Can light slow down?

reply to post by CLPrime


what action creates the photon and what causes it to travel so fast?

the photons created by the sun are the same kind of photons made by a flashlight?

reply to post by CLPrime

Great information
Appreciated

Originally posted by ImaFungi

the photons created by the sun are the same kind of photons made by a flashlight?

Yep...a photon is a photon is a photon. They're all the same.

what action creates the photon and what causes it to travel so fast?

A photon is created when an excited electron falls to a lower energy state within an atom.

One very important result of Maxwell's equations is that the electromagnetic wave must always travel at the exact speed of 299,792,458 m/s in order to exist. If it tried travelling at 299,792,459 m/s, the wave would collapse...and the same if it tried travelling at 299,792,457 m/s.
Specifically, a moving electric field creates a magnetic field, and a moving magnetic field creates an electric field. The electromagnetic wave requires an exact balance between the electric component and the magnetic component. In order for both components to be perfectly balanced, the wave must be travelling at exactly 299,792,458 m/s. Always.

reply to post by artistpoet


Getting back to the CMB for a sec... I should point out that the temperature isn't actually the temperature of the light. Light has no temperature. The temperature is that of the object that emitted the light -- in the case of the CMB, that would be the entire universe 13.7 billion years ago.

"One very important result of Maxwell's equations is that the electromagnetic wave must always travel at the exact speed of 299,792,458 m/s in order to exist."


so is light, the visible result of an energetic reaction of powerful enough proportions.. as sound is an audible result of some reaction..?


are photons potentially within every atom that contains electrons? you said photons occur when electrons move energy states..... theoretically do we have tons of energy and light within our bodies?
to unleash the energy of an atom bomb its not just any atom their splitting?

reply to post by ImaFungi


Photons aren't stored in an atom, they're the direct result of a release of energy. When the electron collapses to a lower energy level, that energy has to go somewhere...so it goes into forming a photon. Essentially, they're a result of the conservation of energy. Photons are "bubbles" (quantizations) of energy.

Electrons can only collapse so far. Only excited electrons will collapse naturally. The most natural way to excite an electron is for it to absorb a photon. So, an electron can be perfectly stable, then it will absorb a photon and jump to a higher energy level, and then it will collapse back to its stable state and re-emit a photon in the process. In between, there is no photon stored anywhere -- the energy is in the electron, causing it to jump to an excited state.

Originally posted by CLPrime
reply to post by artistpoet

 

Getting back to the CMB for a sec... I should point out that the temperature isn't actually the temperature of the light. Light has no temperature. The temperature is that of the object that emitted the light -- in the case of the CMB, that would be the entire universe 13.7 billion years ago.

I understand I think - So at the point we can measure the CMB that is the output from the source that caused it and light is a manifestation or product of that source. Similar to striking a match by movement or friction.
Sorry I am not a scientist - But there was a first movement by the source which created a sort of friction and so then a light emission.
Is not time put in simple terms - movement - for sound indicates movement - so the first emission was a radio wave that turned into optical wave lengths?

reply to post by CLPrime


what will stop this chain of events, cause and effect of the universe from "going" for ever.. the way the universe is now seems like it is in a form and is quite stable.... stars die and make new stars,,,, matter cannot be created or destroyed,,,,


and when the big bang occured,,, was it the quntom and micro mechanics that initiated the creation of larger clusters of matter? ( what came first the smaller stuff or the bigger stuff,,, im guessing the smaller stuff constructed the larger stuff)

reply to post by ImaFungi


An example of the amount of energy contained by a single photon:

The energy of a photon is given by the following...

E= hf

where E is the energy in joules, h is Planck's constant (6.626068×10^-34), and f is the light's frequency.

Consider, for example, a single photon of green light at 6×10^14 Hz (a wavelength of 500 nm).

E = (6.626068×10^-34)(6×10^14) = 3.9756408×10^-19 J

That's 0.00000000000000000039756408 joules.
That's also equal to 2.5 electronvolts. In contrast, an electron has a mass of 46 billion electronvolts. The energy of an individual photon is negligible.

reply to post by ImaFungi


You're guess is as good as mine on what will stop the chain. Though, being a preacher, I could give you a hint at what will be its effective end at some point in the future.

The first things to be formed were elementary particles, in the form of plasma. Then, gravity took over and started gathering things together to form stars, galaxies, and clusters. At least, according to the currently cosmological model.

reply to post by artistpoet


That's essentially right (as far as I can tell).
13.7 billion years ago, the universe was opaque. Then, it became transparent and light was allowed to travel. The temperature of the universe at this time was 3000 K, and this caused infrared light to be released. Over time, the universe has expanded and the light from the CMB has now been stretched and shifted toward the microwave range of the spectrum.
The observed temperature is currently 2.7 K (Kelvin, for those who don't know what the K is), but nothing is really 2.7 K. That's just the temperature the universe would have to be in order to emit the stretched light we're now receiving. Undoing what the expansion of the universe has done, we find that the original temperature of the universe when the light was emitted was 3000 K.

This also requires an understanding of blackbody radiation. A blackbody is an object that absorbs all light that falls on its surface. Consequently, the object then emits radiation in a very specific region of the spectrum, with a peak at a specific wavelength. This peak wavelength depends on the blackbody's temperature.
A blackbody at a temperature of 3000 K will emit a peak wavelength in the infrared. The expansion of the universe then redshifted this initial infrared light, turning it into the microwave radiation we now see.

Originally posted by CLPrime
reply to post by ImaFungi

 

You're guess is as good as mine on what will stop the chain. Though, being a preacher, I could give you a hint at what will be its effective end at some point in the future.

The first things to be formed were elementary particles, in the form of plasma. Then, gravity took over and started gathering things together to form stars, galaxies, and clusters. At least, according to the currently cosmological model.

my guess is that the chain doesnt stop ( but how it started is the big mystery and pretty much the reason for the theory of god,,, viable theory imo),, the point of energy is to create a stable and long lasting system, th universe is so massive, that i feel if all the molecules and atoms were rearranged or if half the energy/mass of the universe disappeared there would still be plenty to play around with each other....
your a preacher? what do you think of god and the universe...?

reply to post by CLPrime

One question I feel I must ask which is not really scientific is this.
Do you think that there are hidden realms who's dimensions we can not measure but can perceive of in thought.
If everything is a form of matter vibrating at different frequencies or conversely that everything is a form of energy again vibrating at different frequencies - then thought itself is a form of energy or indeed the most highly refined matter.
And what of the soul - could it be that we do indeed inhabit a body in space who's energy source is located somewhere else like a hidden realm who's dimension we can not measure but conceive of in thought.
Sorry to ramble and I understand if you do not wish to answer this or these questions

reply to post by ImaFungi

how it started is the big mystery and pretty much the reason for the theory of god,,, viable theory imo

That certainly is the big mystery. In physics. In Scripture, not so much. But that's for another conversation.

Now that the universe is here, half of its physical laws (the conservation laws, in particular) are concerned with sustaining the chain. However, entropy causes the chain to break down with time. It keeps going, but it gets more chaotic -- more disorderly. Eventually, if you let it go for many billions of years, entropy will take over and energy will be so dispersed that conservation laws won't matter anymore. The universe will be a dark, empty void with sparse radiation from the evaporation of black holes. That would seem to be where it ends...conventionally.

reply to post by artistpoet


I'm not much for the metaphysical. I believe in the physical and the spiritual, and there is a very distinct line between the two. To avoid taking the thread off topic, you can U2U me if you'd like...I would love to get more in-depth in answering your question, I just want to respect the topic of the thread.

reply to post by CLPrime

Yes I understand about going off topic - apologies - I do tend to veer off into tangents
But saying that I hope to see you around on more spiritual type threads.
So back to topic of which I am happy to read posts and learn

Originally posted by CLPrime
reply to post by ImaFungi

 

how it started is the big mystery and pretty much the reason for the theory of god,,, viable theory imo

That certainly is the big mystery. In physics. In Scripture, not so much. But that's for another conversation.

Now that the universe is here, half of its physical laws (the conservation laws, in particular) are concerned with sustaining the chain. However, entropy causes the chain to break down with time. It keeps going, but it gets more chaotic -- more disorderly. Eventually, if you let it go for many billions of years, entropy will take over and energy will be so dispersed that conservation laws won't matter anymore. The universe will be a dark, empty void with sparse radiation from the evaporation of black holes. That would seem to be where it ends...conventionally.

"Eventually, if you let it go for many billions of years, entropy will take over and energy will be so dispersed that conservation laws won't matter anymore"

ok a mix of entropy and the belief of universal expansion..... the idea of universal expansion.... is this exapnsion seen in between the distance of stars with one another or only between galaxies,,, all galaxies are moving away from one another?

entropy is kind of the theme or idea of the difficulties of continual energy,, how can something do work and continue to do work without replenishing or boosting or external help.... so its like everything built up into clusters of massive energy generating spheres (stars), and suns do their reaction and spread massive amounts of energy in all directions non stop for billions of years,, this energy goes somewhere and here on earth is used by all living things,, statistically smaller amounts of energy used by life then generated by the sun, but the suns energy is still used for creation, and storage and productivity,, so this smaller play of energies on earth is life, and it is a perpetual system of conservation of energy and recycling......

i guess i dont get how all the energy of the universe can eventually be wasted,,, does it get absorbed into literally nothing? or it just gets spread so thin it gets spread into nothing ness.. but all that energy is still somewhere no?

reply to post by CLPrime


and regarding your last post,, you say you believe in the spiritual.... what does this mean spiritual,,, knowing that all things are made of atoms and such,, where does the spirit come into play..... if we created an artificial intelligent robot would it be allowed to think of itself as spiritual,, if it were made of similar atoms, and photon information processing?

reply to post by ImaFungi


The convention is that it will get spread so thin that there will be nothing more than a sparse field of photons in otherwise empty space. This is due to the continual expansion of the universe.

The expansion of the universe occurs everywhere, but gravity counteracts it. So, inside galaxies, space isn't expanding between the gravity inside the galaxy is preventing it. That's essentially why we only see space expanding between galaxies and larger structures -- the gravitational force within these structures are holding them together.

reply to post by ImaFungi


Well...the apostle Paul didn't even know how to define the spiritual, so I'm not sure how much better I could do. Beyond that, though, it sounds like a topic either for a private discussion or for another thread.