Is Immaterialism Now the Mainstream Physics?

It looks like the idea of the world as a computer program is catching on:
Even Brian Greene seems to be promoting it.

didnt watch cuz just the concept..

if the "universe" is on a computer then where is the computer - how could it not be part of the grander, realer universe?

and as far as immaterialism ideain *PHYSICs*, guess they dont accept e=Mc2??? M is just a figment...

reply to post by BiggerPicture

"Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one." - Albert Einstein

Illusion

maybe a computer program is a reflection to the universe. and digital data on a pc may by a reflection to how data in the universe is stored- that is in packets of information. but to say the universe is in the computer program is kind of cop out answer no?

Originally posted by BiggerPicture
didnt watch cuz just the concept..

if the "universe" is on a computer then where is the computer - how could it not be part of the grander, realer universe?

and as far as immaterialism ideain *PHYSICs*, guess they dont accept e=Mc2??? M is just a figment...

Its not a computer, its a computer program. We can't even begin to contemplate the computer running the program. I think the games the sims is a good example. We are the sims. Do the sims know there is a computer running the program they exist in? No, and they're probably not able to even begin to contemplate the computer running it, and us controlling that program.

Originally posted by BiggerPicture
didnt watch cuz just the concept..

if the "universe" is on a computer then where is the computer - how could it not be part of the grander, realer universe?

and as far as immaterialism ideain *PHYSICs*, guess they dont accept e=Mc2??? M is just a figment...

E=MC2 is just a rule, like AND, OR, XOR, IF, THEN or any of a number of programming rules. The program creator just happens to be good at math ;-)

The holographic universe idea is actually pretty elegant, it explains everything. Like why there is so little mass in mass, which is more space + energy. It would explain a finite universe with temporal boundaries. It would explain existence from inception to conclusion and would follow the four dimensional tensor model (which follows the string theory model). It explains Plank length as the programming "bits" that make up our universe.

So yeah, nothing new really. We live in a movie that is projected on the inside of a big bubble and we aren't really here and there is no free will. I always thought of this place as either a training ground or hell anyway. Go figure, and we (well not me anyway) thought as a species were just the cat's @ss LOL.

Cheers - Dave

We shouldn't let any revelation like this change our way of life? As far as we are concerned we exist, plain and simple. It's not going to make my bills go away .

Who's to say we aren't a computer program within a computer program within a computer program? How far down do the simulations each simulate their own universes?

I have little doubt that sometime in the future we humans may decide to simulate an entire universe via a computer model as well.

Let's hope the original computer never has a power cut!

I really like the computer reality theory.
It allows for a lot variables which we can use to make sense out of just about anything.

Out of time for the vid tonight but will watch it soon. Some how I sometimes wonder if our understanding of what everything is seems likened to a fish in a tank thinking a desk lamp is the sun. One thing seems clear though, math plays a huge roll in all of this but then again, will the rules of math mean diddly after we die? Somehow I think math is just a measuring stick if you will for the physical reality we find ourselves in. The stuff we need for total grasp and understanding of the reality in which we live is miles from here!

Truman Show more real than most realize!

reply to post by Ajax84


I was thinking about this the other day and it occurred to me that while we could be in "simulation", that it doesn't matter. We're still in reality too. The simulation would be just as "real" as we think we are. There is no difference between reality and a simulation.

Think about it. Define reality? Once you try you realize the word doesn't have any meaning. Being made of atoms doesn't make us any more real than if we're made out of electrical charges. We just have a preconceived notion that atoms=real, but no. Being made of atoms doesn't make us any more real, and being made of electrical charges doesn't make us any less real. We're still just information encoded on a medium.

To us an AI made of 1s and 0s may not seem real. It's just a computer simulation right? But to the the AI in the computer, his reality is that he's made of electrical charges. He's still very real. Rearrange his 1s and 0s and he doesn't function right, or ceases to exist. If the computer he's running on crashes he's just as dead as we would be if our universe crashed. Don't make a backup of him and he's gone forever.

Just like if you forget to backup your computer and you lose all your information. What do you say? Oh it's okay, none of that stuff was real anyway? No of course not, you get mad. Because the information that was on your HD was very real and alters your reality.

Assuming there's something like a god out there then it could also make a backup of physical matter just like we backup 1s and 0s. Just keep a note of where every single atom goes, and we could be backed up just the same as the AI if we made a note of where every single 1 and 0 was.

It makes no difference. Information is information. It doesn't matter what you store it on. Just like when a program is in RAM it's being stored as electrical charges. When you save the program to the hard drive it gets converted to magnetic charges. The electrical charges are destroyed. The program is destroyed, dead, gone.

But you can load the program up again off the HD and recreate the same electrical charges you had before. You can bring the program back to life. You can even store the information on atoms by burning the program to a DVD made of plastic. But burning it to a DVD won't make it anymore "real" than it was before. Atoms do not equal real.

Our atoms are in a state that contain the information needed to make us, us. The AI's 1s and 0s are in a state that contain the information to make the AI, AI. But neither is more real than the other. We're both just information that could be copied, changed, or moved to another medium.

What's important is how the information gets changed from one state to another. When transformed by a physical process such as a CPU changing the information in RAM, or by the laws of physics moving our atoms around. That's what creates our reality. Think about it, if there was no time, and your atoms never moved, the physical processes in your brain couldn't play out. You'd just be a statue. If the CPU never read the program data, did a calculation, and wrote new data to RAM the program would be just like a virtual statue also.

What's important is changing from one state to another. That's what creates our perception of reality. So even if we're made out of atoms we're still just as fake as we were before lol. It's still an illusion.

I think that science has evolved beyond labels like 'mainstream'. The fact is we are talking about physics here, which by its very nature deals with the almost intangible, tiny details of the accounting of the universe. None of it is standard.

Immaterialism meaning virtual.
Like virtual particles in virtual physics now on a virtual playing field of the computer.

Physics is under control of people steering everyone away from the material.
Any source of free energy touted by Tesla of course is sealed up in contracts and
other vehicles of confinement.

ED: meaning virtual

(a.) Having the power of acting or of invisible efficacy without the agency of the material or sensible part; potential; energizing

Actually Tesla use the term virtual to describe how his flying machine worked and
we know that was materially sound.

reply to post by Ajax84


Right, atoms are digits in an analogy based in a philosophy of Metaphysics. That's really deep if you're tripping on acid I guess. But we all come down sooner or later and realize that video is a hour and a half of a complete waste of time. I spent my valuable time doing just that listening to people espousing nothing but a simple ordinary analogy anybody could had come up with. I want a refund of my time. Freak! Who burned their DVD player out on The Matrix coming up with that one? Oh I see, they weren't inspired by The Matrix, but by the philosophical writings of some dude named George Berkeley who came up with a philosophy of Immaterialism. That's right it's not any part of science or technology as this forum is suppose to be catering to, but hey, Metaphysics is close enough in the world of ATS. Just so we all understand... Immaterialism The definition being

a philosophical theory that material things have no reality except as mental perceptions

"philosophical theory" not science and technology. Next we'll see a thread posted "Is Urantia becoming accepted by mainstream science?" Make sure, Ajax84, you post that one too if any burned out acid heads from the 60's like Brian Greene start yacking The Book of Urantia at a "weird" science festival, I mean, philosophy festival. And remember always form your title as a question so you can slip a philosophy topic into a science forum as you did this one.

Wheres Immanuel Kant when you need him? Can somebody channel him? Do some voodoo, hire a witch doctor like George Berkeley was if need be. You can find one at the next World Science Festival as a featured program speaker.





Then there is Subjective idealism

reply to post by BiggerPicture

didnt watch cuz just the concept.. if the "universe" is on a computer then where is the computer - how could it not be part of the grander, realer universe? and as far as immaterialism ideain *PHYSICs*, guess they dont accept e=Mc2??? M is just a figment...

really? That's it? Where's the computer? that sure is a boxed in limited view. A computer creating this holographic universe would probably completely beyond your comprehension to fathom, just as your reply shows that since you cant fathom it, you just outright deny it.

Hey OP, Whats up with that machine that they were supposed to do an experiment with which would determine the holographic theory to be true or not