Bad Ufologists-Lets clean the closet of any skeletons

I agree with the majority of your good and bad list, however
:
Art Bell and George Noory should be taken off your bad list. They do not really belong there, because they are open venues that basically let anyone say what they want. They hardly ever ridicule any guest they have, and for that, show professionalism, irregardless of what they believe personally, which is really hard to tell anyway.

They have hosted every one of your good and bad list. Some of them we would not ever know unless they got a spot on this program.

The problem with the whole "cleaning the closet" idea is that the best lies contain partial truths.

That is to say, for example, people like Steven Greer, who may not always appear to be 100% geniune do sponsor events like the Disclosure Project, which IMO is some of the best evidence to prove the existance of extraterrestrial beings.

I think alot of prominent "ufologists" are a bit too ambitious at times and that leads to a credibility check, but it doesn't nessasarily make them liars.

Which is why, you can't just "clean sweep" everything.

Originally posted by Echtelion

Originally posted by TiM3LoRd

Originally posted by Echtelion
Philip Schneider: most controversial case, in my opinion, when it comes to knowing if he's for real or not, which is pretty much impossible, and also for the disturbing scope of his theory (that aliens were already here for a long time, living underground, feeding off human glands, and are now taking over governments from within). The stuff he said is both insane and makes sense at the same time.

edit on 18/5/12 by Echtelion because: (no reason given)

edit on 18/5/12 by Echtelion because: (no reason given)

True or not I pose this question to you all, It is the one thing I cant figure out.

All humans have the capacity for evil this is common knowledge. So its not hard to imagine that those in power are there because they love power. THATS FINE....What I DONT GET is why do they need to be so evil about it. If they love power why not use that power benevolently? Why treat your fellow man like such refuse that you poison his food with additives and all the rest of the crap they put in there. Why hold back humanity? our success is THEIR success? It doesnt make sense...Unless..the people at the top pulling the strings are not human. I am not going to label them because I dont know what they are but I do know what they are NOT and they are NOT human by what we define a human. Because if THEY are human then I dont know what that makes me because I am NOT like them.

Im just going by observation here not off any opinions of others. So now we go deeper down the rabbit hole. Who controls the controllers??

Well, if you think about what Tim Good and Phil Schneider said, there is reason to believe that the reason why there were UFO abductions was to test the human genome in order to make experiments on alien/human hybrids. The fact that most abduction cases stopped at some point in the '80s (with only a few cases since then), this is consistent that they started creating hybrids about 20 years ago, and these hybrids are total slaves to the alien agenda, they'll just do what they're told without a question.

I feel that there are people in society are just like that... bland, mindless, subservient drones just working to maintain the status quo as it is. They simply don't seem like the have a SOUL, at all. Human machines. This is crazy but it could be for real...

It is scary and true all the same. The drones are put in power and places of influence and then told to influence people. They do this through marketing and media. They then brainwash the majority who are simple minded but well meaning humans who then copy the behavior they see in the media and society in general. Once this point of critical mass has been achieved the majority will keep themselves in check by maintaining whatever status quo the drones tell them to follow.

again this is just my opinion based on observation.

I started listening to Art Bell back in the early 90's and have fallowed the show since. Even my family memeber who worked at NORAD loves that show, LoL.
It's a fun show, makes one think but dosn't tell one how to think. It's open to all views no matter how crazy, streight laced or what have you.

Hehe, I love Tsoukalos...I like to see what his hair is going to do next on Ancient Aliens.

I understand the frustrations in UFOlogy though, there is alot of garbage to sift through. There needs to be some spring cleaning done without closing off the venues for more 'out there' stuff. I think if UFOlogy was more organized and less of a cluster fluffeluck, more and more people would be receptive to what it has to offer and our advancement towards the truth would be more fruitful.

Originally posted by Renegade2283
I want to talk about David Ike specifically. To this day I have the feeling that he is there purely to demean both ancient alien theories, and any conspiracy theory. I feel he isn't just wrong, but intentionally destroying the credibility of all conspiracy theories. Just think what power David Ike gives to others to attack any of these theories. It seems that any time you mention any NWO conspiracy or Ancient alien theory, people use David Ike as a reference to compare to.

All I am saying is that we should not let the sensationalists like David Ike and the guys from Ancient Aliens demean what we all know might be some of the most important lines of thought we have ever stumbled upon.

I believe these people are the definition of a dis-info agent. If David Ike and those other people's true intention is to make money, then perhaps they're not only making money from the ignorant people who believe them.

I ask that we( the people here on ATS) do not lump these theories in with such blatant disinformation. Same for Stitchin, though his intentions are less clear.

edit on 18-5-2012 by Renegade2283 because: (no reason given)

edit on 18-5-2012 by Renegade2283 because: (no reason given)

Well you do make a good point. David Icke is clearly living off his books & monies made from lectures because he definitely doesn't have a day job but I don't think he's raking in the $$ like so many think. If you cast his reptilian theory aside his work is still very thorough and full of information, and he provides source but it's up to the reader to fact check and whatnot. I personally don't think Icke is in it for the $$ or daresay fame . Imagine if he never went in the life direction that he did and continued to broadcast as a sports announcer and seeing where his normal life would have taken him instead of being the crazy conspiracy theorist he's become.

reply to post by Swills


I agree.

If you can ignore David Icke's reptilian theories, the rest of his work is quite excellent.

He is all for exposing the Satanic Pedophile war mongering zionists cabalists.

And that's an excellent thing.

reply to post by reeferman


That's pretty much what I'm seeing in this thread. Note..this is not a perfect world where everything is absolute.
The OP just sounds dissapointed in ufo research in general.. While I agree that more than a few of these people tend to embelish to boost their snake oil sales, but to show them all in a negative light is unfair.
Who can say that at least some of the listed people have not made at least some positive contributions?
Seems like a thread I would expect from an imature child. Sorry OP but thats how I see it.
Just because the end result is slow coming, does that make every contributor bad? We all make mistakes and hopefully learn from them.

I just remembered Christopher Everard - he explores many Exopolitical related areas, in particular esoteric practices and the connection of magic to our lives via the psychopaths.

He does not focus on Intergalactic Visitors and Craft but he certainly links into the area. He seems thorough and I have enjoyed the DVDs I have purchased - very well researched and he appears genuine.

He would warrant a place on the genuine list unless anyone here knows otherwise.

Much Peace...

reply to post by wutz4tom

Who can say that at least some of the listed people have not made at least some positive contributions?

This field is more forgiving than any other. Anyone can be caught lying and they'll always get another try. They can even claim *conspiracy* so their lies become the tricks of TPTB. They can tell whoppers and people will queue up to defend them on the basis that we can't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Going off the OP's list, here are some saving graces on the bathwater defence.

Steve Basset recently started running on-line polls to have Congress investigate UFOs. It generated some publicity.

Steven Greer attracted a lot of people to ufology.

Howe did some interesting research in the early 1980s.

Klass caused some UFO researchers to be smarter and his 'Klass Curse' remains true.

The rest of the list haven't made a single contribution that we couldn't manage without. The amount of damage Greer's done is far too much to value anything else he's done - in my opinion. One thing that most ATSers don't know about is that Greer's reputation amongst UFO researchers is beyond contempt. Many of them won't even mention his name.

reply to post by Swills

...but I don't think he's raking in the $$ like so many think. If you cast his reptilian theory aside his work is still very thorough and full of information, and he provides source but it's up to the reader to fact check and whatnot. I personally don't think Icke is in it for the $$ or daresay fame

Last year, Icke did a small world tour that covered the UK, New Zealand and the States. I was going to post a thread, but thought why bother? I worked out the total turnover of the tour based on the seats per venue x ticket sales. It was in the low/mid 6-figures and would suggest fame and wealth are doing pretty well.

This year, he's hooked into the 2012 'scare 'em' scenario. He's playing England's national stadium with prices at £40 - £62 and between 5500 seats and 10000 seats depending on sales. With only the cheapest tickets, sales amount to £300 000 for the night (£456 000 top prices). So about £380 000. If we imagine that times are tight and costs are high, 10% would be around £38k for the night.

For a while, he used to run his overseas income money through an off-shore account in the Channel Islands as a charity. This was exposed by an investigative, conspiracy journalist Will Banyan and Icke covered his tracks. Get this though! The accountancy firm he used was the same used by the Rockefellers. Ethics huh?

The point is, combined with 10 years of book sales, DVDs, tours and PayPal clicks on the website, Icke is well into millionaire territory.

Most Icke fans would deflect this and say he's got a right to make money. Yes he has. It's just worth remembering that the man who's telling you rich people are 'paedophilic murdering-satanists' is richer than any of us.

May I ask if you have checked the credentials of all the people he got to testify?

yes son i have i didnt compile this list for fun.Read first then post your rant , clicky and if that isnt enough for you check this one Greer is a Fraud

Originally posted by Sinny
Lol... So many flags, and yet so little content! Not soley aimed at you OP

I tried to edit to add some people and correct a few bits but after 4 hours you cant edit your post and i dont like to make a second one yet.I ll do a revised edition later on

Originally posted by nerbot
How could people forget about the amazing Dr Jonathan Reed.

He killed greys in the woods?I dont know how but somehow i missed this story lol thank you for bringing this to my attention


To The Rest

this thread proved that we need to separate the weed from the chaf,that said it seems easier to just post the people that are simply trying to find the truth.So many hoaxers and so many information surfaced that indeed this conversation has helped uncover all these bad ones

reply to post by Kandinsky


There's clearly money to be made but even if he fills every seat at those prices he's obviously not getting every single dollar, everyone's getting there cut and with that his share is greatly diminished. Does he fill every seat everywhere he goes? No doubt the man has a large following but still, can he do it? If I were him I'd hope too to make max profit because as I said, let's face it, he doesn't have a day job so he's got to make his money while he can. Is he hiding money in off shore accounts? I'd be disappointed if he didn't, I mean the man reports on the western Gov't and banks being the most vile and corrupt entities on this planet so it only makes sense he hides what he can. Is it unethical that he used or uses the same company as the Rockefeller? I dunno, I suppose, but then again they know what they are doing, so makes sense, but you could draw many conclusions if you so wanted it too.

Just because the end result is slow coming, does that make every contributor bad? We all make mistakes and hopefully learn from them.

You completely missed the point but its ok.Just in case you didnt get it

Its another thing to make a mistake another to blatanly tell lies and disinfo

and by the way in page 1 there are two posts,one is for the bad and the second the smaller one is for the good.And its my opinion,You can disagree

thats why i made this thread to trade opinions and see what other people think for our "gods' of ufology

reply to post by Swills
Yeah, I wasn't arguing against his right to make money. The 'ethics' was whether it's right to be celebrated for accusing rich folk of being murderous child-raping satanists when he actually has the same lifestyle and uses the same bankers?

Does this mean Icke rapes babies on his world tours? Has he got a touch of the Gary Glitters?

It's the pot calling the kettle black.

Icke appeals to the type of person who sees nothing wrong with accusing strangers of murder, satanism and child sex/killing. That's a question of morality, but it's their own business and keeps them happy.

reply to post by TiM3LoRd


You

reply to post by IgnoranceIsntBlisss


and you got it all wrong. I am not saying I am certain they are aliens, I think some of them could be (again not certain), probably most of them are not. This is what objective means, being able to accept both possibilities. So I do not see where I am ignoring the other possibility while the majority of you think it has to be only the man-made because you cannot accept other possibility.

reply to post by AllIsOne


"The Day the Earth Stood Still" Original version 1951

Originally posted by Kandinsky
The point is, combined with 10 years of book sales, DVDs, tours and PayPal clicks on the website, Icke is well into millionaire territory.

Really?

Crap I guess I made a real mistake doing all this work for FREE I coulda bin a contender

I like to take things a bit further and say anyone who has ever profited off aliens and ufo mythology should be put on the bad ufologist list. These people are out for making anything they can off the gullible, and mentally-unstable.

They are many people who have been and are aware that religious believes are taking a backseat to the next big hope of extended life, or after life and that's the alien religion. They are smart and will teach us how to live forever you know this lol.

reply to post by schuyler


Now, OP, you see the extent of the problem. It would be nice to simply clean house of "Bad Ufologists," but that's difficult to do when you have True Believers (tm) like Monocular here who will lap up every ridiculous story as Gospel Truth and defend nutjobs like Basiago. Even people who are caught red-handed, like Billy Meier, still have their adherents despite the fact they have been caught out. We know where he stole his stuff, yet people like Michael Horn and John Lear still say they believe him.

One of the problems with Ufology is that anyone can play. It's not a matter of knowing what you are talking about. There is no degree for Ufology. There are no standards for education or background, so you have people resorting to logical fallacies such as ad hominem attacks, and they don't even realize they are being illogical.

Here's a little quiz I put together a few years ago just to illustrate the problem. If you can answer these questions about UFOs you might be wortth listening to. If not, I really don't see why anyone should pay attention to you.

Im just wondering... why do you need too listen to people and their opinions too belive in something, add somethign into your reality ? Then when those are labelled hoaxers.. it takes that aspect farther away from your reality.

The bottom line here is this; stop pointing fingers at hoaxers, stop looking elsewhere and the internet for evidence (because you wont find it... if there was evidence of ETs on Earth, we would all know by now), stop disregarding things due to your lack of experience.

DO YOU BELIVE IN ALIENS? That is the ONLY questions that matters, its a yes or no thing. Dont base it on other people and their "debunking" (what a joke..) .. What does your heart say when you ask yourself "Are aliens in my reality?" That is all that matters.. not all these faces the OP has labelled as hoaxers or whatever. Look into yourself and ask the question, you will feel the "yes or no" answer.

Do I belive in Extraterrestrials, other dimensions and Interdimensional Being ? Yes of course I do