NIBIRU AT LAST?? Brazilian Astronomer claims have found rogue planet hidden behind Neptune.

reply to post by bjarneorn

What we can say about our Universe, is that there are anomalies in our calculations that state as a fact. That we do not know all about our Universe. Not even our own Galaxy. We also know, that throughout history there have been catastrophies that are outlandish. Ranging from the extinction of dynosaurs, to the complete and sudden freeze of mammals in the russian tundra. So fast, that they froze while eating grass.

There are cases of flashing freezing of mammoths. The animals in question drowned in mud and were preserved. They are few and far between. The extinction of the dinosaurs has many different suggestions. The Permian extinction was an even larger event. Going back tens or hundreds of millions of years does make it hard to get a definitive answer as to why.

There is nothing in our current model of our solar system, or the earth that can explain such events

The mammoths event as you describe does not have to be explained as it never happened. There are plenty of good ideas as to how large scale extinction events can happen.

As far as Nibiru is concerned it is clear that is a fiction of Sitchin. The properties ascribed to the planet by Sitchin are impossible.

Simply coming in here and saying "Nibiru can't be", is not enough.

The problem is that Sitchin claims a regular orbit for a planet with a highly eccentric orbit that enters the orbits of the known planets. There would be a transfer of momentum on each orbit that would prevent a regular orbit.

but the fact that a mammal can freeze at an instant in the tundra of Russia. Tells us, that there are anomalies that far exceed whatever we have or can calculate with our current models.

The freezing is not a fact.

Just as the "size" of the dynosaurs and their bone density, demands that gravity has not been constant during earths lifetime ... so does other anomalies demand that there are celestial issues.

That is not true. Dinosaur size does not indicate that gravity has changed.

reply to post by switching yard


Just as big a problem as the one you've pointed out is the interactions of the planets in our solar system and the planets in the other solar system. Planets are not following a predefined path as if they are on a train track. Planets follow the path that is a result of the forces acting on them. Each pass of a large object close to Earth would change the Earth's orbit and the orbit of the other body preventing a regular orbit or even the objects remaining with the object they revolve about.

Originally posted by stereologist
There are cases of flashing freezing of mammoths. The animals in question drowned in mud and were preserved. They are few and far between. The extinction of the dinosaurs has many different suggestions. The Permian extinction was an even larger event. Going back tens or hundreds of millions of years does make it hard to get a definitive answer as to why.

That "may" be satisfactory to you ... but it isn't to me.

Point is, there are different form of religions ... and it's not always about believing in God, it's also about believing in anything whatsoever ... even Nibiru.

Here are some "official" theories, I find "not-plausible".

*. Millions of slaves in Egypt, moving stones thousands of miles.

*. Nibiru

*. Jesus, Moses and Noah

*. Mass extinction of dynosaurs/mammoths.

*. Big Bang

*. The God Element

*. Plate tectonics

A definitive explanation for their mass extinction has yet to be agreed upon. The warming trend (Holocene) that occurred 12,000 years ago, accompanied by a glacial retreat and rising sea levels, has been suggested as a contributing factor. Forests replaced open woodlands and grasslands across the continent. The available habitat may have been reduced for some megafaunal species, such as the mammoth. However, such climate changes were nothing new; numerous very similar warming episodes had occurred previously within the ice age of the last several million years without producing comparable megafaunal extinctions

...The most common condition was long temperate epochs, like the balmy times of the dinosaurs. Much rarer were glacial epochs like our own, lasting a few millions of years, in which periods of glaciation alternated with warmer "interglacial" periods like the present.

And I'll leave it at that ...

reply to post by bjarneorn

Here are some "official" theories, I find "not-plausible".

*. Millions of slaves in Egypt, moving stones thousands of miles.

*. Nibiru

*. Jesus, Moses and Noah

*. Mass extinction of dynosaurs/mammoths.

*. Big Bang

*. The God Element

*. Plate tectonics

1. The Egyptians did not move stones thousands of miles. No idea where you got that idea.
2. Nibiru is not a theory. It is a fiction planet thought up by Sitchin.
3. DInosaurs are extinct as are mammoths and many other species.

Not sure why you listy aome religious.

The point is that you are relying in part on the mistaken belief that one or more mammoths were flash frozen. That never happened. No such mammoth was ever found. Not one. They drowned in mud and eventually were preserved in permafrost.

None of the quotes you posted in any way support that mistaken belief.

I know there are other threads on this topic.

But here is yet another video from someone claiming to have discovered Nibiru.
Seems pretty compelling to me. He looks at live data from a number of sources.
Be very interested in other opinions.
The name of the video is "32º of Insanity 05.14.12"
I did a search of ATS and did not find it.

reply to post by stereologist


The mammoth they found wasn't even that well preserved. In fact if you read the reports about its discovery one of the things that they make sure to mention is how bad the smell was from decay.

reply to post by Xcalibur254


Thanks Xcalibur254. I think it is interesting how this story has shifted from the reality to this "mysterious" flash frozen case. I also find it interesting how a few examples of partial preservation has been altered to be thousands of animals. Although the mammoths have garnered all of the attention I believe that other animals have also been found in that state such as the bison found in Alaska.

fairbanks-alaska.com...

Blue Babe, a 36,000-year-old steppe bison, is on permanent display at the museum. The bison was preserved in permafrost near Fairbanks until recovered several years ago. Its skin is blue from oxidized minerals in the ground, and it is so well preserved that claw scratches from a predator are still visible in the skin.

Originally posted by bjarneorn

Originally posted by stereologist
There are cases of flashing freezing of mammoths. The animals in question drowned in mud and were preserved. They are few and far between. The extinction of the dinosaurs has many different suggestions. The Permian extinction was an even larger event. Going back tens or hundreds of millions of years does make it hard to get a definitive answer as to why.

That "may" be satisfactory to you ... but it isn't to me.

Point is, there are different form of religions ... and it's not always about believing in God, it's also about believing in anything whatsoever ... even Nibiru.

Here are some "official" theories, I find "not-plausible".

*. Millions of slaves in Egypt, moving stones thousands of miles.

*. Nibiru

*. Jesus, Moses and Noah

*. Mass extinction of dynosaurs/mammoths.

*. Big Bang

*. The God Element

*. Plate tectonics

I'm curious about 2 of these:

* Big Bang: So what is it you don't believe? Do you have an alternate theory? Does it account for all objects in the universe red shifting away, who's paths would bring them to a single point if you reversed them?

* Plate Tectonics: What is it you don't believe? Please don't tell me you buy into that "Expanding Earth" nonsense. That idea has absolutely no supporting evidence at all. Quite the opposite.

Originally posted by Xcalibur254

Here is a tablet that depicts the Sumerian symbol for star/planet, Moon, and Sun. You will notice that only one of these symbols appear on Cylinder Seal VA243.

First of all, please give a link to that picture, not just the picture. Second of all, the Sun/star symbol in both Mesopotamian and Sumarian can be found in more than one shape. They can even be depicted with only 6 points, or 8 points. For the Sumarians the sun god is Utu, meanwhile the Mesopotamians called him Shamash.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


Here you go. Of course the source is Heiser who many SItchin supporters feel is unqualified for some reason. He actually has a background in ancient languages, including Sumerian, whereas Sitchin had a background in economic history.

The Myth of a 12th Planet: A Brief Analysis of Cylinder Seal VA 243

Originally posted by stereologist

When you say that the Sun is a star you are referring to modern thoughts, not ancient thoughts. That notion is not germain to the discussion of an ancient depiction.

Oh really? and pray tell me how do YOU know for sure?... And yes the Sun is a star, and the Sumerians and Mesopotamians knew it because their symbol for sun/star was the same. The Sumerians were astronomers, and if you did any search, including online you would find plenty of links that show this is true.

Originally posted by stereologist
To sugegst that the seal represents knowledge of planetary system is unsubstantiated.

To suggest the contrary is unsubstantiated given the evidence...

Astronomy began with the first settlements of agricultural societies. Mesopotamia, the land between the Tigris and Euphrates rivers in what is today Iraq, was the birthplace of civilization almost 10,000 years ago. It is in ancient Sumeria that we find the oldest records of the study of astronomy. Babylon and Assyria were later civilizations in the same geographic area, and inherited the Sumerians' astronomical traditions and many of their myths and legends surrounding the skies. They in turn developed their own astronomical culture and passed it on to the Greeks and eventually to our modern world. Perhaps the greatest legacy to modern western astronomy was left to us by the Babylonians. We still use many of their original constellations, and the records they kept of astronomical occurences allow us a glimpse into their view of the heavens.
...

www.starteachastronomy.com...

Originally posted by stereologist
There are few records from Sumer of astronomical observations. Most of the information that they actively did astronomy is inferred rom the use of Sumerian words by the Babylonians.

Do tell us how many are "few" to you?... and how many are necessary to know about our Solar System, or even about the Pleiades, among others, as the sumerians knew?...

Originally posted by Xcalibur254

Here you go. Of course the source is Heiser who many SItchin supporters feel is unqualified for some reason. He actually has a background in ancient languages, including Sumerian, whereas Sitchin had a background in economic history.

The Myth of a 12th Planet: A Brief Analysis of Cylinder Seal VA 243

lol anybody with money, or connections can have a PhD these days. You can find plenty of online "schools" that will give you a PHD in no time...

Heck, there are PhDs out there who are frauds. One example is Michael Mann. His thesis for his PhD was the Hockey Stick graph, a graph known to be a hoax and which dozens upon dozens of ressearch demonstrate it to be a hoax, yet a certain group these days count Mann as a "knwoledgeable person" despite all the scandals he has been ionvolved in...

Just having a PhD means jack...

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


So you don't actually have any kind of data to refute Heiser and would instead prefer to go with a straw man argument to in an attempt to discredit all PhDs?

Originally posted by stereologist

1. The Egyptians did not move stones thousands of miles. No idea where you got that idea.

The large granite stones found in the King's chamber, weighing from 25 to 80 tonnes were transported from Aswan, about 500 miles away.

Originally posted by stereologist
2. Nibiru is not a theory. It is a fiction planet thought up by Sitchin.

Nibiru has also been known as Planet X, and Planet X is not only a theory but evidence suggests it exists, despite claims like yours that it doesn't...

Originally posted by stereologist
3. DInosaurs are extinct as are mammoths and many other species.

Really stereologist?... crocodiles/alligators, komodo dragons and sharks are dinosaurs that have existed for millions of years and still exist today. some have barely changed at all since their prehistoric times...

Sharks and alligators/crocodilles for example haven't changed much from their old prehistoric times, and we even know at least one species of dinosaur shark that still exists today...

Fishermen in certain parts of the world have also found prehistoric fish thought to have died millions of years ago.

Top 10 Prehistoric Fish Found Today

This goes to show how much you know about these things...

Originally posted by Xcalibur254

So you don't actually have any kind of data to refute Heiser and would instead prefer to go with a straw man argument to in an attempt to discredit all PhDs?

Nope, now you are puting words in my mouth... Nice strawman... I simply said that having a PhD doens't mean he must be right, that's all... As for disputing what he says, first I would have to read and research what he talks about, and this isn't done in a few minutes... Second of all, the third figure all the way to the right in that picture you gave looks extremely similar to the symbol for Saturn, but I would have to recheck it.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


Planet X was a name give to an object beyond Pluto and has NOTHING to do with Nibiru

Your modern day dinosaurs are a bit smaller than they used to be for example.

About 100 million years ago, toward the middle of the Cretaceous period, some crocodiles had begun to imitate their dinosaur cousins by evolving to enormous sizes. The king of the Cretaceous crocodiles was the enormous Sarcosuchus, dubbed "SuperCroc" by the media, which measured about 40 feet long from head to tail and weighed in the neighborhood of 10 tons

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

To suggest the contrary is unsubstantiated given the evidence...

There is very little direct evidence of the Sumerians being astronoers. The reason we believe they were astronomers is the use of Sumerian names by the Babylonians. It suggests that the work originated with the Sumerians.

And yes the Sun is a star, and the Sumerians and Mesopotamians knew it because their symbol for sun/star was the same.

So you are guessing that anyone in ancient times knew that the stars were like our Sun. Did they write this any place? It seems that Bruno, last person to be burned at the stake by the Church, may have been one of the first people to suggest that stars were like our Sun.

Do tell us how many are "few" to you?... and how many are necessary to know about our Solar System, or even about the Pleiades, among others, as the sumerians knew?... /quote]
Your link is quite corrct in pointing out that astronomy was practiced in Sumer. It also points out that their work was carried on by later civilizations.

So what is few?

en.wikipedia.org...

Our knowledge of Sumerian astronomy is indirect, via the earliest Babylonian star catalogues dating from about 1200 BCE. The fact that many star names appear in Sumerian suggests a continuity reaching into the Early Bronze Age.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

The large granite stones found in the King's chamber, weighing from 25 to 80 tonnes were transported from Aswan, about 500 miles away.

Thanks for corroborating the falsehood about thousands of miles. The material was moved down the Nile a distance of closer to 600 miles.

Nibiru has also been known as Planet X, and Planet X is not only a theory but evidence suggests it exists, despite claims like yours that it doesn't...

By people that don't know what they are talking about. Planet X has nothing at all to do with Nibiru. The evidence that Planet X might have existed was shown to be wrong in 1987. Nothing has ever shown Nibiru to be possible.

Really stereologist?... crocodiles/alligators, komodo dragons and sharks are dinosaurs that have existed for millions of years and still exist today. some have barely changed at all since their prehistoric times...

None of the animals you list are dinosaurs. They are not related to dinosaurs. Please learn why lizards are not dinosaurs. Sharks are NOT even air breathing. Sheeesh ...

Sharks and alligators/crocodilles for example haven't changed much from their old prehistoric times, and we even know at least one species of dinosaur shark that still exists today...

I suppose this was a joke on your part.

This goes to show how much you know about these things...

Please take the time to learn why your commentary is pointless. I am sure I know much more about ancient creatures still found today than you do. Take crinoids as an example.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
Nibiru has also been known as Planet X, and Planet X is not only a theory but evidence suggests it exists, despite claims like yours that it doesn't...

Some people have called Nibiru "Planet X", but the term "Planet X" has been used for a lot of things that have nothing whatsoever to do with Stichen's Nibiru.

So an astronomical body some people may call "Planet X" could very well exist, but that doesn't mean that Nibiru exists.

Originally posted by wmd_2008

Planet X was a name give to an object beyond Pluto and has NOTHING to do with Nibiru

Wrong, Planet X is also another name which had been given to Nibiru. BTW, those who disagreed were ALWAYS claiming "THERE CAN BE NO OTHER LARGE PLANET OUT THERE BECAUSE WE WOULD HAVE KNOWN BY NOW" and look at where we are now... More and more evidence says the contrary to the claims of PROBABLY people like yourself who have claimed "NO LARGE PLANET CAN EXISTS IN OUR SOLAR SYSTEM".

And btw, it has EVERYTHING to do with Nibiru, if you would read the scientific peer-reviewed papers I have given about this topic you would know that scientists are saying that some LARGE unknown gravitational source in our Solar System is affecting comets, satellites, and it seems to be also affecting the distance between the Sun and planets.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Something is pulling the planets away from the Sun faster than it is supposed to be occurring.

Originally posted by wmd_2008
Your modern day dinosaurs are a bit smaller than they used to be for example.

About 100 million years ago, toward the middle of the Cretaceous period, some crocodiles had begun to imitate their dinosaur cousins by evolving to enormous sizes. The king of the Cretaceous crocodiles was the enormous Sarcosuchus, dubbed "SuperCroc" by the media, which measured about 40 feet long from head to tail and weighed in the neighborhood of 10 tons

Did you miss the part where your article says SOME crocodiles?... Which means MANY others were about the same size as today's crocs...