Widespread fraud attempts in both Oklahoma and Arizona!!!!!!!

reply to post by Skript420


I believe it was a Romney delegate who did the assaulting, although there seemed to be some confusion. The guy streaming Arizona asked some girls after the parking lot convention dissolved and they seemed to be confused as to whether it was a Romney delegate or if it was Romney's son (I think).

Originally posted by macaronicaesar
reply to post by redrose123

 

At the Oklahoma convention the establishment chair adjourned the meeting prematurely without a 2/3 majority and with many calls for division, because Paul had the majority, so the convention had been forced to resume outside in the parking lot. Thankfully the Paul supporters were smart enough to reconvene after the chair illegally ended proceedings. I've been at work watching this off and on all day, the Arizona Convention has been full of trickery and dirty tactics all day long as well. If you can't follow the streams, rd the comments to the links posted.

In arizona roll-calls, points of orders, objections, ect are being ignored, same crock as usual. Alternates weren't selected, so they selected delegates they preferred ect ect.

I've provided plenty of sources here.

edit on 12-5-2012 by macaronicaesar because: (no reason given)

Okay, I'm not dropping in to be pro or anti Paul either way, but I am curious about something in how you're describing this compared to Missouri's system I watched here. In Missouri, pretty much the first order of business is selecting the Chairman which, if lost, loses it all. We all lost the hope right there for how the rules on every aspect of the Caucus from that moment on is defined by the Chairman who is presiding after that opening choice.

It sounds like the supporters well outnumber the others for the 50% majority to, if not pass whatever, then keep anything else from happening by procedural moves. Is the system that different between states? It could be I'm also not understanding it perfectly, but the hour long session I attended before the rally here in my city was training us all on how the caucus was going to function and how to make it work for us. Numbers were the start and finish to the whole shebang by what I took from it all.

I'm honestly curious..not trying to debate.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000

Originally posted by macaronicaesar
reply to post by redrose123

 

At the Oklahoma convention the establishment chair adjourned the meeting prematurely without a 2/3 majority and with many calls for division, because Paul had the majority, so the convention had been forced to resume outside in the parking lot. Thankfully the Paul supporters were smart enough to reconvene after the chair illegally ended proceedings. I've been at work watching this off and on all day, the Arizona Convention has been full of trickery and dirty tactics all day long as well. If you can't follow the streams, rd the comments to the links posted.

In arizona roll-calls, points of orders, objections, ect are being ignored, same crock as usual. Alternates weren't selected, so they selected delegates they preferred ect ect.

I've provided plenty of sources here.

edit on 12-5-2012 by macaronicaesar because: (no reason given)

Okay, I'm not dropping in to be pro or anti Paul either way, but I am curious about something in how you're describing this compared to Missouri's system I watched here. In Missouri, pretty much the first order of business is selecting the Chairman which, if lost, loses it all. We all lost the hope right there for how the rules on every aspect of the Caucus from that moment on is defined by the Chairman who is presiding after that opening choice.

It sounds like the supporters well outnumber the others for the 50% majority to, if not pass whatever, then keep anything else from happening by procedural moves. Is the system that different between states? It could be I'm also not understanding it perfectly, but the hour long session I attended before the rally here in my city was training us all on how the caucus was going to function and how to make it work for us. Numbers were the start and finish to the whole shebang by what I took from it all.

I'm honestly curious..not trying to debate.

The Paul supporters were imperfectly organized in the beginning, which allowed a Romney chair, however, the proceedings were not followed by Robert's Rule of Order from that point forward, numerous violations and attempts to defraud Paul supporters were made.

The result in OK is that the OK GOP will hand pick the delegates.

It is a complete farce, and yet more proof that America as a free nation is all but lost. The GOP has now resorted to violence and rule violations to get their way. Very very sad.

One positive is that it will almost certainly lead to Paul running independent, which ends Romney's chances. This is important because letting the GOP anywhere near the Presidency would be a disaster for the world.

reply to post by macaronicaesar

Ouch.. That explains that and makes sense for how it happened. Thanks for the clarification. I'm sorry to hear it went that way. Whatever else happens, millions of us now know how this system works very well who likely had no idea before. I sure didn't know the particulars of the process before this year. I just voted and called it done at that. Never again, and that is at least something it's all accomplished.

I don't understand how anyone at all can support Romney after this stuff has been going on repeatedly. Why support someone involved in so much corruption? Do people need their heads testing or what?

The quicker this corrupt fraud loses any chance of being president the better. People actually support this guy and want him running America? Do they want to see the country finally fall apart for real or what? You'd really think so sometimes.

I for one see someting positive about all of this that extends beyond ron paul. We in america are learning more and more about our government, TPTB, politicians, so on and so on. When enough people finally find the truth in say, elections. you start to gravitate and come together. hence revolution. because the truth has come out. If ron paul was actually part of the establishment, then oh well. if he were to be really what he says, and gets mysteriously ill, if he were to go on to be the best new age president weve ever had....if he drops out now, It has already begun. The revolution of a peaceful takeover. refusal to play the game by the establishments rules. by getting to know the rules very well. that makes sense if you think about it. i just see positivity and dedication in all the ron paul supporters. i like the way this revolution has started.

Originally posted by macaronicaesar
www.ustream.tv...

www.ustream.tv...
or:
www.ustream.tv...

www.dailypaul.com...


It sickens me that even those who are against Paul, Paul's views and his supporters still condone this cheating behavior taking place at all conventions nation wide.

You people need to wake the hell up. If this was over, why the hell would they continue to attempt to defraud the convention goers? Any ideas? You bunch are a real piece of work.

edit on 12-5-2012 by macaronicaesar because: (no reason given)

look, this isn't about any law being broke...this is about political party choices...fraud constitutes something illegal going on...the republican party bosses simply don't want ron paul as their candidate...you're the one that wants to belong to this political group...change it yourself, or leave......quit telling ME to wake up, look in the damn mirror, because i could care less.

Originally posted by robhines
I don't understand how anyone at all can support Romney after this stuff has been going on repeatedly. Why support someone involved in so much corruption? Do people need their heads testing or what?

The quicker this corrupt fraud loses any chance of being president the better. People actually support this guy and want him running America? Do they want to see the country finally fall apart for real or what? You'd really think so sometimes.

that's the problem...you don't understand...romney represents the wealthy, republicans always have supported the wealthy, they don't want ron paul, because he will upset the interests of the wealthy...this isn't rocket science

Originally posted by eLPresidente
reply to post by captaintyinknots

 

The short answer is, there are people working on it. Does that settle your 'question' ??

Really? Where? Show me.... All I have seen so far is Paulites trying to steal delegates from the popular winner.. NO i can't stand Romney, but he took the popular votes in the primaries, WHY is this even an issue?

It's interesting that not one Law Enforcement agency has taken this seriously, not ONE judge, or magistrate, and not one governor or elected official. But "somewhere there are people working on it"

If Romney took the popular vote, then the delegates belong to him, simple. Not that I like it, but this whining and crying because you lose Has got to stop, it's really making you look bad to keep crying conspiracy and foul.. I saw the streams, I saw what was going on, and I also noted that it looked like the chair was trying maintain order where the Paulites weren't allowing it. Jeez.... can we say sore losers?

Originally posted by vkey08
If Romney took the popular vote, then the delegates belong to him, simple. Not that I like it, but this whining and crying because you lose Has got to stop, it's really making you look bad to keep crying conspiracy and foul.. I saw the streams, I saw what was going on, and I also noted that it looked like the chair was trying maintain order where the Paulites weren't allowing it. Jeez.... can we say sore losers?

I watched the livestream too, from the moment they were in the parking lot. Everything was VERY well organized.
Nearly every single vote was for slate A, which is for Ron Paul.
The first votes ended in 696 for A and 4 for B. Also the alternates were nearly all for A as well.
Everyone was chanting "President Paul". I believe there were about 700 (or 1400) people present outside.
They yelled "order" only a few times, because people were talking while the chairman was talking through the microphone.

Originally posted by macaronicaesar
reply to post by captaintyinknots

 

How do you know they're not, the streams are there. I have watched them all day, it's not make believe, it's most definitely taking place, you question it as if these streams may not be proof enough.

Or are you insinuating that Paul is ok with being ripped off because he's some evil scam artist who is in on the joke? Paul is doing this to show what the establishment is all about. He is saying all the right things atm, because he has to, the convention is going to get messy and I can't wait.

There is zero chance he falls in line and supports Romney, none.

edit on 12-5-2012 by macaronicaesar because: (no reason given)

Just like there was zero chance you'd see Paul having breakfast with Bernanke and having "off the record" secret conversations with him.

Hahahaha, he will endorse Romney and you will fall in line so you can continue to worship your idol.

Originally posted by vkey08

Originally posted by eLPresidente
reply to post by captaintyinknots

 

The short answer is, there are people working on it. Does that settle your 'question' ??

Really? Where? Show me.... All I have seen so far is Paulites trying to steal delegates from the popular winner.. NO i can't stand Romney, but he took the popular votes in the primaries, WHY is this even an issue?

It's interesting that not one Law Enforcement agency has taken this seriously, not ONE judge, or magistrate, and not one governor or elected official. But "somewhere there are people working on it"

If Romney took the popular vote, then the delegates belong to him, simple. Not that I like it, but this whining and crying because you lose Has got to stop, it's really making you look bad to keep crying conspiracy and foul.. I saw the streams, I saw what was going on, and I also noted that it looked like the chair was trying maintain order where the Paulites weren't allowing it. Jeez.... can we say sore losers?

Fraud doesn't necessarily mean illegal

A false representation of a matter of fact—whether by words or by conduct, by false or misleading allegations, or by concealment of what should have been disclosed—that deceives and is intended to deceive another so that the individual will act upon it to her or his legal injury.

Fraud is commonly understood as dishonesty calculated for advantage. A person who is dishonest may be called a fraud. In the U.S. legal system, fraud is a specific offense with certain features.

Fraud is most common in the buying or selling of property, including real estate, Personal Property, and intangible property, such as stocks, bonds, and copyrights. State and federal statutes criminalize fraud, but not all cases rise to the level of criminality. Prosecutors have discretion in determining which cases to pursue. Victims may also seek redress in civil court.

Fraud must be proved by showing that the defendant's actions involved five separate elements: (1) a false statement of a material fact,(2) knowledge on the part of the defendant that the statement is untrue, (3) intent on the part of the defendant to deceive the alleged victim, (4) justifiable reliance by the alleged victim on the statement, and (5) injury to the alleged victim as a result.

So I doubt any Law Enforcement agency is going to arrest anyone in the GOP for breaking their own rules and cheating others. Same goes for any judge, right? Although I would like to see any politician stand up to this blatent fraud that's been on going during this delegate process but I doubt we'll see that. Politics in Washington is similar to hanging with the cool crowd in high school. The cool kids aren't going to stray away from what's considered popular by their peers/leaders, and it's not cool to support Ron Paul in DC. We all can agree Ron Paul is the outcast amongst his peers?

As far as the popular vote and Romney taking it, Ron Paul said it best in this video,



Related thread, www.abovetopsecret.com...

I was a delegate at the AZ GOP convention yesterday, it was a disorganized mess and things got real interesting at the end. The old neocons were none to happy to realize our true numbers...

This is PROOF of the vote counting fraud that goes on in the GOP, and why the primary straw poll results can't be trusted. If they blatantly cheat this bad in such a small, discoverable group, imagine what they do when there are hundreds of thousands...

Once voting started we were not allowed to leave our congressional district. The Flagstaff group was in CD-1 which comprised of around 150 delegates. We had to vote for an A and B delegate (two separate ballots). On the first ballot the Ron Paul delegate was Jill Skayfel. The vote was taken and about 30 minutes later the results came back.

It was reported that Jill had only received 15 votes. We knew for a fact that she had received at least 11 votes from Coconino County alone! The place went crazy and someone called for a show of hands. My wife Cindy was chosen to count the hands and as soon as the hands went up you could hear Romney delegates gasp. Hands were raised everywhere. A total of 51 people had voted for Jill Skayfel.

The room erupted and GOP representatives were called. My wife Cindy was chosen to accompany our county vice chair Drake Mitchell to talk to GOP representatives and staff. The GOP wanted to run the ballots through the machine again and if the results matched, call it good. That would have resulted in some kind of riot. Cindy and Drake fought hard for an honest recount and eventually representatives from the Paul and Romney campaigns observed the recount and reported the correct results.

Second place went to Coconino County chair Diana Arendt who received 48 votes. She was part of Romney’s slate. Ron Paul delegate Jill Skayfel had won by 3 with 51 votes.

flagliberty.wordpress.com...

Originally posted by jimmyx

Originally posted by macaronicaesar
www.ustream.tv...

www.ustream.tv...
or:
www.ustream.tv...

www.dailypaul.com...


It sickens me that even those who are against Paul, Paul's views and his supporters still condone this cheating behavior taking place at all conventions nation wide.

You people need to wake the hell up. If this was over, why the hell would they continue to attempt to defraud the convention goers? Any ideas? You bunch are a real piece of work.

edit on 12-5-2012 by macaronicaesar because: (no reason given)

look, this isn't about any law being broke...this is about political party choices...fraud constitutes something illegal going on...the republican party bosses simply don't want ron paul as their candidate...you're the one that wants to belong to this political group...change it yourself, or leave......quit telling ME to wake up, look in the damn mirror, because i could care less.

I couldn't give a # about jimmyx. I wasn't telling you specifically to wake up. There is a process here that is supposed to be sacred, whether it's a private organization or a federal election makes little difference, these clowns are cheating, stealing and abusing American citizens, it needs to stop. If you want to argue semantics, do it somewhere else. This is an integral part of our electoral process and it is being violated at every turn.

Originally posted by vkey08

Originally posted by eLPresidente
reply to post by captaintyinknots

 

The short answer is, there are people working on it. Does that settle your 'question' ??

Really? Where? Show me.... All I have seen so far is Paulites trying to steal delegates from the popular winner.. NO i can't stand Romney, but he took the popular votes in the primaries, WHY is this even an issue?

It's interesting that not one Law Enforcement agency has taken this seriously, not ONE judge, or magistrate, and not one governor or elected official. But "somewhere there are people working on it"

If Romney took the popular vote, then the delegates belong to him, simple. Not that I like it, but this whining and crying because you lose Has got to stop, it's really making you look bad to keep crying conspiracy and foul.. I saw the streams, I saw what was going on, and I also noted that it looked like the chair was trying maintain order where the Paulites weren't allowing it. Jeez.... can we say sore losers?

Popular vote has nothing to do with delegate selection, you are criticizing Paul for your ignorance to a subject you know very little, if anything about.

reply to post by Darkinin


It was an official Romney endorsed delegate who did the assaulting. The GOP put little asterisks, and put those Romney endorsed candidates at the top of the list, out of alphabetical order, to make it easier for the senile Romney supporters. An RP supporter called a point of order after Romney's son endorsed the Romney slate at the end of his speech. The Romney endorsed delegate punched him in the leg, and tried to pull him back down into his chair...at which point other convention goers stepped in and the sheriff deputies filed an assault report against the Romney delegate.

Originally posted by TinfoilTP

Originally posted by macaronicaesar
reply to post by captaintyinknots

 

How do you know they're not, the streams are there. I have watched them all day, it's not make believe, it's most definitely taking place, you question it as if these streams may not be proof enough.

Or are you insinuating that Paul is ok with being ripped off because he's some evil scam artist who is in on the joke? Paul is doing this to show what the establishment is all about. He is saying all the right things atm, because he has to, the convention is going to get messy and I can't wait.

There is zero chance he falls in line and supports Romney, none.

edit on 12-5-2012 by macaronicaesar because: (no reason given)

Just like there was zero chance you'd see Paul having breakfast with Bernanke and having "off the record" secret conversations with him.

Hahahaha, he will endorse Romney and you will fall in line so you can continue to worship your idol.

Go troll somewhere else. I have no doubt the discussions between Bernanke and Paul were constructive discussions with Paul pushing for the gold standard. He's not an aggressive man and does things with integrity. Sitting down and discussing things, even with those you disagree with is a good thing and Paul has never suggested otherwise. His foreign policy is predicated on doing exactly that.

Instead of your constant trolling, do you have anything else to offer?

reply to post by vkey08



Please, we have been over this many times before.

Present 1 GOP rule that the Ron Paul supporters broke to attain delegates.


Here is your homework for the day:

1) google democratic republic
2) google democracy
3) compare the two
4) present your findings here

reply to post by captaintyinknots


Have you ever tried taking on monsanto. That is right because you cant.