Army to cout martial pregnant Lynndie England.

Army Will Court-Martial Lynndie England on Charges of Abusing Iraqi Prisoners

RALEIGH, N.C. Sept. 27, 2004 � Pfc. Lynndie England, the soldier seen in some of the most notorious photos with naked Iraqi prisoners at Abu Ghraib prison, will be court-martialed in January on charges of abusing detainees, the Army said Monday.
The 21-year-old reservist will be tried on 13 counts of abuse and six counts of indecent acts, said Lt. Gen. John Vines, commander of the 18th Airborne Corps at Fort Bragg.

abcnews.go.com...


England did not enter a plea when she was arraigned Friday. She faces a prison sentence of up to 38 years, a dishonorable discharge and forfeiture of all pay and allowances if convicted.

I really don't see how she would be aquitted with the phot'os that appeared all over the world, I just wonder how harsh the sentence will be.
I wonder how she will face the rest of her life and what she will explain to her child , if she is allowed to keep him or her,about her part in this matter.

I wonder how she will face the rest of her life and what she will explain to her child , if she is allowed to keep him or her,about her part in this matter

Look at Monica Lewinsky's life and how she is still shunned when it comes to the opposite sex. She can't get a date and says she can't blame the guys for being embarrassed to bring her home to Mom and Dad. I have a feeling Monica's life is a cakewalk compared to what Pfc England is in for, and rightfully so.
I don't know how she will explain it to her child but I dont think that they can forbid her from keeping her child. Nobody can force you to put a child up for adoption. For the sake of the unborn child I hope that she seriously considers giving it up.

I'm sure I'll get flamed for this but honsetly I was shocked when I first heard she was pregnant. I thought for sure she was a lesbian!


Jemison

Yeah well even lesbians want kids, or maybe its a ploy to recieve a little leniency on her sentence--Because she will be sentenced...That photo is world famous. How many friends is her kid gonna have when people find out who her mother was.....Eventually someone in the PTA will recognize her.

I think it s selfish for her to have a kid...but maybe she KNOWS this is her last chance, especially if she gets 38 years in the pen. It is safe to say she wont be able to raise this child--At least part of its rearing years, she will be incarcerated...The carpet would have to be the size of Iraq to sweep this under it.

Originally posted by xxKrisxx
Yeah well even lesbians want kids,

Yeah, well, I don't really care where she's from, I still think they should evacuate the baby from the room just as soon as it's born...and prior to it getting conscious enough to see what a nasty little pig of a momma it's got.

On the indecent acts part, what about the guys?

I mean the stories leaking were she was photographed in gang bangs with several male guards.

Why does she only get the Scarlet Letter?

Unfortunatly with the way that adoption is these days, even if she does put the child up for adoption it will only be a matter of time before the child discovers who it's mother is. There aren't that many secretive closed adoptions these days and even when they are secretive biologicals are easy to track down.

Good point about getting pregnant in an attempt to get leniency. Are soldiers ALLOWED to get pregnant while on active duty? Aren't there rules against that? I cannot imagine that getting pregnant while in Iraq was ENCOURAGED.

What a mess!

Jemison

On the indecent acts part, what about the guys?

They are dispicable too and should be hanging their heads in shame as well. But she is carrying the baby and choosing to put her suffering on an innocent victim who has no say in the matter. I'm sure she was given an option of taking the morning after pill or having an abortion. Generally I am not in favor of abortion, but in a situation like this I am glad that it IS an option.

I'm trying to justify why I look down more on her and I can't really ... other than I admit, I have double standards

Jemison

Judge not lest Ye be judged yourself..............all our soldiers over there putting there lifes on the line for a war that has nothing to do with defending this country,some coming home in bodybags daily.Anybody that says anything bad about any american soldier over there no matter what they do is unamerican.These men and women are dying for YOUR freedom.The only ones doing anything wrong are the ones who control the war.aka Bush and company.I will be qiute now,as anybody that talks bad about any soldier should be put over there and see how they like it.Just my opinion.....

Anybody that says anything bad about any american soldier over there no matter what they do is unamerican.

Being able to voice my opinion is what makes me so proud of being an American. I can be grateful to soldiers for risking their lives and respect their job while also being disgusted by their inappropriate and revolting behavior. That does NOT make me unAmerican.
Just because someone is an American Soldier and is risking their lives does not mean that anything they do should be accepted and tolerated. And for you to blame Bush and bash him is being rather hypocritical. You are telling me that I can't disagree with the actions of soldiers without being unAmerican and yet you can blame Bush for the actions of the soldiers and not be un American??? I don't get it.


Jemison

Hey don't blame the troops. The fish rots from the head right? "Anytime, any way," isn't that how the president authorized all means of force to acquire intelligence? All she was doing was getting life-saving intelligence from Al-Qaida Iraqis who blew up the World Trade Center. Why's America prosecute it's own heros? And she's female too, got pregnant by helping boost morale of her co-workers. Yeah, crucify her you hypocritical jerks.

Originally posted by donquad2001
Judge not lest Ye be judged yourself..............all our soldiers over there putting there lifes on the line for a war that has nothing to do with defending this country,some coming home in bodybags daily.Anybody that says anything bad about any american soldier over there no matter what they do is unamerican.These men and women are dying for YOUR freedom.The only ones doing anything wrong are the ones who control the war.aka Bush and company.I will be qiute now,as anybody that talks bad about any soldier should be put over there and see how they like it.Just my opinion.....

So Bush made her take pictures of half naked Iraqis and have gang bangs with her fellow soldiers?
c'mon..You dont have to tell me about being a soldier, though. This is conduct unbecoming and thats why she is in the trouble she is in, There are actual crimes here even though I dont think this is the big deal it has become......I do agree, they werent ripping out fingernails or pulling any Udays or Cusays, so let the punishment fit the crime. The idea that she could do over 30 years for this is outrageous.

A soldier is doing a job, A soldier should be honorable at all times..I could understand why they would want to mistreat the prisoners and I cant blame them, but the pictures...that was realllly stupid! Man they cant get out of this..It has to be punished. The picture taking/ sexual exploitation of the prisoners is what they wont get away with...Like I said I cant blame them for wanting to mentally torture these people, I wouldnt condemn anyone for this behavior...BUT It was very foolish

[edit on 27-9-2004 by xxKrisxx]

quote......."..just my opinion "

Originally posted by donquad2001
quote......."..just my opinion "

"just my opinion" - she wasn't representing me and I resent whatever pay she collected from my taxes. She is disgusting and a disgrace to the entire country.

Yup. Deserves a long jail sentance, IMO. It's people like her that make Iraqis not trust soldiers that are liberating them.

Gotta feel sorry for the kid she's having.

[edit on 27-9-2004 by Ultron10]

This was one of the most egregious acts in military history. I'm not putting it in a catagory with a true atrocity, but the sheer stupidity and decadence of the unit is such that everyone who was involved should get the severest penalties allowed.

There should be a clear signal to the entire world that this kind of behavior is unacceptable to the US military. I find it hard to believe that any veteran could possibly defend any of these reprobates.

Worst among these was that scumbag General in charge of the prison who, with her lawyer, went on every TV show she could find to blame her charges for their actions. When you've got a commander with such little dignity or honor, it is no wonder the prison was an "Animal House."

No one involved in these activities should slide. Their names should be synonymous with disgrace. If I were the Secretary of the Army, I would dismantle that unit and retire its designation to the "ashbin of history" and jack up every Reserve unit in the nation to rid the Reserves of any slimeballs like them.

If this had happened on a certain former President's watch, I'm sure they would have all gotten Distinguished Service Crosses and a ticker-tape parade.

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
If this had happened on a certain former President's watch, I'm sure they would have all gotten Distinguished Service Crosses and a ticker-tape parade.

I would think that defending those people would be as difficult as defending this statement.

Edit for clarity.

[edit on 27-9-2004 by intrepid]

I'm not defending what any of those soldiers did. I'm just being sarcastic in pointing out that it seems like the guys at the bottom are the only ones getting 'caught' when there's no way they could drop to that rock-bottom level without the complicity of their chain of command and an utter lack of leadership.

They should have a trial under the UCMJ because they're responsible for their own actions and recieved training that strongly countered the way they acted. There were other soldiers that refused orders to sic dogs on captives and engage in those sickening activities and eventually blew the whistle. Unfortunately, the image of a soldier writing an email to a congressman or a reporter doesn't make as emotional a photograph as someone dragging a man on a leash, and those guys are in essence entirely responsible for ending the abuses. I only assume that the entire chain of command was rotten, because if a soldier has a greivance they can request mass, which is an administrative process by which a soldier can move up the chain of command and talk to a superior. If the chain of command had to be bypassed for these abuses to be stopped, there had to be a major malfunction.

So, while the soldiers who were abusing the captives are responsible for their actions, they were acting under orders from MI officials, both military and civilian, and these orders probably helped establish the pattern they followed. The soldiers are responsible for the abuse of the prisoners. The chain of command is responsible for the abuse of the prisoners as well as misleading their troops.

The soldiers seem to be getting a disproportionate amount of charges compared to the officers that were there. The fact that their general has the savvy and means to run around on talk shows with a lawyer building her case only shows that she's intelligent enough to identify right from wrong in her own command. If she was being ordered to go so far off the mark she should have blown the whistle herself.

Hmmm, I wonder if there is any truth in the idea that Lynndie is having a child calculated to lessen the 'impact' of any trial/sentencing she might otherwise face?

Maybe shew got that idea from VP Dick Cheney himself....Mr 'I had kids timed to the month = multiple Vietnam Draft deferral (no reason too contrived, low or beyond the pale)' himself?

.....and yes, maybe like Dick there will be some 'family issues' later over it all.

I wonder if Lynndie's thought such scum over this pregnancy whether those who feel that way will be thinking that of Dick C too?

I don't think a private would do things things and take photographic evidence of herself in the act? incriminating herself!

I she was just taking orders. That she is feeling the full force of the media etc to try and create some distance between the order givers and takers.

[edit on 28-9-2004 by 7th_Chakra]

being reported that Ms. England delivered a baby boy.
it's a shame now that she may end up being separated from child if she ends up having to serve time for actions in Iraq. I feel sorry for her child and her family.