The Secret Behind the Promise: A Libertarian Dictatorship

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posted on May, 10 2012 @ 01:54 PM
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I hardly agree with any political candidates this time around (or most times around) but I would really like to hear more about increased surveillance from any candidate OTHER than Ron Paul.

I feel like more would get done to remove the Patriot Act and slash the budget for monitoring Americans if the message came from someone with a little less baggage.




posted on May, 10 2012 @ 02:00 PM
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Originally posted by Chrisfishenstein
reply to post by jjf3rd77
 



I take it you are trying to sell everyone on golden boy Romney then? Grew up with no issues and tons of money that kept rolling in.....How is he supposed to deal with any problems with America?? Oh yeah...He WON'T!!

I am not trying to sell anybody on Romney. I made a post awhile back explaining why, I am voting for him over Ron Paul and Obama. I question all sitting Presidents and the candidates before them. Why should Paul be held to a different standard, based on my own personal questionnaires?


Then you have a Dr. who has 30+ years of good standing toward voting on the bills for the benefit of the people.....One of the only candidates in the history of the U.S.A. that is honest proven, and can't be bought with any amount of money....Yet you argue that the best shot America has to get back on the right track...Why??

You certainly seem to be selling Ron Paul to me here.


You are trying to get answers to a couple different things you don't agree on, and that is enough to try and talk people out of voting for the BEST candidate??

As stated in the OP, I keep questioning these things because nobody has given me a straight foward answer that was not devoid of Wishful thinking and empty promises.


Good luck selling people on not voting for Paul because of 2 or 3 things he believes in that you don't!!

SO why should I vote for Paul then if I don't agree with most of his platform?



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 02:02 PM
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I agree it will be very hard to pass alot of things through congress, but another thing you must understand is that Ron Paul has effected people and lots of supporters will be running for office soon so they might be taking up seats in the house and senate.



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 02:40 PM
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I'll try to tackle the fed issue. He wants the congress to do its job and regulate and valuate the currency of our country (Article 1, section 8 of the constitution). If that doesn't work, take away the monopoly of coining the money supply. The debt racked up through the declaring of the fed unconstitutional and criminal will force it null and void so there is a big chunk of change in the american coffers. Everyone but the fed institution survives just fine.

If the above is not valid enough or too impossible- just taking it out of the feds hands solely and allow others to coin the money as well will force fiscal disclosure (which the fed has none of now) so those really charged with our nations finances will be able to do a better job for the people (hopefully), than for the few corporations that the banks have installed on the fed reserve board.


Answered!


P.S. Dont vote for anyone you dont agree with
edit on 10-5-2012 by eazyriderl_l because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 02:41 PM
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Originally posted by jjf3rd77

Originally posted by Damrod
reply to post by jjf3rd77
 


What?...are you candy or what?...."I'm afraid to face the facts"...."My candidate is a jerk-off"....


stop it dude....your dude is a douche-bag....at least RP is real....even more real than Obama...but you are too blind and hard headed to realize that Romney is just a pale skinned version of Obama aren't you....are you scared of the racist card?....I'm not...why?...because it has nothing to do with race and everything to do with right and wrong...and your criminal candidate is wrong and cannot nor will not win....suck it up and realize the fail.....RP is right....if your guy wins...we all fail...for the next seveal years....wake up idjet....get someone who is at least going to start change...your dude is going to perpetuate stupidity and make us all hurt more.....
edit on 5/10/2012 by Damrod because: (no reason given)


What happened to civil discussion??? You started out well and your posts have lacked substance since then, just telling me that Romney is bad and Ron Paul is good and right is not going to stop me from questioning him! Give up your postings if you don't have anything substantial to add. Thank you!


Oh man...just stop for a minute. Your man...wants to tel people what to do and how to live...how is that freedom? Ron at least wants to turn a lot of these decisions over to the states...as should be. I don't get it....how can you call yourself a conservative when you want to be up and in everyone's business?...that is NOT conservatism...that is Christian coalition/moral majority crap....that is not "Liberty'.

this is why the Republicans are failing and will eventually disappear...they are living in a flux...a duo world where there own words defy themselves.....you cannot have it both ways. Do you respect the rights of the LGBT community?...or do you think you have the right to dictate to them? I think I know that answer but I will spare you the indignity of having to say so....true "conservatism" says "stay out of the bedroom"....this is universal...the "Pat Robertson" conservatives need to follow the Jim Jones example and remove themselves from the real world...they are an unwanted burden of antiquated beliefs and witchcraft....they are liars and false prophets....they need to bow out and no longer burden the real world with their ignorance and lies....



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 02:47 PM
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Originally posted by eazyriderl_l
I'll try to tackle the fed issue. He wants the congress to do its job and regulate and valuate the currency of our country (Article 1, section 8 of the constitution). If that doesn't work, take away the monopoly of coining the money supply. The debt racked up through the declaring of the fed unconstitutional and criminal will force it null and void so there is a big chunk of change in the american coffers. Everyone but the fed institution survives just fine.

If the above is not valid enough or too impossible- just taking it out of the feds hands solely and allow others to coin the money as well will force fiscal disclosure (which the fed has none of now) so those really charged with our nations finances will be able to do a better job for the people (hopefully), than for the few corporations that the banks have installed on the fed reserve board.


Answered!


P.S. Dont vote for anyone you dont agree with
edit on 10-5-2012 by eazyriderl_l because: (no reason given)


Not really, you just told me in different terms, what he does want to do, not how exactly he will do this! And neither have you.



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 02:49 PM
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Originally posted by Damrod

Originally posted by jjf3rd77

Originally posted by Damrod
reply to post by jjf3rd77
 


What?...are you candy or what?...."I'm afraid to face the facts"...."My candidate is a jerk-off"....


stop it dude....your dude is a douche-bag....at least RP is real....even more real than Obama...but you are too blind and hard headed to realize that Romney is just a pale skinned version of Obama aren't you....are you scared of the racist card?....I'm not...why?...because it has nothing to do with race and everything to do with right and wrong...and your criminal candidate is wrong and cannot nor will not win....suck it up and realize the fail.....RP is right....if your guy wins...we all fail...for the next seveal years....wake up idjet....get someone who is at least going to start change...your dude is going to perpetuate stupidity and make us all hurt more.....
edit on 5/10/2012 by Damrod because: (no reason given)


What happened to civil discussion??? You started out well and your posts have lacked substance since then, just telling me that Romney is bad and Ron Paul is good and right is not going to stop me from questioning him! Give up your postings if you don't have anything substantial to add. Thank you!


Oh man...just stop for a minute. Your man...wants to tel people what to do and how to live...how is that freedom? Ron at least wants to turn a lot of these decisions over to the states...as should be. I don't get it....how can you call yourself a conservative when you want to be up and in everyone's business?...that is NOT conservatism...that is Christian coalition/moral majority crap....that is not "Liberty'.

this is why the Republicans are failing and will eventually disappear...they are living in a flux...a duo world where there own words defy themselves.....you cannot have it both ways. Do you respect the rights of the LGBT community?...or do you think you have the right to dictate to them? I think I know that answer but I will spare you the indignity of having to say so....true "conservatism" says "stay out of the bedroom"....this is universal...the "Pat Robertson" conservatives need to follow the Jim Jones example and remove themselves from the real world...they are an unwanted burden of antiquated beliefs and witchcraft....they are liars and false prophets....they need to bow out and no longer burden the real world with their ignorance and lies....



Until you have something constructive to say about my questions or my posts, please stop telling me how wrong I am or that I am voting for the wrong person. I've made up my mind and your not going to change it. There are unanswered questions about Ron Paul that I am very uncomfortable with....What's wrong with that?:
edit on 10-5-2012 by jjf3rd77 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 03:03 PM
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Originally posted by jjf3rd77

Originally posted by Damrod

Originally posted by jjf3rd77

Originally posted by Damrod
reply to post by jjf3rd77
 


What?...are you candy or what?...."I'm afraid to face the facts"...."My candidate is a jerk-off"....


stop it dude....your dude is a douche-bag....at least RP is real....even more real than Obama...but you are too blind and hard headed to realize that Romney is just a pale skinned version of Obama aren't you....are you scared of the racist card?....I'm not...why?...because it has nothing to do with race and everything to do with right and wrong...and your criminal candidate is wrong and cannot nor will not win....suck it up and realize the fail.....RP is right....if your guy wins...we all fail...for the next seveal years....wake up idjet....get someone who is at least going to start change...your dude is going to perpetuate stupidity and make us all hurt more.....
edit on 5/10/2012 by Damrod because: (no reason given)


What happened to civil discussion??? You started out well and your posts have lacked substance since then, just telling me that Romney is bad and Ron Paul is good and right is not going to stop me from questioning him! Give up your postings if you don't have anything substantial to add. Thank you!


Oh man...just stop for a minute. Your man...wants to tell people what to do and how to live...how is that freedom? Ron at least wants to turn a lot of these decisions over to the states...as should be. I don't get it....how can you call yourself a conservative when you want to be up and in everyone's business?...that is NOT conservatism...that is Christian coalition/moral majority crap....that is not "Liberty'.

This is why the Republicans are failing and will eventually disappear...they are living in a flux...a duo world where there own words defy themselves.....you cannot have it both ways. Do you respect the rights of the LGBT community?...or do you think you have the right to dictate to them? I think I know that answer but I will spare you the indignity of having to say so....true "conservatism" says "stay out of the bedroom"....this is universal...the "Pat Robertson" conservatives need to follow the Jim Jones example and remove themselves from the real world...they are an unwanted burden of antiquated beliefs and witchcraft....they are liars and false prophets....they need to bow out and no longer burden the real world with their ignorance and lies....



Until you have something constructive to say about my questions or my posts, please stop telling me how wrong I am or that I am voting for the wrong person. I've made up my mind and your not going to change it. There are unanswered questions about Ron Paul that I am very uncomfortable with....What's wrong with that?:
edit on 10-5-2012 by jjf3rd77 because: (no reason given)


Not a thing...and that is fair. I will not ask you to explain your position on human rights or women's rights...basically because your candidate has spoken for you. I would ask you to explain how dictating behavior has ever worked out in the past?.....give me one example where totalitarianism of personal views has ever ended in success....I doubt you can give me one...

And No....telling people how to live has never won....telling people the downsides of living this way or that has some merit....but the most successful method has always been to allow people to live the best way they can....and that my friend is Libertarianism...oh wait...it's actually called true "conservatism....a term apparently alien to Mitt Romney....who wants nothing more than to dictate terms of life to the masses.....

go on...let's hear the rebuttal....I see it is convenient to ignore the questions I have asked...you apparently want to ignore the LGBT community as if they don't exist....i am not going to allow that. Address the statements and questions or you argument is descended into mindless dogma...and is meaningless...give us a reason to hear you....I doubt your antiquated bs can dig one out....

I am shocked you folks are still scratching from the caves....wake up...you are dieing....time for change....

edit on 5/10/2012 by Damrod because: (no reason given)
edit on 5/10/2012 by Damrod because: (no reason given)
edit on 5/10/2012 by Damrod because: (no reason given)
edit on 5/10/2012 by Damrod because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 03:08 PM
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Reply to post by Holodomor
 


So was Mein Kampf. Doesnt make it right.

Seriously, if Ron Paul is a wolf disguised as a shepherd, it would mean he pulled off a 30 year con. It takes a special kind of sociopath to pull off that kind of consistency in lying over the long term and i doubt the Doctor is capable of that.


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 03:12 PM
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Originally posted by Damrod

Not a thing...and that is fair. I will not ask you to explain your position on human rights or women's rights...basically because your candidate has spoken for you. I would ask you to explain how dictating behavior has ever worked out in the past?.....give me one example where totalitarianism of personal views has ever ended in success....I doubt you can give me one...



Exactly dictating behavior has and will never work. Totalitarianism doesn't work! So, executive orders from Ron Paul about how to live life and how money should be controlled, will not work. I guess you answered your own questions there.

Not sure about the rest. seemed like rambling to me.



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 03:13 PM
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Originally posted by netwarrior
Reply to post by Holodomor
 


So was Mein Kampf. Doesnt make it right.

Seriously, if Ron Paul is a wolf disguised as a shepherd, it would mean he pulled off a 30 year con. It takes a special kind of sociopath to pull off that kind of consistency in lying over the long term and i doubt the Doctor is capable of that.


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



Not really, its quite easy to run on the same stuff for a long time. It's quite easy to vote no on every bill. It's harder to actually do something and try to implement some of these things, even if you fail, at least he would have some substance to his claims.



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 03:21 PM
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lol did the OP just try to compare Ron Paul and Obama?

Do I sense deflection because too many are already (and deservingly enough) comparing Romney and Obama declaring the two almost identical?



If you want any credibility whatsoever, you'll abstain from plugging Ron Paul into the mold of those that promise one thing and do another. Even the corporate owned media and general republican electorate (who thinks Iranians want to nuke us) knows Ron Paul is consistent.


Get your stuff straight OP.



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 03:25 PM
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Originally posted by jjf3rd77

Originally posted by Damrod

Not a thing...and that is fair. I will not ask you to explain your position on human rights or women's rights...basically because your candidate has spoken for you. I would ask you to explain how dictating behavior has ever worked out in the past?.....give me one example where totalitarianism of personal views has ever ended in success....I doubt you can give me one...



Exactly dictating behavior has and will never work. Totalitarianism doesn't work! So, executive orders from Ron Paul about how to live life and how money should be controlled, will not work. I guess you answered your own questions there.

Not sure about the rest. seemed like rambling to me.



Whoa...where does your information come from? Have you EVER even heard Ron Paul speak on executive orders before? or even heard him speak?

If you have you would know how completely WRONG you are.

Ron Paul has repeatedly and sternly fought against executive orders as a means to write law. Every speech he makes at his rallies talks about repealing thousands of executive orders.


Talk about misinformation.

Ron Paul and dictatorship? totalitarianism? LOL.

Get out of here...seriously, just leave ATS.





P.S. I'm sure while you are there in your fantasy land thinking Ron Paul wants to be a dictator and force people to be free (wtf?), meanwhile Mitt Romney, your dear savior served in the Vietnam draft, isn't funded by Wall Street, understands what its like to live life as a middle class American and wouldn't absolutely sign the NDAA into law ensuring the executive power to kidnap American citizens without due process.

yup...

Mitt Romney sure is a true American hero.


edit on 10-5-2012 by eLPresidente because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 03:34 PM
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First lets us start and keep with the fed for a moment. He can push for a case of unconstitutionality against the federal reserve act similar to the obamacare case now. Then depending how that goes depends on the actions he will have to take. I am not sure if executive orders (E.O.)are in place other than kennedy's 11110 which strips the feds' power to lend money with interest to the us gov, but starting to enforce that would be a good start. I know you seem not to be a fan of E.O.s but they are there and all presidents have used them, so he could go that route.
Audit the fed (which he is pushing for) and see where the money is going and at what interest rate and you would probably see a swell of rage against them and that is why I believe they fight so hard against it.

There is 4 viable answers to the fed reserve to continue our discourse... Answered?



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 04:17 PM
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Originally posted by gwydionblack
LOL

We don't have to. Ron Paul already did it for us.

Restore America Plan

He already has $1 trillion in cuts made so, were good there. Bring the troops home and end the war, that is another $1 trillion + spent each year as of the current figures.

That puts us in the plus. Wasn't too hard, now was it?



is this a joke ?



Cuts $1 trillion in spending during the first year of Ron Paul’s presidency, eliminating five cabinet departments (Energy, HUD, Commerce, Interior, and Education), abolishing the Transportation Security Administration and returning responsibility for security to private property owners, abolishing corporate subsidies, stopping foreign aid, ending foreign wars, and returning most other spending to 2006 levels.


this proves the point of the the thread tbh. these campaign promises could never be kept, and the worst part is he knows it

and just scanning the list of cuts, he would put a lot of people out of work and there are a lot of curious nuggets like "sell federal lands" to who, china ? logging companies ?

it's a total pipe dream



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 04:28 PM
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Originally posted by eazyriderl_l
First lets us start and keep with the fed for a moment. He can push for a case of unconstitutionality against the federal reserve act similar to the obamacare case now. Then depending how that goes depends on the actions he will have to take. I am not sure if executive orders (E.O.)are in place other than kennedy's 11110 which strips the feds' power to lend money with interest to the us gov, but starting to enforce that would be a good start. I know you seem not to be a fan of E.O.s but they are there and all presidents have used them, so he could go that route.
Audit the fed (which he is pushing for) and see where the money is going and at what interest rate and you would probably see a swell of rage against them and that is why I believe they fight so hard against it.

There is 4 viable answers to the fed reserve to continue our discourse... Answered?



Yes, that actually was somewhat of a good response, however, you do realize how difficult that will be right? especially since people believe Kennedy was murdered for writing that EO?

So we appear to have two camps of people here. Those who believe Paul will never in his right mind use an executive order to do the things he wants, because its against the constitution and most likely against his morals. I tend to believe this. Then we have the other people who believe that he will have to use executive orders when Congress doesn't listen to any of his plans, and cry until he gets what he wants...Just like any other President. So which is it?



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 04:31 PM
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Originally posted by Damrod

You guys fail masively...go ahead...remove my posts....ban me...I'll be back from a new isp..i have about 14 different email adddresses and I will be back with a new IP...and I will record every stinking fact and will draw you into litigation until you are broke and no longer have the money to finance this farce.....how's that?....drop my charges...drop my points...or else....and I mean that.....
edit on 5/10/2012 by Damrod because: (no reason given)


Obvious troll is obvious...



posted on May, 10 2012 @ 04:35 PM
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reply to post by jjf3rd77
 


Until you have something constructive to say about my questions or my posts, please stop telling me how wrong I am or that I am voting for the wrong person. I've made up my mind and your not going to change it.

Ummm, didn't you just contradict yourself here?

You don't really want answers, constructive or otherwise, and pretending that you can be swayed by constructive answers is merely a ploy that allows you to continue bashing Paul's supporters and Paul's statements, which you generally spin and take out of context to suit your goal.

But it does give us a better idea of why you're so charmed by Romney, it takes one flip flopper who says whatever he thinks might sway the present crowd to really appreciate another flip flopper who uses the exact same tactic.

Sorry, looks like it ain't workin'.





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