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Shocking New Oil Propaganda Plan to Fool Americans

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posted on May, 16 2012 @ 03:38 PM
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Originally posted by ZindoDoone
reply to post by longjohnbritches
 


For months about two years ago, he was on nearly every venue he could be on TV and in print about his Peak Oil.
Like your links prove. Abiotic oil is real and his Peak Oil game isn't! Every day (well close) we discover new fields of oil that we thought wasn't there. We are re-drilling old wells that have played out in the early 1900's and finding more oil there! It's not secret! Trade Mags have been writing about this for the last two years.
We have oil and gas for 200+ years untapped. The Tech to run it cleanly is already out there. This 'Green Tech' crap doesn't work. It's a scam!

Zindo


Can you demonstrate with a chart or a graphic of some kind that oil is the best for the atmosphere?
And the $.
thanks ljb
edit on 5/16/2012 by longjohnbritches because: space




posted on May, 16 2012 @ 03:38 PM
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Anyone with a dog in the fight is a questionable source of info, API, Heartland, the Photovaltaic Council of Bayone, anyone, just look with an open mind, eyes and ears.

All science is best guess based on observation, best guess.

That said, the only reason we run on 19th (and earlier) century technology is because the rich mother scratchers who got rich on that technology FOIST that upon us as the only economical way to run the word. Of course they'll do that, they want MORE money. They're artifically control prices to keep competition suppressed to the point it disappears and then bend us over (as they've done many times) to achieve that profits that they demand. The funniest thing is that they manage to scare people into believing power evolution is bad, that being a good steward of our only home is evil and there is no other way (but for thos that they control), doing so for one reason - to make more money.

We went to the Moon, ran all that stuff on late 50s/early 60s technology when miniaturization wasn't nearly as good as today and battery technology was absolutely primative, and we're still running the world on 19th century (and earlier) technology... says a lot about innovation doesn't it?


Derek



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 03:47 PM
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Good news-
Each time factions within the cabal try to re-adjust they shoot themselves in the foot. As far as fooling America....most of you are already way down that rabbit hole and are ate up with foolishness.

You still think you elect your presidents to power and you think Ron Paul is some kind of rogue government statesman for the common citizen fighting for the constitution and bill of rights.



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 03:49 PM
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Originally posted by Viesczy
Anyone with a dog in the fight is a questionable source of info, API, Heartland, the Photovaltaic Council of Bayone, anyone, just look with an open mind, eyes and ears.

All science is best guess based on observation, best guess.

That said, the only reason we run on 19th (and earlier) century technology is because the rich mother scratchers who got rich on that technology FOIST that upon us as the only economical way to run the word. Of course they'll do that, they want MORE money. They're artifically control prices to keep competition suppressed to the point it disappears and then bend us over (as they've done many times) to achieve that profits that they demand. The funniest thing is that they manage to scare people into believing power evolution is bad, that being a good steward of our only home is evil and there is no other way (but for thos that they control), doing so for one reason - to make more money.

We went to the Moon, ran all that stuff on late 50s/early 60s technology when miniaturization wasn't nearly as good as today and battery technology was absolutely primative, and we're still running the world on 19th century (and earlier) technology... says a lot about innovation doesn't it?


Derek


Star for you sir. Sea View and Pamrapo Avenue got nottin on on a bike ride to the Staten Island Ferry.
J. C. is building a golf course out of the trade tower remains under the Sky Way.
A frikin golf course.
let the good times roll ljb



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 05:24 PM
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Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by NoHierarchy
 


Never heard of the Clean air act eh?

Epa gutted oh that is a knee slapper.


Yes...

And oh my god, please do not tell me you're opposed to the Clean Air Act...



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 05:28 PM
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Originally posted by redhorse

Originally posted by NoHierarchy

Originally posted by JIMC5499


Speaking of propaganda....................


Unacceptable response.

You fail.


Actually pointing out the hypocrisy of using propaganda to fight propaganda is appropriate, and a reasonable debate tactic. The rebuttal pointing out this hypocrisy in the OP was succinct, and yet effectively discredits it. Although, it may be slightly off-topic, and could have been approached with less contempt.

Having said that, the primary motivators behind the climate change agenda, and their adversary, Big Oil (so to speak) all have a monetary stake in persuading the public to their point of view. Therefor, both perspectives are suspect. The Truth, is likely somewhere in the middle. Meanwhile, Zealots have yet another reason to stand on their soap boxes entertaining themselves (and frankly, the rest of us), and the world spins on to some unknown inevitable conclusion where the truth of the matter may or may not become readily apparent.

I am a big fan of alternative energy sources, and an even bigger fan of more research in that area. I also advocate more drilling in the meantime. I don't see the two as mutually exclusive, and in fact, I think that if we do end up in an energy mess, it will because of the rabid, insane insistence of the proverbial Great Unwashed on both sides that They Are Right, (and Damn the consequences if they are not).


Wrong again.

You only call something propaganda if it's blatantly lying to forward an agenda.

Huff Post, despite having SLANT, was not publishing a propaganda piece; it was pointing out the oil industry's attempts at propaganda.

People like yourself have to be extremely adept at double-think to call the messenger revealing the propagandists a propagandist itself.

After extensive and honest research into the AGW issue, I've come out of it convinced more than ever that global warming is very real, very man-made, and very serious, and that nearly ALL of the denial is manufactured PROPAGANDA. Just because you believe something doesn't make it true. By fighting against the idea of AGW, you're not fighting liberals, you're fighting logic, science, intelligence, and ecology, and that's a historically/utterly losing battle.
edit on 16-5-2012 by NoHierarchy because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 05:31 PM
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reply to post by NoHierarchy
 


So tell me how does that Clean Air Act stop the largest polluters in the world China and India?

Go on waiting.........



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 05:33 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by NoHierarchy
 


Never heard of the Clean air act eh?

Epa gutted oh that is a knee slapper.

Wow... Looks like I missed quite a thread here.
Well, better late than never!

Agreed on the laughter a statement like 'the EPA is gutted' might bring. Oh is THAT coming from someone with absolutely NO real world experience of any kind. Has to be.... One need only ask their local construction contractor, for instance, to get all the information about Lead they ever wanted to hear and more. Likely with such a sharp Anti-Gov edge to it, it's downright painful to hear. Why? EPA regs on friggen lead paint that have turned things like window and siding jobs into a logistical nightmare and added enormous costs PER job and on the overhead of the contractors. THAT is the "gutted" EPA, and that's only a tiny example of the last 3 years.

You know, something I see on this thread...and I mean the greenie side more than anything, but it's this seeming ALL OR NOTHING attitude. It's 100% war on Coal, Oil and Petrol of all kinds or it's 100% surrender and bend over to Exxon and BP. No middle ground. Likewise, it's 100% support until it hurts for every renewable project a goofball can dream up, or it's dire enemies to the entire concept. Again, no middle ground. Well.... NUTS I say.

Show me ANYONE on the Conservative side who isn't personally invested in some very tangible way that doesn't want to see alternatives to oil and coal developed?? I've yet to meet one myself. Yet, the greenies would seem to suggest that is all of us.



I for one would LOVE to see Wind, Solar and Hydro-thermal developed into truly workable solutions. I'm just steadfast about not destroying the WORKING energy industry while replacements are still far off for being a viable answer. The middle ground is exploiting our own resources to live WELL ....not suffer at the Altar of Enviro-insanity...WHILE we develop those alternatives. Gas was around *ONE DOLLAR A GALLON* The day before 9/11 happened...and our own governments declared war on US as much as each other. NOTHING all that major has changed in those 10 years but political agendas and the idiots pushing them, IMO.


So... because you can't use LEAD PAINT, you're going to claim that the EPA is this "enviro-nut gestapo"?? No. Sorry, I don't buy it.

Forgive environmentalists, but in a world where ALMOST EVERYTHING IN SOCIETY IS STACKED AGAINST YOU, you must take extreme positions. There are millions of people taking watered-down positions all the time and NOTHING GETS DONE. We're coming to a singularity of technology, ecological collapse, population explosion, peak oil, the list goes on... and every year things are becoming more black and white in those regards. I don't typically think in black and white, I view everything as gray areas, but THIS is so clearly coming down to the line that to be honest I cannot pretend we're not headed off a cliff just for the sake of not offending a bunch of right-wingers and Capitalists/industrialists.



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 05:36 PM
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Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by NoHierarchy
 


So tell me how does that Clean Air Act stop the largest polluters in the world China and India?

Go on waiting.........


You're using completely false logic.

Just because THEY'RE screwing up their environment over on the other side of the planet, does NOT mean that we should follow suit.

It's a thing called PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY and morals/ethics. The normal/decent person decides to act righteously even if his neighbor acts terribly.

And yes, I believe that China and India should be FORCED to stop polluting. This isn't a joke, polluting and destroying entire species/ecosystems is not a right or a freedom, nor is it justified by expedient economic growth. It's high time the governments/businesses of China/India give their POPULACES more freedom and become very restricted THEMSELVES. I guess that goes for all/most countries too...


edit on 16-5-2012 by NoHierarchy because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 05:40 PM
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reply to post by NoHierarchy
 


Nope

No amount of regulation in this country is going to do jack squat on a planetary scale other countries do not have and will never have to jump to that tune.

That is a fact.



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 05:53 PM
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Originally posted by NoHierarchy
You only call something propaganda if it's blatantly lying to forward an agenda.


No.

propaganda[prop-uh-gan-duh]   Example Sentences Origin Propaganda
www.ask.com/Propaganda
Get Propaganda Search for Propaganda Dictionary.com Free Toolbar
Dictionary.com
Define Propaganda Instantly. Faster Page Loads With Fewer Ads.
Adsprop·a·gan·da   /ˌprɒpəˈgændə/ Show Spelled[prop-uh-gan-duh] Show IPA
noun
1. information, ideas, or rumors deliberately spread widely to help or harm a person, group, movement, institution, nation, etc.
2. the deliberate spreading of such information, rumors, etc.
3. the particular doctrines or principles propagated by an organization or movement.
4. Roman Catholic Church .
a. a committee of cardinals, established in 1622 by Pope Gregory XV, having supervision over foreign missions and the training of priests for these missions.
b. a school (College of Propaganda) established by Pope Urban VIII for the education of priests for foreign missions.
5. Archaic . an organization or movement for the spreading of propaganda.

No where does it say anything about lying to forward an agenda or lying at all for that matter. Propaganda is slant (as you put it). It does not have to be false before you can call it propaganda. You are incorrect.


Originally posted by NoHierarchy
Huff Post, despite having SLANT, was not publishing a propaganda piece; it was pointing out the oil industry's attempts at propaganda.

People like yourself have to be extremely adept at double-think to call the messenger revealing the propagandists a propagandist itself.


Please see above definition once more. You are now presenting misinformation to further your agenda, and so by your own definition (which in incorrect) and indeed also by the real one, you are proving yourself a propagandaist. Or, in your own words...

Wrong again. Well done.



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 06:15 PM
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Originally posted by NoHierarchy

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by NoHierarchy
 


So tell me how does that Clean Air Act stop the largest polluters in the world China and India?

Go on waiting.........


You're using completely false logic.





Just because THEY'RE screwing up their environment over on the other side of the planet, does NOT mean that we should follow suit.

It's a thing called PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY and morals/ethics. The normal/decent person decides to act righteously even if his neighbor acts terribly.

And yes, I believe that China and India should be FORCED to stop polluting. This isn't a joke, polluting and destroying entire species/ecosystems is not a right or a freedom, nor is it justified by expedient economic growth. It's high time the governments/businesses of China/India give their POPULACES more freedom and become very restricted THEMSELVES. I guess that goes for all/most countries too...


edit on 16-5-2012 by NoHierarchy because: (no reason given)


The reality here is that the earth knows best. Mortals are but piss in the wind .
If and when humanity decides to eliminate them selves, So be it. The mother of life will have life forms waiting in the wings. Stupid trilobytes stupid Dinosaurs.

edit on 5/16/2012 by longjohnbritches because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 08:57 PM
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The problem with this issue is there seems to be absolutely no middle ground. People are either on one side or the other and vehemently defend their stance. Now it is my opinion that we as humans may be contributing to climate change but our impact isn't as dire as it is made to sound. We simply haven't been around long enough. With that being said we do need to work on alternate energy methods. Whatever they may be. It couldn't hurt. If everyone could quit bickering long enough to actually make progress.

-Tij



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 09:05 PM
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Originally posted by longjohnbritches
The reality here is that the earth knows best.


new age nonsense. Earth doesn't know anything at all.

they various "system" on earth will attain equilibrium regardless of what we do to them - if we nuked ourselves out of existence and provided a million years of "nuclear winter" then there would still be an equilibrium reached.

That's not "earth" - that is physics and chemistry and biology.




edit on 16-5-2012 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 09:31 PM
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reply to post by NoHierarchy
 




So... because you can't use LEAD PAINT, you're going to claim that the EPA is this "enviro-nut gestapo"?? No. Sorry, I don't buy it.


Naww.. It has nothing to do with using lead based paints. That has been forbidden for almost as long as I've been alive in terms of use on homes. It's been banned for use in household paints since 1978 in the U.S, to be specific.

It took me a bit of looking to find a real break down of the literal requirements and this still doesn't touch on some of the worst for pure absurdity but this hits the high points:


The firm must:
(A) Remove all objects from the work area or cover them with plastic sheeting with all seams and
edges sealed.

(B) Close and cover all ducts opening in the work area with taped-down plastic sheeting.

(C) Close windows and doors in the work area. Doors must be covered with plastic sheeting.

(D) Cover the floor surface with taped-down plastic sheeting in the work area a minimum of six feet
beyond the perimeter of surfaces undergoing renovation or a sufficient distance to contain the dust,
whichever is greater. If a vertical containment system is employed, floor covering may stop at the
vertical barrier, providing it is impermeable, extends from floor to ceiling, and is tightly sealed at
floors, ceilings, and walls.

(E) Use precautions to ensure that all personnel, tools, and other items, including the exteriors of
containers of waste, are free of dust and debris when leaving the work area.

(F) After the renovation has been completed, the firm must clean the work area until no dust, debris or
residue remains. The firm must:
1. Collect all paint chips and debris, and seal it in a heavy-duty bag.
2. Remove and dispose of protective sheeting as waste.
3. Clean all objects and surfaces in the work area and within two feet of the work area in the
following manner:
a. Clean walls starting at the ceiling and working down to the floor by either vacuuming with a
HEPA vacuum or wiping with a damp cloth.
b. Thoroughly vacuum all remaining surfaces and objects in the work area, including furniture
and fixtures, with a HEPA vacuum.
c. Wipe all remaining surfaces and objects in the work area, except for carpeted or upholstered
surfaces, with a damp cloth. Mop uncarpeted floors thoroughly using a mopping method that
keeps the wash water separate from the rinse water, or using a wet mopping system.
Source (Page 11)

The above is an excerpt from the EPA's guidelines. Now, however bad that sounds to someone who has worked construction. It's worse. What is not possible to capture in that are the methods required to achieve it. We could start with the $800 vacuum cleaner required by the EPA's regs and which is used to literally vacuum not only the inside work area (which isn't such a bad thing anyway) but also the OUTSIDE. A deck, garden or walkway must also be covered by overlapping plastic sheeting with no gaps and out for several feet beyond the real work space. After that impervious plastic sheeting is carefully...OH SO carefully removed (spilling dust off that can be an EPA fine..and these Lead work site fines START in the thousands of dollars) then...the dust which isn't supposed to be there must be vacuumed.

Inside, it's not just silly..it's bordering on high comedy. On window jobs I help my Stepfather with to make ends meet in school, the regs require that the work area not only be totally (overlapped and feet out from the window area) covered and secured, but literal "walls" of plastic sheeting must be put up so as to close off the work area from the open areas of the rest of the house.


Now I'm not even touching on the Wind speed sections which now require work to halt entirely if winds are above a stiff breeze. A paint chip or dust may blow off the sheeting.

Keep in mind, as a last note on this. This doesn't even require PROOF that lead paint exists on site. Simply the CHANCE it may, is enough. Any home prior to 1978, as my PDF link to the EPA docs show, is what triggers this circus...and Oh, yeah. The Home owners are paying a good % of the pre-reg window cost added on now so the over all job for a normal home can be $1,000 more or quite a bit higher than that. Depends on size..but that is the "gutted" EPA. Again, this lead garbage is only one example and not even a major one at that.



edit on 16-5-2012 by Wrabbit2000 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 09:40 PM
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Originally posted by NoHierarchy

Shocking New Oil Propaganda Plan to Fool Americans


www.huffingtonpost.com

The Guardian has unearthed a shocking new propaganda plan intended to turn the American public against wind energy in the 2012 election cycle. The plan is to be deployed by a shadowy network of propaganda contractors like the disgraced Heartland Institute, who recently compared those who accept the mainstream science on climate change to mass murderers, and was prepared by a fellow of the American Tradition Institute (ATI), the same law-breaking group that is suing climate scientist...
(visit the link for the full news article)



Related AboveTopSecret.com Discussion Threads:
www.guardian.co.uk...
www.desmogblog.com...
shawnotto.com...


Now a logical person can just take a look at the fumes and emissions that fossil fuel based energies belch out (think commercial trucks) and look at the rising cases in cancer in towns that are shrouded in perpetual clouds of smog (like L.A.), the kind of nasty brown clouds that stink and smell like a papermill or sewage when you pass through them...

Or...

They can take a look at wind farms, solar energy and geothermal energy and feel good about breathing air without chemicles (well, if you do not count the chemtrails terraforming our planet, being ordered by our government at the command of hostile space aliens who want our planet for themselves) and think hmm, i'd rather breathe (semi-not really clean) air.

Bah forget it, there will come a day where you cannot survive without an oxygen tank or gasmask above ground...we're just screwed.



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 11:49 PM
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Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by OrchusGhule
 


What is hilarious is all the billion dollar loans coming from the Department of Energy to alternative energy that is gone bankrupt like those Solyndra CORPORATIONS.


naw the real joke is that you actually believe that DOE and obummer
were actually trying to promote alternative energy and got "scammed" for billions by solyndra and sundry.

never mind that prez B.S. has proved beyond any doubt he is BP's lapdog.

and never mind you finding DOE an acceptable source concerning "clean coal"

flip- flop
flip- flop
flip- flop

i'll bet you're all for frakking
as long as it's in somebody else's backyard, of course
edit on 16-5-2012 by DerepentLEstranger because: added edit and comment



posted on May, 16 2012 @ 11:58 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

Originally posted by longjohnbritches
The reality here is that the earth knows best.


new age nonsense. Earth doesn't know anything at all.

they various "system" on earth will attain equilibrium regardless of what we do to them - if we nuked ourselves out of existence and provided a million years of "nuclear winter" then there would still be an equilibrium reached.

That's not "earth" - that is physics and chemistry and biology.




edit on 16-5-2012 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)


positivist-nihilist drivel

we are much more than mere "matter in motion"
so you are only speaking for yourself.



posted on May, 17 2012 @ 12:28 AM
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reply to post by neo96
 


Those guys are full of # then.

Clean coal is an oxymoron.

People should stop sucking from the teats of evil bastards like the Koch Brothers and wake the hell up!



posted on May, 17 2012 @ 12:30 AM
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reply to post by The Sword
 


No more than the leftists and their church of climatology!!!

Zeig heil for the new world order!



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