Suicide and thread warnings.

Taking matters into your own hands when you are old and tired or gravelly ill is one thing. Snuffing out your life through the blackness of depression , despair, desperation and tiredness of the perceived evil of the world or avoidance of some imagined doom to come is a whole different kettle of fish.

I don't know anyone who actually did either attempt or actually commit suicide that was capable of physical harm to others. They orchestrated their own demise long before they died by bad decisions, destructive personalities, possessiveness, and every single one that managed to do away with themselves could have turned their lives around had they given people the chance to help, those same people, friends, wives, husbands, mothers, father's and children that were left to find them and carry that vision, that guilt and that loss for the rest of their days.
Those that attempted in the past, even some that attempted sometimes weekly managed to see past the self deception, past the despair and the depression and have gone on to have good lives and beautiful children that they live for. They found their future.

Life is hard, life sometimes sucks massive balls. It can take us to the darkest regions of suffering but in the end it's worth holding onto to while you still have the chance to enjoy it. After all, it's over quickly enough without giving it a helping hand.

reply to post by g146541

If a person puts off suicide and end up having offspring, they have passed on their faulty genes to a poor unfortunate child who just may be doomed to the same problems their parents had. I am also for suicide later on in life when you have "REAL" problems, ones that doctors cannot fix. Some call it euthanasia

actually what you are talking about right there is eugenics. I feel sorry about your outlook on life, it really saddens me. i'm not really sure what you are actually arguing for.

If a person wants to commit suicide, there isn't much stopping them. Are you arguing for doctor assisted suicide?

I don't think I could really have an opinion unless I was put in a situation that would force that choice on me. All I can say is that the friend I have who is fighting cancer will never be cured, but I sure as hell want her to live every moment of her life that she can, not "punch out early".

Suicide is a selfish act, there is no getting around that. When a loved one dies, it's tough, it takes a long time to come to terms with it and live your life again. When that person commits suicide, I don't think I'd ever get that out of my head, the same if a loved one was murdered, I would spend the rest of my life replaying what it must have been like.

And for a suicide, I'd be replaying every instant of my time with them, wondering, was there a sign I missed? Was I not doing what they needed?

Any time the thought of my death creeps into my head, be it self inflicted or otherwise, I can't help but think of the people it would affect once I was gone.

speak for yourself buddy, i know plenty of people who have been through insane personal emotional trauma and come out on the otherside with beautiful and strong personalities, you on the other hand have never met anybody like that obviously.

Suicide is a natural reaction to the realization that you do not own yourself. I believe that most depression stems from this idea as well. We do not own our bodies or our future in this environment, and this idea is unbearable to some. Of course this is not completely true. We are trained to work for the system. We can get out of it if we are lucky enough to see the truth. Look at the peorple around you milling around town, it is not hard to see that they all prisoners of a sort. But there in lies the way out. If you see it for what it is, the answer to freedom is very simple. Just walk free, the chains that bind you are trained into you, they are not physical. The freedom that so many seek is just a state of mind, it is merely inches away at all times. It is possible to walk free among prisoners.

reply to post by Murgatroid


Whose god are you referring to? You must not realize that not everyone believes in your god.

reply to post by g146541


I totally agree,

My belief is we are placed in this world without consent, and should be able to end ones life as we have the right to do with our own body as we see fit.

If a person chooses death to be happy...can we really argue that it's wrong?

Apparently threads get deleted about suicide, well not this one. But ATS are clear in their T&Cs about this, or maybe they are not. Whatever.

reply to post by g146541


Pretty pathetic that even though we all can see there is a problem with humanity, and rather than putting oneself out for another (unless they benefit from it in some way), some people will choose to be indifferent instead.

Should you hand your child a gun, because your child just doesn't see a solution to his/her unhappiness?
Hey dad been out of work for months, he is wrought with anguish and not old enough to retire, shall you hand him a gun too?
Or should we just promote suicide as a solution for "other" people. Will we have a panel of people such as these fine upstanding politicians running our country to make these decisions?

Tell me, should the town take a vote, maybe these homeless people want to die? Maybe they just don't have the means to end their miserable existence. Should we hand them the means to kill themselves or do it for them?.... is it even possible that there might be another solution? Or is it that any solution that requires any compassion and kindness from others out of the question? I see in some cities, we have made it a crime to feed the homeless ...this is where you want humanity to go?

Something seems amiss in your logic, in my opinion. Will you please tell me, who should be encouraged to kill themselves?

See, I think that people who think others ought to be killed, or encourage others to kill themselves, ought to show their sincerity, and be the first example because I am sure you wouldn't want to come off as a hypocrite would you?. What say you?

Well, I think it is definitely a good thing you were brave enough to bring this to discussion. I don't see the problem with "euthanasia" if the person wants it for themselves, also, sometimes we are unnaturally extending an old person's life span by "plugging them in" so all that needs to be done is "unplug them."

I do see a problem though, when it comes to having a national health care plan. In the U.S., I would not be surprised if the politicians tried to pull off "mandatory euthanasia" to "save taxpayer dollars" in certain situations. I would be a very vocal opponent of that.

Suicide is a dark road. I won't be talking about that today.

Originally posted by Dustytoad

But seriously though,
My main point is that you cannot cheat this game.
you can't cheat life, and you can't cheat death.

edit on 6/6/2012 by Dustytoad because: (no reason given)

This. It's cheating. I know I've had and have times where I want out of here. But not like that.

This is a murky grey area for me. I guess I have to go with my own life's motto: "Do whatever as long as it doesn't hurt yourself or somebody else".

A person with an incurable illness that is dying should be able to hurry up the process, because it is on the horizon anyhow, so why not get there a bit quicker? Nobody would be hurt or grieve over this action.

A person who is depressed and cannot see the purpose of it all is simply blind and can be helped to see again. To check out when there is so much potential, even though the despondent person doesn't see it, hurts not only themselves, but others who care about them.

I don't believe that people can escape their problems by checking out early. I believe that, by dropping out of the school of life, you are doomed on the other side....But this is only my own opinion.

I have been in the deepest depths of depression and seriously considered the coward's way out. Then I went to a funeral of a peace officer who had used his service revolver to kill himself because his wife had left him. Although all his fellow officers were there, it was an awful funeral. Nobody would speak for this man, and they all turned their backs on his urn (he was cremated) and walked out without a word. I saw his children, who were crying, torn-up, and confused. I saw his family hugging each other and crying out "why" in grief.

As upset and low and I felt them, I realized that taking my own life, as insignificant as I felt, would have severely negative repercussions for my children and my family, and I just couldn't do that to them. I got through it, and 12 years later, I look back and thank God that I didn't do what I was thinking of doing. I was blind for a while, but eventually I regained my sight. This is the difference between a terminal physical illness and a mental one.

My dad commited suicide last week.

And my mother's aunts husband explained it like this.

It wasn't selfish, what he did, it was just an act of complete desperation. And I hate the fact my dad did it, but if he felt like it was the only way out of the life he was living, then I feel sorry for him, and I wish he would've let people help, but I can't blame him, and won't hate him for what he did.

I loved him, always will, he was a great respectable man. He just couldn't let his feelings out, at all.

But I don't think suicide is selfish. Because it must be torture for the person who actually thinks it's the only way out, and then actually acts on those impulses. To end your own life, I can't imagine what's happening in their head before they do it. And that's why I won't judge someone who does it. Because I've never felt that desperation, and I hope I never will.

Originally posted by ScatterBrain
reply to post by g146541

 

Pretty pathetic that even though we all can see there is a problem with humanity, and rather than putting oneself out for another (unless they benefit from it in some way), some people will choose to be indifferent instead.

Should you hand your child a gun, because your child just doesn't see a solution to his/her unhappiness?
Hey dad been out of work for months, he is wrought with anguish and not old enough to retire, shall you hand him a gun too?
Or should we just promote suicide as a solution for "other" people. Will we have a panel of people such as these fine upstanding politicians running our country to make these decisions?

Tell me, should the town take a vote, maybe these homeless people want to die? Maybe they just don't have the means to end their miserable existence. Should we hand them the means to kill themselves or do it for them?.... is it even possible that there might be another solution? Or is it that any solution that requires any compassion and kindness from others out of the question? I see in some cities, we have made it a crime to feed the homeless ...this is where you want humanity to go?

Something seems amiss in your logic, in my opinion. Will you please tell me, who should be encouraged to kill themselves?

See, I think that people who think others ought to be killed, or encourage others to kill themselves, ought to show their sincerity, and be the first example because I am sure you wouldn't want to come off as a hypocrite would you?. What say you?

Agreed, if someone is so distraught early on, maybe they just got the short end of the stick and should get out of the gene pool.

Now who should be encouraged to do away with themselves?
The same people who are miserable on this plane of existence, get out of the way so those of us who do like to live can do what we do.

Now your last paragraph talks of people who "ought to be killed", that is called murder and is not suicide and it is not the topic.

Originally posted by g146541
If mental problems can be "CURED", then why does the news always seem to mention when a person flips out and mows down folks in public, "The assailant it seems was off his medications".
Taking pills that make you feel like a zombie for the rest of your life is hardly a "CURE".

Of all your glib views on the delicate subject of suicide, this one troubles me the most. You seem to think there is a solid connection between suicidal thoughts and homicide. If this were the case, why don't the majority of death row inmates hang themselves each year? It's because they are mutually exclusive problems even if they are often intertwined.

Also, by your rationale, if you can't "cure" a condition and constantly have to treat it, then life should be ended. What about you? Don't you suffer from hunger? It's a pesky condition with no cure. Sometimes the withdrawal symptoms actually kill people in painful deaths. You have to swallow all this pesky designer food just to ebb out and existence. May as well off yourself, right?

Originally posted by Cuervo

Originally posted by g146541
If mental problems can be "CURED", then why does the news always seem to mention when a person flips out and mows down folks in public, "The assailant it seems was off his medications".
Taking pills that make you feel like a zombie for the rest of your life is hardly a "CURE".

Of all your glib views on the delicate subject of suicide, this one troubles me the most. You seem to think there is a solid connection between suicidal thoughts and homicide. If this were the case, why don't the majority of death row inmates hang themselves each year? It's because they are mutually exclusive problems even if they are often intertwined.

Not every killer wants to die, but just as a for instance you have those two idiot emo boys at Columbine high school who killed a bunch of people then did themselves in, if they would have just got their suicides done early on, maybe the teacher and those students that were killed that day would still be with us.
And the reason why folks don't kill themselves in prison is, we take away most or all opportunities they have right down to their shoelaces.

Also, by your rationale, if you can't "cure" a condition and constantly have to treat it, then life should be ended. What about you? Don't you suffer from hunger? It's a pesky condition with no cure. Sometimes the withdrawal symptoms actually kill people in painful deaths. You have to swallow all this pesky designer food just to ebb out and existence. May as well off yourself, right?

This paragraph is so silly that even the hardest would even disagree, however I'll bite.
To the contrary, I love eating, it is not a chore it is a pleasure, it is one of my greater reasons for living.
It also does not make me feel dumbed down like a pill would, but energized for more!

In fact in order for the human race to survive, we must procreate, oh that terrible chore. /sarcasm

Suicide?

I've done a lot of living in the past six minutes, and I'm running out of time, no needs of ending the race early, I've yet to come around the bend.


ps: I'm hoping if I do ever a fall that sporty lil prat from the state track meet will scoop me up and help me across the finish line...

Originally posted by Murgatroid

Originally posted by g146541.
I am totally fine with mu Grandpa's death, how do you feel?
Was he wrong?

The REAL question is: what does GOD say about it?

"Angie Fenimore, a wife and mother haunted by abuse in childhood and overwhelmed by despair, was in a desperate state of mind. On January 8, 1991, she committed suicide, hoping to escape her sense of emptiness and suffering. But clinical death didn't draw her to the light seen in so many near-death experiences."

"Then I heard a voice of awesome power, not loud but crashing over me like a booming wave of sound; a voice that encompassed such ferocious anger that with one word it could destroy the universe, and that also encompassed such potent and unwavering love that, like the sun, it could coax life from the earth. I cowered at its force and at its excruciating words:

"Is this what you really want? Don't you know that this is the worst thing you could have done?"

I could feel his anger and frustration, both because I'd thrown in the towel and because I had cut myself off from him and from his guidance.

And I'd felt trapped. I had been able to see no other choice but to die before I could do any more damage in life.

So I answered: "But my life is so hard."

My thoughts were communicated so fast that they weren't even completed before I absorbed his response:

"You think that was hard? It is nothing compared to what awaits you if you take your life."

When the Father spoke, each of his words exploded into a complex of meanings, like fireworks, tiny balls of light that erupted into a billion bits of information, filling me with streams of vivid truth and pure understanding."

edit on 6-6-2012 by Murgatroid because: Added link

Is that not between god and the person. If you are not meant to leave yeet then things will happen to make you stay. Some go home temporary and come back if they are unfinished and some stay here. Death is just another change. I feel sorry for those left behind but most people do not understand the extreame need for release that people in these situations have.

But then I constantly remind god of the promise he made.



If I laid down my love
To come to your defense
Would you worry for me
With a pain in your chest?

Could I rely on your faith to be strong
To pick me back up and to push me along?
Tell me

You'll be there in my hour of need
You won't turn me away
Help me out of the life I lead
Remember the promise you made
Remember the promise you made

If I gave you my soul
For a piece of your mind
Would you carry me with you
To the far edge of time?

Could you understand if you found me untrue
Would we become one, or divided in two
Please tell me

You'll be there in my hour of need
You won't turn me away
Help me out of the life I lead
Remember the promise you made
Remember the promise you made

Could I rely on your faith to be strong
To pick me back up and to push me along
Please tell me

You'll be there in my hour of need
You won't turn me away
Help me out of the life I lead
Remember the promise you made
Remember the promise you made
Remember the promise you made

Originally posted by MartyrCollect
My dad commited suicide last week.

And my mother's aunts husband explained it like this.

It wasn't selfish, what he did, it was just an act of complete desperation. And I hate the fact my dad did it, but if he felt like it was the only way out of the life he was living, then I feel sorry for him, and I wish he would've let people help, but I can't blame him, and won't hate him for what he did.

I loved him, always will, he was a great respectable man. He just couldn't let his feelings out, at all.

But I don't think suicide is selfish. Because it must be torture for the person who actually thinks it's the only way out, and then actually acts on those impulses. To end your own life, I can't imagine what's happening in their head before they do it. And that's why I won't judge someone who does it. Because I've never felt that desperation, and I hope I never will.

Sorry for your loss and pain. I think you have a very understanding view of what happened. Do not worry. They will fix it so that he gets the release he needs if they have not already.

Ok... I suffered badly from depression in the past, in fact I ended up in hospital on suicide watch where the nurses would check on me every few minutes to see if I was still with them basically....

I came through that depression but I've never been the same again, I feel like I'm walking a fine line and the ""cowards way out"" is on my mind constantly.

I wont bore you with the details of my life or my problems but I ask anyone out there opposed to suicide, What gives you the right to enforce the daily pain, suffering and anguish onto me for the rest of my "natural" life??

Don't say "I know how you feel" How could anyone know how another truely feels?

The torment is unbearable at times, tell me again why my life is yours to decide my fate.

Being depressed is NOT being "a bit sad"