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Where did all these souls come from? So is God creating more all the time?

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posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:02 AM
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Scripture makes clear that there are three parts - the body, the soul and the spirit. The idea of a soul going to Heaven is a pagan idea, because scripture tells us that our bodies contain both a spirit AND a soul. It's the spirit that is eternal - NOT the soul.

The soul and spirit are not the same things. "The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned." 1 Corinthians 2:14. The Greek word translated as "natural person" means "soulish". Paul is stating, in other words, that the natural soul does NOT discern the things of the Spirit of God BECAUSE these things can ONLY be discerned by spirit - the soul is NOT the part of man that receives and understands  spiritual things.  In 1 Corinthians 2:12-13 Paul says, “that we might know the things freely given to us by God, which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual things to spiritual men”.

This is why Jesus said that one must be BORN AGAIN in order to receive the Holy Spirit - this means that you must crucify the ego (Galatians 2:20) " “I have been crucified with Christ and I [ego] live no more, but Christ lives in me.” I must strive to give up the ego which is of SELF and of the soul, because God's spirit comes in. And to do that, the Word of God divides the soul from the spirit by washing clean our minds. The soul is our personality and our character - emotions, thoughts, intellect, love, hate, mind, will, self consciousness etc. Christians who accept Jesus as their Saviour still have to overcome the soul, and its the Word of God that accomplishes it - it divides the soul and spirit by understanding and implementing the Word. This is the exact reason why many Christians are still full of sin, because they confuse the spirit with the soul.  The spirit is something entirely different, and it is by the spirit that we communicate with God in the spiritual realm. Science today proves that energy doesn't just cease to exist, and likewise, the Bible tells us the same thing - that the spirit lives on to judgement. If the spirit mimics the characteristics of the soul (sinful, rebellious, greedy, adulterous and separated from God etc) then it suffers the second death. 

But Jesus told him, “Follow me, and let the dead bury their own dead.” – Matthew 8:22 What does He mean? Let the spiritually dead bury the physically dead because they share the same fate. Jesus also said, “My words are life. They are spirit and they are truth.”

OP, the most important question that you asked was about wanting PROOF that Jesus existed. He provided it - in your awareness of the life, death and resurrection of Jesus.  No other sign will be given to this generation other than the sign of Jonah. God also provided proof to you all around you - in the Heavens, in the Earth and in humanity. If you knew that the 'Gentiles' in scripture were these western nations who overwhelmingly responded to His gospel of the Kingdom of God, then you would be able to understand and discern the times that are near. The descendants of these once faithful Christians are embroiled and smothered in sin which is packaged  to look good. Why? Because He promised to write His laws in the hearts of their descendants, and therefore the media that gives us a culture of sex, greed, materialism, homosexuality, abortion and love of money is only designed to lead the Israelites into rebellion and rejection of their Saviour. Because the spiritual realm understands the power of the soul and it's fleshy desires. If you desire money at all costs, you will be at enmity to God. If your mind comes to accept those things as 'good', you will reject a God who rejects those things. Sin separates the spirit from ever WANTING to seek God by putting the love for all of these things inside your soul/mind. It plays to the ego. Think about it - the last thing a drug abuser wants to hear about is cleaning up their life. In the same way, a person who's mind has been indoctrinated to view 'evil as good' will never WANT to seek a God who states that they are not good. Why not? You know intuitively that you would have to give those things up. There are two choices at this point: stick with what feels good to the physical body, or change by accepting His Truth. Scripture is adamant, those that seek God also are those that take the latter option because they loved truth more than lies. God is there to seek for those willing to humble their hearts before Him. And you will then KNOW, without a doubt, that Christ Jesus lived, died and was resurrected.




posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:03 AM
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'new' souls being created ?


i think it's more like the transformation of the Mother Earth energy into unique human beings

as we spring from the dust of the Earth and return into dust upon death... but the Earth energies of minerals were transformed into DNA energy (we call it 'Soul')

once enough animal/vegetable dust has accumulated on the Planet through the transformation of minerals/matter/ores)--- then the Earth/Gaia goddess energies will have created a brand new and energized bio-sphere


Then in the eternal process of 'creation', the DNA laden surface material (dust) of the Earth will in some way be swept up into space where the cloud of life generating stuff will 'seed' other interstellar bodies


if One wishes to think in terms of 'souls', then that's OK... but it's only dead/inert minerals being transformed into an energetic DNA type of matter we know of as bodies, animals, vegetables, sea creatures, etc



~ostensibly regarded as a little lower than Angels, but humanity having the destiny of rising into 'glorified bodies' ~
connect this explaination with the 'mystery' of 'heaven'



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:04 AM
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Who's to say that there is a soul anyway?



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:11 AM
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Originally posted by Vandettas
Who's to say that there is a soul anyway?

Whether you believe or not it's well worth discussing IMO. Not being religious myself, it's something I've challenged religious friends on. Also those who believe in reincarnation. Because if we are just being 'recycled' where did the new ones come from?
Some interesting thoughts on this thread. Kudos to OP and those who took the time to think about it .
edit on 23-4-2012 by starchild10 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:13 AM
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reply to post by inivux
 
Thank you, that story gave me the chills a little.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:13 AM
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reply to post by samlf3rd
 


First off, your source seems wrong on population projections. Why does it assume the population growth will slow down so drastically? Most projections have us about 50% higher than that by 2083!!

As for the souls. There are two explanations I can think of, and I actually believe both of them.

#1. I don't believe every living person has a soul. I think some are just place keepers, or perhaps they weren't loved enough, or perhaps they had one and lost it.. In fact, the Bible even mentions soulless people, especially in the end times.

#2. I believe the soul is an energy force, connected to all other energy forces in nature. Maybe a human soul is the equivalent of 1000 trees, or 100,000 ants? I don't know, but as more and more forests are cleared and animals become extinct and insects are exterminated, as all of that happens the human population continues to grow. There is probably some mathematical way to assign arbitrary values to all living things and tweak the numbers until it accounts for rising population of humans and die-offs of everything else, and I imagine one could prove the overall life-force of the planet earth has stayed constant throughout history.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:22 AM
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When God spoke The Word= Time. It sent off a vibration through space and has not stopped "moving".

God is outside of Time (within each of us as a fractal of consciousness) this is why we have to go through Jesus (the light at the end of the tunnel) to get home. Its like being reborn again and traveling through the womb of Space.

Jesus taught of reincarnation (papers were burned by Constantine) and there are little tid bits in the Bible that make this reference. Jesus said "Before Abraham I am".

Genesis clearly says WE not I. We (souls) were there in the beginning. We have reincarnated throughout "time" but our soul constantly goes back home in the dream state working for the "matter" at hand which is thought/experience. This is why WE can travel to other dimensions in the dream state or meditative state.

We chose our life, parents, friends and so on. There are many roads we can travel per our blue print. There are choices to be made day in and day out that can effect (cause and effect) the outcome of our memories when our breathe is denied in this vessel and we travel back home. There is no hell except for the thoughts you allow in that cause suffering to your own Psyche.

When we take our last earthly breathe we will then feel like a weight has been lifted. We will feel peace and the warmth of Love. We will feel alive again without the burdens of a slaved society. We will be ALIVE without limitations and we will KNOW the purpose if we have not remembered it while in this vessel.

If one really sits back and spend the rest of their days trying to remember where they came from.... you may remember.

For me.... I have memories of coming here and being excited before hand. As soon as I had the clearance and thought of coming back... I was back.


Had I not had the memories of knowing I could communicate without words "before" this Earthly experience I would not have known what I was missing out on.

We subconsciously remember what we are missing out on and this is why a lot of people are NEVER happy regardless of their success's. It simply doesn't matter when looking at the bigger picture because WE KNOW deep within this is a hell compared to our home.

There are newer souls being created because there is infinite life.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:25 AM
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reply to post by samlf3rd
 



All Is one one is all. To answer your question, just like the universe expands, so will the souls. Yes there are new souls, evolved ones too. You can call these new souls "Indigo's" or "crystal childs". But make no mistake. Every soul on earth is a part of you. All you need to do is ask God. He/she is much closer than you think.

I am not religious, nor am I a cultist. I am but a messenger. To know God, you must put away your ego or set it aside. Be still and listen.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:33 AM
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Originally posted by inivux
I myself am an agnostic-atheist, but I found this a year or two ago, and it really made me think. Its not the end all be all, but it is a surprisingly intuitive explanation, and addresses the underlying point behind your questions.

www.galactanet.com...
edit on 21-4-2012 by inivux because: (no reason given)


Well a discussion of religion, or more properly 'God' and the workings of His creation, you have to either participate or not. Your reasons for participation can be varied, but ultimately are meaningless for those other than the ones who believe in 'God'. By that I mean in a theology sense.... "the rain falls on the just and unjust'. So to include atheists or agnostics in the conversation would serve no purpose just because they exist.

This is not to exclude them, it's just that in the realm of the conversation, their words are moot. This is not meant as a snub or antagonistic comment, but rather to reduce or exclude any negative or contrary components not related to the conversation.

Kind of see it like this...... a group of physicists discussing astrophysics... need not be disrupted or derailed by indulging comments from say Carpenters or Masons, or Welders adding their two cents in, when clearly their interuptions serve no purpose other than delaying the discussion at hand...astrophysics.. buy physicists, and not being physicists precludes any meaningful contributions.

Simply put, the discussion is for believers in the workings of God. Anything else will not contribute to the topic. What I'm getting at is 'Focus'

There is a scripture in Hebrews, from the Hebrew bible that goes like this:
Hebrews 9:27 Hebrew Bible
וכאשר נגזר על בני אדם פעם אחת המות ואחריו הדין׃
The English version is: Hebrews 9:27 "And it s appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment"
So... what I'm getting at, is the site aboves suggested scenario could not be right or even plausible. Where do all these souls in waiting come from, and have they lived and died before? Were they always in existence or created as needed? No one has the answer, Nor will anyone ever fathom Gods grand design, let alone understand the complexities. So again, the conversation only applies to believers and is only a curiosity for unbelievers.... Fair enough?
edit on 23-4-2012 by Plotus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:37 AM
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Originally posted by samlf3rd
I have a great question for those who believe in religion other than the sun and the elements around us being responsible for life:

If God created every thing within a short time span then where did all these extra souls come from? Is there an extra soul bag that makes more as we need them?
Our population was at around 200 Million at the year 1 now the population is at 7 Billion. That's a whole lot of more souls into the mix right? Were they waiting around for the go ahead?

So God is still creating new souls?
?

But wouldn't this mean that those souls would in fact interfere with the old souls and that would be "intervention" which can't happen except for Moses and Hundreds others who were somehow privileged...



Dark matter/unknown matter - matter/known seen matter what if every energy within this little universe goes thru many PHASES OF LIFE AND DEATH WITHIN EXISTENCE until reaching the desired level of consciousness from experiences (CHANGING FORMS OF THEIR ENVIRONMENT SUITS OR SPIRIT FREQUENCIES DURING PHASES) this allows you to be more then what you may think you are as you are interdimensional -flesh and non flesh make up..

Known/matter and unknown/dark matter may just be the matter being observed recycling within this little universal energy containment device. SO IN SHORT THE SOULS/SPIRITS/ENERGIES MAY JUST BE CYCLING. SO ask yourselves WHAT MAY YOU HAVE BEEN BEFORE AND WHAT MAY YOU BE NEXT????? MAY DEPEND ON HOW WELL YOU VIBRATE (with others) WITHIN THE KNOWN 3RD DIMENSION..... FLESH-SOUL ECT.. So resonate well (WITH OTHERS YOU ENCOUNTER) when experiencing the phases of life and death within existence so you can relate your next body/environment suit/prana suit-HIGHERSELF TO A POSITIVE MANIFEST unless you chose to be the negative in any atte ris your free will to do so (sto) OR (sts)..

NAMASTE*******
edit on 4/23/12 by Ophiuchus 13 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:44 AM
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reply to post by samlf3rd
 




1750 700 million

What did they do in 1750, go around the world and count person by person, 700 million?

So how are these figures even correct?

That's all I have to add to the thread, sorry.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:50 AM
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Originally posted by inivux
I myself am an agnostic-atheist, but I found this a year or two ago, and it really made me think. Its not the end all be all, but it is a surprisingly intuitive explanation, and addresses the underlying point behind your questions.

www.galactanet.com...
edit on 21-4-2012 by inivux because: (no reason given)


The Egg is a terrifying theory. I pray it is not true or existence is more horrible than I could have imagined.

Having to live a complete life for each and every person on the planet. Let's see......7 billion people and counting, even if they only lived an average of 40 years is close to 70 billions years. Not counting all those who have died before us. The universe is only 15 billions years old!

What a pointless existence if such a thing were true.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:55 AM
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reply to post by inivux
 


i loved it a great read, star for you



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:55 AM
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Originally posted by Malcher

Originally posted by samlf3rd
I have a great question for those who believe in religion other than the sun and the elements around us being responsible for life:

If God created every thing within a short time span then where did all these extra souls come from? Is there an extra soul bag that makes more as we need them?
Our population was at around 200 Million at the year 1 now the population is at 7 Billion. That's a whole lot of more souls into the mix right? Were they waiting around for the go ahead?

So God is still creating new souls?
?

But wouldn't this mean that those souls would in fact interfere with the old souls and that would be "intervention" which can't happen except for Moses and Hundreds others who were somehow privileged...



Seems like the question is more relevant for reincarnation where some god-like entity have to sort out the new beings and what happens to the old being and how they return. Going from 100,000 to a few billion means they all could not be reincarnated.

I dont think people view the soul in the way you are presenting it here. Seems to me, and i am not particularly religious or at least dont push the issue, that only humans have souls and that keeps things easier to account for. What people would say is the soul is not visually detectable or at least not under normal circumstances. Is it at all possible? Well there are many things we do not understand and some would argue cannot see. We cannot see the wind air...and if the conditions circumstances are right water can would be undetectable to the human eye.

An interesting experiment was done in 1901 and worth looking into:

In 1901, MacDougall weighed six patients while they were in the process of dying...

Something i was thinking about earlier today is what if it is all true that we really do pass on to another system after we die (expire) here?

All the good and bad things we have done are taken into account and determined where you go next. Do you have some special ability (like Jimi Hendrix) that would be admired or useful in a desirable next level etc.
edit on 23-4-2012 by Malcher because: (no reason given)


While reading this post there should be forward slash marks that show up in previewing but dont display in the actual post. Should be obvious where they go though.
edit on 23-4-2012 by Malcher because: (no reason given)


Wow, now that's science right there-HOLY CRAP!


I have never heard of that before. That needs to be an entire thread on ATS!



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 09:00 AM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by samlf3rd
 


First off, your source seems wrong on population projections. Why does it assume the population growth will slow down so drastically? Most projections have us about 50% higher than that by 2083!!

As for the souls. There are two explanations I can think of, and I actually believe both of them.

#1. I don't believe every living person has a soul. I think some are just place keepers, or perhaps they weren't loved enough, or perhaps they had one and lost it.. In fact, the Bible even mentions soulless people, especially in the end times.

#2. I believe the soul is an energy force, connected to all other energy forces in nature. Maybe a human soul is the equivalent of 1000 trees, or 100,000 ants? I don't know, but as more and more forests are cleared and animals become extinct and insects are exterminated, as all of that happens the human population continues to grow. There is probably some mathematical way to assign arbitrary values to all living things and tweak the numbers until it accounts for rising population of humans and die-offs of everything else, and I imagine one could prove the overall life-force of the planet earth has stayed constant throughout history.


Awesome! You guys have some neat stuff locked inside of your brains!

I wanted to pick everyones brains, and you guys have some crazy awesome ideas and analogies about how this works. I am not religious but I believe in our souls however. I am not bashing religion-just pondering our existence.

The population chart was just a general helper to my argument is all. I could've got a more precise chart-but Carl Sagan describes how we can't get that big because the laws of nature say a colony of bacteria can only grow so large before something begins to feed on its abundance. Therefor we will reach a threshold.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 09:14 AM
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Originally posted by samlf3rd
I have a great question for those who believe in religion


There are very few believers on ATS who believe in organized religion. Many of us believe in God and Jesus, but you won't find many proponents of religion around here.


Originally posted by samlf3rdIf God created every thing within a short time span then where did all these extra souls come from?


First what makes you think he created "everything" in a short time span? God's work isn't static, it's constantly moving and changing, at least to our perception. God probably exists outside of time. Since we do not, we perceive things a lot differently than he does. Second, what makes you think there's only life on earth? Looking at the incredible diversity of life on our one planet and considering the billions of stars and planets out there it seems short-sighted to believe that we are the only intelligent life around, so if you're looking at belief in God based on some strange soul count thing then you'd do well to consider that we are just a tiny fraction of the total life in the universe. As the soul count increases here it may very well be decreasing in another star system (assuming there is a fixed number of souls, which I do not believe).


Originally posted by samlf3rd
So God is still creating new souls?
?


Why not? We see life born here on earth every day and never give it a second thought. Is it so strange to think that life could also be created in Heaven?


Originally posted by samlf3rd
How can a person base their entire life around something by just stopping in a book reading session without looking into history for themselves to see what they find?


Some people may, but there are many who have been on amazing spiritual journeys and have discovered the true God. Instead of fretting over what "religious" people think or do, you should embark on your own journey.


Originally posted by samlf3rd
You know for Jesus living in such a great time of philosophers and world population such as in Rome-you'd think someone would've mentioned about these people who could float and walk through walls, but you don't find that in history only in the books that people base their world around.


Jesus was a pauper. Romans did not write about paupers, especially Jewish ones. Pontius Pilate was a Roman leader and for centuries Bible critics argued that someone of his importance should have been documented, the fact that there was no documentation (at that time) led many to argue that the Biblical account of him was fabricated. Then the Pilate Stone was discovered in 1961 proving conclusively that he did indeed exist. He was an important Roman figure, yet nothing of him was discovered until 1961. It's not surprising at all that there's no documention of a Jewish carpenter, especially considering that the Romans would not have considered him divinity.


Originally posted by samlf3rd I will pray/give thanks to the sun that it gives us life yet another day. I will not ask it to help me pay my bills-instead I will work harder. I will try to eat healthy and exercise so I take care of my body instead of asking the Sun to do it for me.


The sun won't hear you or respond to you or care about you, it's just an orb in the sky. Sun worship is just another form of religion. Forget religion, the answers aren't there. Try out that spiritual journey, you might be surprised where it takes you.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 09:48 AM
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I like the concept of The Masters from the book Many Lives, Many Masters by Dr Brian Weiss Yale qualified and Chairman Emeritus of Psychiatry at the Mount Sinai Medical Center.

"As a traditional psychotherapist, Dr. Brian Weiss was astonished and skeptical when one of his patients began recalling past-life traumas that seemed to hold the key to her recurring nightmares and anxiety attacks.

His skepticism was eroded, however, when she began to channel messages from "the space between lives," which contained remarkable revelations about Dr. Weiss's family and his dead son.

Using past-life therapy, he was able to cure the patient and embark on a new, more meaningful phase of his own career."

It seemed that during regresion therapy one of his patients Catherine knew intimate details of his late son. Dr Weiss was shocked.

Eventually Catherine during the regression therapy described being a "vessel" who was occassionally visited by "The Masters" who were highly spiritual beings.

When she awoke she had no recollection of what she had said during regression therapy.


I have recently considered the universe as the higher power creating unexpected opportunities rather than god which has religious connotations. The trouble is the word universe doesnt rhyme with anything to create a line which resembles the term "odd or god" when an unexpeceted event in one` life occurs.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 11:23 AM
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If all souls are a tiny spark of God, and God is infinite, then there would be an infinite number of souls.

Our world as we know it, being only a tiny drop in an infinite ocean.

Its kind of exciting when you think about it.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 11:27 AM
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What makes you think that every human has a soul? Haven't we seen enough evidence yet that a soul isn't a requirement for having a pulse?



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 11:35 AM
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The soul is not immortal. It has a beginning and it can have an end.
Adam became a living soul when he was created, he was not given a pre-existing soul.

The soul can die. It is not immortal. (Ezekiel 18:4) . . .Look! All the souls—to me they belong. As the soul of the father so likewise the soul of the son—to me they belong. The soul that is sinning—it itself will die. . .


This goes against most religions belief that the soul is immortal. Satan's first lie is that if Adam & Eve rebelled against God, they would become "like" God, who is immortal. Most people today still believe that lie.
edit on 4/23/2012 by Sparky63 because: Comments






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