Muslim Woman Asked to Remove Headscarf in NJ Mall

I'm not religious at all and I think veils are ridiculous especially when worn in extreme heat. BUT I think every human being has the right to wear what they want to wear, Christians, Muslims, black, white, gay straight, you should be able to wear what EVER you want. She's in a mall with her two children shopping just like everybody else only difference is you don't like her garment? So the hell what, I don't like the tacky clothes 99% of Americans wear but I'm not going to run up to them and tell them to take it off.

reply to post by CaticusMaximus


I guess she is protected.

609.735 CONCEALING IDENTITY.

A person whose identity is concealed by the person in a public place by means of a robe, mask, or other disguise, unless based on religious beliefs, or incidental to amusement, entertainment, protection from weather, or medical treatment, is guilty of a misdemeanor.

Originally posted by CaptainPicard
reply to post by CaticusMaximus

 

I guess she is protected.

609.735 CONCEALING IDENTITY.

A person whose identity is concealed by the person in a public place by means of a robe, mask, or other disguise, unless based on religious beliefs, or incidental to amusement, entertainment, protection from weather, or medical treatment, is guilty of a misdemeanor.

BAM!

on the other hand, i greatly support a business's right to refuse service. (as the mall itself is a business not just the stores)
though i dont know if the security guard was properly enforcing a certain rule or not. so i cant make that call.

we dont know for sure if this was race related, it could have been. but then that would be contrary to my belief that a business has the right to refuse a muslim, and i clearly believe that would be wrong as well.

cant really win. take away some freedoms from some, to preserve the greater freedoms of most.
both sides have to sacrifice something. 100% freedoms for all is a dangerous world.

Originally posted by draco49

Originally posted by CaptainPicard
reply to post by CaticusMaximus

 

I guess she is protected.

609.735 CONCEALING IDENTITY.

A person whose identity is concealed by the person in a public place by means of a robe, mask, or other disguise, unless based on religious beliefs, or incidental to amusement, entertainment, protection from weather, or medical treatment, is guilty of a misdemeanor.

BAM!

Well, those exceptions cover pretty much everything don't they? It is amusing to cover one's face, or I was on my way to a party, or I have a cold today, or i didn't want to catch a cold today, etc., etc.

Why even have the law?

How about this mask?




From:

www.oddee.com...

Originally posted by darthdamo74
reply to post by smyleegrl

 

No Difference

edit on 25/5/12 by darthdamo74 because: (no reason given)

I would have so much fun screwing with those idiots.

In general, I hate political statements. We always have something going on here in front of our Capital building, and I just love to heckle them, even when I agree with them. Attention seekers and rabble rousers. Sure, stand in the mall in your camo pants and black mask, you're perfectly safe there, I bet you won't walk across my yard looking that way.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
Well, those exceptions cover pretty much everything don't they? It is amusing to cover one's face, or I was on my way to a party, or I have a cold today, or i didn't want to catch a cold today, etc., etc.
Why even have the law?

I agree... that's a pretty stupid law, at least the way it's written. I suspect that when they say "amusement" and "entertainment", they are referring to Halloween, Santa at Christmas time, the mall Easter Bunny, or en route to a masquerade. Of course if I got caught wearing a ski-mask in a robbery attempt, I could claim it was for my amusement and at least get off of that charge

ive seen the nuns can do it so muslims should be allowed to wear a veil......

www.google.com...:en-USfficial&biw=506&bih=477&tbm=isch&p rmd=imvns&tbnid=aBXQngkBIUWRzM:&imgrefurl=http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php%3Faz%3Dview_all%26address%3D389x5221827&docid=dC2OW TDpBzDMrM&imgurl=http://redriverpak.files.wordpress.com/2008/08/nuns.jpg&w=457&h=300&ei=udS_T8KYAqOSiAKLm5HeBw&zoom=1 nuns head covering vs muslim head covering www.google.com...:en-USfficial&biw=506&bih=477&tbm=i sch&tbnid=5_0a2EXo4-9aIM:&imgrefurl=http://www.esculent.co.uk/blog/current/july_09.html&docid=006uYYYHP63FhM&imgurl=http://www.esculent.co.uk/blog/ima ges/islam/niqab4.jpg&w=1100&h=919&ei=INW_T6jkEYeyiQLesqHVBw&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=226&vpy=149&dur=3174&hovh=205&hovw=246&tx=122&ty=104&sig=10705678200570 9750019&sqi=2&page=1&tbnh=111&tbnw=114&start=0&ndsp=10&ved=1t:429,r:2,s:0,i:89 notice that the nuns face is not covered but in that perticular head covering the muslim womans veil obscures her face where as this one does not www.google.com...:en-USfficial&biw=506&bih= 477&tbm=isch&tbnid=-jtppRgxDPSGWM:&imgrefurl=http://itsafreeworld.wordpress.com/page/2/&docid=W0KhbdYauqCXlM&imgurl=http://www.mediacurves.com/Culture /J6652/headcovering.jpg&w=545&h=202&ei=IdW_T5rnDuasiALStuiGCA&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=12&vpy=226&dur=394&hovh=130&hovw=352&tx=234&ty=69&sig=107056782005709 750019&page=2&tbnh=64&tbnw=172&ndsp=12&ved=1t:429,r:4,s:10,i:14 so yeah as long as the face isnt covered i dont have a problem with it but i think all face coverings should not be allowed in public places

just figured id clear up the well the nuns can do it so every one should be able to do it non sense

Originally posted by getreadyalready

In general, I hate political statements. We always have something going on here in front of our Capital building, and I just love to heckle them, even when I agree with them. Attention seekers and rabble rousers. Sure, stand in the mall in your camo pants and black mask, you're perfectly safe there, I bet you won't walk across my yard looking that way.

I bet the ski masks and camo won't do much good against my PPK

reply to post by KilrathiLG


Please edit and correct your post. Your ridiculous link attempts are causing a reasonable risk to my eyesight and sanity.

reply to post by draco49

Of course if I got caught wearing a ski-mask in a robbery attempt, I could claim it was for my amusement and at least get off of that charge

Tell them you wore the mask because you had the flu and you didn't want to infect anyone during the robbery. Make it part of your official statement, so they will have to read it during the trial. Jury sympathy right off the bat. You must be a nice guy if you went into the robbery worrying about everyone's good health.

Probably those that defend her wearing it in the US would be among the same calling it savage/inhumane/brutal if she was forced to wear it in another country.

If it's clearly her choice, if she is sound of mind, not a victim of abuse, leave her alone.

I think it's nuts, just like that entire set of cultural laws, but this is the country where you are supposed to be allowed to be as nuts as you want to be as long as it does not infringe upon someone else's pursuit of insanity.

Originally posted by getreadyalready

Tell them you wore the mask because you had the flu and you didn't want to infect anyone during the robbery. Make it part of your official statement, so they will have to read it during the trial.

Jury sympathy right off the bat. You must be a nice guy if you went into the robbery worrying about everyone's good health.

The armed robber with a heart of gold. That old chestnut.

Originally posted by primus2012
Probably those that defend her wearing it in the US would be among the same calling it savage/inhumane/brutal if she was forced to wear it in another country.

If it's clearly her choice, if she is sound of mind, not a victim of abuse, leave her alone.

I think it's nuts, just like that entire set of cultural laws, but this is the country where you are supposed to be allowed to be as nuts as you want to be as long as it does not infringe upon someone else's pursuit of insanity.

I completely agree. If it's something that's being forced upon her against there will, I am 200% against that because it would be a violation of her personal freedom. If she wears it by choice in accordance with her faith, she should be left alone.

reply to post by WeRpeons


their heads yes but rarely their faces (would make for more interesting news) but that is a good point you brouhg up about the reporters star for you!

Originally posted by mysterioustranger
Good. If we went to her country, we would have to abide by their ways. Theyre here...so abide by ours.

Our ways clearly spell out FREEDOM OF RELIGION. If you are not familiar with this, then you do not know our ways.

First of all, I'd like to say I totally dislike the veil. It's a sign of oppression of women. Patriarchal dominance is obsolete and has no place in today's society.
...BUT...
That is my personal opinion. Now if this woman was wearing it on her own accord; if she was acting on her own will, nobody has the right to tell her to remove it. If women wearing bikinis, skirts, etc. are acceptable, so should be veils. It's her body, she has the right to cover it the way she wants.
Then comes the question of security. Now was this woman acting in a threatening way? Was she going around the place cursing, threatening or hitting people? If not then there shouldn't have been any problem. She was carrying some ID right? That should have been sufficient.

reply to post by MegaMind


good points but i think federal law comes into play you can discriminate against people legally if they are not a protected class of people (ie gays religious people minorities etc or deny some one due to color for example would be illegal)but i think it would be legal to refuse service to any one wearing a particular brand of shoe (not a protected class) but not on grounds of what clothing they wear if they are religious in nature (crosses menonite hats head coverings etc ) but a ban on sunglasses or hoodies for example would be legal under that they can reserve the right to refuse service to any one law thingy.i think it really comes down to what they tell you when they ask you to leave as the deciding factor of if it is legal or not.


(not condoning discrimination by the way just saying that in a few cases it can be legaly done for good or bad reasons by good bad or just ignorant people as the law stands)

Originally posted by draco49

Originally posted by darthdamo74
The Koran warns muslims of lood women, Nowhere to my knoledge does it say women have to hide there entire body and face, only the muslims with extreme fundamentalists views aprove of this you know the ones that agree with murdering infidels

Excellent spelling and grammar. We got another scholar here. Earth to idiot: the burqa is NOT just for Islamic Fundamentalists. Go to Philly, go to Dearborn, MI. Go anywhere in the US where there's a large Muslim community (hint: they're not in your backyard, Skeeter) and you'll see FLOCKS of women covered head to toe wearing identical all-black burqas. By your logic, they must ALL be murdering terrorists. Please, remain in the swamp and try not to reproduce.

1. I have never claimed to be a shcolar or anything remotely similar

2. I live in England so I wont be visiting any of the places you mentioned above

3. Not quite in my back yard but close enough to have a distinc effect (are they in yours ?)

4. Flocks of women covered head to toe wearing identical all black burqas! you mean like a uniform ?

5. By my logic, they are more than likely sympathisers