"There is no doubt that Shuai was suffering from a severe mental illness," her defence lawyer Linda Pence said. She first met the defendant when she was in the mental wing, a few days after Angel died. "I personally observed a very depressed woman, a grief-stricken individual."

There is her defense in nutshell.

I doubt any jury (that is fully informed) would fail to note the exigent circumstances and do whatever they can to reduce this nonsensical charge to 'time served.'

.... unless of course, we start sending doctors and other abortive mothers to prison.

In my opinion; this is another distraction piece. They will get more outrageous as the political games proceed.

This one is going to be interesting to follow. Unless the prosecution backs off I see this going to the SCOTUS. The baby was less than a month from full term. BUT as stated in the article what about pregnant women that smoke? Drink? Do drugs? Not to mention abortion. Was she in a suicidal state? Did she think, "I'll get rid of this and he'll come back?" Interesting case.

This is ridiculous. If this is allowed to stand then what is next for pregnant women? This woman did a deliberate act, i get that, but what about accidents? Will women be charged for those too if the fetus dies?

Originally posted by Maxmars

"There is no doubt that Shuai was suffering from a severe mental illness," her defence lawyer Linda Pence said. She first met the defendant when she was in the mental wing, a few days after Angel died. "I personally observed a very depressed woman, a grief-stricken individual."

There is her defense in nutshell.

I doubt any jury (that is fully informed) would fail to note the exigent circumstances and do whatever they can to reduce this nonsensical charge to 'time served.'

.... unless of course, we start sending doctors and other abortive mothers to prison.

In my opinion; this is another distraction piece. They will get more outrageous as the political games proceed.

with all due respect to you, maxmars...i think there are millions of people that have bought into the "abortion as murder" diatribe, and that this women may well be convicted of murder. these people have stopped at nothing to get their way. murdering doctors, bombing clinics, commiting assaults, all this is still happening.

The crux of the matter:

Originally posted by antonia
If this is allowed to stand then what is next for pregnant women? This woman did a deliberate act, i get that...

That is what the prosecution is going to base it's case on. The defense will say that she was not "of right mind". Unless there is something out there that is not reported, the defense will win this case.

Originally posted by antonia
This is ridiculous. If this is allowed to stand then what is next for pregnant women? This woman did a deliberate act, i get that, but what about accidents? Will women be charged for those too if the fetus dies?

well, YES!!...do you think these people are joking? they want forced birth, no matter if it kills the mother, they don't care about the mother's life...she is a throw-away piece of meat vessel that contains a baby, that's it

What she did was wrong. But I think she's been punished enough already. (instead of a quick death from her rash decision, she had to hold her live baby and watch it die because of her mistake, sounds worse than prison to me) She needs help, not prison.

Man, the hits just keep on coming! From the maniac chewing off a man's face in Miami, dismembered body parts arriving at the Conservative Party headquarters in Canada, and now this? I don't know what to make of it? It is a tragedy any way you want to look at it. Tragic for the mother, the child, and her family.

Was she of sound and rational mind when the incident occurred or was she mentally unstable? I am fairly certain all that will come out in trial, and after further evaluation by psychiatric professionals. I would hope someone in her predicament would go for help first or seek consul from people she trusts in her inner circle.

To me, the case seems fairly cut and dry. Although the murder charge is a little much considering the circumstances surrounding the case. She attempted to commit suicide and was with child. Unless my logic is off, the child or fetus is intrinsically linked to the mother. The mother dies and so does the child. I do not believe she had the intent to murder her unborn child? I am only speculating because it has not gone to trial. If I were the prosecutor? This case would be tried as an incident of involuntary manslaughter and not murder. Murder is really stretching it, because premeditation has to be proven. Moreover, the baby was born and died afterwards. That could pose another potential road block to the prosecution's case. The prosecution has to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that her attempted suicide directly led to the child's death after being born.

Some have already said that this particular case could end up at the Supreme Court. I would have to agree. I hope the woman is treated fairly and is treated as innocent until proven guilty. Lets not sensationalize or politicize this incident before we know all the details. Patience is a virtue, and until a verdict is render by a jury? This woman has my benefit of a doubt and will remain innocent.

I agree. Its not first degree murder, and yet she is being made an example of. Because she excercised choice, and we're not allowed to. In reality, people need to work hard and rally to overturn that decision and fire the judge, he's obviously a very crooked sadistic piece of work.

Originally posted by Maxmars

"There is no doubt that Shuai was suffering from a severe mental illness," her defence lawyer Linda Pence said. She first met the defendant when she was in the mental wing, a few days after Angel died. "I personally observed a very depressed woman, a grief-stricken individual."

There is her defense in nutshell.

I doubt any jury (that is fully informed) would fail to note the exigent circumstances and do whatever they can to reduce this nonsensical charge to 'time served.'

.... unless of course, we start sending doctors and other abortive mothers to prison.

In my opinion; this is another distraction piece. They will get more outrageous as the political games proceed.

A distraction piece it may be, but you know what, we need to get distracted for every single person is the center of existence and a terrible thing happening to one is equal to it happening to everyone. So people have to work to get her out and the judge out as well.

Have to agree that this is 9 kinds of messed up abortion is legal and yet the result was the same, and they want to throw her in prison?

No they shouldn't tell me where the high ground is for the law to call you a murder and they made it legal.

Sad all the way around.

she should get counseling and maybe a treatment center. this is what a police state looks like

Originally posted by intrepid
The crux of the matter:

Originally posted by antonia
If this is allowed to stand then what is next for pregnant women? This woman did a deliberate act, i get that...

That is what the prosecution is going to base it's case on. The defense will say that she was not "of right mind". Unless there is something out there that is not reported, the defense will win this case.

I hope so, because honestly this is just going to go way too far. I can envision some situation in which a woman get's into a car accident and is held liable for the death of her fetus.

There is a lot of discussion here on whether she was in her right mind (whatever that means legally). Something significant in the article is:

Curry pointed to a suicide note that Shuai left the former boyfriend in which she wrote that she was "taking this baby with me".

"What we allege is that her actions were directed specifically at the unborn child. It's not that she was trying to take her own life, it was that she was trying to take the life of her foetus," Curry said.

Whether she should be allowed to kill her unborn child, or punished for it, is one question. But it seems as though she intended to do it, and had the composure to write down that she intended to kill her child.

(Just had a thought. Zimmerman will only be able to claim self-defense if he can prove he met the requirements, lawfully in the place, in fear of grave bodily harm, etc.. What's wrong with having the requirement that a doctor perform an abortion? The state puts requirements on you before you can kill an attacker, why not before you can kill a foetus?)