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The Court System and Freemasonry.

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posted on May, 23 2012 @ 09:11 AM
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reply to post by Honor93
 


In all of these types of threads there is one thing I never understand. Why does anyone think they have a right to know anyone else's secrets?

There are secrets passed from father to son, father to daughter, mother to son, mother to daughter, friend to friend, generation to generation, professional to professional, etc., etc. Nobody is demanding that their plumber spill all the secrets he learned from his mentor. No one is demanding every girl spill the all the secrets their mother told them. No one is demanding every member of the Chamber of Commerce regurgitate every conversation or contact they made at their meetings.

Does Masonry have secrets passed down from generation to generation? Kind of, but nothing more than the secrets Ray Kroc passed down to his managers or my mother passed to me in the course of growing up. Our secrets are exactly what any mentor/mentee would pass between one another. We aren't giving out Nuclear Launch Codes or bank account numbers. I wish we were, but we're not.

We are giving out secrets like, "Hey youngin, you've got a young wife at home, why are you spending so much time at the Lodge?" or "Hey youngin, I overheard you complaining about your job and thinking of quitting, do you have another job lined up? Have you talked with your boss? Have you talked with your wife? Have you really thought this through? What is it about this job that is so terrible, will a new job really solve your problems, or do you just need to buckle down and muscle through?"

Life secrets. Important stuff. Things that everyone should know, and everyone should have a resource for getting the answers they seek, but nothing that you couldn't get from a dozen different trusted sources.




posted on May, 23 2012 @ 09:22 AM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 
you're welcome. you just don't strike me as a corrupt leaning candidate in life.
and just because you're a Mason doesn't mean you're a bad person either.

i have fond, very fond memories of the Masons, the Shriners and their families, their contributions and their talents to pull my hometown out of more than one disaster. They, all the groups are deserving of more accolades than words can muster, for their acts.
However, all the good works in the world can still be ... a path to you know where.

all i'm gonna say on the subject of "secrets" is they are very much existing, very much in action and painfully obvious to those who know where to look and what to look for.
i fully understand the sudden curiousity and the need to know expressed by so many.
kinda reminds me of the game Jenga.



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 09:29 AM
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reply to post by Honor93
 


I am still curious to know where you got the information that PA lawyers had to have masonic connections to take the bar in the early 80's. I have family in PA and even a lawyer in the extended family. She is not a mason.
I look forward to learning something I didn't know.



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 09:30 AM
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Originally posted by Honor93
reply to post by W3RLIED2
 

since you admitted you're somewhat of a Masonic geek, perhaps you can enlighten me regarding this ...
in the 1980s, in certain parts of PA, unless you had a written reference from either a Master Mason or Lodge, you could not get access to the state Bar exam ... why was that ?


just so this doesn't mysteriously disappear.



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 09:36 AM
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Originally posted by network dude
reply to post by Honor93
 


I am afraid I will need to see some sort of proof for that accusation.

Masonry has NOTHING to do with the court system. Unless of course you provide proof to state otherwise.
are you joking ??
what kind of proof would be acceptable to you ??
do you think this was demanded in writing ??
did you even ask which region or lodge was involved so (if you are a member), you could ask an elder ??
geeeez, you ppl kill me.

did i not say ... in certain parts of PA ??
i don't remember if it was a local, municipal, township or regional request but i do recall the difficulty a family member endured because Papa wouldn't sign for them. (he was GIP)
point is, i asked if the "demand" could be explained by those in the know ??

you say, it has NOTHING to do with court system, yet, so much of it is intertwined and either you don't see it, view it as coincidental or colorful rather influential and that's fine if it's your opinion, just kindly keep it there because your opinion doesn't make it fact or true for that matter.



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 09:45 AM
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Originally posted by Honor93
reply to post by getreadyalready
 

i have fond, very fond memories of the Masons, the Shriners and their families, their contributions and their talents to pull my hometown out of more than one disaster. They, all the groups are deserving of more accolades than words can muster, for their acts.
However, all the good works in the world can still be ... a path to you know where.


So, in a nutshell you're saying that despite your own personal (and apparently positive) relations with identified members of Freemasonry, you (for whatever reason not disclosed) harbour suspicions about them and every other member of the fraternity because......because.....what exactly? They're members of the fraternity?

I guess I never can quite understand the predilection of some to resolutely believe the worst possible about someone who has given them no offense (or worse still, given them every possible reason for respect and/or love) based on nothing whatever; based on the motivated hate of certain individuals and groups against groups that deserve to be lauded. This is the same sort of approach that allowed Hitler to rise to power in bad international economic times, pillory (and worse) selected groups within German society and be lauded by the thoughtless and morally-challenged as a hero.

All that is required for evil to flourish is for good people to stand by and do nothing.

Fitz



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 09:49 AM
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reply to post by icepack
 


yes they worship Lucifer.



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 09:53 AM
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reply to post by Fitzgibbon
 


I can speculate on this. I might be wrong, and they can correct me if I am, but I think it goes to the hardline Christian stance of "good works" vs. "salvation." Masons do the best they can as human beings, and for some of us (like me) that is enough, and I have no need for promises of heaven or salvation, but some people believe you absolutely must accept Jesus Christ or else you are going to hell despite your best works.

What they don't understand is that Masons don't claim any rights to heaven, and we do have Christians that are also Masons and believe one must accept Jesus Christ, but since Masonry is not a religion, those people can co-exist with people like me without any problem.

Masonry is not a path to salvation, nor a religion, and we don't do any good works as a means to get into Heaven, but some people don't understand that part, and they hate Masonry on a religious basis. My father falls into that category.



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 09:54 AM
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reply to post by Honor93
 


OK, you are serious here,

Let me try to grasp this. You claimed that in certain parts of PA, anyone who wished to take the Bar exam would need a masonic reference. OK, the key part here is "you claimed". remember that.

Then I asked for the location of that information. I think that is very appropriate seeing as how you had asked a mason to explain why that was the case.

If you arbitrarily make stuff up to make other people look bad, that is what we call "dishonest".
And when you are pointed out being deliberately "dishonest" you have the choice to either recant your statement, or try to get all squirley and cover it up.

Now that I have clarified my point, I eagerly await your link to where this information can be obtained. If I am wrong here, please explain why.



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 09:59 AM
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Originally posted by DeafRaz
reply to post by icepack
 


yes they worship Lucifer.


clear and concise.
I like that.



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 10:14 AM
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Originally posted by W3RLIED2
reply to post by protocolsoflove
 


So far every thread you've started has been directed at Freemasonry using poor sources and some flat out bunk. What's your issue? Spit it out already.

Did a Freemason wrong you some how? Are you envious of the strong fraternal bond forged between brothers? Did you get denied admission on an application to join? Do you just need a boogy man to make you feel better about your own misguided beliefs? Do you think Jesus wants you to persecute people blindly in his name?

There is little to no logic in some of the things you and other anti masons seem to blindly latch on to as factual. Do you simply accept this garbage as truth because some moron on the Internet says Masonry is anti Christian?

I just don't get you [snip] people. Why not just live and let live?

Stop casting your judgements on others who have done nothing to wrong you. There is only One who will pass judgement on the deeds of men, and that certainly is not you, protocol, and not any of the other zealous Jesus freaks who think they speak for God. Step down off your high horse and join the rest of us regular ass humans.
edit on 23/5/12 by masqua because: removed ensor circumvention


I agree. This is not the first post that you have started with "facts" obtained from poor sources. If you are so interested in freemasonry, join a lodge. You will discover nothing unusual or odd, and you are free to leave at any time. I promise you that we will not turn you into a devil worshipper or anything else rediculous. What we will do for you is give you a sense of brotherhood, fellowship, and most importantly, the values we practice will make you a better man. The whole "thing" about masonry is that "it will take a good man and make him a better man".



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 10:20 AM
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Originally posted by Honor93

Originally posted by network dude
reply to post by Honor93
 


I am afraid I will need to see some sort of proof for that accusation.

Masonry has NOTHING to do with the court system. Unless of course you provide proof to state otherwise.
are you joking ??
what kind of proof would be acceptable to you ??
do you think this was demanded in writing ??
did you even ask which region or lodge was involved so (if you are a member), you could ask an elder ??
geeeez, you ppl kill me.

did i not say ... in certain parts of PA ??
i don't remember if it was a local, municipal, township or regional request but i do recall the difficulty a family member endured because Papa wouldn't sign for them. (he was GIP)


Perish the thought that "Papa" mightn't have been dissembling (assuming "Papa" even ever said such a thing). In any case, it falls to you to support the 'facts' and prove your assertion and not to others to go on a wild goose chase disproving it


Originally posted by Honor93
point is, i asked if the "demand" could be explained by those in the know ??


Insomuch as even you don't "know" anything in particular about it, how about you research yourself?


Originally posted by Honor93
your opinion doesn't make it fact or true for that matter.


On that much we can agree. Opinions are like **; everyone has one.



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 10:22 AM
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reply to post by Honor93
 


I expect this.

edit on 23-5-2012 by network dude because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 11:57 AM
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reply to post by network dude
 

not sure what you're expecting, i cannot view videos.
however, your expectations are far beyond the subject matter of the this thread.

how you would expect me to "research" a family event is beyond me.
i know why the relative was refused {it'd be a nunya to you}, i know due to Paps influence, no other capable signer would for 3 counties wide and i know the event destroyed my relative who eventually drank to death.
what more do you need to answer my Question, not my claim ??

PA is a big, wide state and you never asked where or when for that matter.
alot of ppl suffered effects of TMI in York and Allentown but not so much in Ebensburg or Altoona or Philly. what makes you think a request such as a written referral would be the same in Lincoln as it is in Mansfield?

besides, the whole topic is conspiratorial because none of it can be proven, that's the whole point.



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 11:59 AM
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Originally posted by W3RLIED2
reply to post by Honor93
 


That sounds highly irregular to me, and doesn't make much sense. I know there are plenty of masons who are lawyers, but I've never heard of that.
not just plenty, but a majority of lawyers and judges are masons.

these days, i would agree that's it's highly irregular but it wasn't when Anabelle Mansfield passed the bar.
it's probably just coincidence, but isn't it odd that she gained acceptance just a year after marrying a mason.

know what else is odd, finding her "argument" before the IowaSC isn't so easy, even online.
guess what else is odd, she earned the title yet chose not to employ it.
one more, is it also coincidental that the first US Order of the Eastern Star came to be in 1850 and was started by a lawyer ?

sorry, i missed the joke entirely.
i'd rather all of them get taxed and give the rest of us a break



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 12:12 PM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 

Why does anyone think they have a right to know anyone else's secrets?

because these are not personal secrets and you should know so.

these are not employment or proprietary secrets and you know it.
these cannot be achieved with minimal participation, hence the growth in America.
what better way to walk off a cliff if you can't see it coming ??

i don't need to ask what the secrets are anymore, the answers are everywhere.
the warnings issued have been well heeded and i shall never intentionally tarnish the memory of those i love.


No one is demanding every girl spill the all the secrets their mother told them. No one is demanding every member of the Chamber of Commerce regurgitate every conversation or contact they made at their meetings.
hmmmm, these words from the poster against govt spy techniques and the Patriot Act and recordings everywhere ???
while it's true these demands aren't made, requests sure get a speedy response.
regarding the CoC, well yes, they're called "minutes" and they're kept on record for many decades.


Does Masonry have secrets passed down from generation to generation? Kind of,
i stopped the statement there because that says enough, may i refer you back to the cliff scenario ??

those life secrets you share at the lodge over cocktails are not the secrets of which many refer and you know it.





edit on 23-5-2012 by Honor93 because: add txt



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 12:16 PM
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reply to post by Honor93
 


Ok, so we were discussing third party hearsay. Now I get it.
I sure hope you don't expect any of us to provide a reason why this possible event may or may not have happened.

What is the ratio of judges and lawyers who are and are not masons?
Oh, and I hope I am not being too forward in asking that when you answer that, you provide more than opinion for a source.



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 12:17 PM
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reply to post by Honor93
 


what do you want to know?



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 12:18 PM
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reply to post by Fitzgibbon
 

Perish the thought that "Papa" mightn't have been dissembling
dissembling what ?? why would he hide his intent from anyone in the room ??
were you there ??
guess what, i was.

what you don't know involves specific behaviors of the person requesting the referral.
those are none of your concern.
however, the family (self included) discussed Paps decision at great length, how else would i know this??
you can question my family history all you want, it doesn't change any of it.

besides, back to the OPs points ... Masonry has always been involved with the Courts.
Masonry was involved in the First Continental Congress and all that's transpired since.
for anyone to think otherwise is simply naive.



posted on May, 23 2012 @ 12:29 PM
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I've only just read the first page. I feel compelled to reply to the blibbering idiots that want to know, "What's your problem OP? You think they devil worship?"

Although its not as blunt as that, yes that's what they do! (Look no further than Bohemian Grove!)

I've got a thread in the works that is about secret societies, from how they formed, major points in history, how many pies they've got their fingers in, up to what they do today.

I wasn't interested up until the other week, it was something I always over looked, however upon findin reoccuring names, organisations and ideoligies that kept popping up in other lines of research, I was compelled in investigate.

So far, I havent strayed from already known history, and its already scary, before we even entertain the thoeries and "what ifs".

The history of these organisations is worrisome. As are their teachings, and activities.

It should more worrisome to think that all of these theoligions were some of the best minds universities could deliver, and they knowingly conspired and spread there ideals and teaching infecting every other educational system and political system, and the rituals that they DO conduct are based on the occult, old gods, and mystic energy, as the stonemasons utilised the power sacred geometry and earth forces they were infiltrated by the masons, who were in turn infiltrated by the illuminati in 1776.

Think of the influencial people, and your founding fathers who were masons, and all the elite world wide who have stemmed from the same, if not similar groups, no one can believe its merely coinsidence, that's foolish.

Its an elborate plan that's coming together, the "abolishment of all soverigne independant states" yet the preservation of heritage and monarchies".

Look at the symbolism in even the most standard and basic of the rituals, that most masons never believe could leave to evil, do they question what the purpose of some superficial ritual is for anyway?

Messing ariund with skulls, bones, swords, coffins, blood... If that's not a little dark, excuse me!
edit on 23-5-2012 by Sinny because: (no reason given)





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