Something truly wondrous is going on.

Being a long term agnostic and very well grounded in science fact this experiment just blows my mind and should tell everybody that there is something going on that is truly wonderous. I am talking about the double slit experiment, now at first glance it's just particle wave duality, but keep watching the bit about what happens when they try to observe the particle travelling through the slit!! Basically it stops acting odd and starts to act like it is expected to. Further research into this 'bug' in the universe shows that it even has a delayed response, i.e. all possibilities are evaluated before behaviour is set. So no matter how sneaky we get at trying to detect a single particle travelling through the slit the result will always be the same under observation. It is like the material recording the interference pattern has not been seen by the universe as an observer so it acts as it wants and creates an interference pattern. To any pure atheists out there this should make you think seriously about the true nature of reality, seems the universe is watching us watching it!

Sorry if this has been discussed before but it just blows me away big time, nothing has ever really rocked my belief in pure science but this does, and in a good way

Anyway onto the youtube video


this one is a lot harder to get your head around but is goes on about delayed response

reply to post by theukbloke


mmmm....Quantum Conciousness is more alive than matter. A thought is more powerful than a nuclear bomb.

reply to post by cointelprotroll


Who's to say Quantum Consciousness isn't controlling matter?

Furthermore, who's to say Quantum Consciousness isn't God?

I keep saying, God is much more simple than any of us know, and so much more complex than any of us have dreamed...spirituality is science we haven't caught up to yet, but it seems that we are drawing closer. Religion continues to defy science because we are convinced that we already know everything about spirituality. When we accept that we aren't even close to such knowledge, we will make progress. Ignorance stems from believing you already know the answer when you haven't collected all the facts.

I await the day that science and God come to terms with one another, and spirituality and science become one. Because they actually are...we just haven't discovered it yet.

It's like the closer you look the less erratic they behave. Now tie this into focus and sight. The closer you look at a perticular object the more detail you see, everything else is a blur. We tune into the particles and they arrange for us to see. Sounds all matrixy dunnit.

Now take into account everything else is some kind of frequency, light, heat, sound, ect, all created by particles vibrating at different speeds. And we interact with all these and call it reality. We perceives these body's we have to be solid but atoms are made up mostly of empty space, 98% I think. So, no matter (excuse pun) how many atoms you have, overall the mass should be made up of 98% empty space. So the frequency(vibration) or just our human perception must some how add the mass. Sounds crazy but logical, lol

It's all very exciting, and yet the conclusions drawn from notion of the observer, tend to be subjective.

For me I say consciousness resides within every particle......

Just because a table cannot talk, doesn't mean it cannot think.

Controversial I know, and yet absolute evidence cannot be produced to contrary .

So, lets think about the old saying: "A Watched Pot Never Boils."

The water knew. It knew all along.

reply to post by Starchild23


maybe you didn't understand or I wasn't clear, But I believe QC controls matter, and is God, In a sense

reply to post by Starchild23


Not really sure that the idea of God should come into play, after all 'God' has a very funny idea of compassion towards living things. No, what is going on is much bigger the the god idea. Can it be that we (anything living) shapes the behaviour of the universe, that the very act of looking (no matter how) makes something so? I can't get this thing out of my head, it is just totally out there.

reply to post by theukbloke


what if you had no eyes? would your intention be any less?? I don't know of anything bigger than the"god" idea, please enlighten me
I'm not talking about some wacked christian type God; I'm talking about the Source of everything

reply to post by cointelprotroll


As you say, eyes have nothing to do with observation. Ok not really sure where I am going with this one but consider this. Could the universe/(big bang unproven) come about because of the sudden existence of life, tiny tiny life that just came into being. There is nothing mad about this idea as it is the just same as the big bang theory. That tiny life form (long since gone) gave birth to time, space and energy for the rest of life to make and shape the universe under it's observations, creating the conditions and rules we see today without conscious knowledge of this fact. Call it chaotic arrangement throughout an uncountable number of life form observations to create a life giving universe. When we point our telescopes into that seemingly empty area of space we see billions more galaxies, did we just create them or were they already there?

I am not nuts honest

Matter is an epiphenomena of consciousness. The sooner that gets sussed the better.

I'm not edumacated so this is really just my own "quantum leap":

The "observer" is what, a ccd? So it sees electrons as what they are... rays of light. Like a Gamma "ray" or cosmic "ray". Single event detected. "Single electron" gun? How do they know it fires singly? Even if it does at the scale of the smallest, this is fuzzy "Quantum leaps". What about Photons? Wave or particle? I say Waves of Particles. Like an ocean wave, a sound wave, a desert dune, a cloud... as above, so below.

Bottom line: If it behaves like a wave then... itsa itsa wave. The interferomitry proves that. Once you (have to) accept the results then there is only that conclusion. Like I said... I dunno.

reply to post by intrptr


No we are the observers, the ccd has no more effect on the particle then the slit holder, it is our action through technology or otherwise that changes the outcome. We are linked to the particle! Like you say 'I dunno' either

reply to post by theukbloke

Thanks for the reply. We are at a disadvantage because anything we invent to "detect" some outcome has to interpret the results so that we can see it with our eyes. Hardly passive. Heres a problem I have with their experiment The marbles they use are not a good comparison. For one they are not being fired at the speed of light. If they were they might smash into bits as they pass thru both slots and set up an interference pattern of "shrapnel". That would be more akin to their other results. Maybe if they fired a single water balloon at "water ballon speed" thru two slits they would get the same results as their other interference patterns?

Just observing...

reply to post by intrptr


NP, you do get the fact that when they try and observe the particle (not marbles, that was just for clarity) that it only travels through one slot and does not create an interference pattern! but take away any observation methods other than the pattern recorder and it returns to create an interference pattern from One particle. In the second video the experiment used a laser that created a single photon - it is possible to do, so light speed was reached with the same conclusion only it got really weird when they tried to hide the fact it was being watched.

Originally posted by Starchild23
reply to post by cointelprotroll

 

Who's to say Quantum Consciousness isn't controlling matter?

Furthermore, who's to say Quantum Consciousness isn't God?

I keep saying, God is much more simple than any of us know, and so much more complex than any of us have dreamed...spirituality is science we haven't caught up to yet, but it seems that we are drawing closer. Religion continues to defy science because we are convinced that we already know everything about spirituality. When we accept that we aren't even close to such knowledge, we will make progress. Ignorance stems from believing you already know the answer when you haven't collected all the facts.

I await the day that science and God come to terms with one another, and spirituality and science become one. Because they actually are...we just haven't discovered it yet.

edit on CTuesdayam070725f25America/Chicago15 by Starchild23 because: (no reason given)

This is what I have been trying to explain to a lot of people, but they don't seem to understand.

OP, great thread btw, I had already seen the double slit video, but not the second one. My mind is doubly blown now. Haha S&F for you!

Originally posted by FenderWolf
So, lets think about the old saying: "A Watched Pot Never Boils."

The water knew. It knew all along.

I wonder if this could explain why people get a 'funny feeling' whenever they are being stared at. Even when you can't see somebody, you can tell when they are looking at you. Like when people say "I can feel somebody's eyes on me." My grandfather used to think I was psychic because I would catch him spying on me in the shower every single time.

All joking aside, this is very interesting to think about. Does consciousness have an effect on matter? Perhaps it does. When I was in school I could always tell when somebody was going to start a fight with me, even before they started acting aggressive. Maybe we really do pick up on 'vibes'.

Originally posted by theukbloke
reply to post by intrptr

 

NP, you do get the fact that when they try and observe the particle (not marbles, that was just for clarity) that it only travels through one slot and does not create an interference pattern! but take away any observation methods other than the pattern recorder and it returns to create an interference pattern from One particle. In the second video the experiment used a laser that created a single photon - it is possible to do, so light speed was reached with the same conclusion only it got really weird when they tried to hide the fact it was being watched.

NP, I understand the experiment as they laid it out (in a cartoon). My problem like I said is the "observers" perspective and the "single photon" lasers. So I googled it. Turns out the "single photon" is really a stream of photons in single file (like machine gun bullets).

It is here that students must convince themselves that this counting rate indicates the bulb is indeed dim enough so that only one photon at a time reaches the photomultiplier. Here are two possible conceptual arguments, both use the fact that the distance from single slit to detector is close to one meter.

Emphasis added.

1. Using time of flight measurements: A photon traveling 3x10 to the 8th m/s will navigate the one meter path from single slit to detector in roughly 3 nanoseconds. Our counter indicates a time of flight of 10-6th seconds or 1000 nanoseconds. On average, therefore, there is a photon in flight between the single slit and the photomultiplier for only about 3 ns out of every 1000 ns. This means that for 99.7% of the time, there are "no" photons in flight, while for only 0.3% of the time there is "one" photon in flight in the apparatus. The probability of there being two photons in flight simultaneously is thus negligible. All of the interference effects observed in the apparatus can thus be comfortable ascribed to the behavior of individual photons, coming through the single slit one at a time!

Using frequency measurements: The flight path is roughly one meter. If we were to visualize an arrangement such that a new photon would be released only after the one in transit arrived at the photomultiplier then the photons would be 1 meter apart. This would mean that the time between photons would be 1m/3x10 to the 8th m/s. The photon count rate would then be 3 x 10 to the 8th photons per second.

Hardly a single photon gun. But a "stream" of photons in which "double taps" are "negligible". Then you have the detection grid and interpretation of the "counts" on a screen. Without going into that, it is more complex than they let on in a cartoon. There is room for error in their "single photon interference with slits". I still hold that they are measuring more than one photon at a time thru the slit. As they say, it is "conceptual", "convincing" and "negligible".

Someone who knows more about it can set me straight here. I still hold that if they see an interference pattern then that is the result, not "God hiding". Look at it this way. If he is "hiding" (which is ridiculous) then why make the bar just so high and not infinite? Like God was here, ha ha? Silly.

www.teachspin.com...

It's exactly what the ancients believed; that the Earth and all things in it are alive - there are no such thing as "inanimate" objects.
Looks like science is finally catching up.

Originally posted by FenderWolf
So, lets think about the old saying: "A Watched Pot Never Boils."

The water knew. It knew all along.

Well that can be proven wrong just by putting a pot of water on the stove and turning the stove on. I can promise you that without fail as long as the heat is turned up that pot of water will boil. Every time ! Now a pot of water on a cold stove will sit there until it evaporates on its own just by the heat of the room. Either way the water will eventually become a cloud. The water will disappear no matter what.