My take on Masonry , page 3

reply to post by 3n19m470

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You really should learn how to break your post into paragraphs.

Our organization does have counter measures to ensure the basic principles and tenets are kept in tact.

The finances of the Masons comes from the members. Our finances don't exist to make anyone wealthy.

It would be curious to see how America would have been formed without any of the Masons around.

Actually, the primary verse about the builders comes from the Book of Psalms and is later repeated by the Apostle Peter not Christ (see Acts 4 and Psalm 118:2). Builders was a metaphor for the people who rejected Christ, not actual builders.

Why wait until the 33rd? I may never get mine. I'm not über active in the Scottish Rite and the 33rd is not an entitlement. I may never be invited but that is neither here nor there.

You certainly are an interesting character.

reply to post by protocolsoflove

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Wow!

OK I enjoyed that post. Very fair.

Manly Hall probably knew more about Freemasonry 30 years before he became one than many of us know today.

When Hall, Pike and others talk about inner and outer masonry, or higher/lower, they are speaking about exoteric and esoteric masonry.

The vast majority of men who join are doing so for the exoteric aspects, IE fellowship, charity, social events.

The minority (and probably most or all masons on ATS) either join or become interested in the esoteric aspects, or 'inner' masonry.

The problem with today's technological society is that we expect free access to all information and life has become a parody of Wikipedia. Critical thinking is gone. Analytical thinking is gone. Parallel thinking is gone.

To understand the deeper meaning of Freemasonry a mason must make a conscientious effort to understand it. The truly deep "secrets" of inner masonry are experiential and by definition can never be revealed (unless we come up with some sort of Vulcan mind-meld technology).

Freemasonry makes no promises and makes no excuses. It's often said in my lodge that a man will "get out of it what he puts into it", whether that is taking on responsibilities in lodge or personal reflection.

Originally posted by getreadyalready

Originally posted by EnochWasRight

Originally posted by W3RLIED2
I want my ignore button back.

I'll leave you to your thread on my last comment. As always, it's a joy. I am not here to condemn you, only show you what is revealed in the Word of God on the subject. My hope is that you all see the truth and the truth sets you free from the lie.

Get out of Egypt. God is found in the Name of His Son only.

God is love.

A Post you should read. LINK Know them by their fruit.

edit on 29-5-2012 by EnochWasRight because: (no reason given)

What I don't understand is why people believe a Christian Faith should trump everything else? Masonry is not a religion, and it is non-denominational in its practice. So, why would someone's bible quotes and Christian fundamentals be relevant to a thread on Masonry? Masonry is not a path to heaven, it is a path to being a good person here.

I wonder if people like Enoch are going down to the Golds Gym and telling people that exercise will not get them into heaven, they must repent and accept Christ? I wonder if he is going to the Chamber of Commerce meetings and telling them they are following the wrong path? How about the Bridge Club at the Senior Center? I mean, is it his mission in life to go to every group or gathering that is not a fundamentalist Christian gathering and telling them they are doing everything wrong? It just makes no sense. I coach my kid's t-ball team, we have a hierarchy, structure, uniforms, secret symbols, why is Enoch not down there protesting and telling them t-ball won't get them into heaven?

We are all going to face financial meltdown in our country because of the actions of the Masons, Bankers and the False Priests who will send your sons and daughters to war so daddy Warbucks can make more money. The East wind will blow and take away the harvest from the earth and our sons and daughters will starve. Mankind is in the state that it is in because of Daddy Warbucks.

We fight for truth, against the lies, so we can preserve the ability to have that t-ball practice. You asked why and I told you.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by EnochWasRight

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Again...... so what?

This isn't a thread about how to get to heaven. Masonry is not about how to get to heaven. There are some very good Christian Masons, and I don't want to offend any of them, but I do not identify myself as a Christian, and I do not believe there is only one gate and one shephard. I have seen a stampede, and there is no need for a gate or a shephard at all. It just takes a good clap of thunder, or a shot from a shotgun, and the whole fence comes down, LOL!

What does all of your religious spewing have to do with Masonry?

Your symbols are painted across the world like a banner saying, we were here. It was us that caused your banks to fail and sent your sons and daughters to war so we could seal the resources for Daddy Warbucks. Your sons and daughters are orphans because mother and child were separated from their father in war to protect the profit.

I couldn't tell this story unless you told it first on yourselves in the media. We know the symbols now and we now have the ability to look back and connect the dots right back to the Rockefellers and the Masons. I would run form this organization if I were you.

Do you deny that the symbols below are anything but Masonic?

reply to post by EnochWasRight

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Firstly, I believe salvation is a gift offered to all, regardless of religion. Also, Jesus emphasized the necessity of both WORKS and faith:

Faith and Deeds

14 What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them?

15 Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food.

16 If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it?

17 In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.

18 But someone will say, “You have faith; I have deeds.” Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds.

19 You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that —and shudder.

20 You foolish person, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless[d]?

21 Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar?

22 You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did.

23 And the scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness,”[e] and he was called God’s friend.

24 You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone.

25 In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a different direction?

26 As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.

James 2

reply to post by EnochWasRight

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You know... Your link in your sig points to a page called Links to Truth which include a discourse on "Faith without Works is Dead."

reply to post by emsed1

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Firstly, I believe salvation is a gift offered to all, regardless of religion. Also, Jesus emphasized the necessity of both WORKS and faith:

There are many Masons who are saved. There is no doubt. The problem is not with the heart, but with the pledges you take to the Masons who are controlling and influencing you from above. Know them by their fruit. Daddy Warbucks was not a mythological figure, nor was his desire to gain wealth from robbing others of theirs.

Who did Rockefeller pay tribute to? Jesus? The Experts? Know them by their fruit. Their army is deceived.

Originally posted by emsed1
reply to post by EnochWasRight

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You know... Your link in your sig points to a page called Links to Truth which include a discourse on "Faith without Works is Dead."

You are correct. Those are my words in the article. It's the difference between taking and giving, as I describe in the the article that bears my name. There is a direction to earning reward. It first comes from suffering. Taking represents gaining reward apart from the work of suffering first. Faith must first suffer the loss of all to gain it back again in proper context to truth. Debt is created by taking. This is why we suffer a nation debt in our economy. We took and did not earn.

Matthew 6:33

But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.

Duplicity is saying one thing and doing another. If we seek good for the reward, then we are seeking the reward only. If we seek good to avoid judgment, we are seeking our own protection. Faith starts with a love for God first. From there, the works are not done in duplicity for self gain. They are done to honor God as the primary focus of our efforts.

God gave us a word to use, complete with riddles, mysteries and symbols to define. The only work is the one we do to find God so he can develop our faith. God can only give to those who do the same.

Acts 17

24 “The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by human hands. 25 And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything. Rather, he himself gives everyone life and breath and everything else. 26 From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands. 27 God did this so that they would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from any one of us. 28 ‘For in him we live and move and have our being.’ As some of your own poets have said, ‘We are his offspring.’

edit on 30-5-2012 by EnochWasRight because: (no reason given)

reply to post by Masonic Light

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No, the builders whom Jesus mentioned were the Jews who rejected him: the religious fundamentalists, whose children are today's anti-Masons.

The "temple" mentioned by Jesus was not Solomon's Temple, which had already been destroyed centuries before His birth by the Babylonians (the Temple in use during Jesus' time was Herod's Temple, not Solomon's).

Rather, the "temple" that Jesus referred to that would be destroyed, but be raised back up in three days, was His own body.

Then again I'll ask: Who does daddy Warbucks pay tribute to? Jesus? When it comes down to it, Daddy Warbucks is the key to the symbols in Freemasonry. Follow this path to the Jesuits as well. They all reject Christ.

Who is Peter (Roman Catholic Church / but not their faithful)? Who are the builders? Can the faithful builders be saved? YES. Can the faithful Catholics be saved? YES. Should we pay tribute to their fallen leaders and serve their causes? NO!!

Matthew 16:18
18And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter (Petros), and upon this rock (Petra) I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Petros is the smaller rock that is rolled away to reveal an empty tomb. Petra is the foundation stone and capstone. It's all tied together in the symbols. Does the Roman Catholic Church show fruit of repentance? Does Peter answer Jesus with honesty when asked to feed the sheep? Read the article on Peter in my signature.

Who does Daddy Warbucks pay his tribute to?

reply to post by EnochWasRight

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In response to both of your posts....

I don't know any bankster Masons. I'm sure there probaby are some, but the ones I know are small business men and blue collar workers. The Masons I know founded the Tea Party in Florida, and they certainly are not in favor of the ongoing wars in Iraq, Afghan, Libya, Egypt, Syria, etc. I have to admit, a few of them do think we should attack Iran, but an equal number think that is absurd.

As for our symbols painted all over the world. I'm sorry, but anytime 3 sticks fall down, there is a decent chance of them making a triangle, LOL! Just about every living thing has eyeballs, and so they are a significant thing to notice, and to paint. Survival depends on keen awareness, so any company would be wise to at least consider an eyeball as their emblem. The sun or "blazing star" is kind of a significant feature to every living thing on earth. I'm pretty sure my 4 and 5 year olds painting the sun in every picture has nothing to do with Masonry.

So, if pre-kindergartners are drawing suns, and triangles, and eyes, then I'm pretty sure it is not the fault of Masonry when these things show up painted all over the world.

Blame your politicians, blame your peers, blame your own votes, blame selfishness, blame greed, blame human nature, even blame the devil if you believe in one, but don't waste time inventing a boogeyman to blame. There are plenty of real problems and real people that should shoulder the blame.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by EnochWasRight

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In response to both of your posts....

I don't know any bankster Masons. I'm sure there probaby are some, but the ones I know are small business men and blue collar workers. The Masons I know founded the Tea Party in Florida, and they certainly are not in favor of the ongoing wars in Iraq, Afghan, Libya, Egypt, Syria, etc. I have to admit, a few of them do think we should attack Iran, but an equal number think that is absurd.

As for our symbols painted all over the world. I'm sorry, but anytime 3 sticks fall down, there is a decent chance of them making a triangle, LOL! Just about every living thing has eyeballs, and so they are a significant thing to notice, and to paint. Survival depends on keen awareness, so any company would be wise to at least consider an eyeball as their emblem. The sun or "blazing star" is kind of a significant feature to every living thing on earth. I'm pretty sure my 4 and 5 year olds painting the sun in every picture has nothing to do with Masonry.

So, if pre-kindergartners are drawing suns, and triangles, and eyes, then I'm pretty sure it is not the fault of Masonry when these things show up painted all over the world.

Blame your politicians, blame your peers, blame your own votes, blame selfishness, blame greed, blame human nature, even blame the devil if you believe in one, but don't waste time inventing a boogeyman to blame. There are plenty of real problems and real people that should shoulder the blame.

The Masons, when they finally wake from their delusion, will see the trail of symbols leading right back to the ones in charge. I have identified three groups that Jesus reveals as the ones corrupting the Earth. The Moneychangers, the Builders and the False Priests. In all of our history, these three groups have done two things that identify them like a neon sigh: 1) They locked secrets in symbol so that they could speak private inside jokes on the general populace. 2) They tagged themselves to Daddy Warbucks (War profiteers). By doing this, the general populace can now read the symbols for their true meaning and rewind the path back to the head of the original scheme. Masons should not be afraid to see their leaders at the root of the organization. Know the truth and the truth sets you free from the delusion.

Read this Thread: Rothchild's Merge

Follow them to their root: Experts in the Law. Who do you swear oaths to serve? Do you even know? After speaking with me here, you should have a way to see clearly.

reply to post by EnochWasRight

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But what if I don't want to take Jesus' word for it? From what I know of Jesus, he wasn't a hardened criminal or a conspiracy theorist, and he didn't have his ear to the ground the way I do. I probably know more criminals than Jesus did, and they are not Masons. Priests and Bankers maybe, but not Masons, LOL!

You're entire barrage hinges on the words of Jesus, which is fine, for you, but since I'm not a Christian, why is it important to me?

I've shown that the symbology argument is bunk, and the lower/upper levels are bunk, and all you have left is religion, but many people of your same religion are also Masons and they do not have the problems you have. Many other Masons are not Christians, so they do not have the problems you have.

You are shouting nonsense from the rooftops. Why? Are you trying to "save" us? I don't want to be saved. Even if Jesus approached me on the street, and I was 100% it was really him, I would tell him I choose to experience this life for myself and reach the same conclusions he reached, but reach them of my own accord, through my own actions and my own consequences. I would tell him his father and I have already talked about this, and we are on the same page, and thank him for his concern, and be on my way.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by EnochWasRight

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But what if I don't want to take Jesus' word for it? From what I know of Jesus, he wasn't a hardened criminal or a conspiracy theorist, and he didn't have his ear to the ground the way I do. I probably know more criminals than Jesus did, and they are not Masons. Priests and Bankers maybe, but not Masons, LOL!

You're entire barrage hinges on the words of Jesus, which is fine, for you, but since I'm not a Christian, why is it important to me?

I've shown that the symbology argument is bunk, and the lower/upper levels are bunk, and all you have left is religion, but many people of your same religion are also Masons and they do not have the problems you have. Many other Masons are not Christians, so they do not have the problems you have.

You are shouting nonsense from the rooftops. Why? Are you trying to "save" us? I don't want to be saved. Even if Jesus approached me on the street, and I was 100% it was really him, I would tell him I choose to experience this life for myself and reach the same conclusions he reached, but reach them of my own accord, through my own actions and my own consequences. I would tell him his father and I have already talked about this, and we are on the same page, and thank him for his concern, and be on my way.

As important as it is to know Jesus, it's even more important to know how well Jesus knows us.

John 2

23 Now while he was in Jerusalem at the Passover Festival, many people saw the signs he was performing and believed in his name.[d] 24 But Jesus would not entrust himself to them, for he knew all people. 25 He did not need any testimony about mankind, for he knew what was in each person.

The citizens of Israel that witnessed Jesus rise form the grave were coming to him for salvation. He refused to entrust himself to them? Why? Because they must be born again. He already knew all people and did not need their testimony. He knows you. He knows all men and all deceit in the heart. Repentance is turning away from the world and toward the God of love and mercy. Grace is free. Grace is unmerited favor to those who have no merit.

Isaiah 8

12 “Do not call conspiracy
everything this people calls a conspiracy;
do not fear what they fear,
and do not dread it.
13 The LORD Almighty is the one you are to regard as holy,
he is the one you are to fear,
he is the one you are to dread.

reply to post by getreadyalready

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You are shouting nonsense from the rooftops. Why? Are you trying to "save" us? I don't want to be saved. Even if Jesus approached me on the street, and I was 100% it was really him, I would tell him I choose to experience this life for myself and reach the same conclusions he reached, but reach them of my own accord, through my own actions and my own consequences. I would tell him his father and I have already talked about this, and we are on the same page, and thank him for his concern, and be on my way.

I'm shouting truth from the rooftops in hopes that our country will wake up and end the private associations with the Synagogue of Satan. Our children need a future to inherit. My children and yours. The Masons willingly give their allegiance to this false synagogue. I choose to steer clear and allow God to judge rightly. You are correct. There are many good Masons who do not realize what they are serving.

The Headquarters of the Synagogue, funded by the Masons. The Experts in the Law reside in their building of worship. Did Satan promise Illumination?

reply to post by EnochWasRight

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A book, retelling stories of men, retelling stories of Jesus, who was also a man. I don't think that will hold up under cross examination.

I hope I don't offend any of my Masonic brethren, because they are mostly Christians, and I myself was raised a Christian, but then I started finding holes in the religion.

Christ seems to have been an important man. An enlightened man. A wonderful teacher, and a pious and charitable man that has impacted millenia of his followers. That is a wonderful resume, I applaud him. I just don't need the middle man. I pray, and I receive answers. I go to church from time to time, and it is wondeful to see the people trying to do good, and be good, and be humble, and pious, and worshipful. Personally, I think it is silly. Any omnipotent being does not require worship, or praise, or fear, or thanks. It is completely illogical.

Do you require the ants in your yard to fear you? Worship you? Pay homage or sacrifice to you? No, you just want them to stay out of the kitchen and do their ant business.

I believe in God, and I also believe God has provided all the questions and all the answers, and prayer, and meditation, and life experience are the keys to unlocking all the questions and answers. My personal belief system does not require a Jesus character, but if it works for you, then GREAT!

For me, something Jesus may or may not have said, a few thousand years ago, to someone who may or may not have interpreted and repeated it correctly, so that 300 other someones could repeat it again and again, so that you could use it here to tell me about something I already know just seems pretty ludicrous. I think I'll trust my personal experience over your hearsay.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by EnochWasRight

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A book, retelling stories of men, retelling stories of Jesus, who was also a man. I don't think that will hold up under cross examination.

I hope I don't offend any of my Masonic brethren, because they are mostly Christians, and I myself was raised a Christian, but then I started finding holes in the religion.

Christ seems to have been an important man. An enlightened man. A wonderful teacher, and a pious and charitable man that has impacted millenia of his followers. That is a wonderful resume, I applaud him. I just don't need the middle man. I pray, and I receive answers. I go to church from time to time, and it is wondeful to see the people trying to do good, and be good, and be humble, and pious, and worshipful. Personally, I think it is silly. Any omnipotent being does not require worship, or praise, or fear, or thanks. It is completely illogical.

Do you require the ants in your yard to fear you? Worship you? Pay homage or sacrifice to you? No, you just want them to stay out of the kitchen and do their ant business.

I believe in God, and I also believe God has provided all the questions and all the answers, and prayer, and meditation, and life experience are the keys to unlocking all the questions and answers. My personal belief system does not require a Jesus character, but if it works for you, then GREAT!

For me, something Jesus may or may not have said, a few thousand years ago, to someone who may or may not have interpreted and repeated it correctly, so that 300 other someones could repeat it again and again, so that you could use it here to tell me about something I already know just seems pretty ludicrous. I think I'll trust my personal experience over your hearsay.

edit on 30-5-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)

I understand what you are saying. I was there once, not too long ago. The ants in my yard were not created by me. They can only give to their colony, as God intended for them to do. They server an ultimate purpose for mankind by aerating the soil, spreading pollen and helping nurture the environment around them. All God's creatures are charged with this duty of serving the many. Man serves the few at the expense of the many.

2 Peter 3

3 Above all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own evil desires. 4 They will say, “Where is this ‘coming’ he promised? Ever since our ancestors died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation.” 5 But they deliberately forget that long ago by God’s word the heavens came into being and the earth was formed out of water and by water. 6 By these waters also the world of that time was deluged and destroyed. 7 By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly.

We are under a veil that keeps us from seeing who we really are. Genesis states that we are in an image. When you look at a mirror, do you see yourself, or do you see the reflection? Is the reflection you? It only reveals you. If you don't like what you see, you can change the image and come back. Since God created us in an image, what we see here is only a representation of our true soul. We are here to see the image for ourselves and change what we see. The Bible is only a mirror we see ourselves in. It can only show us what we see within ourselves.

Many men have tried to say the mirror is smudged or distorted. Even so, the symbols locked within reveal the true person. The words on the surface do not contain the entire meaning. The way to see clearly is to get yourself out of the way.

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