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Muslim Woman Asked to Remove Headscarf in NJ Mall

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posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:22 PM
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Originally posted by mysterioustranger
Good. If we went to her country, we would have to abide by their ways. Theyre here...so abide by ours.


What the!?!?

There is no law that states a woman may not wear a veil in this country.



Why the hell did this guy get 67 stars for this B.S. post?



edit on 25-5-2012 by eLPresidente because: (no reason given)




posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:23 PM
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reply to post by poet1b
 



However, they should be restricted in how little clothes they should wear.

And just as they should be restricted in how little they wear, women should also be restricted in how much they are allowed to wear.

That is balance, that is sanity.


I see.

Someone else should decide how much is too much or too little, and by dictating that amount, we are so much better than the oppressive Muslims? And that is balance and sanity?

Do you see the insanity in that notion? We should override the oppressive policies of someone else with our own version of oppressive policies, because we know better than they do?

Of course, I am a all for personal responsibility, extremely limited government, and little to no regulation in most areas, so we are WAY FAR APART on what we think is balance or sanity.

The thing is.... if they don't like wearing them..... and they are in the US..... then they can just...... stop.


We don't have Sharia law, they most likely will not be killed for it, and if they are attacked, their attackers will be brought to justice and the hole house of cards begins to crumble down, and their culture evolves. They have to change it from within, we cannot dictate it as outsiders.



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:23 PM
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Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by Rosha
 


I think that our public universities should be required to admit U.S. applicants before any immigrants, but immigrants are not teaching their sons that my daughter is a whore because she does not cover her face, or where a headscarf.

How do you not see the difference.


I agree with you that US applicants should get first dibs on education here. We're doing our country a great disservice by allowing massive numbers of foreign students into our universities at the expense of our own children. I am sorry if this is a sore subject for you, but you've now twice this fear that people perceive your daughter to be a "whore" because she doesn't wear a burqa. Has your daughter ever been subjected to that type of judgment based on the fashion or appearance of a Muslim woman?



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:23 PM
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Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by Rosha
 


I think that our public universities should be required to admit U.S. applicants before any immigrants, but immigrants are not teaching their sons that my daughter is a whore because she does not cover her face, or where a headscarf.

How do you not see the difference.




It sounds like you have ESP...you must, to know the words of every hajib or burqa wearing woman.

I do know there are extremists in every group..in my experience of Chinese nationals for example, I am well aware already not ALL Chinese nationals are even students let alone directly buying their way through Uni.

How can YOU not see that not all muslims are sharia fundamentalists who want to kill you?


I see your fear..I see what you think..I see what you've 'heard'..and it comes down to my own experience, and that is that Ive not met one single hijab wearing woman that called me a whore for not wearing hijab.

Your experience..if it is first hand experience..might be different.


Ro



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:24 PM
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Originally posted by eLPresidente

Originally posted by mysterioustranger
Good. If we went to her country, we would have to abide by their ways. Theyre here...so abide by ours.


What the!?!?

There is no law that states a woman may not wear a veil in this country.



Why the hell did this guy get 67 stars for this B.S. post?



edit on 25-5-2012 by eLPresidente because: (no reason given)


Uhhh, yes there is. Depends on where you live, but there are many laws across the nation saying one cannot hide their face. They have been posted throughout this thread, and there was an example from here in Florida where a boy was arrested for wearing a mask walking down a sidewalk. One statute was even posted.

Read through again.



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:26 PM
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reply to post by Rosha
 


I have no fear of Muslim women wearing burqas, I feel sorry for them. I would like to see them freed.

I have talked to them. They are quite ready to talk any time they get a moment away from their controlling men.

You see what you want to see, because it is so much easier to be politically correct than to stand up for what is right.



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:26 PM
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Originally posted by redneck13

Where we part ways is in your belief that you or anyone else has the right to tell someone else what is or is not a valid expression of ownership. Ownership and property knows physical boundaries, so your argument that property owners shouldn't refuse service to people covering their face in a Western nation is irrelevant. Neither you nor I have the power to dictate the property owners practices by another. Period. That line of thinking is in direct conflict with the Constitution, and the ideals this nation was founded on. Regardless of how you feel about it personally, you don't have the power to override the Constitution. And if you are truly a patriotic American, that should never be your desire.


LMAO!!! Once again the mosquito regurgitates the same talking points, without addressing the issue. Kudos!



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:27 PM
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Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by getreadyalready
 


Yeah, the burqa fad is taking off all over the world, as free women everywhere embrace this fabulous form of dress. NOT.


The burqa and the niqab shroud the full body, covering every part of a woman except her feet. The niqab includes a slit for the eyes, whereas the burqa has mesh netting. Malalai Joya, an Afghan MP and a devout Muslim, hates wearing it. "It's not only oppressive," she says, "but it's more difficult than you might think. You have no peripheral vision. And it's hot and suffocating under there."

When visiting Australia recently, Joya didn't pack her burqa. She is one of the many millions of Muslim women around the world who choose not to wear it



Read more: www.smh.com.au...

Who do, who do you think you are fooling?


edit on 25-5-2012 by poet1b because: up the sarcasm.

edit on 25-5-2012 by poet1b because: typo




See that wonderful word CHOOSE

THAT is what is important. CHOICE.

I support those that CHOOSE to..and those that CHOOSE not to..equally.



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:29 PM
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Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by Rosha
 


When I look into the eyes of the women I see regularly wearing a burqa, I see a frightened young woman, or an older woman who has her spirit broken.

Not all, but mostly.


So your problem is you. You are projecting your feelings onto someone who you claim you pity and want to help. That is a most arrogant trait; feeling as though you are in a position to offer pity and comfort to someone else because of your misgivings about their religion. We're starting to scratch the surface here...



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:29 PM
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Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by Rosha
 


I have no fear of Muslim women wearing burqas, I feel sorry for them. I would like to see them freed.

I have talked to them. They are quite ready to talk any time they get a moment away from their controlling men.

You see what you want to see, because it is so much easier to be politically correct than to stand up for what is right.



Controlling men are a hobby of mine. At least they were many years ago in my rowdier days.

There is no woman on this earth more fun to flirt with than the wife or girlfriend of a jealous, machoistic man.
Arab men, and Hispanic men, and Italian men are the most fun!! I have a Cuban friend now that is so much fun to rile up. His girlfriend gets a kick out of it, but man does he hate it!

I do not understand jealousy in the slightest bit, and if some guy flirts with my wife, it is a compliment to us both. If she enjoys it, even better. If he gets out of line, or if she asks him to leave her alone, then that is where I come in, but the men that get all possessive and controlling are just too much fun to poke with sticks.



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:32 PM
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Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by Rosha
 


I have no fear of Muslim women wearing burqas, I feel sorry for them. I would like to see them freed.

I have talked to them. They are quite ready to talk any time they get a moment away from their controlling men.

You see what you want to see, because it is so much easier to be politically correct than to stand up for what is right.




And what is "right" according to you, is for a man, a stranger, one in a position of authority ( security) to, and without due cause, detain, threaten, intimidate and harass a mother and her children in public, simply for going to a shopping mall in NJ USA after she made a choice to wear a niqab ?


ok..


That's different to what you're saying she is subjected to in her own home or religious group how exactly?


If it had been a baseball cap she had on..it would be an assault had he actually touched her to remove it...under law. The veil is no different in legal terms from a cap..the assault is assault regardless.


Grow up.

Ro
edit on 25-5-2012 by Rosha because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:41 PM
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Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by getreadyalready
 


There are plenty of hot women out there who like to wear revealing clothes, and revel in the power it brings them over men.

However, they should be restricted in how little clothes they should wear.

And just as they should be restricted in how little they wear, women should also be restricted in how much they are allowed to wear.

That is balance, that is sanity.

You are either kidding yourself, living in denial, have yourself completely fooled, or don't care, if you think most women wearing those horrible outfits want to wear them.





omfg

you're kidding..." should be restricted"

wtf?

...just who do you think you are exactly?

Speaking only for myself...I will wear what I wish, when I wish and wherever and whenever I wish and all I can say to the above is you and who's army is going to tell me otherwise?

MY sense of style, needs, beliefs, choices and morality determines what I wear and what I feel comfortable in not YOURS! You have NO right to tell others what to wear..you are NOT the law and not my God!

YOU thankfully..do not choose how much I will or wont wear. And while the law does set boundaries..which I do often adhere to for my own comfort or for respect, even then its only an imposition if I am not prepared to accept the consequences of not adhering to those boundaries. Even so..UNDER LAW this woman is protected. Its as simple and as difficult as that.

Don't like that? Maybe consider moving to a more 'nazi like' nation were only certain types of people are welcome.


Ro

>done



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:43 PM
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Originally posted by guitarplayer
If I were to wear a KKK hood because of my religion would that be ok?


only if your black
that is rasist against whites



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:53 PM
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Originally posted by draco49
As a Constitutional Libertarian, it really grinds my gears when people propagate hate and discrimination, completely dismissing the Constitution we ALL live under when it suits them. I am completely intolerant of intolerance LOL


You might want to direct some of that venom at your government in that case. They, not the people, are the biggest culprits of dismissing your own Constitution.

T



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 09:57 PM
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Originally posted by guitarplayer
If I were to wear a KKK hood because of my religion would that be ok?


No. The Klan isn't a religion. It's a pack of sexually repressed, Baptist men who are insecure about the size of their penis'



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 10:01 PM
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Originally posted by torqpoc
You might want to direct some of that venom at your government in that case. They, not the people, are the biggest culprits of dismissing your own Constitution.


You're certainly correct about that. The state of the US political landscape has sickened me for the past 20 years. My biggest hope right now is for Ron Paul to be elected President. In my opinion, he's the only candidate Thomas Jefferson would vote for.



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 10:02 PM
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I guess I fall into the category with the ones posting about security issues, or maybe a better term, loss prevention. I saw one post about wearing a ski mask in a store, they cannot identify you, or more to the point, the FACIAL RECOGNITION software cannot identify you.

It is common place now for large retail outlets to use said software to identify known shoplifters and the like. I know of at least one instance in the last few weeks of a person I know being banned from that big Mart that sells Wals, and headed off at the pass, being hauled to jail for trespassing, known, busted before, shoplifters!!

So in that aspect, the guard had every right to ask her to remove it, IMO. If indeed that is the reason.

Hell, even facebook uses it, TAG your it.

Sorry if that has been posted before, but I was not going to read through the pages to see.

edit on 25-5-2012 by timewalker because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 10:02 PM
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Originally posted by draco49
It's apparent that you've never read the Qur'an or had any meaningful conversations with Muslims or an Imam. What you are speaking about is the twisted interpretation of a particularly fanatical and tiny sect of Islam. The majority of Muslims do not carry those beliefs or engage in those practices. Dude, you gotta get out more.


I'm not sure which version of the Qu'ran you read Draco49, but after reading many of your posts, starting with the ones where you degenerated to name calling, I can see you're also in dire needing of getting out more. You really need to stop condescending people and bullying them to fall in line with your beliefs.

The majority of Muslims follow the Qu'ran, the Qu'ran is not full of fluffy rainbows and unicorns, it's full of pretty explicit texts dealing with "how to deal with non believers". It also makes it pretty clear everyone should be converted to that religion, much like the Bible and Christianity.

Meaningful conversations with an Imam? So in one post you slate all religions then you state we should talk to an Imam to have a meaningful conversation about.. religion? Bwa.

Furthemore, it is not a "tiny sect".. seriously, get a grip and stop being such a staunch proponent of "Draco49"'s version of the world, history and religion.

T



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 10:37 PM
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Originally posted by torqpoc

Originally posted by draco49
It's apparent that you've never read the Qur'an or had any meaningful conversations with Muslims or an Imam. What you are speaking about is the twisted interpretation of a particularly fanatical and tiny sect of Islam. The majority of Muslims do not carry those beliefs or engage in those practices. Dude, you gotta get out more.


I'm not sure which version of the Qu'ran you read Draco49, but after reading many of your posts, starting with the ones where you degenerated to name calling, I can see you're also in dire needing of getting out more. You really need to stop condescending people and bullying them to fall in line with your beliefs.

The majority of Muslims follow the Qu'ran, the Qu'ran is not full of fluffy rainbows and unicorns, it's full of pretty explicit texts dealing with "how to deal with non believers". It also makes it pretty clear everyone should be converted to that religion, much like the Bible and Christianity.

Meaningful conversations with an Imam? So in one post you slate all religions then you state we should talk to an Imam to have a meaningful conversation about.. religion? Bwa.

Furthemore, it is not a "tiny sect".. seriously, get a grip and stop being such a staunch proponent of "Draco49"'s version of the world, history and religion.


I think you're taking a few things out of context here. Let me make myself clear. I am not a member of any religion and have no sort of religious agenda. I think they are all equally silly. Nothing you've said about the Qu'ran is incorrect. What you've left out is the interpretation and ethos that the majority of American Muslims follow. Just like the Bible, the Qu'ran is filled with horrific stories depicting the worst in human behavior, promises of great reward for the faithful, and damnation for the non-believers. With the Bible, those who follow it literally, word for word, are considered to be the more radical fundamentalists. The same is true for Islam; Those who practice a strict adherence to the literal word are what we call the Islamic Fundamentalists. Just as Christian fundamentalists comprise a minority of the totality of Christianity, Islamic fundamentalists comprise a minority of the totality of Islam.

In America, Muslims tend to be more moderate as a whole. I've had several conversations with the Imam of the Mosque near my old school in Philly, I've had Muslim co-workers, and friends. These people are not evil. And they're not terrorists. They want the same things the rest of us do; a stable family and home-life, a decent job to earn a living, and the right to practice their faith, which is strikingly similar to both Christianity and Judaism. A few bad apples and a massive propaganda campaign, starting with the administration of George HW Bush, has created an atmosphere of indoctrinated fear and hate towards their entire religion in one sweeping motion. What makes it worse is that sectarian disputes and violence has been going on under the umbrella of Islam since their Prophet Mohammad died back in the late 600 AD period. Now, all these factions that really don't like each other, are all lumped together and branded as "evil". And that's just not true.

These people are no different than you or I (and I'm NOT referring to the jihadists), and I think it's terrible that we've allowed such a pervasive and largely-invalid prejudice to infect us. Everyone acts all patriotic and pro-America, until it comes time to extend the same rights and respect to these people that we automatically extend to every other religion. Then the logic breaks down, the arguments become nonsensical and circular, and the person who was previously sane and rational completely breaks away, submitting to this indoctrinated fear and hate. If I didn't make these points clearly before, you'll have to excuse me. I'm not a perfect person by any stretch of the imagination, and I'm subject to the same emotion-fueled rants as anyone else is when engaged in a heated debate. I hope this clears up any misconceptions I may have perpetrated.



posted on May, 25 2012 @ 10:40 PM
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reply to post by draco49
 



Once again the mosquito regurgitates the same talking points, without addressing the issue. Kudos!


At what point do you realize that posts like this completely destroy your credibility.

Learn to use some humor.

I don't project my feelings, I recognize a legitimate threat. No fear, just plain ole response of tactical defense.

Try walking into a mall naked, with a couple of your kids and see how badly they violate your rights.

You are clueless at this point in the debate.



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