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you say( I don't believe your introduction)
I posted references
mil docs at that
just for starters smartboy:
but you already know all this you are an xpert
Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin
In the case of Anwar Al-Awaki for example, the justification for this killing is that it was an act of self defence, which does not constitute assassination. It is an extension to the same morality that justifies a police officer shooting an armed and dangerous criminal who is going to kill innocent civilians. This comparison can be difficult to comprehend and I admit that it is a difficult concept to accept as being the morally right thing to do. Weather one believes this is the correct course of action is a personal judgement as currently the American administration is legally justified in its current use of covert drone strikes to neutralise perceived terrorist threats by successfully claiming that these operations are acts of self defence against an enemy of the state. It would be absurd to claim that each and every one of these drone strikes is legally justified in this way; however one would have to go through each individual operation and judge its legality, Al-Awaki was legal.
Originally posted by Aim64C
With all due respect - you don't know what you're looking at.
Meanwhile, the same White House that insists in court that it cannot confirm the existence
of the CIA's drone program spent this week anonymously boasting to US news outlets of the
president's latest drone kill in Pakistan. And government emails ordered disclosed by a federal
court last month revealed that at the same time as they were refusing to disclose information
about the Bin Laden raid on the grounds that it is classified, the Obama administration was
secretly meeting with, and shuffling sensitive information to, Hollywood filmmakers, who are
producing what is certain to be a stirring and reverent film about that raid, originally scheduled
to be released just weeks before the November presidential election.www.guardian.co.uk...
Originally posted by neformore
You think I'm not outraged at suicide bombings and executions without trial?
Why on earth would you think that? Because it simply doesn't suit your argument that I am? Because I don't type it in every other sentence? Because I'm capable of seperating out logic from bias maybe?
Did it not occur to you - obviously not, actually - that the reason I'm raising this is because I AM outraged at such things?
What is killing someone by missile strike from a drone if not execution without trial?
And when its done without warning, or chance to lay down arms and surrender - whats the difference between it and a suicide bomb attack that kills indiscriminately without warning?
When you ignore due process, and turn murderous vigilante, you become as bad as those you condemn.
I feel sure then that you've heard of DARPA.
You must also know that they aren't all about fluffy cuddly toys. They and others even nastier than they are have all sorts of toys that you guys don't get to play with.
I feel absolutely certain that there are drones that don't ask any questions whatsoever. I'm just waiting for the announcement that some weapon that was meant to do A, B, and C is now doing X, Y, and Z and it doesn't want to talk to us anymore. You know what I mean?
Congress Approves 30,000 Spy Drones Over America As US Police State Tightens
Originally posted by CosmicEgg
reply to post by Aim64C
I feel sure then that you've heard of DARPA. You must also know that they aren't all about fluffy cuddly toys. They and others even nastier than they are have all sorts of toys that you guys don't get to play with. Those toys bear a more than passing resemblance to any sci-fi book you might remember reading in your youth. I assume you read that sort of thing, right?
I feel absolutely certain that there are drones that don't ask any questions whatsoever. I'm just waiting for the announcement that some weapon that was meant to do A, B, and C is now doing X, Y, and Z and it doesn't want to talk to us anymore. You know what I mean?
Be careful who you call "Master". Remember whose side you're on.
Active projectsACTUV - A project to build an unmanned Anti-submarine warfare vessel.
Adaptive Vehicle Make - Revolutionary approaches to the design, verification, and manufacturing of complex defense systems and vehicles.
ArcLight (missile) - Ship based weapon system that is capable of striking targets nearly anywhere on the globe. It is based on the Standard Missile 3.
Battlefield Illusion[19]
BigDog - a legged robot protoytpe, "gallops" 18 mph and has completed more rigorous field tests.[1]
Boeing X-37
Integrated Sensor is Structure
Boomerang (mobile shooter detection system) - an acoustic Gunshot Location Detection System developed by BBN Technologies for detecting snipers on military combat vehicles.
CALO or "Cognitive Assistant that Learns and Organizes" - software
Combat Zones That See - "track everything that moves" in a city by linking up a massive network of surveillance cameras
DARPA XG - technology for Dynamic Spectrum Access for assured military communications
EATR An autonomous tactical robotic system
FALCON
High Energy Liquid Laser Area Defense System
High Productivity Computing Systems
Human Universal Load Carrier battery-powered human exoskeleton
MAHEM Molten penetrating munition
MEMS Exchange MEMS Implementation Environment
Mind's Eye - A visual intelligence system capable of detecting and analysing activity from video feeds.[20]
Persistent Close Air Support
Protein Design Processes
Proto 2 - a thought-controlled prosthetic arm
Remote-controlled insects[21]
DARPA Silent Talk - A planned program attempting to identify EEG patterns for words and transmit these for covert communications.[22]
Satellite Remote Listening System - a satellite mounted system that can eavesdrop on a targeted area on the surface of the planet in coordination with satellite cameras. This project is in its infant stage.
SyNAPSE - Systems of Neuromorphic Adaptive Plastic Scalable Electronics
System F6 - Fractionated Spacecraft demonstrator
XOS - powered military exoskeleton
Transformer - flying armoured car[23]
UAVForge[24]
Vulture
WolfPack[25]
[edit] Past ProjectsProject AGILE
ARPANET, the predecessor of the Internet
Aspen Movie Map
ASTOVL, precursor of the Joint Strike Fighter Program[26]
Boeing X-45
CPOF - the command post of the future - networked information system for Command control.
DAML
DARPA Grand Challenge - driverless car competition
DARPA Network Challenge[27]
DEFENDER
High Performance Knowledge Bases
HISSS
Hypersonic Research Program
I3 (Intelligent Integration of Information),[28] supported the Digital Library research effort through NSF
Internet
Project MAC
Luke Arm, a DEKA creation
MOSIS
MQ-1 Predator
Multics
NLS/Augment, the origin of the canonical contemporary computer user interface
Northrop Grumman Switchblade - an unmanned oblique-wing flying aircraft for high speed, long range and long endurance flight
Onion routing
Passive radar
Policy Analysis Market
POSSE
Rapid Knowledge Formation
Sea Shadow
DARPA Shredder Challenge 2011[29] - Reconstruction of shredded documents
Strategic Computing Program
Synthetic Aperture Ladar for Tactical Applications (SALTI)
SURAN (1983–87)
Project Vela (1963)
And with all due respect your attempt at defelction is extremely apparent.
The fact is Obama is the POTUS, and he is also the first POTUS to be
a United Nations Security Council Chair.
This is an election year.
The Drone Warrior POTUS is attempting to garner support for his
re-election hopes attempting to boost his ratings with these drone stikes.
The Drones used in these strikes are CIA drones, they are not ordinary
military drones.
theintelhub.com...
guess they gotcha covered eh?
Requires the FAA Administrator to: (1) develop plans to accelerate the integration of unmanned aerial systems into the National Airspace System, and (2) report to Congress on progress made in establishing special use airspace for the DOD to develop detection techniques for small unmanned aerial vehicles and to validate sensor integration and operation of unmanned aerial systems. Directs the DOD Secretary to establish a process to develop certification and flight standards for military unmanned aerial systems at specified test sites.
Authorizes the FAA Administrator to: (1) arrange with the NAS to assess unmanned aircraft systems; and (2) establish three two-year cost-shared pilot projects in sparsely populated, low-density Class G air traffic airspace new test sites to conduct developmental work and service testing to improve unmanned aircraft for safe integration into the National Airspace System. Authorizes appropriations for FY2010-FY2011. Directs the FAA Administrator to make available on the FAA's website a five-year "roadmap" for introduction of unmanned aircraft systems into the National Airspace System. Prohibits the FAA Administrator from promulgating rules or regulations on model aircraft flown strictly for recreational, sport, competition, or academic purposes, and meeting certain other criteria.
there goes the supply line argument
yeah DARPA is insignificant
The Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency's (DARPA) $2.8 billion budget would drop only $1.4 million under the Obama administration's fiscal 2013 budget — less than a half-percentage point drop and much less than other parts of the Defense Department, Noah Shachtman reports in Wired's Danger Room.
Originally posted by Xcathdra
If the UN did more to prevent terrorism and engage those countries that harbor and fund it we wouldnt need to invoke article VII to defend ourselves against it.
Agreed, if the UN would stand up and put an embargo on the United States, both economically and trade embargo. It would greatly reduce terrorism in the world. All the deformed children in Iraq, might even have been born normal.
But it's much easier to put an embargo on North Korea, than the US. Because North Korea is basically just an empowerished nation, whose only valuta is pride, and the notion of single nationality. The desire to defend their culture against foreign invaders.
It would be impossible to put such an embargo on the US, they'd just nuke the entire world ...
So much for "we don't deal with terrorists". We are forced to listen to the US every day, because of their active threat against the entire world ... "do what we say or we'll nuke you".
Originally posted by neformore
You think I'm not outraged at suicide bombings and executions without trial?
Originally posted by neformore
Why on earth would you think that? Because it simply doesn't suit your argument that I am? Because I don't type it in every other sentence? Because I'm capable of seperating out logic from bias maybe?
Originally posted by neformore
Did it not occur to you - obviously not, actually - that the reason I'm raising this is because I AM outraged at such things?
Originally posted by neformore
What is killing someone by missile strike from a drone if not execution without trial?
1 a (1): a state of usually open and declared armed hostile conflict between states or nations (2): a period of such armed conflict (3): state of war b: the art or science of warfare c (1)obsolete: weapons and equipment for war (2)archaic: soldiers armed and equipped for war
2 a: a state of hostility, conflict, or antagonism b: a struggle or competition between opposing forces or for a particular end
Lawful conduct of belligerent actors
Modern laws of war regarding conduct during war (jus in bello), such as the 1949 Geneva Conventions, provide that it is unlawful for belligerents to engage in combat without meeting certain requirements, among them the wearing of a distinctive uniform or other distinctive signs visible at a distance, and the carrying of weapons openly. Impersonating soldiers of the other side by wearing the enemy's uniform is allowed, though fighting in that uniform is unlawful perfidy, as is the taking of hostages.
During conflict, punishment for violating the laws of war may consist of a specific, deliberate and limited violation of the laws of war in reprisal.
Originally posted by neformore
And when its done without warning, or chance to lay down arms and surrender - whats the difference between it and a suicide bomb attack that kills indiscriminately without warning?
Originally posted by neformore
When you ignore due process, and turn murderous vigilante, you become as bad as those you condemn.
Originally posted by Unity_99
Here is something to think on and do it with sanity instead of sold out generalizations and propaganda.
It is illegal to murder anyone.
Originally posted by Unity_99
Those drones are used in countries where no war has been declared.
(a) IN GENERAL- That the President is authorized to use all necessary and appropriate force against those nations, organizations, or persons he determines planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, or harbored such organizations or persons, in order to prevent any future acts of international terrorism against the United States by such nations, organizations or persons.
Originally posted by Unity_99
And they target civilians, first aid responders to those civilian casualties and then to really ensure that everyone knows they are deliberately targetting said civilians and declaring their right to murder without oversight, they show up at the funerals and murder civilians yet again.
Originally posted by Unity_99
AND YOU CONDONE THIS AND CALL THIS SELF DEFENSE>>>>
Originally posted by SuperFrog
reply to post by Xcathdra
So in other words, terror gives us right to answer it with terror?
Interesting...
Originally posted by SyphonX
You literally have no shame.
Originally posted by SyphonX
You know why the UN doesn't do anything? Because the US and other military superpowers are already doing something. You know what they're doing? They're bombing civilian populations with drones and other munitions. Oh, I'm sorry, it's only an "unfortunate accident" when that happens.. because we all know incompetence is a valid means of defense.
Originally posted by SyphonX
I suppose your argument is that the UN should "piss on the burning man", so to speak?edit on 8-6-2012 by SyphonX because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by syrinx high priest
the pakistani gov't has specifically outlawed drone attacks
the US just doesn't care
I'm torn on it. pakistan seems like an ally one day, an enemy the next
but still, where else on earth would the US even dare to do it without the gov't blessings ?
or maybe pakistan just publicly condemns them but privatley just accepts payouts for allowing them ?