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Do You Really Need Someone To Tell You About The Lines In The Sky?

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posted on May, 3 2012 @ 03:26 PM
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Originally posted by truthseeker05
I go out of my way to fight ignorance wherever I see it, not just in regards to fictional chemtrails.


Well then you should beat the crap out of yourself.
edit on 3-5-2012 by YourDreamsCanceled because: (no reason given)

edit on 3-5-2012 by YourDreamsCanceled because: (no reason given)




posted on May, 3 2012 @ 03:27 PM
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Originally posted by YourDreamsCanceled
I love this, let me bash my head against the wall so I can respond in a manner you can understand. Ouch, ok here we go.

"If the governments want to kill you they would poison our drinking water"

Quite right indeed, have you ever heard of fluoride? Well it is poison, you can verify that with your toothpaste, just look at the poison label and your see fluoride. Well chap that is exactly what their doing to your water, adding fluoride. Cheers, Drink up! You see over here in England it is illegal to put fluoride into the tap water along with 98% of European countries that outlaw it, but hey you keep believing that it helps you teeth and that your country holds you in the highest regards. Maybe that's what is 'clouding your eyes' pun intended.
edit on 3-5-2012 by YourDreamsCanceled because: (no reason given)


Alright, I wish your dreams were canceled. Fact: Fluoride does lower the incidences of cavities. Compare the US tooth loss to those in your country. The US populations teeth are still intact.

Fact: Fluoride naturally occurs in fresh water from springs, lakes and rivers. Arsenic, barium, beryllium, cadmium, lead, mercury, nitrate, etc... are also in our fresh water lakes, rivers, springs and ground water. These named here alone are killers of humans and animals. During the cleansing process of our drinking water, most a removed for our protection. If they were intentionally trying to kill us, these poisons would be left in. Thanks for proving my point. When you lose an argument, the subject changes.



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 03:28 PM
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I guess I could make a thread with photos and films of clear skies from the 1950's and claim that clouds did not exist back then.

Everyone would agree that my premise was preposterous.

But the same evidence can be used to show that contrails did not exist.... and that is possible????



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 03:34 PM
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"The United States does not torture." --President George W. Bush

We are dealing with Star Wars. It involves the combination of chemtrails for creating an atmosphere that will support electromagnetic waves, ground-based, electromagnetic field oscillators called gyrotrons, and ionospheric heaters. Particulates make directed energy weapons work better. It has to do with "steady state" and particle density for plasma beam propagation.

They spray barium powders and let it photo-ionize from the ultraviolet light of the sun. Then, they make an aluminum-plasma generated by "zapping" the metal cations that are in the spray with either electromagnetics from HAARP, the gyrotron system on the ground [Ground Wave Emergency Network], or space-based lasers. The barium makes the aluminum-plasma more particulate dense. This means they can make a denser plasma than they normally could from just ionizing the atmosphere or the air.

More density [more particles] means that these particles which are colliding into each other will become more charged because there are more of them present to collide. What are they ultimately trying to do up there -- is create charged-particle, plasma beam weapons.
Chemtrails are the medium - GWEN pulse radars, the various HAARPs, and space-based lasers are the method, or more simply:

Chemtrails are the medium -- directed energy is the method.

Spray and Zap.

This system appears to be in Russia, Canada, the United States, and all of Europe. Exotic weapons can be mobile, stationary, land-based, aerial, or satellite.

It is an offensive and defensive system against EM attacks and missiles. It uses ionospheric particle shells as defense mechanisms [like a bug-zapper shell]* against missiles and EM attacks. That means they spray and then pump up the spray with electromagnetics. When these shells are created using the oscillating, electromagnetic, gyrotron stations, it "excludes" and displaces the background magnetic field. These shells can be layered one above another in a canopy fashion for extra protection from missiles. The chemtrail sprays have various elements in them like carbon which can used to absorb microwaves. Some of these sprays have metal flakes in them that make aerial craft invisible to radar. Spoofer sprays. Sprays like these can be used to create colorful, magnetized plasmas to cloak fighter jets.

There are satellite weapons involved. Activists are using meters and are getting readings of microwaves, x-rays, and some other kind of emission that they are not sure of, maybe a low-intensity laser.

They are also photographing gas plasma generation due to the heating of chemtrails by electromagnetics. The technical names for vertical and horizontal plasma columns are columnar focal lenses and horizontal drift plasma antennas. Various size of gas plasma orbs are associated with this technology. These orbs can be used as transmitters and receivers because they have great, refractory and optical properties. They also are capable of transmitting digital or analog sound. Barium, in fact, is very refractive -- more refractive than glass.

What does that mean? Someone or someones are very involved in unconstitutional, domestic spying and the entrained plasma orbs carried on electromagnetic beams can be used for mind control programming. The satellites can be programmed to track and monitor various frequencies on different parts of your body. These electromagnetic beams carrying the gas plasma orbs stick due magnetic polarity and frequency mapping and tracking to people's eyes, ears, temples, and private parts. A beam with entrained orbs carries pictures in each orb just like the different frames in a movie. It is a particle beam that is also a frequency weapon.

The satellites download holographic mind control movies, pictures, sounds, and sensations to people through this technology. The Air Force has stated in "Air Force 2025" that their goal is to develop virtual and augmented reality mind control. Depending on the how the computer is programmed or depending on the mood or intent of the person interfacing with the technology, you can be probed, bothered, gaslighted, frightened, manipulated, electronically raped, or tortured. It scans your brain frequencies and deciphers your thoughts. The satellites track you by mapping your bioenergetic signature [body biometrics] and constantly scanning an area to find you.

We are the lab rats for this technology and something is very wrong in the military or intelligence branches somewhere. Because developmental projects in government and military are often so compartmentalized, I suppose someone could be using and developing this technology secretly and without authorization. Then again, behavioral and mind control programs were an authorized policy under MKULTRA. Our country has a history of experimenting on its citizens. We are talking about satellite charged-particle frequency weapons attacking a person 24 h



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 03:34 PM
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reply to post by DoubleDNH
 


Why not go out of your way to find a solution "Using Science" to stop the formation of these CONtrails.

Getting pretty sick to my stomach of having every single blue sky marred , scarred, and air quality immediately lowered, changed.

The Amazing Scientists cannot figure out a way to stop these things, i do not buy it at all.

It is clear that upper echelons ENJOY the effect these trails have, especially telling in the effort they take to make people believe it is all normal, and has no side-effects whatsoever.

This is a problem, it changes climate, and yet nothing is ever mentioned about it ???



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 03:37 PM
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reply to post by GrinchNoMore
 




Getting pretty sick to my stomach of having every single blue sky marred , scarred, and air quality immediately lowered, changed.

You need to convince vacation travelers to stop flying on commercial airlines.

That is what causes most of those marred skies.

I will admit to being part of the problem. I have flown on commercial airlines for trips that were purely for pleasure.



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 03:44 PM
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Originally posted by malachi777

Originally posted by YourDreamsCanceled
I love this, let me bash my head against the wall so I can respond in a manner you can understand. Ouch, ok here we go.

"If the governments want to kill you they would poison our drinking water"

Quite right indeed, have you ever heard of fluoride? Well it is poison, you can verify that with your toothpaste, just look at the poison label and your see fluoride. Well chap that is exactly what their doing to your water, adding fluoride. Cheers, Drink up! You see over here in England it is illegal to put fluoride into the tap water along with 98% of European countries that outlaw it, but hey you keep believing that it helps you teeth and that your country holds you in the highest regards. Maybe that's what is 'clouding your eyes' pun intended.
edit on 3-5-2012 by YourDreamsCanceled because: (no reason given)


Alright, I wish your dreams were canceled. Fact: Fluoride does lower the incidences of cavities. Compare the US tooth loss to those in your country. The US populations teeth are still intact.

Fact: Fluoride naturally occurs in fresh water from springs, lakes and rivers. Arsenic, barium, beryllium, cadmium, lead, mercury, nitrate, etc... are also in our fresh water lakes, rivers, springs and ground water. These named here alone are killers of humans and animals. During the cleansing process of our drinking water, most a removed for our protection. If they were intentionally trying to kill us, these poisons would be left in. Thanks for proving my point. When you lose an argument, the subject changes.


God I love the ignorance - Calcium Fluoride occurs naturally yes but Sodium fluoride does not - the difference - Calcium fluoride in natural, Sodium fluoride is synthetic and a waste product from nuclear, fertilizer and heavy metal manufacturing - your statement is like comparing black to white. The US uses Sodium Fluoride in your water, your a good example of the effects.



You can see dental records in the US have increased the exact same as Europe but yet Europe doesn't fluoridate making your statement false


Sources of fluoride include: fluoride dental products, fluoride pesticides, fluoridated pharmaceuticals, processed foods made with fluoridated water, and tea.

Fluoride is one of the basic ingredients in both PROZAC (FLUoxetene Hydrochloride) and Sarin nerve gas (Isopropyl-Methyl-Phosphoryl FLUoride).

Fluoride is a waste by-product of the fertilizer and aluminum industry and it’s also a Part II Poison under the UK Poisons Act 1972.

Sodium fluoride is a Part II Poison under the UK Poisons Act 1972. In addition, toothpaste manufacturers are required by law to include the following text on their products, “If you accidentally swallow more than used for brushing, seek professional help or contact a poison control center immediately.

The report also notes that “a series of epidemiological studies in China have associated high fluoride exposures with lower IQ.”


I really agree with that last one about IQ, by God I think it works


In their research, scientists examined the relationship between fluoride intake and the hardening (calcification) of the arteries. Studying more than 60 patients, the researchers found a significant correlation between fluoride consumption and the calcification of your arteries. Published in the January edition of the journal Nuclear Medicine Communications, the research highlights the fact that mass fluoride exposure may be to blame for the cardiovascular disease epidemic that takes more lives each year than cancer. In 2008, cardiovascular killed 17 million people.


Read more: naturalsociety.com...


“Sodium Fluoride is a synthetic waste product of the nuclear, aluminum, and phosphate fertilizer industries. This fluoride has an amazing capacity to combine and increase the potency of other toxic materials. The sodium fluoride obtained from industrial waste and added to water supplies is also already contaminated with lead, aluminum, and cadmium.”

“Sodium fluoride, a hazardous-waste by-product from the manufacture of aluminum and phosphate fertilizer, is a common ingredient in rat and cockroach poisons, anesthetics, hypnotics, psychiatric drugs, and military nerve gas.”


timenolonger.wordpress.com...

Look up ORGANIC and SYNTHETIC

edit on 3-5-2012 by YourDreamsCanceled because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 04:02 PM
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reply to post by YourDreamsCanceled
 



Well by golly here's a 1960 video with chemtrails...


Your video refers to tests conducted at LOW altitudes, in small scales, as part of attempts, during the Cold War, to learn how any enemy biological airborne attack might behave, and spread.

AND, these (Oh, so "conveniently" called "chemtrails"!) were completely invisible!!



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 04:08 PM
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reply to post by YourDreamsCanceled
 


Oh, for Pete's sake!:


Gotta love the "The sky looked like this when I was a kid" line when seeing that first few seconds


THAT same video has been posted over and over, here...listen VERY carefully as he tells you (and his audience) that it is nothing other than chaff.

Chaff, as has already been pointed out, is not in any way similar to the so-called "chemtrails" that are being confused with normal contrails.

And, although it "seems" huge....remember that chaff is designed to mess with radar, and make very large "false" returns.

Oh, and of course, his time-lapse loop he shows is not real-time! (Just in case that was not immediately obvious to everyone).

Oh, and also....does that happen every day, everywhere?? Check your favorite weather radar website, mmmmkay?



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 04:11 PM
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reply to post by YourDreamsCanceled
 


I am sorry, but THIS video?? I think it's funnier than television:

www.youtube.com...

Seriously?



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 04:16 PM
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Originally posted by ProudBird
reply to post by YourDreamsCanceled
 



Well by golly here's a 1960 video with chemtrails...


Your video refers to tests conducted at LOW altitudes, in small scales, as part of attempts, during the Cold War, to learn how any enemy biological airborne attack might behave, and spread.

AND, these (Oh, so "conveniently" called "chemtrails"!) were completely invisible!!



LOW Altitudes huh, how would you know that, there is not one source on the whole internet that say these were low altitude tests, interesting. So they did it to see how an enemy biological airborne attack might behave, and spread and they used Cadmium to TEST?


Cadmium is an extremely toxic metal commonly found in industrial workplaces, particularly where any ore is being processed or smelted. Due to its low permissible exposure limit (PEL), overexposures may occur even in situations where trace quantities of cadmium are found in the parent ore or smelter dust. Cadmium is used extensively in electroplating, although the nature of the operation does not generally lead to overexposures. Several deaths from acute exposure have occurred among welders who have unsuspectingly welded on cadmium-containing alloys or worked with silver solders. Cadmium is also found in some industrial paints and may represent a hazard when sprayed. Operations involving removal of cadmium paints by scraping or blasting may similarly pose a significant hazard. Cadmium is also present in the manufacture of some types of batteries. Cadmium emits a characteristic brown fume (CdO) upon heating, which is relatively non-irritating, and thus does not alarm the exposed individual.

www.osha.gov...

Let's drop poison on the people to see how a biological attack would look!!!

Got any more big fancy statements with no source that make no sense?

Hey listen everyone were gonna prepare for a biological attack by dropping poison on you, really - are you drinking the fluoride too.
edit on 3-5-2012 by YourDreamsCanceled because: (no reason given)

edit on 3-5-2012 by YourDreamsCanceled because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 04:25 PM
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Mathematics is not my best discipline. Has anyone found any evidence that these chemtrails can be made naturally, or not following weather patterns? I want to see those papers. A chess board in the sky does not look natural, what happened to the blue skis?
edit on 3-5-2012 by bo12au because:




posted on May, 3 2012 @ 04:43 PM
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Look, too much of anything will kill you. Too much water ingested in a short time will kill you, too much of numerous vitamins and minerals will kill you, the list goes on and on. Tell me why the average lifespan of American's are now between 80 and 90 years old? Killing 'em slowly with all that poison. I'm gonna go get me another glass of ice cold fluoridated water. I need my teeth white and healthy for my 100th birthday.



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 04:46 PM
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Originally posted by bo12au
Mathematics is not my best discipline. Has anyone found any evidence that these chemtrails can be made naturally, or not following weather patterns? I want to see those papers. A chess board in the sky does not look natural, what happened to the blue skis?
edit on 3-5-2012 by bo12au because:



Um no but its easy to reproduce Contrails. Just fly a plane at altitude through cool moist air. But no Chemtrails are not produced naturally or any other way because they dont exist. Show me proof that they are some conspiracy and pinpoint exactly what chemical other than spent jet fuel is being dropped on us and then, maybe I will listen but as it is it is all speculation which can be easily explained using the science and a large dose of common sense.



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 04:49 PM
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reply to post by YourDreamsCanceled
 


Yes:


they did it to see how an enemy biological airborne attack might behave, and spread and they used Cadmium to TEST?


There are many, many threads about those tests, back then......search "Norwich" and "Porton Down", here on ATS!

Oh, and then....you will see that at that time they simply did not know that cadmium could be harmful! They truly thought it was not hazardous.

I mean.....ever heard of asbestos??

Or, paint with lead in it??



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 04:59 PM
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Originally posted by ProudBird
reply to post by YourDreamsCanceled
 


Yes:


they did it to see how an enemy biological airborne attack might behave, and spread and they used Cadmium to TEST?


There are many, many threads about those tests, back then......search "Norwich" and "Porton Down", here on ATS!

Oh, and then....you will see that at that time they simply did not know that cadmium could be harmful! They truly thought it was not hazardous.

I mean.....ever heard of asbestos??

Or, paint with lead in it??


Kind of like at this time, right now in America, they simply don't know that Fluoride is harmful? Even though they label it a poison and put it in the water.

So your saying that there are many threads about the tests for chem trailing in the 1960 in Norwich, well there you go friends you got Mr. Proudbird admitting chemtrails as well.

"There are many, many threads about those tests, back then......search "Norwich" and "Porton Down", here on ATS!"

I know there are I just wanted you to say it, ever heard of fishing, well you just got hooked up mate!



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 05:04 PM
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Originally posted by TheTardis

Originally posted by bo12au
Mathematics is not my best discipline. Has anyone found any evidence that these chemtrails can be made naturally, or not following weather patterns? I want to see those papers. A chess board in the sky does not look natural, what happened to the blue skis?
edit on 3-5-2012 by bo12au because:



Um no but its easy to reproduce Contrails. Just fly a plane at altitude through cool moist air. But no Chemtrails are not produced naturally or any other way because they dont exist. Show me proof that they are some conspiracy and pinpoint exactly what chemical other than spent jet fuel is being dropped on us and then, maybe I will listen but as it is it is all speculation which can be easily explained using the science and a large dose of common sense.


I'm positive that the lines in the ski can be produced by "Fly a plane through cool moist air". My question is this, using physics, are these patterns naturally occurring, or not.



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 05:05 PM
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reply to post by YourDreamsCanceled
 


Back to the point of that slew of videos in your OP:

It's been pointed out, repeatedly, that those examples merely showed cases when skies were clear at that time and place.

Again, the "logic" could be flipped......if you found a ton of videos that all showed it raining, in the 1950s and 1960s.....in ever video....then you could have made a thread (hypothetically) to try to argue that it is "different" today. Further, you could concoct a wild and imaginary "reason" as to why.

Ya know.....I started perusing some family photo albums from the 1960s, onward....and, guess what I've found?

I will attempt to photograph the photos, and then post them....looking at one from at least late 1960, here in the South West USA (there is a palm tree in the pic) with four large parallel contrails. Two sets of two, all parallel, big and fluffy....and persistent, since they go all the way across the image, with no "end", either where the airplane made them to begin with, or where they may have dissipated later.



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 05:06 PM
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reply to post by Pilot
 


Originally posted by Pilot
We are talking about the sky, not the little ATS world where some of you seem to think answers can be proven by spouting "deny ignorance" like it's some kind of magic incantation.

Indeed, there is an abundance of evidence explaining how clouds and contrails form on other websites, in textbooks, in scientific papers and meteorological studies. Yet some people refuse to look at these, and instead will only accept something if it means there is a conspiracy. Posting the real evidence out there is how the answers are proven, but still some people seem to need reminding of what the motto of this site is about.


Originally posted by Pilot
if you are looking for answers, you can't find them neatly packaged in a thread on this website. Talk to real people.

Like my great grandfather? He was the one who explained to me what a contrail was and how they formed. And this was well before the chemtrail theory existed. I have talked to pilots who think it's hysterical that people think a contrail is a chemtrail, simply because it lasts more than a few minutes, or that chaff is evidence that white trails are chemtrails. This is the kind of ignorance that should be dispelled, yet it gets repeated ad nauseum on here. But that doesn't mean there can't be any answers found on here either.


Originally posted by Pilot
I am open minded enough to consider that the spraying is designed to help rather than hurt, but people here who continuously debunk will not consider that spraying is occurring.

So you're open minded enough to consider alternative chemtrail conspiracies, just not that there isn't one occurring? That's not all that open minded. Note that I have never said that there is nothing going on, and I have often admitted that it's possible (but unlikely given the evidence presented). But I am still labelled a debunker or "disinfo agent" (
) simply because I have posted the well understood (by some, at least) and documented science explaining that a contrail can persist in the right conditions.


Originally posted by Pilot
I have watched this go on for years and it disgusts me. If you sir, do not like what I have to say, fine.

I have watched this site for years also. What disgusts me is posts like yours which simply attack other posters without bothering to try to refute what they're actually saying. Labelling people "shills" because they post just as much as others but have a different opinion is weak. If you want to post actual evidence or reasoning, then that's great, but you haven't.


Originally posted by Pilot
I won't try and convince anyone to come around to my way of thinking because it is not important to me. What is important is that honest inquiry is given a chance for those who are new to the subject-before the abuse starts.

For honest inquiry to be given a chance, they need to see all the evidence presented, not just the supposed "evidence" that people use to try to justify a massive chemtrail programme. Yet you are contradictorily claiming that others should "leave it to the loonies to blather about". That does not give people a chance for an honest inquiry, which you claim is important, and I agree. Posting factual information is not obfuscating the topic, but simply calling other people "shills" or "chemtrolls" without bothering to refute what they say is.
edit on 3/5/12 by Curious and Concerned because: to add the reply at the top of the post for reference



posted on May, 3 2012 @ 05:37 PM
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Originally posted by bo12au

Originally posted by TheTardis

Originally posted by bo12au
Mathematics is not my best discipline. Has anyone found any evidence that these chemtrails can be made naturally, or not following weather patterns? I want to see those papers. A chess board in the sky does not look natural, what happened to the blue skis?
edit on 3-5-2012 by bo12au because:



Um no but its easy to reproduce Contrails. Just fly a plane at altitude through cool moist air. But no Chemtrails are not produced naturally or any other way because they dont exist. Show me proof that they are some conspiracy and pinpoint exactly what chemical other than spent jet fuel is being dropped on us and then, maybe I will listen but as it is it is all speculation which can be easily explained using the science and a large dose of common sense.


I'm positive that the lines in the ski can be produced by "Fly a plane through cool moist air". My question is this, using physics, are these patterns naturally occurring, or not.


Yes, I made a simulator that has just two intersecting flight paths, and some average wind at altitude. After only a few planes fly along the two paths, then a grid is formed. More paths would make the grid more complex. See here:

contrailscience.com...




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