Advice for an amateur singer? (my daughter), page 1

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ATS Members have flagged this thread 4 times

Topic started on 22-4-2012 @ 04:51 AM by CX

Hi all,

I thought i'd ask this question here as i know a lot of people on ATS are involved in music. My daughter is 14, a regular reader of the paranormal boards here, but is also a keen singer. Nothing fancy, just singing non-stop at home. She's also learning the guitar, just self taught at home to accompany her singing.

She has always had a massive confidence issue when it comes to singing in front of people, so via Youtube she is starting to get over this. She's not too bad and has a few fans, but would like to improve her technique. I wondered if there was any recommended exercises or tips for assisting with your singing?

She is starting to play to friends at school now, but thats it as far as audiences are concerned. Here she is singing a couple of covers of her fave songs...

YouTube Link

Thanks for any advice.

CX.

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 05:01 AM by kyred

She sounds pretty good. As for the confidence issue, that is something she will have to deal with on her own. I know of no exercise to get over the issue, other than just getting in front of people and singing. You know, there are musicians who get sick to their stomach before each live performance, even after years of performing. Once in front of the audience, though, they do okay.

I spent a career in the military, and was often required to give classes and presentations. I was always nervous before I started a class. I don't know why. I guess it was a confidence issue. But once I started teaching, that all went away.

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 05:52 AM by phatpackage

reply to post by CX

Based off the Youtube clips you have shown your daughter has nothing special at this particular time. She sings in key but nothing special. Average at best. No "Mega" range that is going to get to her noticed. I'm sorry to be so hard but it is the truth. But the good news is she is only fourteen and time is on her side. Confidence does seem to be an issue as she never seems to hit that "big" note. In the videos it looks like a confidence issue not ability.

She needs to put more feeling into the music. Sing likes she means it. sing the song as though she "owns" it. She does not seem to be "feeling" it. Keep on meeting people and practising as often as time allows. You never know what can happen. 14 is such a young age to cast a lifetime judgement but at the minute she shows little potential. Hard work could change that in a very very short space of time. I hope she improves and does well but that is entirely up to her!

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 06:25 AM by swan001

I agree that she must FEEL her song. But the only way to feel a song, even in front of a camera or an audience, is to overcome shyness. How do you overcome shyness? By starting singning in front of a camera only, with nobody. Then, sing in front of a friend. Then 2 friends. This will make her learn that her environnement is not important.

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 06:29 AM by daaskapital

Originally posted by phatpackage
reply to post by CX

Based off the Youtube clips you have shown your daughter has nothing special at this particular time. She sings in key but nothing special. Average at best. No "Mega" range that is going to get to her noticed. I'm sorry to be so hard but it is the truth. But the good news is she is only fourteen and time is on her side. Confidence does seem to be an issue as she never seems to hit that "big" note. In the videos it looks like a confidence issue not ability.

She needs to put more feeling into the music. Sing likes she means it. sing the song as though she "owns" it. She does not seem to be "feeling" it. Keep on meeting people and practising as often as time allows. You never know what can happen. 14 is such a young age to cast a lifetime judgement but at the minute she shows little potential. Hard work could change that in a very very short space of time. I hope she improves and does well but that is entirely up to her!

Geeze you are in a trolling/arsehole mood

To the OP, i think she is pretty good. Much better than all the other 14 year old girls on Youtube!

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 07:09 AM by phatpackage

reply to post by daaskapital

Geeze you are in a trolling/arsehole mood

Where do you get off? The OP was asking for opinion and I gave it to them using my 25 years experience as a musician. If you read the whole post it was not all bad news! If you don't like it you know what can do! When you have more than 25 years experience as a musician you can tell me!

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 07:12 AM by swan001

Originally posted by phatpackage
reply to post by daaskapital

Geeze you are in a trolling/arsehole mood

Where do you get off? The OP was asking for opinion and I gave it to them using my 25 years experience as a musician. If you read the whole post it was not all bad news! If you don't like it you know what can do! When you have more than 25 years experience as a musician you can tell me!

You were not very smooth either, to tell ya the truth. The girl need encouragement. It's her dream. Not your discouragement.

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 07:21 AM by CX

Thanks for the replies, much appreciated.

As for the level of her talent, she's not looking to be the next celeb anytime soon, she just loves singing but wants to get better. She is the first to admit that she isn't star quality, but she also doesn't want to go down that road at the moment. She just wants to sing better. Thats wny i am after tips for a better performance.

As has been said though, she is only 14 so time is on her side if she does ever want to expand on her hobby.

The "putting more feeling into it" is something that has come up before, i think there are a couple of reasons for this. One, her confidence. Two, some of these songs, she doesn't know off by heart, so she is reading the lyrics or chords as she sings and plays. That makes for a more wooden performance i'd imagine. So knowing her material better is something to work on.

I'm getting her out and about to experience more different types of live music, not just typical kids pop music, but all genres and instruments played by all ages.

To be honest, she has blossomed through her music, and it has given her an interest that takes up a lot of her spare time at the moment, so whether she is good or not, i'm not going to discourage her. She's a girl who has had confidence issues for a long time, so i'm going to help her get over that through her singing if i can. It's getting there, baby steps and all that.

Thanks again for the constructive advice.

CX.

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 07:22 AM by Hardfelt

Disclaimer: I'm not a vocal professional, though I have had professional instruction.

I find that your daughter has a sound voice with a strong and resonant mid-range. A great number of female vocalists have built very successful careers around songs that fall within the range your daughter can reasonably expect to sing. In any case, all vocalists are compelled to choose songs they can actually sing, and the wise vocalist chooses songs in which their voice can be heard to best effect.

Her voice drifts off-key at times - i.e. is a little pitchy - though it is apparent she can hear and vocalize the key. She will probably not have a soaring upper register - which is okay. Her upper register is currently light and breathy - which can be addressed with instruction and practice, (I suspect the basis of the issue being that her diaphragm is not in full support of her vocalization).

In short, is she has a genuine desire to sing as a profession, (and you're in a position to fund it), she will need instruction. Her voice will improve considerably.

Other than this, encourage her to start listening/singing outside the folkly, guitar-soloist type genre (though it may well be where her strengths ultimately lay). Jazzy tunes are great for timbre, intonation and vocal 'play' all of which will help her hear/find and develop her 'head voice'. Range will be a problem, but by seeking to simulate a more foreign sound she will come to 'feel' how and where these heady/nasally tones are produced - think Diana Krall, Norah Jones, Joss Stone, Amy Winehouse. (Remember: Adult themes lay here).

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 07:24 AM by swan001

reply to post by CX

I personnally think she needs to practise singing in front of strangers. Show that the environnement does not matter.

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 07:30 AM by phatpackage

reply to post by swan001

The girl need encouragement. It's her dream. Not your discouragement

Did you not read the whole post. Let's remind you einstein

Keep on meeting people and practising as often as time allows. You never know what can happen. 14 is such a young age to cast a lifetime judgement but at the minute she shows little potential. Hard work could change that in a very very short space of time. I hope she improves and does well but that is entirely up to her!

Read it again moron I did offer positive reinforcement! If you cannot see that then you have serious literacy issues! Does "I hope" sound like discouragement? goose!

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 07:33 AM by phatpackage

reply to post by Hardfelt

with a strong and resonant mid-range. A great number of female vocalists have built very successful careers around songs that fall within the range your daughter can reasonably expect to sing.

A polite way of saying she does not have a big range. Unless someone is a musician that comment is very cryptic. The girl needs needs professional tuition

edit on 22-4-2012 by phatpackage because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 07:38 AM by swan001

reply to post by phatpackage

Please try and stay polite. ''moron'' and, above all, ''goose'', are some words and I almost lost my MIB-mood.

I think that saying she had ''nothing special'' and no Mega range and that she won't get noticed was not very encouraging. Saying ''keep working, maybe she'll improve'' looks like sugar-coat to me. If I were a singer I would have been pretty discouraged.

Please, no childish name calling... Phat.

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 07:52 AM by phatpackage

Originally posted by swan001
reply to post by phatpackage

Please try and stay polite. ''moron'' and, above all, ''goose'', are some words and I almost lost my MIB-mood.

I think that saying she had ''nothing special'' and no Mega range and that she won't get noticed was not very encouraging. Saying ''keep working, maybe she'll improve'' looks like sugar-coat to me. If I were a singer I would have been pretty discouraged.

Please, no childish name calling... Phat.

Firstly if you want to wrongly come at me and accuse me of bad intentions well I will call you whatever I see fit! Get it?

Sugar coating? I was telling the truth at where she stood now but saying don't give up! that is all. If you went to pieces over that well you lack any sort of heart and would never make it anyway. Music is a hard business where you live with rejection all the time. And even times with no positive spin. At least I gave her a positive outlook! Fair dinkum you get in my face because I told the truth. You know what you can do with that!

edit on 22-4-2012 by phatpackage because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 07:58 AM by swan001

reply to post by phatpackage

Please, calm down. I understand your point. I am in music too you know. The most important part is work.

You must be Irish.

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 08:08 AM by phatpackage

Originally posted by swan001
reply to post by phatpackage

Please, calm down. I understand your point. I am in music too you know. The most important part is work.
You must be Irish.

What is with the racist Irish BS? No I am not Irish but some of my close friends are so be careful with the racist stuff

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 08:14 AM by swan001

reply to post by phatpackage

I am Irish, stupid. I am not afraid to say that I get I a bit warm-headed if someone insults me.

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 08:30 AM by CX

reply to post by Hardfelt

Thank you for the reply, lots to think about and work on there.

And Swan001, yes i agree she does indeed need to sing in other environments more. A year ago she wouldn't have even sung in front of family, she had to go into another room to sing, but Youtube has been a great way of getting her voice across.

Plus, her teacher at school has got her singing in front of the class, which has led onto singing in front of larger groups of pupils. My daughter wanted to take her guitar to school and lock it in the teachers cupboard afterwards, so the teacher said she could, as long as she put on a performance for the class lol. Luckily they liked it and she does it every week now.

Thanks again,

CX.

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 08:31 AM by swan001

reply to post by CX

Keep up, mate. She'll succeed.

reply posted on 22-4-2012 @ 10:04 AM by Asktheanimals

reply to post by CX

I think she has a very good voice and her guitar playing is pretty solid for a beginner. I also think you're a great parent to be so supportive of her dreams

Singing in front of class is exactly what she needs to "loosen up" about playing in front of people. Do you have any local spots with open mic night? Might be something else to try.

If you cannot afford professional voice instruction there is an old book called The Gan-Tone Method of Voice Reproduction, by Robert Gansert which came with an audio tape of exercises. I found it very helpful as it goes into great detail about proper breathing, stance, timing, mouth shape for certain vowel sounds etc. More of a classical operatic vocal style but still worth getting if you can find it.

After 35+ years of playing and singing in various bands all I can say is it's the most fun I've ever had. The most frustrating times were when I was with bands that had some notion of "making it big" - never happens and it takes the fun out of it. I've made some decent money but it was never anything I counted on getting.
I took my cue from the band Queen who all had their degrees and then played their music - if they made it great, if not they had something to fall back on. Queen is also one of the greatest vocal bands of all time and singing along is a great way to learn singing harmonies for backup.

Buy her a cheap multitrack digital recorder so she can record and hear herself back. It will also encourage her to write original music.

Be supportive but take care to not "push". Kids need to ease in to things at their rate of readiness. Your daughter has some real talent and I truly wish she has all the fun and joy that music can bring. Good luck CX!

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