Jiddu Krishnamurti asks; "Why don't you change? What prevents you?"

Hello, and may Peace be upon us all.

I've listened to these words for months now. And to tell you the truth.... I've found it difficult to fully engage the topic. I can not come to an answer or conclusion that I am proud of. Pondering these words, I am ashamed of any reasoning I can rationalize.

However, I highlight this monologue in hopes that you all may ponder this extremely pertinent idea.

Peace.

"Why don't you change? What prevents you?

If each one of us asks that question... not verbally or merely intellectually as a mere entertainment. But ask that question most seriously and deeply. What's your answer?

What's your answer to this problem that human beings have lived this way for millennia upon millennia? Why haven't they changed? Why haven't you, who are listening now, why haven't you changed?

You know if you don't change, what the consequences are. You'll be national, nationalistic. You'll be tribal, insular, isolated, and therefore have no relationship globally. Fighting, fighting, fighting. Building up more and more armaments, destroying each other.

Now why don't you, if you are at all serious in this matter, why don't you ask yourself that question? Why haven't I, 
a human being who have been to all this... why haven't I changed? What would be your answer?...

Either you are not serious. You want to live a very very superficial life,  and that superficiality temporarily satisfies you. Or you really don't care. As long as you're immediate pleasures, immediate satisfactions... you really don't care.

You don't care for your children if they are murdered, or you really have no deep love or affection for them. If you had, you would prevent all wars. So, apparently, none of these things mean anything to you.

Or probably you are so deeply conditioned psychologically... of course we are biologically conditioned as a full matter altogether, but psychologically conditioned. And one is not aware of it. And unless there is a fear from this condition, you will go on this way.

After all...life is what? One global unity movement. So, in the same way... our consciousness is common to all mankind. Now, if I radically change, surely it affects the rest of the consciousness of man.

Now...why don't you change?"

He's exactly right. There is no problem that cannot be immediately resolved in our personal lives, in our communities, in our nations, on our planet, by simply changing what needs to change. It is ego attachment and fear that keep us in this state of resistance. We lose on every level when we do so.

Think about our biggest problems globally. Right now, economic problems dominate our world. Why? Sell everything you have, get a futon, a pillow, and a water kettle and live as skinny as you possibly can. Give up all of your vices. It's really very easy. You are immediately free. So why hold onto the very things that cause you pain? It doesn't have to be given up forever, but you will have time to reflect on why those things had and have such a hold on you. You will most likely realize that they were meaningless, in fact.

Same with relationships. When you have a problematic relationship that has caused you nothing but pain, you can easily just walk away. It doesn't matter how close the person is nor indeed how distant. Just walk away. Likewise, you can choose to change your view of the situation. Change your perspective. The relationship will change too.

When things don't work, change them. Doesn't have to be forever, but keep changing until things work. It's the best means of liberation. Few people really know what freedom feels like. Give it a try.

It's almost impractical to change yourself, sadly. That's why a lot of people move away when they need to change, but not everyone can do that. A lot of people aren't equipped with knowledge on how to change themselves without offending their friends and family, so a lot of people are just stuck.

Looks like it's time.
Ego death is coming.

Question: Is it possible to achieve in the time span of two months? This is with the assumption that I have been going through a spiritual journey for a while (haven't we all)

We don't change because we were meant to be the way we are. It's the ones that are trying to change that are upsetting the balance. Desire is love's evil twin and the enemy of peace.

Wanting to change is an expression of your dissatisfaction with what exists already. Dissatisfaction is not love, it is hate. In chasing an ideal, you fail to stop and smell the flowers that exist already. Nothing ever changes, it only grows.

Originally posted by CosmicEgg
He's exactly right. There is no problem that cannot be immediately resolved in our personal lives, in our communities, in our nations, on our planet, by simply changing what needs to change. It is ego attachment and fear that keep us in this state of resistance. We lose on every level when we do so.

There is no problem.

Same with relationships. When you have a problematic relationship that has caused you nothing but pain, you can easily just walk away. It doesn't matter how close the person is nor indeed how distant. Just walk away. Likewise, you can choose to change your view of the situation. Change your perspective. The relationship will change too.

Perhaps, if you had not wanted the relationship to be different, if you would have accepted the person for who he/she was, there would have been no problems.

When things don't work, change them. Doesn't have to be forever, but keep changing until things work. It's the best means of liberation. Few people really know what freedom feels like. Give it a try.

Or, when things don't work, accept them for what they are. Then they would have never not worked.

reply to post by smithjustinb


You think that "trying to change causes imbalance"?

What about the gambler or compulsive shopper who throws away their family's savings? Should he/she not attempt to change the gambling/shopping addiction that is causing economic suffering to their self and their family?

What about the pedophile or rapist? Should they not change to liberate from sexual desires and impulses that cause suffering to victims, families, and communities?

What about those of us that have extremely bad tempers or violent streaks? Is the effort to change for the sake of peace, compassion, and love not worthy?

Change is natural. Nothing on this earth is permanent.

Peace.

reply to post by TheOneElectric


Hello TheOneElectric. I finally have a moment to say; I LOVE your user avatar. It speaks volume to me!

The questioning you posed... are you addressing me, your self, or speaking rhetorically?

Originally posted by Sahabi
reply to post by smithjustinb

 

You think that "trying to change causes imbalance"?

I guess I should say "trying to change things outside of yourself causes imbalance."

reply to post by smithjustinb


Do you think that the outside and the inside are alike each other?

Originally posted by Sahabi
reply to post by smithjustinb

 

Do you think that the outside and the inside are alike each other?

I think there is no outside.

The i is the very essence of the problem, the i is conditioned through culture and nationalism, believes and so on.
Many seek self knowledge, but self knowledge is vastly different from knowing one self.
To be precise, i can have knowledge of when i get angry or sad.
That knowledge is not going to change me, i can control it, but then i am controling myself, thoughts controling thought.
But if i know what i am, that changes everything, then al sides have stopped to exist.
What remains is space.

reply to post by smithjustinb


The outside and inside are absolutely the same, yes. This is what Krishnamurti says over and over, and it is also what the Buddha said. You are violence, you are sorrow, you are fear... this is what JK is saying. He is not merely saying you have violence, sorrow or fear in you, he is saying you are the world and the world is violent, greedy, sorrowful and fearful...

So to say there are no problems is not helpful, in an absolute/"enlightened" sense there isn't any problems, true, but most people suffer from a great deal of problems. Most people are suffering in some way or another right now, you cannot tell them they aren't, it does no one any good. Even the wealthiest and most privileged people on the planet suffer psychologically in some fashion. JK, and the Buddha, are saying, see this as true, see this with great intensity and vigorous amounts of passive attention. JK says, all division is conflict, and all time is division, and all thought requires time, therefore none of our problems can be fixed through analytical thought as so many philosophers, psychologists, scientists and sociologists are trying to do.

Change must happen, and since we are the world, it must happen within us. To change one must realize analytical thought cannot fix our problems, therefore by accepting this as true the mind becomes quiet, and from this silence comes a great amount of creative awareness which sees the entirety of the world at once, as one movement. Once this happens a dramatic revolution of the consciousness will have taken place, and man will have been transformed. That is what JK is saying.

Peace

PS. Glad you finally picked JK up Sahabi, his 'style' definitely suits you well. I just bought "The Awakening of Intelligence" by him and it has some of his best discussions. He has one with David Bohm that is really good, but very in depth, and another with a french biologist strictly about consiousness that I have been meaning to post, but it is kind of long. Maybe I'll get around to this weekend.

No one should sleep on JK!
Peace.

reply to post by smithjustinb


I think something doesn't want use to change and is working at are flaws to keep us asleep. We should use psychadelics to overcome this obstacle.

Originally posted by LifeIsEnergy
reply to post by smithjustinb

 

So to say there are no problems is not helpful, in an absolute/"enlightened" sense there isn't any problems, true, but most people suffer from a great deal of problems. Most people are suffering in some way or another right now, you cannot tell them they aren't, it does no one any good.

What is problematic is relative and sufferring is mostly optional.

Originally posted by mnkyvsalien
reply to post by smithjustinb

 

I think something doesn't want use to change and is working at are flaws to keep us asleep. We should use psychadelics to overcome this obstacle.

I see you're new here. The mention of psychadelics or the advocation of use of psychadelics is against the terms and conditions here on ATS and the mods patrol the crap out of this site and usually penalize you for comments like that. Just warning you. I wish we could talk about psychadelics though.

Originally posted by smithjustinb

Originally posted by mnkyvsalien
reply to post by smithjustinb

 

I think something doesn't want use to change and is working at are flaws to keep us asleep. We should use psychadelics to overcome this obstacle.

I see you're new here. The mention of psychadelics or the advocation of use of psychadelics is against the terms and conditions here on ATS and the mods patrol the crap out of this site and usually penalize you for comments like that. Just warning you. I wish we could talk about psychadelics though.

Woah, my bad, thanks for the heads up. That really sucks cause the greatest conspiracies and secrets that have ever been revealed to me were with the use of said substancies.

reply to post by Sahabi


Thank you very much, and I guess I'm addressing you or anyone else who has an answer or two.

THIS -> www.jkrishnamurti.org...
krishnamurti 4 life