Freedom watch: Not a single Democrat voted in favor of ending FDA raids on raw milk farmers

Originally posted by SaturnFXI will say one thing though..and this kicks in my skeptic radar. Pasturization processing is costly...a corporation would gladly remove this process and save money..so, that immediately puts me on the defensive..they would sell their grandmothers for fuel if it made them a profit. Anyone pushing an emotional angry argument that ties back into being pro-corporate profits immediately puts red flags up for me.

If you didn't need to pasturise then you could source your own local milk from local dairy farmers, who could sell their milk without going through the established pasturisation system. This would decrease revenue for the big corporations. Making it illegal to do this guarantees that they can control the milk supply and make money off anyone that wants milk.

So the way I see it is that its a cost but also what is keeping them in business.

The danger of raw milk is overstated, especially when the majority would still probably drink pasturised milk.

Making raw milk illegal and raiding people who sell it is massively unethical IMO.

Rand Paul's bill is a big WTF?

If he wanted to make raw milk legal, then why not change the raw milk laws? Instead he tried to interfere with how the FDA operates. Even if he had gotten his proposed changes, it still wouldn't have changed the raw milk laws. PLUS raw milk laws are STATE laws, each state determines if raw milk sales would be allowed. There is NO FEDERAL LAW against the sale of raw milk. Only against interstate transport and selling unlabeled food.

Don't put your trust in some blogger site like 'naturalnews', that site distorts the truth. Allgyer was never 'raided' and was given multiple warnings before finally being arrested.

U.S.: Pa. farmer can't distribute raw milk

www.upi.com...

reply to post by alfa1


mens rea: There can be no crime without a vicious will...

Ok now... your reply is equally as misleading as I'm certain that no where in the bill was the word "snake oil" used.. Yes I understand a lot of dietary supplements do claim sensationalist effects but many supplements have proven health benefits.. Heck where do you think most medicines get their chemical blueprint? Herbs...

Originally posted by Blackmarketeer
reply to post by frazzle

 

Once again, and for the record, I did not say the bill was "satisfactory as it was", I only said that the original bill (S.3187) already carries prohibitions against when and where the FDA can carry firearms.

,,,, no it doesn't say when and where firearms could be used, its opened ended and when you say the bill "already carries prohibitions", isn't that the same as saying Rand's bill was redundant, so why bother? That seems to be the reasoning behind your entire argument. And you're all about making up pretend scenarios when the goons might really need to be waving guns around. If the FDA needed someone arrested, I'm sure there are plenty of armed local LEOs out there to do the job for them. WITH A PROPER WARRANT AND SHOWING CAUSE.

But oh yeah, you let Forbes and KTLA, a Bain Crapital, Clear Channel, fairly unbalanced Fox News affiliate, do all the talking for you without question, and then you complain about Natural News of being a tabloid and having an agenda? Well, I have to disagree with you AND them and here's why:

During a year-long investigation, investigators made undercover purchases of unpasteurized dairy products from Healthy Family Farms stands at Los Angeles, Ventura and Santa Barbara county farmers markets and at Rawesome.

So during that year long investigation, investigators made long lists of all the products Rawesome made, along with where/how they were stored and wrote a detailed 21 page report because that's what investigaors do, right? They make lists and document every minute detail.

So WHERE in the HELL are the lists telling the Fox Zombies about all the people who were harmed by consuming these dangerous products? Oh, there weren't any? Well never mind, that part isn't applicable, they say and you echo. Its all about licenses and permits and how we must all bend over and spread them wide for all the alphabet agencies running loose on the land of the free, and in the home of the brave. No one should be concerned with all of those unsick, happy Rawesome "customers". That's what makes MSM news so totally bogus, regardless of the story they're only half covering. ANY alternative media is more to be respected.

So, although it probably won't happen in my lifetime, the anger is building and bubbling and there will ultimately be a bloody backlash against all they've done to us. People will realize that being law abiding in an unlawful, out of control police state is NOT in their best interests.

And then they will revert back to good old Ben Franklin's philosophy, that They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

When that happens, the police staters might discover that overturning raw milk containers and throwing the owners and other harmless people into their gulags didn't work out all that well for them in the end. It never does. Unfortunately, tyrants never learn from history.

Originally posted by frazzle

Originally posted by Blackmarketeer
reply to post by frazzle
[more

During a year-long investigation, investigators made undercover purchases of unpasteurized dairy products from Healthy Family Farms stands at Los Angeles, Ventura and Santa Barbara county farmers markets and at Rawesome.

A year long "undercover" investigation? Besides being a ridiculous waste of time and money, why in the world would the FDA go undercover to investigate farms and farmers markets at all? They are being treated like drug dealers, which is such a joke when we all know who the biggest "drug" dealers are, yup, our government...those wonderful folks who keep us all so "safe"....

A year long "undercover" investigation on organic farms and farmer's markets? What a ridulous waste of time and money, why would there be a need for the FDA to be "undercover" at all? These aren't drug dealers, thier farmers for God sake!

Maybe they should "investigate" the biggest drug dealer, our government and the CIA.....yeah, those wonderful folks who keep us all so safe.....

reply to post by MountainLaurel


I've given this a lot of thought and strongly suspect they do it for the IMF, WHO and multi-national corporations who will not tolerate fair competition. So the powerful few first use things like bogus scientific studies and yellow journalism to crank up fear of anything natural and of anyone who openly questions the value of the big manufacturers chemical laden products. When that fails to stop the upstarts, they call in their corporate army of regulatory agencies that use the drug war and prohibitions on other natural substances to maintain their power over commerce. And, of course, over our health.

The bogus war on drugs and natural compounds is what keeps the insurance companies, doctors, medical facilities, pharmaceutical makers, publicly funded research labs, research foundations AND government agencies all rolling in clover.

FDA has been quietly adding more prohibitions over the past several years as per UN demands for eventual full implementation of Codex Alimentarius and that will get worse as time passes. But because so many people are rejecting the hyped up propaganda and moving more and more toward organic foods and natural supplements, the big dogs have no choice but to bring out the guns to maintain the status quo.

Funny thing, I bought some organic half and half at the local health food store yesterday and when I opened it just now I noticed a big bold label across the carton saying "pasture-raised". Cool.

reply to post by frazzle


Like usual, very well said....This is all about maintaining corporate monopolies, and preventing a free market. With so many regulations, taxes, etc.,,,,,it is very difficult to start a small business these days, which is what our country needs more then ever now.......

The brightest young minds and scientists are often solicitated right out of school to work for the government, big pharm co's.etc., and often must sign gag orders to not "release" any positive technology and discoveries they may make that would challenge the status quo, and the one's that speak out, tend to "dissapear"

Our "rivals" are diabolical, and without ethics and morals. I saw an interview with one of the Rockafeller kid's, can't think of his name now, but it was interesting, he lives on an organtic farm, lol, I a very nice one I'm sure. So that's the way those folks "roll", they certainly are not going to eat the crap they want the rest of us to eat! For some reason I'm guessing his farm isn't being "raided" by the FDA anytime soon.....

Originally posted by MountainLaurel
reply to post by frazzle

 

Like usual, very well said....This is all about maintaining corporate monopolies, and preventing a free market. With so many regulations, taxes, etc.,,,,,it is very difficult to start a small business these days, which is what our country needs more then ever now.......

The brightest young minds and scientists are often solicitated right out of school to work for the government, big pharm co's.etc., and often must sign gag orders to not "release" any positive technology and discoveries they may make that would challenge the status quo, and the one's that speak out, tend to "dissapear"

Our "rivals" are diabolical, and without ethics and morals. I saw an interview with one of the Rockafeller kid's, can't think of his name now, but it was interesting, he lives on an organtic farm, lol, I a very nice one I'm sure. So that's the way those folks "roll", they certainly are not going to eat the crap they want the rest of us to eat! For some reason I'm guessing his farm isn't being "raided" by the FDA anytime soon.....

edit on 30-5-2012 by MountainLaurel because: (no reason given)

That's absolutely true and the news that Monsanto doesn't serve GM soya and maize in their own pharmaceutical factory cafeteria in Buckinghamshire went viral. But because of the added little phrase "as far as is practical", even the people who work for them cannot be absloutely certain they aren't consuming GM. And why should Monsanto care about their workers any more than they do us, they're expendable, too.

I'm wondering, though, how a person (even a young one) who willingly signs a gag order could be considered bright. Maybe very well educated, but not very street smart. If a business owner doesn't trust a perspective employee without cause, why should that someone trust the employer enough to work for them? There are already espionage laws on the books to protect the company from theft of their secrets. That might be too black and white for a lot of people, but I've never been gagged by sticking that principle.

I do think "rivals" might be putting it a little to mildly, although diabolical squarely hits the mark and the rash of suicided and/or murdered biologists is probably just the tip of the iceberg of what these people will do to protect their interests. (I use the word "people" loosely).

Hell, FDA probably patrols the perimeter of that Rockefeller fiefdom to keep the hungry riff raff out. Maybe Robin Hood is looking for a way to penetrate the defenses to feed the multitudes.

Yeah, heard that story about Monsanto cafateria....."limiting" GM foods for thier workers....gee, how nice of them. The only reasons I can see why they would care at all about thier workers is to keep them healthy, with brains that still can function so they will be better workers. That story was very telling about just "how" safe Monsanto thinks GM foods are....

The point about why any "bright" person would agree to sign a gag order is an interesting question, I think it's a few things possibly.

1. They are convinced that it is to "protect the security" of the Country

2. It is very lurative, and they are promised the funding to continue thier work on research they may actually "believe" will help mankind.....hense the high suicide rates.....when thier work is suppressed, and they realise they sold thier souls.

3. They are outright threatened, along with thier families, and I'm sure are well aware these "people" mean business

4. Well, some people just aren't to "bright" no matter how educated they may be.....lol.....


Last.......wouldn't surprise me at all if the FDA protects the organic farms the "elite" own....why not...we have to pay them to raid our farms, might as well add a little "insult to injury" and make us pay to "protect" thier farms...it's so obscence.....if we could find a way to make these "people" pay back the money they outright STOLE, all the while openly "poisoning" people, to the point many just feel helpless and hopeless, maybe we could save our Country.

I try to keep the "faith"....but I think God might be the only one that can kick thier ass....lol...Ron Paul tried hard, along with many Americans, and friends from other Countries.....yeah "rival" was too weak of a term, and I guess all we can do is to try and live on own terms as much as possible, Love the people we Love, share a few laughs and some "healthy" meals with others. I need to go camping soon and connect with nature while I still can.

reply to post by MountainLaurel


The point about why any "bright" person would agree to sign a gag order is an interesting question, I think it's a few things possibly.

1. They are convinced that it is to "protect the security" of the Country

2. It is very lurative, and they are promised the funding to continue thier work on research they may actually "believe" will help mankind.....hense the high suicide rates.....when thier work is suppressed, and they realise they sold thier souls.

3. They are outright threatened, along with thier families, and I'm sure are well aware these "people" mean business

4. Well, some people just aren't to "bright" no matter how educated they may be.....lol.....

1. could be the main reason, although young people are becoming less trusting of late and less willing to shut up, God love 'em. Look at the college kids occupying and flooding Ron Paul events. They seem to be pretty aware of the corruption over politics and money issues.

2. is even more likely. That makes a lot of sense.

3. threats would probably only come after the grand disillusionment became known to the higher ups and would probably be limited to those with high security clearances and access to potentially damaging information, but yes, that's certainly possible.

I try to keep the "faith"....but I think God might be the only one that can kick thier ass....lol...Ron Paul tried hard, along with many Americans, and friends from other Countries.....yeah "rival" was too weak of a term, and I guess all we can do is to try and live on own terms as much as possible, Love the people we Love, share a few laughs and some "healthy" meals with others. I need to go camping soon and connect with nature while I still can.

Scrolling down through the latest posts on ATS and reading other websites can really do a number on my faith, but you can also find many stories of people who are working on ways to fight back against the aggressive nature of corporate power. It is hard to keep an even keel, though, and not vaccilate so much between despair and hope.

I don't think the Ron Paul R3VOLution is over by a long stretch. Not that he could actually win even the nomination with all the election fraud going on, just that he has opened so many eyes and there's no way to unlearn something once it has been clearly seen. The movement will go on, we just don't know what path it will follow or how many obstacles will the thrown into that path. But I guess one of my biggest disappointments over Dr. Paul losing is that the FDA and so many other unnecessary, harmful federal agencies will remain open for business.

Unfortunately I think God is going to force us to get ourselves out of this mess, too, and we humans haven't been very good at undoing our messes. We just move somewhere else and make worse messes in someone else's territory. Okay ... back to despair. See what I mean?

reply to post by frazzle


Yeah, I don't think the "fight" is over yet...and the R3VOLUTION will move forward, and just out of my sincere Respect for Dr. Paul I'll keep speaking out, lol, at least be a "thorn" in thier side. The number of recent resignations of bankers and CEO's fearing mass arrests must mean something?

Who knows, I guess if your rich enough perhaps public humiliation doesn't mean much, but it must take it's toll on some that have been shown to be outright crooks.

Sometimes when I get overwelmed with doom and gloom I play a little game in my head, and imagine the "panel" of people I would put together to make all the "criminals" face justice. No lawyers, paid off Judges, just lie detectar tests on every last one of them, this time Honest people will decide thier fate on Earth, then "do not pass go...straight to jail"....all ill gotten assets seized and used to pay off our debts and re-build America.

LOL, Alex Jones would for sure have to be there, the guy earned it, fighting all these years, way before I ever had a clue, Ralph Nadar might be cool to have there too....who else should be there? Since it's a fantasy might call in JFK, John Lennon, Martin Luther King and Bill Cooper...may they R.I.P.

It quite an amusing game that takes the "edge" off and does bring an "evil" little grin to my face.......sorry God, I am only human and can't help wanting to "judge" them for the harm and death they have caused....you'll have the final say on thier souls.

Originally posted by frazzle
That's absolutely true and the news that Monsanto doesn't serve GM soya and maize in their own pharmaceutical factory cafeteria in Buckinghamshire went viral.

Half the news went viral. The other half didnt.
This being that it was the outsourced catering company, Sutcliffe Catering that put the sign up in the canteen. It was their policy, not Monsanto policy.

But never let the truth get in the way of a good story. "Monsanto wont allow GM in their own canteen" sounds so much more dramatic.

reply to post by alfa1


So the "vender" Monsanto hired to provide food to it's employees doesn't want to serve GM foods? LOL, that's priceless, it's an even better story now. May I ask if you are in favor of GM foods? Are you comfortable having the FDA , a Federal agency over seeing your food supply when Monsanto and Big Pharm. Co.'s actually have a ALOT of influence over FDA policies?

This is a HUGH conflict of interest, and it should NEVER be allowed to have "former" Monsanto people holding any positions of power over seeing food and drug regulation...just seems so obvious to me.

reply to post by alfa1



Half the news went viral. The other half didnt.
This being that it was the outsourced catering company, Sutcliffe Catering that put the sign up in the canteen. It was their policy, not Monsanto policy.

Who set up the contract with Sutcliffe? Didn't Monsanto know Sutcliffe was serving non GM food as much as practlcal in their own cafateria? At least they didn't seem to put up much of a fuss over it and demand that their own brand be served or they'd contract with a different caterer. It would be more interesting to know what the employees who eat there think of the whole dust up in the media.

But never let the truth get in the way of a good story. "Monsanto wont allow GM in their own canteen" sounds so much more dramatic.

It said "not served" not "not allowed." Nope, not quite as dramatic as you'd like to make it sound.

But if you're so pro GM foods, you can have my share since its not served (OR allowed) here, either, whenever practical. Of course GM is hard to detect with the lax labeling laws and I suppose that's either by oversight or design. I'll let you figure out which one it is but there are plenty of clues for you on this thread.

reply to post by MountainLaurel


Sometimes when I get overwelmed with doom and gloom I play a little game in my head, and imagine the "panel" of people I would put together to make all the "criminals" face justice. No lawyers, paid off Judges, just lie detectar tests on every last one of them, this time Honest people will decide thier fate on Earth, then "do not pass go...straight to jail"....all ill gotten assets seized and used to pay off our debts and re-build America.

LOL, Alex Jones would for sure have to be there, the guy earned it, fighting all these years, way before I ever had a clue, Ralph Nadar might be cool to have there too....who else should be there? Since it's a fantasy might call in JFK, John Lennon, Martin Luther King and Bill Cooper...may they R.I.P.

It quite an amusing game that takes the "edge" off and does bring an "evil" little grin to my face.......sorry God, I am only human and can't help wanting to "judge" them for the harm and death they have caused....you'll have the final say on thier souls.

Wow, I like this game. I'll probably be awake all night figuring out who all I would want there to question the defendants. I'd want my Dad there for sure!! And Michael Rivero. I like your crew, too. And I have a friend who'll bring plenty of tar and feathers. What a party!

Originally posted by MountainLaurel
So the "vender" Monsanto hired to provide food to it's employees doesn't want to serve GM foods? LOL, that's priceless, it's an even better story now.

The background to the story appears to be that in 1999, GMO foods were a big topic, well debated in the media and even in the British Parliament. I think its the time when the word "frankenfoods" was invented.
In this frame of anti-GMO public opinion, the Sutcliffe Catering company declared an anti-GMO food policy in *all* places where it was employed, not just at that Monsanto site.
Some said it was a bit silly, considering that (since the Tomato Paste was no longer on the market) there wasnt even any GMO food being sold in Britain at that time.

Originally posted by MountainLaurel
May I ask if you are in favor of GM foods?

As I've mentioned a number of times on ATS, I am in favour of
1. The truth. Which is why I dont like the "popular" version of the Monsanto cafeteria story.
2. The belief that "GMO" is a very wide multitude of different technologies, unfortunately lumped into the one name. There may come a time when real evidence shows some of these technologies are dangerous, and some are harmless. I will support or reject each one on its own merits.
3. And FYI, although not employed or linked to the GMO industry in any way at all, I do have a Uni. degree majoring in Genetics and Molecular Biology so I'm somewhat familar with the details.

Originally posted by MountainLaurel
This is a HUGH conflict of interest, and it should NEVER be allowed to have "former" Monsanto people holding any positions of power over seeing food and drug regulation...just seems so obvious to me.

Agreed.

reply to post by frazzle


LOL, your crew sounds good too so far, I hadn't thought about my Mom, her job would be to give them "the look" only a Mom can give! Sounds like you feel your Dad is an honest man....that's cool...

But man, it would be something else to make all these crooks "answer" for thier crimes in the presence of honest, fair people "armed" with "truth". Can you imagine putting Dick Cheeny on the "hot seat"? I always wonder what could he possibly say to defend himself? Does he hold any "illusions" that he is not a horrible, horrible man responsible for betraying America to the "core" of her Heart?

I guess I'm the "curious" type, I want to know WHY? What goes through thier minds? What does it take to make decesions to poison people through our food and water? What does it take to have complete disreguard for the lives of other people? What happens in thier NWO? Is the agenda to kill most of us? Do they ever lose any sleep thinking of terrified, mamed children hurt in thier insane wars?

Most people just want peace and happiness, and want to "believe" that they have basic rights to the pursuit of life and liberty, I truely do understand why many can not "wrap" thier brains around how SERIOUS these "people" are to bring about thier sinister plans for the World.

reply to post by alfa1


I appreciate the points you have made, I will respect your educational background may give you knowledge of GM foods and technology I perhaps don't fully understand. My educational background at Cal Poly...SLO is in Ornamental Horticulture....so I guess I have a more "earthy" approach to nature, and throughout my career I ultimately rejected pestsides and other chemicals in favor of a more "organtic" approach to gardening.

I am obviously not a big fan of Monsanto, and for that reason something as IMPORTANT as "changing" the course of Mother Nature, effecting seed supplies through GM plants makes many of us uneasy....we don't know the long term implications of doing this....and based on Monsantos "track record" of unethical business practices, I don't think this is something they should be trusted to decide for the rest of us.

I'm not as willing to cut Monsanto any slack on "hiring" a vendor that didn't feel serving GM foods was wiise, I think it's absolutely hysterical .....the irony of it is worthy of mention......Monsanto is certainly cutting no slack to the small farmer's they're willing to devestate.