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The Rise Of Socialism And How Capitalism Ran Out Of Other Peoples Money.

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posted on May, 9 2012 @ 04:07 PM
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reply to post by Germanicus
 


So you claim capitalism is the problem, but you'd did nothing to point out how anyone is really practicing capitalism nowdays. The system is already socialist under the guise of capitalism...

So... tell me again why capitalism is the problem? America already paved way for socialism in the 1900s. Look at the state of America (and the rest of the world) and tell me we don't have a bomb waiting to burst.

At least RP is taking it back to a free market society 2012.




posted on May, 9 2012 @ 04:18 PM
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Originally posted by GambitVII
reply to post by Germanicus
 


So you claim capitalism is the problem, but you'd did nothing to point out how anyone is really practicing capitalism nowdays. The system is already socialist under the guise of capitalism...

So... tell me again why capitalism is the problem? America already paved way for socialism in the 1900s. Look at the state of America (and the rest of the world) and tell me we don't have a bomb waiting to burst.

At least RP is taking it back to a free market society 2012.


The bomb is not socialist. The bomb is Imperialist Capitalist. You may think its clever to claim everything is socialist when it isnt but it doesnt make you sound clever. What have you read about socialism? Im guessing not much at all.

And I support Ron Paul for the American Presidency. I am National Socialist so his 'isolationist' idea's are close to the Autarky that I want for the nations of the world. Ron Paul is also going to curb American Imperialism. Have you read Ron Pauls opinion of the IMF? On Foriegn Aid? Ron Paul will work toward ending these scams.

Ron Paul isnt close to socialist but he is the choice of socialists. Im glad you are on the right track with Ron Paul comrade. Paul isnt perfect but he is the best available step toward socialism.



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 04:21 PM
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Originally posted by onthedownlow

Originally posted by Germanicus

Originally posted by onthedownlow
reply to post by Germanicus
 


Perhaps I am wrong, but if I understand your post correctly, socialism is your real enemy. Socialism has created the policies that are bankrupting Europe, and the policies that will soon bankrupt the United States. Are you advocating communism?


I know there are a few pages but please skim them so we dont have to repeat things.

Your comment actually makes my head hurt. Europe is capitalist. This is not hard.

And Europe will bankrupt the United States???? Are you freaking kidding me? Im sure you are just messing with me hey.


Perhaps you should reread. Socialist policies have created financial issues in Europe and the US, not capitalism. I would wager that your head hurts because of the amount of focus required to light your dimb bulb!


See,that doesnt make sense either. Are you just repeating the same thing twice? Does that make it fact?

Europe is capitalist. That is fact. It is also clear. google it for god sake.



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 04:23 PM
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I am personally all about liberty and a return to a constitutional republic. I love things like machine guns, civil liberties and privacy, but I still recognize the need for some social programs.

Imagine our country without the social programs.

No tools to fight extreme poverty: Would mean shanty town and many millions in the dirt. Those slums you see in African countries would be much more prevalent here without much doubt. Notice I say extreme poverty because thats all welfare should be used for.

No public schools: Would mean only the privileged would get an education and many millions would be completely uneducated which would make us third world really.

We live in a mix of Capitalism and Socialism and this is how it should be. We also live in what is supposed to be a free democracy for and by the people, which means we can elect to have any systems we choose. America will never be a Communist country!

Our markets are not very free with Monopolist systems all over the place. Are markets are more like facist systems than free markets. Sure you may be able to open a restarant or small business, but just try to compete with Walmart or bring a candy bar to market. The Mom and Pop operation the built this great nation has been all but eliminated. Just because you call somthing a free market does not make it so.

edit on 9-5-2012 by Donkey_Dean because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 04:25 PM
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Just great, replace one oppressive form of pyramidal thievery with another! "There is NO Government like NO GOVERNMENT"- Socialism is fun until the sociopaths get to run things, then EVERYBODY INTO THE GULAG!



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 04:27 PM
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Originally posted by Germanicus

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
reply to post by Germanicus
 


I am not clear why someone who openly agrees with Hitler should believe anyone should be polite to them. If you want to distinguish a collective from the individuals who make up that collective, then I suppose all collectives are stupid, mindless blobs of masses. Of course, it goes without saying that any socialist agenda is highly dependent upon the masses, and ultimately has to deal with the individuals who oppose it. This is why you speak of armies, isn't it? This is the purpose of this thread, isn't it? To threaten the individuals who oppose the socialist agenda?

Here's the deal, sport. Your dismal view of the masses misses the point that all human masses consists of individuals, and while you are foolishly presuming the masses to be stupid, there will be plenty of individuals who will ultimately outsmart you and your socialist army. Brains are always more powerful than brawn.





Yes,the purpose of my thread is to test toast reactions to the idea of Nationalization. Nationalization is the key.
And I agree with Hitler on alot. I am for Autarky and National Socialism. Hitler turned Germany around from a basket case to the strongest economy in Europe in only 4 years. National Socialism works.

And I dont think I miss the point at all old chap. The individual is not an individual when he is part of the masses.

And Im glad you get brawn from this thread. Another thing that turns people off Socialism is that they think a Socialist is just a limp wristed liberal wearing a Che Guevara t-shirt. Socialists are not dirty lazy hippies that want free money. They are also not stupid. You may find me to be stupid but Socialism has plenty of brains behind it.


There you have it in a nutshell. So you agree with Hitler do you? Well a Socialist would never ever do that.

"Nationalization is the key" is it? So what you are proposing is Stalinism, or Maoism. The subjugation of the masses to dictatorship. Do you realize Stalin killed more communists than the West ever did? His own country's people. Do you realize that? Stalin's 'socialism in one country' allowed no dissent.

A simple fact for you. History has proven socialism in one country does not work. Just as history has proven Capitalism does work but it has an end-by date, one that arrived and we ignored many decades ago. Hence we had the first and second world wars staged in order to redivide the great pie that is the world and its resources.

I want to believe you are genuine. However this post in particular I am replying to demonstrates you are not genuine. Or is it you are simply misinformed?

For the record people. Socialism requires an international movement, and the end of nation states. It is the next step after Capitalism. It entails the rational allocation of resources found all around the world and therefore belonging to humanity but in unequal distribution. The globalization of trade, and the spread of Capitalism to every corner of the globe including China signaled the end of the stage we knew as Capitalist. There is a fateful contradiction you see in having the world divided into nation states (a necessary product of Capitalism) and the Capitalist system itself which puts profit above human need. World wars are the end result of that contradiction that cannot be resolved.

Socialism means true democracy, because it is the workers (all of us making up the 99%) who elect representation from our own ranks. Socialism is the rational allocation of resources based on human need not the greed of a very few. Socialism does not rest on the myth that we humans are driven solely by self interest, greed, and irrationality.

The kind of appeal being made by Germanicus is for more dictatorship muddled up with pure anarchy. We already have the free market which is nothing less than chaos itself, and here we are asked to turn to anarchy and opportunism as the answer. What a joke. But I am not laughing.

Do not fall for this appeal to isolation and nationalism, What you end up with is dictatorship and fascism. It is what we are heading toward in each and every country at present, and rapidly. Actually I am inclined to think Germanicus is not in fact that tufty haired young kid you see in his side pic.

To find out what socialism really is look at the 4th International. Find out about Trotsky. I recommend if you are interested in genuine socialist perspective on what is taking place in the world right now then GO HERE.

No stars from me for you Germamicus.
edit on 9-5-2012 by Tallone because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 04:28 PM
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Originally posted by HEYJOSE
Just great, replace one oppressive form of pyramidal thievery with another! "There is NO Government like NO GOVERNMENT"- Socialism is fun until the sociopaths get to run things, then EVERYBODY INTO THE GULAG!


So what you are saying is that you are a 'libertarian socialist'?

Thats good to hear comrade.



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 04:30 PM
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reply to post by Germanicus
 


Try to figure it out and let me know what you come up with.

(You might want to wait until you have a bit more education and
life kicks you in the ass a couple of times before you reply.)



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 04:32 PM
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reply to post by Tallone
 





There you have it in a nutshell. So you agree with Hitler do you? Well a Socialist would never ever do that.


I will get to the rest,but straight off the bat you say this? Im not sure if I should waste time reading the rest of your post.

Hitler was a National Socialist. Why would a Socialist not agree with a Socialist?

And I never said I "agree with Hitler". Some things I agree with,some obviously I disagree with.



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 04:35 PM
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Originally posted by Nite_wing
reply to post by Germanicus
 


Try to figure it out and let me know what you come up with.

(You might want to wait until you have a bit more education and
life kicks you in the ass a couple of times before you reply.)


Life doesnt kick me. I kick it.

And I already explained that you are obviously calling me masses. Makes no sense like the rest of the stuff you say.

On Topic- Capitalism is bad.



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 04:39 PM
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reply to post by Tallone
 


I was right. What a waste of my time. National Socialism is Hitler genius. What does the pretend word nazi mean?

And thanks for the link
I actually check that site every day. I have threads that link the site. In my opinion they are poor socialists. Closer to liberals really. But they are ok. Seems you cant teach me anything. Nothing at all. I have heard your script a thousand times. Thanks for the effort though hey.




I am inclined to think Germanicus is not in fact that tufty haired young kid you see in his side pic.


I have more pics. And like I said,I was over 30 when that was taken. I look awesome hey.
Wait a sec I will change my pick.

There you go.
edit on 9-5-2012 by Germanicus because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 04:55 PM
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Originally posted by Ghost375

Originally posted by libertytoall

Originally posted by Germanicus

Originally posted by Nite_wing

Originally posted by Germanicus

Hitler covers the topic of propaganda quite well in Mein Kampf. I agree with what he says,the masses are stupid.


Thank you for proving Hitler'r point.


I dont get what you mean.

Are you calling me masses? Or are you refering to the many stupid posts I got from the masses?

There were some good posts too. I liked hearing from the Europeans at the end of my thread.

But if you are calling me stupid,you should be more clear. Also,bring it. what do you disagree with and why?

Edit- i see by your uninspired first post that you are calling me masses. Clever


And American and proud? Proud of what? You rip on Europeans when the US economy is an unfixable mess? Are you some kind of corporatist or what?
edit on 9-5-2012 by Germanicus because: (no reason given)


You are not worth the effort because frankly most socialists like yourself are incredibly ignorant to world history and what socialism leads to. You also appear to have no clue what capitalism is and how the world as we know it is no longer following capitalist ideals. What people like you love to do is pick and choose what you want to read and respond to and continue to live inside an ignorant shell unable to take an objective view. So for this reason I won't waste my time on you. Go take some history classes and see where socialism has lead the world throughout history. In fact the only system that has ever worked and prospered the public was capitalism. We no longer have capitalism in the USA. We have a quasi fascist socialist government which likes to imagine it's capitalist. This is why so many are duped into thinking socialism is better than capitalism as if the "capitalist system" has failed. This couldn't be farther from the truth. What has failed capitalism is the infiltration of socialism and fascism.
edit on 9-5-2012 by libertytoall because: (no reason given)

And right now the most successful country is China....it sort of negates everything you just said.

Why is China the most successful country? They have only gained and surpassed the US as the international fascists infiltrated our legislature through lobbying, payoffs, and higher regulations. Incrementally over the last 50 - 60 years the power of capitalism has been diminished into a false idea of capitalism which is really a quasi socialist fascism. Socialism is the perfect system to bankrupt a country while fascism protects the international big business interests.


And what's going on now is exactly what capitalism is supposed to do. Wealth is supposed to be concentrated in the hand of a few people. That's where capitalism always leads.

That's utter BS because this is the first time there has been a capitalist system. AMERICA was the first my friend and we have NEVER had this happen before so how could capitalism always lead to this when capitalism never existed before the United States??


What are these capitalist ideals you speak of?

Oh I don't know maybe small government programs and free markets? Maybe a country where special interests don't decide what legislation will be? Maybe it's a system where legislators don't cheat and personally vote 8 times on legislation when they are only suppose to get one vote? Capitalism has free and fair elections unlike what we have now. Most of all capitalism is not compatible with departments like the EPA, FDA, DOA, DHS, Welfare, IRS, etc.. These are all big government institution designed to take more from the public and give it to the big internationalists.. It's a fascist control grid that regulates out competition. The EPA was setup to prevent JIMMY JACK from opening a business but then turn around and let a big international corporations setup shop in the same exact place. You see special treatment is NOT COMPATIBLE with true capitalism. Neither is a central bank that instantly puts the public in debt.


It's funny, for calling someone else ignorant, you sure are very ignorant.
We don't have anything close to a socialist government. There is a huge wealth disparity. 10% own 80% of the wealth.

That has nothing to do with capitalism. It has to do with corrupting the capitalist system.


In socialism there is no wealth disparity.

Are you serious?? See past socialist dictatorships.. There was LARGER income disparity.
edit on 9-5-2012 by libertytoall because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 05:03 PM
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In socialism there is no wealth disparity. What we have in America is the complete opposite of socialism.
Saying our government is socialist shows just how ignorant you are.

What we have in America is a complete opposite of socialism?? What do you think this mega welfare state is? it ain't capitalism buddy.


not to mention socialism is a very new idea.

NOT it's an old idea that has NEVER worked..


Saying look where it's lead people throughout history is very naive.

You just said you thought it was a new idea and now your saying it has a history. Which one is it? And I'm the ignorant one??


Plus Marx suggested it be implemented in a developed industrial society for it to be effective.
It hasn't once been done that way. Anyone who actually knows what socialism is about who lived back then could've told you those countries would fail with socialism.

Correction.. All countries fail with socialism in fact socialism is what's killing America..


edit on 9-5-2012 by libertytoall because: (no reason given)
edit on 9-5-2012 by libertytoall because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 05:10 PM
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reply to post by libertytoall
 





Why is China the most successful country? They have only gained and surpoassed the US as the international fascists infiltrated our legislature through lobbying and payoffs. Incrementally over the last 50 - 60 years the power of capitalism has been diminished into a false idea of capitalism which is really a quasi socialism and fascism. Socialism is the perfect system to bankrupt a country while fascism protects the international big business interests.


None of that made sense.

China is actually State Capitalist if you want to get into it. But they are only capitalists so they can play America's game and beat them at it. They have. Lobbying and payoffs my [SNIP]. Does it comfort you to tell yourself that? America had all the cards and they still lost. China will overtake the US economy as the worlds largest within 5 years. America is toast and you cant blame socialism. Greed is what has brought down America. Capitalist greed. China is smarter than America though. Thats why they beat you.



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 05:15 PM
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Originally posted by Germanicus
reply to post by libertytoall
 





Why is China the most successful country? They have only gained and surpoassed the US as the international fascists infiltrated our legislature through lobbying and payoffs. Incrementally over the last 50 - 60 years the power of capitalism has been diminished into a false idea of capitalism which is really a quasi socialism and fascism. Socialism is the perfect system to bankrupt a country while fascism protects the international big business interests.


None of that made sense.

China is actually State Capitalist if you want to get into it. But they are only capitalists so they can play America's game and beat them at it. They have. Lobbying and payoffs my [SNIP]. Does it comfort you to tell yourself that? America had all the cards and they still lost. China will overtake the US economy as the worlds largest within 5 years. America is toast and you cant blame socialism. Greed is what has brought down America. Capitalist greed. China is smarter than America though. Thats why they beat you.



It made perfect sense you see all these environmental laws drove production overseas to China. Like I said the EPA killed US production. Inflation killed US production. All the car manufacturing would still be in America if it wasn't for the Fed and EPA.. I never said I blame socialism I blame fascist ideals which infiltrated our legislature and politics. Capitalism has NEVER failed when in it's truest form.



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 05:34 PM
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reply to post by libertytoall
 


China did not make America pass 'environmental laws'. Also how do you explain jerks like Bill Gates exploiting the Chinese worker? The corporatists has been drawn to China because of greed. Low wages mean high profit margins. These people that destroy your country are the very same people that fund your elections and control your governments. They pass laws to make it easier for multi-national corporations to send jobs oversea's. The corporatist dont care about America and its people. The corporatist only cares about profit. China protects its industries. They are smart about how they run their Nation. America has a Government that is run by the few,for the few.

And Im glad you dont blame socialism. If you look at how the Founding Fathers treated corporations its clear that America has gone away from what it is supposed to be. I prefer socialism to capitalism but I agree with you that capitalism could be better.

I would like to see a capitalist organisation emerge that is against corporatism and imperialism. It would almost have my support. But like I said,Im socialist.



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 06:10 PM
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reply to post by AwakeinNM
 


i can see you're the type of person who would stand in front of the mona lisa, complain that there's a speck of dust on the corner of the ballistic glass protecting da vinci's masterpiece for 15 mins., and then escorted off the property by 4 security guards.



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 10:09 PM
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Originally posted by Germanicus
reply to post by libertytoall
 


China did not make America pass 'environmental laws'. Also how do you explain jerks like Bill Gates exploiting the Chinese worker? The corporatists has been drawn to China because of greed. Low wages mean high profit margins.

First of all in a true capitalist world it has to be acceptable to try to capitalize on your profits. I don't have a problem if a company goes to China as long as there aren't anti-capitalist regulations in the USA preventing any competition. Right now there is no level playing field. if you want to produce something in the US be prepared for a whole slew of expenses that dwarf the cost of labor. In China they also do not have laws that protect the worker and workers need work so bad they let themselves be exploited. In a free capitalist world you can't blame the company for it's labor abuses for the corporation doesn't hold a gun to anyone's head to make them work. The worker ALLOWS themselves to be exploited but the alternative is to not have a job at all and the family goes hungry. It's very complex in China and the unemployment rate is VERY high outside any major cities. Do you know China's population? Can you imagine how many unemployed there are? Now you see why they are willing to work like robots 12 hours a day, sometimes all night, because if not their family starves.. Bring that kind of poverty to America and watch how "non lazy" Americans become..


These people that destroy your country are the very same people that fund your elections and control your governments. They pass laws to make it easier for multi-national corporations to send jobs oversea's. The corporatist dont care about America and its people. The corporatist only cares about profit.

And there would be nothing wrong with that if big government didn't get in the way of the rest of the public having a fair shot. Right now the public is regulated out of any chance against the big multinational corporations and it's a game setup to be that way,,


And Im glad you dont blame socialism.

I don't blame socialism for production going to China but I do blame it for bankrupting America.


If you look at how the Founding Fathers treated corporations its clear that America has gone away from what it is supposed to be. I prefer socialism to capitalism but I agree with you that capitalism could be better.

Socialism is unsustainable in the long run unless you have a massive dictatorship aligned with the people but we know that will never happen..


I would like to see a capitalist organisation emerge that is against corporatism and imperialism. It would almost have my support. But like I said,Im socialist.

That organization is the Campaign for Liberty my friend.
edit on 9-5-2012 by libertytoall because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 10:34 PM
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Originally posted by AwakeinNM
The first thing you need to do if you want to be taken seriously would be to learn where apostrophes go. Apostrophes indicate a word is either possessive or a contraction of two words. Plural words never have an apostrophe.

"There are millions of us", not "There are million's of us".

"Our numbers increase every hour", not "Our number's increase every hour".

"The Capitalists have run out of other peoples money", not "The Capitalist's have run out of other peoples money".



I find this hilarious. The grammar nazi doesn't use correct grammar.
edit on 9-5-2012 by campingman because: make bold



posted on May, 9 2012 @ 11:00 PM
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My biggest concern about Socialism --- and please correct me if I’m wrong. But wouldn’t that mean giving the our politicians...the same people who continually lie and erode our freedoms...even more power?

In other words...we’d be giving a bunch of highly paid thieves (our puppet politicians) the few resources and property that we have left and we’re then supposed to have faith that the government will redistribute it amongst all of us fairly?





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