Kelly Thomas Video Finally Released

Originally posted by Gestas
Wait a second what was Kelly initial crime?

That he was homeless in a bus shelter late at night ?


He appeared to be just sitting down calmly for 20 minutes before he was murdered.

From what I can see in the video there was no crime. This was a case of profiling a homeless man, possibly because he had long hair, may have looked dirty..since when is that a crime???

These murderous thugs had one thing in mind on that night..let's see who we can f..k with period, especially that overweight cop who couldn't run after him if he fled....Justice needs to be severe

The cops were saying they thought he was on something. If this man had schizophrenia he would have had disordered thinking to begin with and the cop confused him. This made me cry.

reply to post by Another10Pin


I hear what you are saying on this. Also, parents of people 18 and over have zero say about how their sons and daughters are treated thanks to the medical establishment and HIPAA laws.

grrrrr this is what good taxpayers pay for, i say the law is an ass

In England we call police "pigs" a slang term

If i ever got hold of them then "bacon" would definitely be on the menu

A friend of mine spent twenty hours editing in the transcription...

reply to post by MemoryShock


Nice work tell your friend for his subs..

reply to post by MemoryShock


Agreed. Tell your friend 'thank you'. I am going to write the Fullerton PD and CIty Hall. I am just waiting to let most of the anger to subside ...

reply to post by Another10Pin


My brother has shizophrenia and he does not know what day it is, he also forgets and hears voices alot

of course the man in vid is gonna freak out because thats what they do as they become highly confused and scared
bless he was calling for his dad as he was so frightened and confused knowing his last breath the poor soul
wanted his father figure to save him from this ordeal i shed a tear for this man and i have not cried since my dad died just recently. My brother called for his dad and is still a bit confused so this upset me and if i ever got hold of them i would wreak great vengence and furious anger on them.. R.I.P THOMAS may you be at peace wherever you may be..

go for it with the letter good luck and peace to you..

I haven't read the full 12 pages of the thread, and my thoughts are probably parroted throughout...

In this case these were not cops, they were criminals. If something has to be done with LEO policy to prevent something like this, it needs to be done. The people involved should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

This is an abhorrent case.

There is no reason for someone to be treated like that. And in the case of his mental illness, the indifference by the acting officers was inexcusable, even if he hadn't died.

This is truly a sad video, and probably an end to a sad existence for the man.

I should also add that I think all the officers present should be charged, as the wiki seems to imply that not all of them were. If it were a civilian case, I don't see how any would walk away without criminal charges. Police are supposed to uphold the law, even if it is their own breaking it.

I am so angry+disgusted that I feel dumb.

4 big guys could not control 1 weak man. Then they are repeatedly shouting 'hands behind the back', when at the same time they were sitting on his hand and back......hence he could not move. Just because he was homeless and shabby in appearance so they decided he had little rights left. Only people these Police are afraid of are the mafia types.

What will happen to these officers? Suspension, Termination but with benefits, or mere reprimand.

Policing is tough job? Most of the time they are just patrolling and doing little else. Mere sight of the police gets 95% of people straighten up.

This from the news article:

"Out of the six officers who responded to and were involved in handling Kelly, only two have been charged. Officer Manuel Ramos has been slapped with second-degree murder and involuntary manslaughter charges and Corporal Jay Cicinelli has been given involuntary manslaughter and excessive force charges.

“We ran out of options so I got the end of my Taser and I probably … I just start smashing his face to hell,” Cicinelli is quoted as saying in a courtroom testimony provided by prosecutors. “He was on something. Cause the three of us couldn’t even control him.”

The officers are currently in pre-trial hearings, as the court attempts to determine if there is enough evidence to move forward with a trial."

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
reply to post by Another10Pin

 

I hear what you are saying on this. Also, parents of people 18 and over have zero say about how their sons and daughters are treated thanks to the medical establishment and HIPAA laws.

edit on 10-5-2012 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

edit on 10-5-2012 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

edit on 10-5-2012 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

Most people never have to deal with this stuff first hand, so they don't know. Our society has pushed issues like mental health and geriatric care so far under the carpet that it just isn't seen by a large majority of the population. It is dispicable the way in which our society has decided to manage these issues. I don't know about this part ...

thanks to the medical establishment

The medical establishment, although I wouldn't refer to it as such, has their hands tied. As I said, a persons autonomy (specifically after they are of legal age) overrides every consideration, unless those folks are a danger to themselves or others. No one can do anything about it ... the laws protect them ... and for the most part, rightfully so. Most of these folks just are not dangerous. They just aren't with it. It is only a very small percentage who, if they are not properly medicated, become dangerous; re: Jared Loughner. It is these few that our society and our laws need to address. It is when these folks are in an acute phase that danger exists.

But I will tell you this, I have seen more dangerous people on the street who are supposed to be 'sane' than I have of the likes of Jared Loughner. The only difference is with paranoid schizophrenia, it's more noticable. To me, the supposed 'sane' ones are much more scary ... because it's NOT noticeable.

Just take a look at old Ramos and his cohort in that video. Most people would have avoided Kelly Thomas, but thought nothing of the two officers ... But in reality, it was those two supposed officers of the law that were and are the real threat.

The truth is that the people who do know about mental illness and disorders of the central nervous system, or a medical condition that can cause altered mental status, are just too few in number.

You have the families of these folks ... they know more than anyone. And I can tell you that most of them worth their salt want nothing to do with law enforcement, EMT's, hospitals, or the health care system in general, because they KNOW what will happen.

You have people in the medical profession. Specifically psychiatric health care workers ... bacause even most of those who are in the profession but only work on the medical side of the house don't really understand.

But here is the thing ... paramedics see this regularly, particularly in the larger communities. So do firemen. And so do the police. Which to me makes what happened even more egregious. Ramos knew, and so did that second officer. They knew who they were dealing with and murdered him anyway.

And now, I read only those two officers are being charged. The one for second degree and the other for something else, 15 max for the one and 4 max for the other. And no one knows whether or not they will even be convicted. I just can't get my head around this.

It just goes to show the low regard our society has for those with central nervous system disorders, and how little they understand the nature of those disorders.

Anyway, thanks for your comment.

reply to post by denver22


See my post right above this one.
2

Originally posted by victor7
This from the news article:

"Out of the six officers who responded to and were involved in handling Kelly, only two have been charged. Officer Manuel Ramos has been slapped with second-degree murder and involuntary manslaughter charges and Corporal Jay Cicinelli has been given involuntary manslaughter and excessive force charges.

“We ran out of options so I got the end of my Taser and I probably … I just start smashing his face to hell,” Cicinelli is quoted as saying in a courtroom testimony provided by prosecutors. “He was on something. Cause the three of us couldn’t even control him.”

The officers are currently in pre-trial hearings, as the court attempts to determine if there is enough evidence to move forward with a trial."

Here ... the one just acknowledges his guilt, even more than what he is charged with.

“We ran out of options

What options? There was absolutely NO REASON for this incident to have even progressed to this point. Kelly Thomas was not doing anything illegal. What option is he referring to? That he couldn't just shoot him?

so I got the end of my Taser and I probably … I just start smashing his face to hell

Nice one, you thug. Police brutality. He used deadly force when none was warranted.

He was on something. Cause the three of us couldn’t even control him

Has anyone else heard this one before? What was he on, antipsychotics? I doubt even that. As a police officer, I am sure he has had his share of training regarding altered mental status related to certain medical conditions and people with psychiatric issues.

as the court attempts to determine if there is enough evidence to move forward with a trial

Yes ... the video, the statements, and Kelly Thomas's dead body aren't enough, right?

The physical altercation should not have even happened and Kelly Thomas should not be dead.

reply to post by Another10Pin


that ramos it seems just did not like that guy and instigated it, waited for the guy to respond so he could do what he wanted . You are right the medical side just do not know like the families do

and yes the others should get charged and dealt with .but the law is an ass

reply to post by denver22


That swine Ramos deserves 20 years in hard prison. Very sad video indeed, may Thomas RIP and his family gets a windfall settlement from the police department. You got it right, Fatty Ramos wanted to hurt the victim as he was swinging his baton right already in the beginning.

reply to post by Another10Pin


Thanks for your reply. Yes, you are right. People do not understand what happens in the families afflicted with this difficult disease. The patient simply cannot help their condition and this is very difficult for people to understand. Parents and family do their best to care for the person but after 18, the parent gets shut out of decision making due to the fact the person is considered adult. I can see how this can protect a patient from people who aren't helpful, but it also effectively shuts out those who care the most.( I don't trust everything about the medical establishment, but everyone is mystified by the behavior and my comment about the Med Est was cynical) Bakeracting is sometimes the only way to protect the patient from himself until he gets the right medications or works through the episode. It made me mad hearing people blaming the Dad too, because the Dad has likely done all that he can in a heroic way. I can see him ripping up that check only wishing to have his son back. It is so sad and tragic, broke my heart. I am going to pray for his soul to be free.

I hope someday we can find real help for these people.

Originally posted by popsmayhem
this is why you do not resist arrest
Its called shut up and lawyer up..

now why you do this so these
guys cant get off on beating you up
this guy in the video is a complete
moron..

he should of shut up let them apes arrest him and let his lawyer
do the dirty work

he fell right for what they were wanting to do

LMAO, then they beat you at the station mate.

reply to post by MemoryShock


I want to say as a father myself after listening to thomas call for his father in desperation for help ,like a scared child i wept, knowing that thomas felt nothing but loneliness, pain and absolute fear before his end and he wanted his dad save him.
I have seen alot in my time and most of it wasnt nice, but this went straight through me. i dont know what to say.