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do you think these things are illusory?
What is GOD without Existence?
so the same kind of self generation as a man who is born and lives a linear life and has a line of work,,,, we can view hiim objectively as a part of nature acting out its function,,, just as rain does?
Originally posted by ImaFungi
reply to post by TheJackelantern
"Now knowing at the start that a conscious state can't exist without cause, we can then know that the system as a whole is a self-generating system.."
would you say that capitalism/free market is a self governing system?(at least meant to be) yet it was established and created by people?
a computer can be programed to run endless algorithms and practically fix and run itself,,,,,
there could have been a programmer behind the self solving algorithms of this universe,,,,
but that programmer would have had to be the product of something?
and that something would have had to create the programmer by itself?
Originally posted by TheJackelantern
im not sure about that
If it didn't, this centrifugal force / G-force would have nill effect on the conscious state. Hence, the disruption of information processing of the system. And information can't be made of nothing since nothing can't exist.. So this fundamentally proves the point:
A Creator who contracted or constricted Himself - apart from the whole into 4 elements which would then be the sub-atomic particles of all the universe - above and below could most definitely.
This doesn't make any sense...How do you exist outside of existence to be apart from the "WHOLE"?. That argument again is a self-refutation.. Hence, are you trying to say a GOD can exist in a place of non-existence? Well, at that point, saying your god is outside of existence and in a place of non-existence is like trying to defect to the other side of the debate to try and win the debate. It's a self-admission of the non-existence of said god concept. You can't just toss out "outside the whole" and have it make any sense.edit on 26-7-2012 by TheJackelantern because: (no reason given)edit on 26-7-2012 by TheJackelantern because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by rootbranch2012
Tzimtzum: A Kabbalistic Theory of Creation by Dr. Sanford Drob
I think i found my answer,.,.,.,.,.,.,.
Without existence There is nothing,,,,,,,
With existence there is God,,,,,,,,,,
There is existence,,,, there is God,
what is existence without God
What is God without existence?
without existence,,,, nothing = nothing
if there is God,,,, there exists existence,,,
if there is existence,,,, maybe god is the sum of existence
if there is existence ,,,,, maybe god is existence,,,,
if there is existence ,,,,,, maybe theres just existence
Originally posted by TheJackelantern
So ignoring circular logic and other fallacy games being displayed by some here.. I do believe I might be deserving of the 250 points for winning the debate Without existence there is no possibility of the concept of GOD, and thus I win
without existence there is no possible concept of anything,,, there is no possible anything ,,,, there is no,,, thing,,, there is nothing,.,,.,.,..,
what would you think if god does exist?
what would it mean to you? what would it change intellectually and emotionally for you?
as long as existence existed before this universe,,, a conscious creator ( god) could have created this universe,,
"Hence anything that thinks it's GOD, is in my opinion full of delusions of narcissistic grandeur. :/"
you just think the idea of God is one of delusion and grandeur,..,,.,., but humans have given it that name,, and if god exists,, humans have given it its well deserved prestige,,,,,
if there is a god we do not know what its ego is like,,,,, it "simply" created the universe,,, its not begging you to think or feel anything,,,, if it created the universe it created you and all potential for events in the universe,,,,
we are to decide if that is grand or shrug our shoulders,,.,.,. like an archetecture or engineers work,,,, or if an artist is proud of their creation and proud of their ability for creating it do you have a problem with these peoples egos and sense of value?
Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) is a personality disorder.
The narcissist is described as being excessively preoccupied with issues of personal adequacy, power, prestige and vanity. Narcissistic personality disorder is closely linked to self-centeredness.
Narcissism is the personality trait of egotism, vanity, conceit, or simple selfishness. Applied to a social group, it is sometimes used to denote elitism or an indifference to the plight of others.
* In Matthew 25:41, Jesus says: "Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting FIRE,. . ."
* Mark 16:15-16 15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. 16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be condemned to hell.
* Matthew 10:35-37 35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. 36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household. 37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.
* Luke 14:26 26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.
* Matthew 10:34 34 "Do not think that I have come to bring peace on earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.
you dont believe in this god,, so he hasnt even forced you to worship its ego and ability,,, if a god did create this universe,,, and seeing as how you are interested in philosophy and reality and science,, it seems you traveled the path yourself,,, towards become enamored in wonder of the creator,,