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Regarding science explaining the paranormal

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posted on May, 14 2012 @ 05:41 PM
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Originally posted by DontTreadOnMe
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posted on May, 14 2012 @ 05:51 PM
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Originally posted by 0thetrooth0

I hope it's not that important like their hiding the truth on reincarnation from us and will be be coming back ro earth over and over again for all eternity since we just think we have one life. Little do we know there's proof of reincarnation, but it is kept secret so only they can ascend and we the masses get stuck in eternal rebirths.
I can only hope it's not something serious like that...
I can swallow them hiding free energy or the real truth behind 9/11 or advanced technology etc but when it comes to real important things like god, afterlife, etc. dam


I would hesitate to say that science as we know it today is hiding paranormal information since, by definition, science does not deal with the paranormal.

Are people who are investigating the paranormal, the technologically superior, the outside-the box workings of the Universe hiding things from us?

Do dogs often bark?

How about life on Mars?

RV and Evidence Of Life On Mars

There is coming a time soon when we are going to have to face up to the fact that the real world is a much larger and more complex place than we suspected. It's all part of growing up individually and as a species. Many resist this evolving process and some of those get increasingly uncomfortable with what I am reporting and even hostile and reactive as they perceive their comfort zones to be threatened by this information and the direction they perceive it may be headed in. Just remember, I didn't make the reality and, if you are having trouble with it, you must take that up with the big fellow that made everything including you. Likewise, I do not create what is on Mars, only report what is already there as I encounter it.



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 06:06 PM
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Originally posted by AlchemicalMonocular
I would hesitate to say that science as we know it today is hiding paranormal information since, by definition, science does not deal with the paranormal.

Are people who are investigating the paranormal, the technologically superior, the outside-the box workings of the Universe hiding things from us?

Do dogs often bark?

How about life on Mars?

There is coming a time soon when we are going to have to face up to the fact that the real world is a much larger and more complex place than we suspected. It's all part of growing up individually and as a species. Many resist this evolving process and some of those get increasingly uncomfortable with what I am reporting and even hostile and reactive as they perceive their comfort zones to be threatened by this information and the direction they perceive it may be headed in. Just remember, I didn't make the reality and, if you are having trouble with it, you must take that up with the big fellow that made everything including you. Likewise, I do not create what is on Mars, only report what is already there as I encounter it.


When it comes to the point that it warrants scientific investigation, it's no longer "paranormal" but just "normal" and would be subject to the data collection conditions of the scientific process.
It's not to say those things aren't possible, many probably are, they just aren't in the realm of the accepted at the moment. That doesn't mean they'll never be.
When they reach the point of being investigated, they'll be renamed and no longer referred to as paranormal since they won't be "beyond what is normal".
I don't think they're hiding anything, they just haven't given it much creedance or study do to the spectacular nature involved as well as the multitude of hoaxes that are easily proven to be hoaxes. When people stop "faking it" and they are able to look at actual occurances (if, in fact they exist, I'm not sure either way), then there will be more time and effort dedicated to them. Due to all of the hoax situations, paranormal is often associated with fakery and human "ignorance" if you will. When the fakery and desire for attention is taken out of the equation, it can be investigated and if there are actual occurances of additional sensitivity or influence beyond what we are presently aware of, they can get the attention they should have instead of being lumped in with those who just want attention and "fake it".
It won't be "paranormal", it will be a new field with a new name when there is actual proof of occurance.
edit on 14-5-2012 by PurpleChiten because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 06:32 PM
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Originally posted by schuyler

If the paranormal exists, science simply must explain it. Science is the search for Truth. Right now science does not have the theoretical framework to explain the paranormal, nor do its participants have the requisite mindset to even acknowledge the possibility that the paranormal exists. Both have to change.


That is well said, I would add two additional comments. Science based on quantum principles has explanations but the line of deccorence between materialistic science and those who study quantum scinces is hard, fast and rarely overlapped.

Second, I would take exception that all tings must be explainable and point to these considerations. We don't know "all things" so "all things" are unexaminable and what of mystery? I firmly believe that mystery is a very important human consideration.


Originally posted by schuyler

Right now, especially in places like this, you have a lot of people who think they have figured it out. They can quote you reams of material "proving" their speculations. We have a wide variety of both New Age and ancient material that speaks to these issues. We also have many people who claim to have a conduit to the paranormal. But this is largely anecdotal and, unfortunately, without science to provide continuity, is fraught with fraud. We can't trust it even though some of it is very likely very real. For every sincere person there is a Sylvia Browne to cast doubt on the entire process.


True however remote viewing falls outside of the fraudulent paradigm, outside of the speculative and irresponsible "Sylvia Browne" paradigms, for those RVs who follow strict protocols such as CRV



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 06:41 PM
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Originally posted by PurpleChiten...
When it comes to the point that it warrants scientific investigation, it's no longer "paranormal" but just "normal" and would be subject to the data collection conditions of the scientific process.
...


Science works for deterministic, causal behavior. It doesn't work for whimsical. For example, if humans truly have free will, then science can't study that free will.

Quantum mechanics shows that randomness is intrinsic to our universe, but science doesn't know much about that randomness. That randomness could be the interface that allows entities in a super universe to control us without leaving any fingerprints.

(I hope that makes sense. Either it's a stupid idea or I don't usually explain it very well.
)
edit on 14-5-2012 by cloudyday because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 06:47 PM
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@ cloudyday

Interesting angle! But for them, would it be "science" since they've mastered it? It's normal for them, just not normal for us.
Not really agreeing or disagreeing with the possibility, but entertaining the idea of it.

edit on 14-5-2012 by PurpleChiten because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 06:48 PM
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Originally posted by PurpleChiten

When it comes to the point that it warrants scientific investigation, it's no longer "paranormal" but just "normal" and would be subject to the data collection conditions of the scientific process.


Exactly! You got it!


Therein lies the difference between paranormal and normal!



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 06:48 PM
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Originally posted by AlchemicalMonocular

Second, I would take exception that all tings must be explainable and point to these considerations. We don't know "all things" so "all things" are unexaminable and what of mystery? I firmly believe that mystery is a very important human consideration.


I see that objection as more literary than scientific. The goal of Science is to reach Truth--in all things--eventually. Of course we don't know all things right now. Mysteries are good for novels and can be fun entertainment, but I don't see any scientific value in them.


True however remote viewing falls outside of the fraudulent paradigm, outside of the speculative and irresponsible "Sylvia Browne" paradigms, for those RVs who follow strict protocols such as CRV.


No, it doesn't, unfortunately. Remote viewing involves the human mind directly. And when that happens frauds like this show up on a regular basis.



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 06:57 PM
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reply to post by schuyler
 


Frauds show up in all scientifically based endeavor, it means nothing except that people with sentience are capable of discerning the frauds from the nonfraudulent.

E.g

Ed Dames - RV fraud
John McMoneagle - RV with unshakeable, well documented and explicitly verifiable track record of accuracy



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 06:59 PM
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Originally posted by schuyler

Originally posted by sickofitall2012
Sorry, but science will never recognize life after death, because that would mean they were wrong and Jesus was right. They would rather kill us all than admit religion was right about anything.
The " experts" are wrong all the time, do you ever hear them admit it? No.


It's hardly as simplistic as that. If science did discover "the Other Side" that in no way means "Jesus was right." It doesn't prove Jesus even existed or any Biblical truth whatsoever. It's not an "either/or" proposition. Science is hardly out to get religion; it just doesn't accept religious truths, things like you must accept Jesus or suffer damnation. To science, that's really incredibly silly stuff.

Science wants reproducible truth. It will not admit that some medium is channeling an alien--OR a dead person because, quite frankly, not only is it not reproducible, but many acts of fraud have come from that sort of "truth." In part, science is a reaction against religious quakery and that likely is one reason it chooses to avoid the issue of the paranormal.

However, if the paranormal exists (and I believe it does) then science MUST eventually find it, interact with it, and establish reproducible communication with it. Science will need to accommodate the paranormal within the theory of reality. In that sense science will need to reach an accommodation with religion. That doesn't mean accepting Jesus. It means acknowledging there is an "Other Side" and that our souls survive physical death. That doesn't mean science has to accept God, angels, and Heaven. Those are just religious interpretations of what is going on. You can easily have an "Other Side" without any religion at all.


Now how do you get " believe in Him or suffer eternal damnation" from my little post? NO WHERE did I say anything about that. You don't know my beliefs and I would appreciate if you would not assume to. I am a scientist fyi.
Jesus existed, not a question. He did say their is life after death, therefore, He was right. So are you denying that those religions were all wrong about life after death? Religion was the first to say there is life beyond this one, even the Egyptians believed in an after life.
And how do you explain science ignoring the paranormal and ridiculing those who study it for decades upon decades if they're so interested in the truth?

edit on 14-5-2012 by sickofitall2012 because: Fix



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 06:59 PM
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Originally posted by PurpleChiten
@ cloudyday

Interesting angle! But for them, would it be "science" since they've mastered it? It's normal for them, just not normal for us.
Not really agreeing or disagreeing with the possibility, but entertaining the idea of it.

edit on 14-5-2012 by PurpleChiten because: (no reason given)


It would be science for them - more like a computer simulation. But unbeknownst to those super entities (our souls, deities, spirits, etc.), their universe is merely a simulation inside another super universe...



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 07:05 PM
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There's been some hard studies on the paranormal.
A good example is the The Scole Experiment.
There's a good documentary in this thread also;
Afterlife Investigations.
And this is a little thread I authored Ghosts scientifically possible?
Science is always trying to push the limits and boundaries and one day I believe, with technology, we'll find out if there is another side or not.



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 07:17 PM
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Originally posted by AlchemicalMonocular
reply to post by schuyler
 


Frauds show up in all scientifically based endeavor, it means nothing except that people with sentience are capable of discerning the frauds from the nonfraudulent.


Umm, but you just said otherwise. Your original quote:


True however remote viewing falls outside of the fraudulent paradigm, outside of the speculative and irresponsible "Sylvia Browne" paradigms, for those RVs who follow strict protocols such as CRV


which is what I was responding to.


E.g

Ed Dames - RV fraud


Umm, that was my link, an extensive story about the Ed Dames fraud.

Is there something I'm not understanding here? YOU rold ME that "remote viewing falls outside the fraudulent paradigm." I told YOU, no, it doesn't and here's a good example, Ed Dames. Now you repeat back to me what I told you, first that fraud shows up everywhere, and second an example is Ed Dames.



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 08:38 PM
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reply to post by PurpleChiten
 


A tree looks simple to us but in actuality it is a hundred more complex than anything man has created. Science can only investigate and steer life as a farmer tends the crops. Scientists do not look enough at the whole picture because they are too busy taking things apart into unrelated pieces. We are just starting to investigate how the puzzle is put together.



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 09:15 PM
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Originally posted by rickymouse
reply to post by PurpleChiten
 


A tree looks simple to us but in actuality it is a hundred more complex than anything man has created. Science can only investigate and steer life as a farmer tends the crops. Scientists do not look enough at the whole picture because they are too busy taking things apart into unrelated pieces. We are just starting to investigate how the puzzle is put together.


It doesn't mean they can't, it just means they haven't.



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 09:32 PM
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reply to post by PurpleChiten
 


I guess you are right there, We just have to start looking at all the information we have accumulated and filed and have someone with some common sense piece it together. Puzzling analogy isn't it
Where do we find people with common sense, maybe a small farmer or handyman?



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 09:47 PM
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Originally posted by rickymouse
reply to post by PurpleChiten
 


I guess you are right there, We just have to start looking at all the information we have accumulated and filed and have someone with some common sense piece it together. Puzzling analogy isn't it
Where do we find people with common sense, maybe a small farmer or handyman?


I've got it!!! The Amish!!!!



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 11:07 PM
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reply to post by PurpleChiten
 


Good idea, didn't even think of them. But if we were all Amish, who would drive us to town?



posted on May, 14 2012 @ 11:20 PM
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reply to post by schuyler
 


Ed Dames does not follow the proven protocols of RV which either you know, and are being argumentative, or you don't know, and are being argumentative; in both cases you are either disingenuous or simply ill informed or both.

edit on 14-5-2012 by AlchemicalMonocular because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 15 2012 @ 02:00 AM
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reply to post by 0thetrooth0
 


Personal experience is the same thing that we had with meteorites, chimpanzees, and rogue waves. All of them proved to be real phenomena. Just wanted to point that out.



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