What do we do when religion is a drirect threat to freedom and liberty?

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posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:30 PM
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Religion is the US has built in protections, they are not taxed as up to this point they are able to do what they want even if its sheer lunacy in the public eye (think westboro baptist church).

I live in a red state were we have dry counties and your not able to buy or sell certain products on certain days. History shows us back before prohibition took hold of the country it was preceded by a great religious revival across the country, and this helped usher in decades of religiously inspired government banning of certain products, and that leads us to where we are today, a absolute ton of money wasted for what? So one group can tell us all how to live?

Today the great evil the Religious are battling against is the Homosexual community. They wish to deny this group the right to marry and live happily ever after. They have even gone as far as making this a national election issue in the zeal to limit the rights of others. They are doing everything they can to dictate how everyone must live.

What do we do? How can we make this group understand these protections in place for them, should be in place for everyone, yet all there main efforts seem to be to limit the right of those who do not agree with them?

What say you ATS?
edit on 19-5-2012 by LDragonFire because: (no reason given)




posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:35 PM
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I would apply this to muslims, gays, socialists etc.... Think about the law of unintended consequences before you propose to change the status-quo.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:37 PM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte
I would apply this to muslims, gays, socialists etc.... Think about the law of unintended consequences before you propose to change the status-quo.


Please show me where I have lost any freedoms or liberty to a muslim, gay or socialist?

However I did say religion so muslims would be included in my op.

I will add that during this time of economic downturn and other obvious problems in the states the state of Mississippi and North Carolina are busy working on social laws like gay marriage and abortion instead of fixing there roads or improving there schools and other things that would in fact improve there state and the lives of the people who live there.

edit on 19-5-2012 by LDragonFire because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:40 PM
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If a community votes to be a dry county, THEY made the choice. You can move or deal with it. Why should you dictate how that community wants to live (as long as they are not breaking the laws of the land)?

I lived in one of those counties. It was an inconvenience to drive 20 miles to buy alcohol, but the community chose to be dry. About two years ago, there was another vote and two of three precincts voted to change things. Those precincts now sell beer and wine (but still no hard liquor). If you want to change things, work within your community to do so.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:43 PM
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Originally posted by queenofswords
If a community votes to be a dry county, THEY made the choice. You can move or deal with it. Why should you dictate how that community wants to live (as long as they are not breaking the laws of the land)?

I lived in one of those counties. It was an inconvenience to drive 20 miles to buy alcohol, but the community chose to be dry. About two years ago, there was another vote and two of three precincts voted to change things. Those precincts now sell beer and wine (but still no hard liquor). If you want to change things, work within your community to do so.


Sorry I don't agree with being able to legislate a religious belief.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:43 PM
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Originally posted by LDragonFire

Please show me where I have lost any freedoms or liberty to a muslim, gay or socialist?

However I did say religion so muslims would be included in my op.

Sharia is coming, so you will find out soon. Gays now leave straights subject to extraordinary punishment due to unprovable "thought crime". Socialists force me to give over my hard earned money to support them when they choose not to work, or choose to have children that they cannot afford. That is theft imo. Stealing isn't right, and it still isn't right when you get someone else to do it for you. There are multiple examples I could cite for each category, but you get my point.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:44 PM
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What is needed is for a purge of any recognition of religious benefits or institutions from any and all government, and an amendment to clarify the position of the states to disallow any clearly religious function, organization, or influence to effect our government, from local city council, up to the fed.

Then remove any recognition of marriage from the hands of the state....recognise civil unions (for legal purposes..choose a single person at any given time to be your partner..be it for romantic or simply legal issues)..let the churches decide who they will marry and give them back their power.

This protects all parties (state and religion) for the long term. If Islam, Buddism, or spagettiism takes over the US in 20 years, the majority cannot influence banning things (such as crosses, booze, or pasta) for the individuals. Any person serious about religion shouldn't be demanding a amendment to stop gays from marrying..they need to stand up and stop marriage from being a state issue to begin with.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:45 PM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by LDragonFire

Please show me where I have lost any freedoms or liberty to a muslim, gay or socialist?

However I did say religion so muslims would be included in my op.

Sharia is coming, so you will find out soon.


If you believe that, then would you agree to my former post above?



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:45 PM
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Originally posted by LDragonFire

Originally posted by queenofswords
If a community votes to be a dry county, THEY made the choice. You can move or deal with it. Why should you dictate how that community wants to live (as long as they are not breaking the laws of the land)?

I lived in one of those counties. It was an inconvenience to drive 20 miles to buy alcohol, but the community chose to be dry. About two years ago, there was another vote and two of three precincts voted to change things. Those precincts now sell beer and wine (but still no hard liquor). If you want to change things, work within your community to do so.


Sorry I don't agree with being able to legislate a religious belief.
Then move. The socialist republics of California and/or Massachusetts would certainly welcome you.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:46 PM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by LDragonFire

Originally posted by queenofswords
If a community votes to be a dry county, THEY made the choice. You can move or deal with it. Why should you dictate how that community wants to live (as long as they are not breaking the laws of the land)?

I lived in one of those counties. It was an inconvenience to drive 20 miles to buy alcohol, but the community chose to be dry. About two years ago, there was another vote and two of three precincts voted to change things. Those precincts now sell beer and wine (but still no hard liquor). If you want to change things, work within your community to do so.


Sorry I don't agree with being able to legislate a religious belief.
Then move. The socialist republics of California and/or Massachusetts would certainly welcome you.


If your willing to push someone out what else are you willing to do? This is the point of the thread.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:47 PM
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Originally posted by SaturnFX

If you believe that, then would you agree to my former post above?
Nope. I would not.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:50 PM
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Originally posted by LDragonFire
If your willing to push someone out what else are you willing to do? This is the point of the thread.
Nobody is forcing you out. You have a choice, actually two. 1) work to change the law. 2) move to where your views match those of the majority. We are all different, there is no "one size fits all". That is why I oppose federal interference in state/local/individual affairs.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:50 PM
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Originally posted by LDragonFire

Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by LDragonFire

Originally posted by queenofswords
If a community votes to be a dry county, THEY made the choice. You can move or deal with it. Why should you dictate how that community wants to live (as long as they are not breaking the laws of the land)?

I lived in one of those counties. It was an inconvenience to drive 20 miles to buy alcohol, but the community chose to be dry. About two years ago, there was another vote and two of three precincts voted to change things. Those precincts now sell beer and wine (but still no hard liquor). If you want to change things, work within your community to do so.


Sorry I don't agree with being able to legislate a religious belief.
Then move. The socialist republics of California and/or Massachusetts would certainly welcome you.


If your willing to push someone out what else are you willing to do? This is the point of the thread.


I think you missed an amusing aspect there

he says in a big warning style...Sharia is coming
aka, he is nervous about a religion (islam) suddenly moving into legislation

You say, you dont want religion to be legislated
He then tries to insult you and your concern about religion becoming legislation

cognitive dissidence? hypocrisy? what are we dealing with here?

Its ok if its the christian religion being legislated..
aka, theocratic desires..christian taliban fan.

You live in the land of the free..so long as its my freedom and not yours.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:50 PM
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reply to post by LDragonFire
 


We live in a State's rights nation. It is in our constitution. You can work to change what you don't like about where you live by using your freedom of speech etc., or you can move to another area where you better agree with the laws and ordinances already in place. This is not a form of church control as you assert, but rather it is the laws and ordinances put into place by the people who live where you also live.

No I don't want to fundamentally change our constitution, so NO I don't agree with you.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:51 PM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by LDragonFire
If your willing to push someone out what else are you willing to do? This is the point of the thread.
Nobody is forcing you out. You have a choice, actually two. 1) work to change the law. 2) move to where your views match those of the majority. We are all different, there is no "one size fits all". That is why I oppose federal interference in state/local/individual affairs.


Do you believe in freedom and liberty for all, its a yes or no question?



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:51 PM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by SaturnFX

If you believe that, then would you agree to my former post above?
Nope. I would not.

Then I hope you get what you desire.
May you one day live in a land that imposes religion on you.

sidenote caveat: may that religion not be your specific one


All things are equal after all...enjoy your call to prayer.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:54 PM
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reply to post by LDragonFire
 

The county I referenced chose to be dry, not for religious reasons, but to limit the problems and subsequent expense that results from alcohol consumption. It's a small county. The two precincts that voted to eliminate the ban are looking to entice chain restaurants that serve alcohol to move in because a new freeway will be going through the area. They weighed the cost vs. revenue issues, and the community saw the advantages and voted it in.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:54 PM
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reply to post by SaturnFX
 

Its why I used religion in the op instead of Christianity, religion seems to be like fads today its red wine a decade from now it will be white wine....

Religion in America are attacking the rights of several groups of people, yet at the same time they claim they are under attack, this is one of the reasons there so so few teens claiming to be religious compare to a decade ago.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:57 PM
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Originally posted by LDragonFire

Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by LDragonFire
If your willing to push someone out what else are you willing to do? This is the point of the thread.
Nobody is forcing you out. You have a choice, actually two. 1) work to change the law. 2) move to where your views match those of the majority. We are all different, there is no "one size fits all". That is why I oppose federal interference in state/local/individual affairs.


Do you believe in freedom and liberty for all, its a yes or no question?
I don't believe that you have the right to force/compel me to accept your views. Work to change the views of your neighbors, or move to where your views match those of your neighbors. The fact that you have to drive an extra 20 miles to buy alcohol does not make you oppressed imo.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:58 PM
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As far as religion goes, if you don't agree you do not have to participate. When you get stuck in a place such as a dry county, you can move. You don't have to live there if it makes you feel oppressed. Dry counties aren't religion as much as they are trying to stop alcohol related deaths and crime. When I was in Texas there were dry counties, but that's just the way they have it set up, no skin off my back. Not hard to drive somewhere else to get a beer.

Religion doesn't force anything on you unless you let it in the US.

You are free to move from such places.
IMO.





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