, at this point. It might be considered the most ill-advised act taken in human history, giving the Israeli government nuclear weapons.
edit on 11-6-2012 by petrus4 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 11:16 AM
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reply to post by Ophiuchus 13
 





Its understood part of that LAND was promised to Israelite


Who promised this land and what proof do you have of this? Besides the book that they wrote stating this? If the people who the Jews took this land from were to show up of course the Jews would have the good graces to leave the land seeing how the prior owners have shown up. They have no right to claim any land just because it belonged to them over 1400 yrs ago.



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 11:22 AM
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Originally posted by petrus4

Originally posted by Citybig
I love the way you call me hateful whilst using such abusive language


You are hateful. You're not going to believe that, of course, for reasons I've already explained; but the point is that that argument can be made, without needing to resort to abusive or profane language at all.


Because you pro-PaLIEStine folks are full of love...


Originally posted by ken10
The more people I see defend the indefensible acts committed by Israel, the more I despise it and wish to see it gone.....It is a festering boil on the face of humanity



Originally posted by Peruvianmonk
You are such a hateful moron.


I love the irony in this particular post, clearly being loving involves personal attacks in Peruvianmonk's mind


Originally posted by Peruvianmonk
Look you can try and deflect from you ignorance all you want.


Peruvianmonk is very good at irony, considering I asked him the same simple question 3 times and another very simple question once and he failed to answer or at least attempt to answer, reverting to his favourite tool; abuse.



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 11:41 AM
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reply to post by buster2010
 





How can land be stolen from a country that didn't exist before 1948? This explains why Israel is speeding up the building of settlements. Steal what you can when you can seems to be Israels motto.


Simple and I can explain, though I will probably have my account terminated because I did so.

See, it's simple. You create an anti-defamation league and various lobby groups in various countries, mostly the western nations. You use those as tools to label any and all criticism of Jews, Israel, Israelis, the IDF, anything that in any way connects at all with a Jewish person, "antisemitic" and then go about making that a crime.

Then, as you gradually expand the illegal settlements, you rename the cities, and those that aren't "reconstituted" are razed and a forest is planted in it's place.

then you go about teaching your citizens that those places didn't exist, the country that was divided up to make yours, never really existed.

you are half way there.

Then, you expand the antisemitic label to include anything that would make Israel or an Israeli uncomfortable. So, you call it antisemitic to even infer that the nation of Palestine existed. You make it a crime to investigate the holocaust that was the reason Israel was created in the first place.

Then, since you have set the precedent, you simply refuse to acknowledge the place existed, you wipe it from the maps, and make it an off topic subject, taboo, not to be taught.

Now, since you have made it a crime to talk about that stuff, it disappears from history, and in a few generations, it never existed at all.

i think, i honestly believe, that we are maybe 2 or 3 generations away from having Palestine completely wiped from history and the collective consciousness.



posted on Jun, 11 2012 @ 12:28 PM
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Originally posted by Citybig
Hopefully the talks will result in the "Palestinians" returning to their actual lands of origin in Syria, Jordan and Egypt and the liberation of the areas stolen from Israel by the Arabs.


I'm a big supporter of the rights of Israel to exist but this kind of talk is not helpful at all. A lasting peace will involve a 2 State solution. Just as there is no way Israel packs up and moves out of the Middle East, there's no way the Palestinians move out of the West Bank and Gaza. Both sides will have to learn to peacefully coexist with each other or one side will have to totally kill off the other. You tell me what option you prefer?



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