It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Karma and Duality are philosophies of evil

page: 2
2
<< 1    3 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:22 PM
link   
everyones addicted to rationalism and logic here.


the universe and the world work in mostly an irrational state.




posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:26 PM
link   

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
reply to post by arpgme
 


I don't think there is a duality, just varying degrees of one thing. For instance "good and evil," there is no separation between the two, just varying degrees of difference. All dichotomies are false.

In my opinion, it's apparent that there is no such thing as karma. Its also apparent that we will try as hard as possible to tell ourselves otherwise.





its in our human nature to make the unexplainable or abstract accessible. we like to put things in categories or make divisions to understand something.


pointing out what is good and evil us us trying to quantify something or make it more clear. saying that things are varying degrees of one another (while very observant and i do agree with you here) is that as well.



we wont be able to figure out our world through western lenses. we will just barley be able to make a small hole in the blanket of the cosmos to see through the other side.


and i do realize that in my comment above i am acting trying to think rationally which is the nature of the whole problem.

edit on 19-5-2012 by krossfyter because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:30 PM
link   
I'm just going to throw this out there since many of us frequent each other's threads.

I perceive that reality is All-One, fully interconnected... so I can agree on one level that there is no duality, only One thing.

However, at the same time there are varying levels of superficial separation, division, and fragmentation.

When this All-One is fully unified, there is no-thing.

The illusion of separation, duality, relativity, and subjectivity within the All-One is what allows there to be an experience or observation other than the no-thing of the unified All-One.

Where is evil? It's a relative concept of individual or societal norms.

Peace.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:30 PM
link   
reply to post by krossfyter
 


And yet, you are here creating more categories, those who see things "rationally" and "irrationally"...



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:38 PM
link   
reply to post by arpgme
 



You are doing everything in your power to defend your belief .

I could say the same for you.


There is a difference between a dirty filthy room, and a room that is clean that sometimes have a little bit of dirt.

Yes, but dirt is dirt my friend... whether a little or a lot.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 01:47 PM
link   

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by krossfyter
 


And yet, you are here creating more categories, those who see things "rationally" and "irrationally"...



DUUH!


like i said at the end of the comment...

"and i do realize that in my comment above i am acting trying to think rationally which is the nature of the whole problem. "



please dont use this to dismiss what i am saying. use it to strengthen your opinion of the nature of reality.
edit on 19-5-2012 by krossfyter because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 02:37 PM
link   
reply to post by krossfyter
 


Even if there are some irrationalities in nature, there are also rationalities, so it is not completely one or the other.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 03:03 PM
link   

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by krossfyter
 


Even if there are some irrationalities in nature, there are also rationalities, so it is not completely one or the other.



well actually how much of the supposed "junk dna" makes up most of our dna? how much dark matter makes up the whole of matter?

there are FAR more things that we do not understand then what we do understand.
edit on 19-5-2012 by krossfyter because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 03:06 PM
link   
reply to post by arpgme
 


IF Karma is evil... or does not exist... Why did Jesus speak of it?

Explain these verses... without the existance of Karma...

Matthew 7:2
For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

Mark 4:24
And he said unto them, Take heed what ye hear: with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you: and unto you that hear shall more be given.

Luke 6:38
Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.


Read the entire chapter for context...

Karma is real my friend... its a Natural law




posted on May, 19 2012 @ 03:13 PM
link   
reply to post by Akragon
 


Because that is the PERSPECTIVE he held.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 03:16 PM
link   
reply to post by arpgme
 


Karma is heartless and evil.

Christian, are you? Sounds like something a Christian would say, is all. How is a Universal Law of Karma evil? Can you prove what you say, or are you simply parroting what someone told you to say?

According to the Buddhist teachings, the law of karma says that for everything you do there is a result. Or as they say, for every cause there is an effect. Do something Good, and Good will return to you. Do something Bad, and Bad will return to you. How is that evil? Based on the Law of Karma, when we perform an act that is intentional, we reap the results or effect, either good or bad.


"I am the owner of my karma .
I inherit my karma.
I am born of my karma.
I am related to my karma.
I live supported by my karma.
Whatever karma I create, whether good or evil, that I shall inherit."
The Buddha, Anguttara Nikaya V.57 - Upajjhatthana Sutta

source
I suppose now you will say Buddhism is evil?

For future reference, the word "evil" means:
1. morally reprehensible
2. arising from actual or imputed bad character or conduct
3. causing discomfort or repulsion
4. causing harm
(Websters)
I challenge you to show how the Law of Cause and Effect fits these descriptions, and how Karma is "heartless" and "evil".



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 03:18 PM
link   
reply to post by arpgme
 


Interesting... I thought Jesus was "the truth"


Either way... IF you don't believe Karma exists... prove it to yourself.

Do something out of the ordinary for yourself... I would suggest it be an extremely positive action or deed... but if you insist on finding the extent of the effects of Karma... Do something very negative...

Give it some time... and watch whatever you do come back to you...




posted on May, 19 2012 @ 03:23 PM
link   
What would be the alternative, non duality? It is what it is my friend. Except it.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 04:37 PM
link   

Originally posted by autowrench
reply to post by arpgme
 


Karma is heartless and evil.

Christian, are you? Sounds like something a Christian would say, is all. How is a Universal Law of Karma evil? Can you prove what you say, or are you simply parroting what someone told you to say?


I can not "prove" that karma is evil since that is my perspective based on my values and my value is FREEDOM.

however, it is heartless. If you do evil you will be given evil to you. There is no forgiveness with karma. If you do things or others, you will get things in return, this will make people dull and heartless doing things only for their own benefit instead of from their heart.

It builds a SLAVE mentality, if something bad is happening in your life, you can just blame it on karma instead of doing something...

It also builds heartlessness. If someone is suffering, you don't have to do anything you can just say that is what they get because they must have had evil karma in the past.

Or you can selfishly take the opportunity to clear your own karma. Instead of just helping people from your heart you are not heartless only doing things for your gain...



Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by arpgme
 


Interesting... I thought Jesus was "the truth"




I never said that it was a lie. I said it was a perspective, and while it is a valid one. It is bad for the reasons that I already stated many times...


Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by arpgme
 


Either way... IF you don't believe Karma exists... prove it to yourself.

Do something out of the ordinary for yourself... I would suggest it be an extremely positive action or deed... but if you insist on finding the extent of the effects of Karma... Do something very negative...

Give it some time... and watch whatever you do come back to you...


If karma is true then it should be IMPOSSIBLE to get away with evil, and yet people do. It should be IMPOSSIBLE for good people to suffer, and yet they do.

And just to justify this SLAVERY of karma, people will say, it is from a past life.



Originally posted by Theophorus
What would be the alternative, non duality? It is what it is my friend. Except it.


I believe an alternative perspective to duality is monism.



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 04:49 PM
link   
reply to post by arpgme
 


You do know the difference between spirit and matter. Mind and body. Please expand why you think mind and body are the same. Your theology is bunk.
Monism is not an alternative to what is black and white
edit on 19-5-2012 by Theophorus because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 04:55 PM
link   
reply to post by arpgme
 



I never said that it was a lie. I said it was a perspective, and while it is a valid one. It is bad for the reasons that I already stated many times...


The only way Karma can be bad is if one creates said Karma for themselves.... you get what you Give

The exception of course is... IF you have Karma from previous lives that has yet to be resolved... That can be extremely BAD... but not Evil...

read those passages i posted again... You get what you give, nothing less... nothing more in terms of what you claim is "evil"... But if you do "Good" you will be rewarded... and more.


If karma is true then it should be IMPOSSIBLE to get away with evil, and yet people do.


It is 100% impossible for anyone to "get away" with anything... Do you believe man can fool God?


Some things can not be resolved within one life time...

You only believe these "people" you speak of are getting away with it... but there are absolutes in life...

Death is an absolute... then they will face their maker...


It should be IMPOSSIBLE for good people to suffer, and yet they do.


Suffering is a part of life.... Take up your cross my friend...

It is also self inflicted... Believe it or not...

Some things are true regardless of "belief"


And just to justify this SLAVERY of karma, people will say, it is from a past life.


yup...

But one does not need to be a slave to his/her Karma...

Love is the path... Jesus knew it... Buddha knew it... Krishna knew it...

ANYONE who reads and understands the words of Jesus knows it...

And now you know it...



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 05:04 PM
link   
reply to post by arpgme
 


You can respond selfishly to whatever you're presented with. That freedom exists within you, and you are the only one who can choose how you will respond.

You can call the difference between you and not-you "duality" and I guess you're correct in that assignment of terminology definition. However, if this is true, then duality is primordial to the existent state. This means that nothing that exists can exist in any other state than (at the very least) a state of duality (existing as itself as opposed to existing as that which is not it). This is what bothers me about the threads that condemn duality as being illusory. To exist, it must be delineated from that which either does not exist or from that which exists as what it is not. There is no other definition of existence. This means that singularity can only refer to a restricted definition of qualified inimitable Identity as achieved by a contextually relative unique whole. It can't be a full and true description of anything that actually exists.

Before the advent of existence, the absence of existence may have constituted a singularity, but the identification of that absence of existence (which did obviously occur) eliminated the reality of singularity or even the concept of singularity as an existential reality that can exist, persist or ever achieve existence. The water is over the dam, the ship has sailed, the milk is spilt, the cat's out of the bag, and there will never be a singularity to ever exist again.

This may sound harsh, but it's really best if you guys deal with it, and make the best of the dualistic reality you dwell within.
edit on 5/19/2012 by NorEaster because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 05:27 PM
link   
reply to post by NorEaster
 


Your theory of existence is incorrect.There is no non- existence!. To be non- existant is in itself a state of existance. Things exist as being non-existant. That famous saying to be or not to be makes no sense. We exist... we are... there is no alternative
edit on 19-5-2012 by Theophorus because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 05:31 PM
link   

Originally posted by arpgme
Originally posted by autowrench

If karma is true then it should be IMPOSSIBLE to get away with evil, and yet people do. It should be IMPOSSIBLE for good people to suffer, and yet they do.


And exactly who is deciding on whether one gets away with evil? How do you determine that? You are under the impression that suffering comes from evil, or that suffering is evil, when it is not evil, it is sorrowful. Karma is not a system of merit, where one "gets what they deserve", it is one of cause and effect, in that, when you do good, good does return to you effectively, and when you do bad, it returns effectively, both as a matter of circumstance, not as a matter of what is deserving.
edit on 19-5-2012 by juveous because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2012 @ 05:36 PM
link   

Originally posted by Theophorus
reply to post by NorEaster
 


Your theory of existence is incorrect.


What exactly is the theory of existence?




top topics



 
2
<< 1    3 >>

log in

join