Tai,

Actually I think kok was trying for sarcasm…I think.

Originally posted by curme
The majority of people at Gitmo, like Abu Gharib, are innocent. It's popular in Iraq or Afghanistan to blackmail people. Say, "Give me money or I'm going to tell the Americans you are a terrorist." If you don't pay, you go to jail. I was reading a Seymour Hersh article that talked about how Gitmo was worse than Abu Gharib, and when these atrocities come to light, America is going to be shamed for years to come.

They are innocent are they, please post your information, I would very much like to see it. Otherwise stop pretending you know something when obviously you don't.

Originally posted by mad scientist

They are innocent are they, please post your information, I would very much like to see it. Otherwise stop pretending you know something when obviously you don't.

What can you tell us about those people? Who are they? What did they do?

Burden of Proof is the responsibility of the state, not individuals, and for good reason.

Can you tell me a good reason to keep people in detention indefinitely without charges or trial? Who are those people?

Originally posted by taibunsuu

Originally posted by Koka
Well, as long as it doesn't affect your good self, I assume the US is well within it's right s to hold people for 3 yrs without charge. It's not like the US went to Afghanistan or Iraq for the good of the local people.

How would you like it if you were held in a cage for three years with no charges, no rights, no access to counsel, no hope of getting out. I don't think you'd be so smug. Empathy - use it. If you cannot charge a person with a crime, you must release them. If you are retaining them for information, you cannot treat them like dogs. If an individual is holding information and you torture them, they will tell you anything you want to hear but not necessarily the truth. Human resolve is greater than physical pain and the act of torture reinforces the informants opinion of his captors being the enemy. If you capture a foot soldier in a war, the information he can give you is good for minutes or hours, or a day at most. Are all those guys in Guantanamo foot soldiers, or leaders? If they are foot soldiers, their information potential is long gone. If they are leaders, charge them and try them. There's no reason to keep people detained indefinitely.

taibunsuu
Couldn't agree more, not sure why you're directing it at me though. I thought my sarcasm was more than obvious.

keholmes
I won't even pretend to have read the Geneva Convention, but I do know that the reason the US is using Gitmo and refusing to refer to the "illegal combatants" as POWs, is so they do not have to comply with the Geneva Convention, and get to make up their own rules. That is a blatant abuse of power, something the Bush Administration seems to enjoy flaunting more and more.

Innocent until PROVEN guilty. Yes, that's right. That's the way freedom loving people do it after all.

Sorry, Koka, some replies I see are completely serious even as they redefine hyperbole.

Koka,

How is it a blatant abuse of power....is there some treaty to prevent it, quite the contrary if the Geneva convention applied which it does not see part 1 article 118

Prisoners of war shall be released and repatriated without delay after the cessation of active hostilities

Have hostilities ceased?
As for the Geneva Convention I will make it easy for you…it doesn’t apply: see part 1 article 2.

Originally posted by keholmes
Koka,

How is it a blatant abuse of power....is there some treaty to prevent it, quite the contrary if the Geneva convention applied which it does not see part 1 article 118

Prisoners of war shall be released and repatriated without delay after the cessation of active hostilities

Have hostilities ceased?
As for the Geneva Convention I will make it easy for you…it doesn’t apply: see part 1 article 2.

Was it not GW that said the "War in Iraq had been won".
At the time, I believe he was standing on a large naval ship as a photo opportunity. Does this mean the war in Afghanistan is not over, in fact was it a war. Or will they be released when all terrorists have been won over. It all seems very grey and convenient, that no real definition is being given.

Fact is they are being held illegally, as they are not recognised as POWs.
And the US administration refuses to answer global concerns about the issue, a law unto themselves.

kokn,

The gitmo prisoners are from Afghanistan. And no there was no cessation of hostilities in either conflict with regard to terrorists. To the best of my knowledge there are no Iraq POW, except for a few of the deck that are being processed....Geneva Convention wasn't quite geared for complete collapse within days....even if it applied.