The Bane of Being a "Friend."

reply to post by truthseeker1984


I can add, that we've been happily married for over 8 years, so just an example that it can work out.

You should at least see (via the girlfriend) if the lady has similar feelings for you, before closing the door on it completely, but if she doesn't, then yeah, move on (even if just for now)....

reply to post by Gazrok


Very romantic story, lol, made me cry...in a good way...Thanks for sharing your "Happy Ending"....whatever may be, is gonna be alot more special with the one you Love by your side....lol, yeah, yeah, I'm a corn ball...silly romantic....Glad you and your Lady worked it out.......♥

reply to post by MountainLaurel


No offense, but you seem to be crying a lot on this thread. If I could hand you a tissue through the computer, I would. You poor thing.

OP, I second Gazrok's advice. Get a good gauge from mutual friends. It does help a lot.

Originally posted by MountainLaurel
reply to post by Gazrok

 

Very romantic story, lol, made me cry...in a good way...Thanks for sharing your "Happy Ending"....whatever may be, is gonna be alot more special with the one you Love by your side....lol, yeah, yeah, I'm a corn ball...silly romantic....Glad you and your Lady worked it out.......♥

Only love can break your heart
Only love can mend it also

The "friend" is a very lop-sided relationship, and hands the girl a lot of power. It is energizing to have someone "give you the key to his/her heart," and I think she is tarrying with you only because of that pleasurable sensation.

Without meaning to, you may turn her into an emotional vampire, who you love more and more, but who makes you feel worse and worse.

Bad advice is often free, and here's mine:

Decide now that there is no way you can have a sexual relationship that is healthy with this woman. Look for sex elsewhere. Be her friend if you want, or can reign yourself in. But know that there will never be any hot sex there---only weirdness. And I speak from intimate experience.

Meet a new girl. Totally new., like one whose name you do not know yet. You'll be surprised how quickly it will break the spell you are under.


Trying to fix bad love is worse than being a hermit. You know in your heart that I am right.

Originally posted by Taupin Desciple
reply to post by MountainLaurel

 

No offense, but you seem to be crying a lot on this thread. If I could hand you a tissue through the computer, I would. You poor thing.

OP, I second Gazrok's advice. Get a good gauge from mutual friends. It does help a lot.

LOL, no doubt.....wanna hear a cool song?

Warning, may be so corny you will puke...lmao.......Good Morning OP, hope your feeling even better today.

www.youtube.com...

reply to post by MountainLaurel


I'm trying to make myself feel better. I'm still questioning the timing of the event which caused me to write this thread. Part of me still says that I should have waited, and the other part tells me that I did the right thing. If I did the right thing, why do I still feel bad about it?

I feel very guilty for doing it while I was drunk. That's my biggest regret. I've been fighting the urge to call/text/email her to apologize and to tell her to forget I said anything so we can go back to normal. I'd rather have her as a friend in my life than nothing at all...we've been through a lot together, and I guess it didn't hit me how much I cared about her until she dropped that question (or maybe it hit me earlier and I was just trying to suppress it for whatever reason my screwed up head could think of).

On another note, some posters have mentioned about the alpha/beta male thing, and I posted a few subsets of that. I had an interesting discussion with a young man almost 10 years younger than myself yesterday about my situation. He brought many things into light that I had not considered before. We talked about assertiveness vs. being pushy, and being a push over vs. being compliant/submissive. We talked about how when we seek a mate, we look to what we grew up with, and either look for the opposite, or the same. In my case, I came from a very domineering household. I was told what to do down to the last second of every day. I had no control over my own decisions. Being the intelligent person that I am, I was very defiant in my youth (and just to make a point, I was the first in my family to achieve a Master's Degree with a few credits into a post-graduate program). The lack of control was what started this path of seeking out people that couldn't control me, or that I could be equals to (never "above," as that's what my parents did to me...in a non-nurturing way). In this woman's case, I think there was this thing where she wanted to be led....as I guess being led means that you are an assertive person. I have an inferiority complex where I think that being assertive will make me look like an arse (once again, back to my childhood), so I'm usually just complacent or follow (even though I'm a natural leader...I manage a theater during the year, and that takes some brass cajones to do that job). He observed that since perhaps she had never seen "me" (aka: The assertive person I really am), she was shocked to receive the text message, and hence, no response.

In the short 20 minute conversation that I had with this young man, I learned more about myself than when I went through therapy in grad school for some unrelated issues...mostly stress related, given my course load.

I wanted to post what he said, because I believe that it will help some others understand the underlying motivations for why people do what they do (and help myself by seeing all of this in words...I'm a very visual learner). The long process of re-wiring the brain is going to be tough, but I'm going to switch back to assertive mode and see what happens. I know how to do it; I'm a school teacher.

If I've learned anything from past mistakes is that affairs of the heart are never black and white. There are always underlying layers of emotion mixed into it (being an empath, I know that all too well). I guess if it helps one sleep at night thinking that there are only two sides to a problem, then to each one's own.



Thanks everybody.


-TS

Originally posted by truthseeker1984
reply to post by BravoBull

 

Typical machismo response.

No, I wholeheartedly agree with you. I felt that by explaining the whole story, and explaining how much time we spent together would help outline my dilemma. I'm not necessarily pining, more just annoyed at myself. Things happen for a reason, and perhaps my actions will somehow make me better in the long run. Every mistake is a learning lesson.

In either case, thanks for your response.


-TS

Well said. Clearly you have a pair. I haven't yet figured out if everything happens for a reason, but whatever happens, you should learn from it and grow in some way. It sounds like you know what to do. Good luck!

Originally posted by MountainLaurel

Originally posted by Taupin Desciple
reply to post by MountainLaurel

 

No offense, but you seem to be crying a lot on this thread. If I could hand you a tissue through the computer, I would. You poor thing.

OP, I second Gazrok's advice. Get a good gauge from mutual friends. It does help a lot.

LOL, no doubt.....wanna hear a cool song?

Warning, may be so corny you will puke...lmao.......Good Morning OP, hope your feeling even better today.

www.youtube.com...

Journey does has some corny songs, but I always thought that one was pretty cool.

This one's for you hon. youtu.be...

I think it's with the new singer. It doesn't sound like Steve Perry.

I've come upon this a bit late, so it may already have been said, but yeah, you're a beta, and the unfortunate thing here is that you caught her after a break up on the rebound. That's an extremely vulnerable and bad position for both of you to be in. Yeah, I know you were there to "catch" her, as you put it, but upon reflection I can't say I've ever met a woman who really wanted to be saved. That really doesn't make you attractive.

I've been in your position, and it never works. It took me a long time to get out of the "I'll save you if you'll just love me" routine and into one that says basically this: "I'm going this way and doing these sorts of things because I like them. These are my goals and I'm going to pursue them." Then go do them. If she says, "Gee! That sounds like fun. I've always wanted to try bungee jumping off bridges! May I come with you?" then you can graciously allow her to accompany you.

The point is that SHE is not going to make you happy. YOU are going to make you happy. If it winds up you are going in the same place, great! You've got a chance that your relationship can grow in a positive way.

So never pine away. Never beg. Never proclaim your undying love and devotion. And never never ever ever sniff--[you know what goes here] because that's the road to certain doom. Hormones can be devestating and lead you to really stupid decisions. So stand tall. enjoy your friends. Move on. If she wants to go along, great. If she doesn't, believe in yourself and that it's her loss. You're the best person for somebody. Just be patient.

Ahhh the dreaded "friend zone". That special place where a guy gets to really "be there" for a girl. To spend time with her and help her over the low-life, dead-beat, slacker or scumbag in her life. Of course, without any of the fringe benefits enjoyed by said low-life. You help her get back on her feet and she moves on to the next low-life. Who will treat her badly and you end up picking up the pieces, helping her get back on her feet and ... the cycle repeats.

Its a rough place to be and rougher to get out of. Honestly, try to move on. Sometimes people want what they can't have. Maybe that will happen with her. Stop being there for her *all* the time. Just ignore her for a bit. Give it a few months. Then a "Hi, haven't heard from you in a while and wondered how it was going." and see what happens.

Girls who have "friend zones" exhibit typical parasitic behaviour.

The chain of parasitism begins with the deadbeat she is seeing. First, the deadbeat establishes a relationship where she is losing resources. To compensate, she seeks out a relationship where she would gain resources. Parasitic relationships don't work out in the long run.

Instead seek out a mutualistic relationship, and make sure the lady wants the same.

Originally posted by schuyler
I've come upon this a bit late, so it may already have been said, but yeah, you're a beta, and the unfortunate thing here is that you caught her after a break up on the rebound. That's an extremely vulnerable and bad position for both of you to be in. Yeah, I know you were there to "catch" her, as you put it, but upon reflection I can't say I've ever met a woman who really wanted to be saved. That really doesn't make you attractive.

To be fair, I just kinda fell into that position. I was just a neutral observer until things got that way. I should have known better that I had a choice to do it or not, but with my altruistic nature (to a fault, even), it happened that way. Lesson learned...haha.

I've been in your position, and it never works. It took me a long time to get out of the "I'll save you if you'll just love me" routine and into one that says basically this: "I'm going this way and doing these sorts of things because I like them. These are my goals and I'm going to pursue them." Then go do them. If she says, "Gee! That sounds like fun. I've always wanted to try bungee jumping off bridges! May I come with you?" then you can graciously allow her to accompany you.

That's how it was working eventually. Perhaps through the lack of communication, things went awry.

The point is that SHE is not going to make you happy. YOU are going to make you happy. If it winds up you are going in the same place, great! You've got a chance that your relationship can grow in a positive way.

And this is a lesson that I'm still learning. I was fine before I even met her, and I know I'll be fine after her. Right now is the part that sucks, but it's getting a hell of a lot better.

So never pine away. Never beg. Never proclaim your undying love and devotion. And never never ever ever sniff--[you know what goes here] because that's the road to certain doom. Hormones can be devestating and lead you to really stupid decisions. So stand tall. enjoy your friends. Move on. If she wants to go along, great. If she doesn't, believe in yourself and that it's her loss. You're the best person for somebody. Just be patient.

Thanks schuyler! Your words really ring true with me. It's really touch and go for me right now, as I tend to over analyze everything...I think most intelligent people do that...to a fault.

I have no qualms either way with which direction this situation goes (at least for right now). The suckiest thing would be losing an awesome activity partner that is willing to do all the crazy poo that we did, and the best thing is that we remain friends a few months down the road, as I do value her as a friend. The icing on top would be that everything works out. The most likely situation is that we both forget this happened, I put myself back out on the scene, and she goes back to her old ways, but without my hand guiding her this time.

The only thing I feel guilty about is doing this now in such a crucial point in her life. If I had to do it again, I would have done it without the booze, and would have waited another week until we could sit down and talk face to face about it. I'll remember that if this ever happens again (and I hope it won't).

I said it before, but I'll chalk this up to experience. Being able to finally see a situation objectively, learning how to fix it next time, and moving on is quite a liberating experience.

Thanks for everybody's support and words. I'm glad my ATS family had some good ideas and views to throw at me.


-TS

reply to post by truthseeker1984


I would be more than happy to discuss this further with you privately. I have taken some heat from others here for being harsh and that's fine. My only response to those that disagree is that there's a difference between harsh and truth. I was not trying to put the OP down at all. Truth is a hard pill to swallow and most people don't want to hear it even though they claim that's what they want. In my experience people gain more from looking at things stripped down to the truth and truth is harsh. I have complete empathy for those I work with and I don't claim to be the end all be all. I just have a different approach. It's clearly not for everyone and that's fine as well. My observations and advice were directed at the OP and him alone, and while I don't agree with the statements made by those condemning my perceived harshness with another dose of harshness directed towards me, which seems highly hypocritical, I respect your opinions and commend you for standing up for what you believe.

OP... U2u me if you'd like to speak further. I hope you do find the answers you're looking for and wish you all the best even if we don't end up talking further. Take care