Muslim Woman Asked to Remove Headscarf in NJ Mall

Originally posted by SGTSECRET
so let me get this straight....it's completely fine to wear pants that hang around your knees and show your undergarments, but wearing something that covers your face is bad?

Actually a lot of cops are trying to put a stop to that, pants around their knees that is. I've seen it first hand where they get on a group of boys and tell them to pull them up. Of course that only lasts until the cops leave and down they go again. What's hilarious is watching them TRY to run while holding their pants up. They look crippled or some thing. LOL!

Needless to say, the picture of the woman can not be identified so in that respect, I can see the problem in a Mall being as they have security issues of their own to deal with. So yes, comply with the rules or leave.

It's no different than being told no hoodies worn on the head when in a store. Same principle.....

I don't have an issue with this. She is in America and should abide by our laws.

Originally posted by buster2010

Originally posted by luciddream
You can practice religion, but when i see this i see domination of women, and as well as security threat.

Oh really domination of women? If a nun were to walk into that mall would they be forced to remove part of their garments as well? Because their religion is dominating them as well.

I always laugh when I hear security threat. People that say this has already let the terrorist win.

A Nun's face CAN BE seen......

The woman in the picture, her face is obscured which CAN NOT be seen nor identified if a situation called for it.

Mall security has their own rules to abide by. Either accept or shop some where else......

Originally posted by ManFromEurope
BS! Your wife wouldn't have to wear a veil there, so why should that muslim woman remove hers in your mall?

BS! Even as a tourist you can run into trouble with the police in muslim country if you're dressed in the modern western way, as it 'exposes' to much and that's evil. I experienced it myself and it's the first thing tourist company tells you: Wear a lot of clothes because you will run into trouble if you don't

And overall, you have to abide the laws of those countries if you are there. Ever tried of ordering a pork dish in a muslim country? What about alcohol? You won't have much success, because they aren't allowed to consume it, so you are also not allowed to consume it, when you're there. (In fact in some of those countries alcohol is legal, if you run around with a bottle Jack Daniels, you'll end up in jail.
You're forced to follow their rules. So why shouldn't they be forced to our rules. Especially if they want to live here.

And i'm all for banning those headscarfs/veils as it's a sign of the suppression of women

It seems like the security was trying to be an A** Ho**, I'm pretty sure it could have been a better way to handle that situation so she didn't fill embarrassed and upset, Human Beings trip me out sometimes, I wish the best for her. Love&peace

Originally posted by getreadyalready

Originally posted by GunzCoty
People don't get it.
It's a mall they have the right to tell her to remove it or leave.
She is upset because she felt he was going to remove it for her, which he has no right to do.

ETA: its not about NJ its about a privately owned mall

edit on 5/24/2012 by GunzCoty because: ETA

Malls, and other private areas of public conglomeration are kind of a gray area. In some cases they are considered public space. I don't like it, but courts can go either way on whether or not a mall is public or private. The same goes for large sporting events, fairs, festivals, etc. They might be private property, but then again they might be public on any given day.

I've worked Malls before at Christmas time and they DO have their own set of rules and regulations. And even Vendors have to abide by these rules as well as the general public.

Same goes for Fairs/Festivals. The Committee people that run these event get together with the police and set up their guide lines for security. Of course, it depends on the area as to how strong the security. Such as State Fairs and such.

One year we worked a festival during Halloween and people were TOLD not asked to remove any masks. We asked our cop buddy's why and they said so they can see their faces. Simple and to the point....

So in our line of work, I understand the way things are now a days as far as security goes and respect it.

Identification of some one is a large concern any more......

It has nothing to do with culture, color or any thing like that. It's all about being able to identify a person if the situation calls for it.

reply to post by ManFromEurope


muslim women wear veils so only their husbands can see the complete beauty and nakedness of their wives in private at their home.

muslim women also wear this as a gift to their husbands.

it is their culture. they are not forced, they are expected to wear it.

just like society expects you to wear underwear and pants when you go out in public.

reply to post by snarky412


I agree, but that wasn't the point of my post. If this lady thinks she was discriminated against, then we have to decide if the "mall" is a public or private entity. A Jewish Synagogue is most likely a private entity when considering whether or not they are required to admit someone from a different religion, whereas a State Park is a public entity. Somewhere in the middle is theatre, and a restaurant. In most cases, a Mall is considered a "public gathering place" and it falls more under laws of the Park than it does the laws of a sole proprietor restaurant.

This topic comes up from time to time regarding guns, and dress codes, etc. I can swim naked in my pool, I can even swim naked at a private party at a club's pool, but I can't walk naked through the mall.

It is never cut and dry about where private rules and public laws intersect in a semi-public area. It always requires a court to sort out the details when there is a disagreement.

[edit] Semi-public spacesA broader meaning of public space or place includes also places where everybody can come if they pay, like a café, train, or movie theater. A shop is an example of what is intermediate between the two meanings: everybody can enter and look around without obligation to buy, but activities unrelated to the purpose of the shop are not unlimitedly permitted.

The halls and streets (including skyways) in a shopping center may be declared a public place and may be open when the shops are closed. Similarly for halls, railway platforms and waiting rooms of public transport; sometimes a travelling ticket is required. A public library is a public place. A rest stop or truck stop is a public space.

For these "semi-public" spaces stricter rules may apply than outside, e.g. regarding dress code, trading, begging, advertising, propaganda, riding rollerskates, skateboards, a Segway, etc.

Wiki

I don't see a security threat or think that wearing something over your head is a threat. It's the mall, in the US. More people have died from dog bites than terrorist attacks.
Have the "terrorist' won so that this person scares people in public. Amazing. What it seems to me is a person in an elevated position of security needs to calm down and get some training so hoodies and veils/masks don't scare him.

Let other people do their thing. If they shoplift or break an actual law, then you can demand to remove the mask. Until then respect other peoples privacy. Same for the people who wear the pants hanging down to the knees. Let them be. Sure it looks stupid to some but that's no basis to harass.

This is what I love about being a libertarian...

Let that woman wear what she wants, when she wants, however she wants--It's a free country,
and everyone enjoys the same freedoms. The freedom to be stupid, the freedom to be religious,
the freedom to say what you want and do anything you want and express yourself in any way, as long
as what you are doing is harming no one.

This one's easy...that woman is harming no one. If you're scared of her, keep your eye on her and
be wary....sorry, but freedom takes a little work.

If what you desire is to sit on your butt and be taken care of by government, one day you will find
that you are either, doing as you're told by government, or sitting on your butt being taken care of
by government--sipping water from a combination toilet/sink/water fountain, and enjoying bologna
sandwiches, unsweetened Kool-Aid and cold concrete bunk beds.

I'd rather keep my eye on the suspicious woman and be a little wary for my own safety....

In fact, it evens feels good to take a little responsibility for yourself....EVERYONE SHOULD TRY IT!

What scares me more is that she probably drove to the mall with that thing on her head. That aside, I don't think most business owners or people who work in these stores feel safe when someone enters the store wearing a mask. I can understand that feeling. I probably would't like it either. Not because I don't respect her religion. It's just that people who cover their faces usually do so to hide their identity in order to commit a crime.

I say we start using Vlad the Impalers method..if you feel the need to wear your stupid little hat we can gladly nail it to your head for you with metal spikes...your in America, follow the rules jack offs..we'd have to do the same in your country

You can never be to careful.
You never know when a ninja is going to strike.

Not sure about other countries but in the UK you're not allowed to wear a hoodie in some shops, but religious freaks can do what they like? Religion is just some fictional belief, and should have nothing to do with law.

im sorry that the truth hers, but if you come to our country, learn our rules.
if you wanna wear your scarf of shame STAY in your country.
we dont want to look at your scarf all day FORCING your religion on us.

with that said the security guard shouldnt touch the woman, she does has human rights.
dunno what to say more.

reply to post by wevebeenassimilated


You took the words right from my fingertips.! She is a US citizen, protected by the constitution. A veil is not probable cause.

Originally posted by smyleegrl
source

A Muslim woman has accused a New Jersey shopping mall security guard of trying to force her to remove her head-covering garment.

“He came into my face and made a hand gesture like he was going to lift my veil off,’ ” Wakeelah Salaam, 30, told The Post of her ordeal at the Bridgewater Commons Mall last Saturday.

“I felt like he was going to do something. I didn’t feel safe in the mall.”

The US-born Salaam said the confrontation happened about 10 minutes after she entered the mall with her two young sons.

She was wearing a Muslim veil known as a niqab, which covered her entire head and face except for her eyes.

Greetings, ATS,

Ran across this story and thought I'd share. Personally, I don't see a problem with the woman wearing her garment, but my guess is there's a fear of potential hidden items ? I find that kinda ridiculous, considering that you could hide bombs or what have you in any type of clothing.

As a Western woman, I find the veil distasteful, but that's my opinion and only reflects how I would feel if I were required to wear it. I am quite aware that many Muslim women feel differently abou the veil, and they have every right to wear it.

So I guess my question is....how do you feel about this? Is it even an issue?

If that's a picture of her, all I have to say......looks like a guy !!!

I don't understand why we need to make a drama about a simple security procedure. Nothing to do with religion or race. Try to go inside a bank with an Anon mask on your face, cops will explain it to you better than me.

Originally posted by apporro
with that said the security guard shouldnt touch the woman, she does has human rights.
dunno what to say more.

If the guard touched her, he made a big mistake. He had to call the cops instead.