Originally posted by Barcs


Agnostics don't necessarily have to believe that you can't ever know. There's always a chance that science will answer the question some day.

I am going by the definition as given by mirriam webster.

1ag·nos·tic
noun ag-ˈnäs-tik, əg-
Definition of AGNOSTIC
1
: a person who holds the view that any ultimate reality (as God) is unknown and probably unknowable; broadly : one who is not committed to believing in either the existence or the nonexistence of God or a god

Okay, so "probably" unknowable.
Pretty much exactly what I said.

Agnostics simply admit that they don't know the answer. It's pretty much the only logical position. Atheists don't have to deny the entire concept of god, it is sometimes limited to certain versions of god.

The only logical position, is to accept a claim when given proof of its existence.
Atheists disbelieve the claim that god exists, based on the lack of evidence to support the claim that "god exists".

I could write a book telling everyone that a pink unicorn with fairy wings and chocolate pants that controls the universe landed in my back yard and had a conversation with me, that it is true, and that you have to believe me or you will burn for ever in hell. Would it be logical to accept it at face value after 1500 years of no proof, the fact that is completely ridiculous/illogical, and it defies the laws of nature that science has evidence to support, OR to deny it based on lack of evidence, and only accept it if given proof that it ever happened, or that the pink unicorn even exists?

I'm sure most people here are atheists when it comes to believing in Zeus.

Right, which is yet another reason religion is hypocritical and illogical. Anyone can create their own "god" and give this "god" their own rules to live by, and then justify their actions based on the rules of this "god" that they created.

To make a long story short atheists and agnostics are pretty much the same thing

ETA: Actually, I disagree with this.
Agnostics give credence to the theory of "god"

Atheists do not, until given evidence to support it.

If given ANY evidence, although not absolute proof, I believe it's possible for an atheist to turn agnostic.
But this would have to be objective evidence.

Originally posted by paradox
ETA: Actually, I disagree with this.
Agnostics give credence to the theory of "god"

Atheists do not, until given evidence to support it.

Agnostics don't give any credence to the god hypothesis. They just admit they don't know answer, and don't make absolute statements like "god definitely exists" or "god doesn't exist". They say "I don't know" or "I don't care" if god exists. Agnostics and most atheists would believe if the evidence was there. Agnostics are atheists, but not all atheists are agnostic. Maybe that's a better way to phrase it.

Originally posted by Barcs

Originally posted by paradox
ETA: Actually, I disagree with this.
Agnostics give credence to the theory of "god"

Atheists do not, until given evidence to support it.

Agnostics don't give any credence to the god hypothesis. They just admit they don't know answer, and don't make absolute statements like "god definitely exists" or "god doesn't exist". Agnostics and most atheists would believe if the evidence was there. Agnostics are atheists, but not all atheists are agnostic. Maybe that's a better way to phrase it.

I understand this myself... not that should be butting in to your reply to someone.

Agnostics are not active in their missionary acts like an atheist, in fact that is what defines an atheist... Dawkins is rather good in this respect like MIMS was in where he wasn't aggressive nor did he seem to use 'the Word/Bible' to do his bidding (a very hideous act imo)

though I am not hedonophobic because it would seem I am one too

-------------

eg; deriving pleasure from my rant and denying an atheist their pleasure, but my hedonism is 'Just'. An atheists pleasure is to inflict pain on theist... be it mentally or physically.

Originally posted by Barcs
Agnostics don't give any credence to the god hypothesis. They just admit they don't know answer, and don't make absolute statements like "god definitely exists" or "god doesn't exist". They say "I don't know" or "I don't care" if god exists. Agnostics and most atheists would believe if the evidence was there. Agnostics are atheists, but not all atheists are agnostic. Maybe that's a better way to phrase it.

I don't agree with that. I don't think agnostics are automatically atheists. Some agnostics, such as myself, are still open to the idea of God existing if personal experience were to confirm this. A part of me even believes God might exist, just not in the way organised religion has portrayed God. The key factor for an agnostic when it comes to the issue of God is doubt; they are divided on whether or not God exists.

Theists believe that God exists. Atheists do not believe God exists. Agnostics do not know whether God exists and are divided on the issue.

Originally posted by Dark Ghost

Originally posted by Barcs
Agnostics don't give any credence to the god hypothesis. They just admit they don't know answer, and don't make absolute statements like "god definitely exists" or "god doesn't exist". They say "I don't know" or "I don't care" if god exists. Agnostics and most atheists would believe if the evidence was there. Agnostics are atheists, but not all atheists are agnostic. Maybe that's a better way to phrase it.

I don't agree with that. I don't think agnostics are automatically atheists. Some agnostics, such as myself, are still open to the idea of God existing if personal experience were to confirm this. A part of me even believes God might exist, just not in the way organised religion has portrayed God. The key factor for an agnostic when it comes to the issue of God is doubt; they are divided on whether or not God exists.

Theists believe that God exists. Atheists do not believe God exists. Agnostics do not know whether God exists and are divided on the issue.

edit on 25/4/2012 by Dark Ghost because: (no reason given)

the dictionary would not seem to support this but I do agree with you, that's why most Agnostics whose paths I've crossed I use the word "cool" to define them.

Islam and I believe Roman Catholicism surely defines agnostics as an atheist... that's one main difference in Protestant Christianity, they seem to live and let live in this respect... but an Atheist is very determined much like an Islamic fascist... again in my opinion and observations only.

personally I would love the Atheist to join with the Protestants in our attack on Roman Catholicism and the Pope

that pretty much defines how America got here and what we represent... we could use those determined minds in our quest too.

Originally posted by Barcs


Agnostics don't give any credence to the god hypothesis.

I disagree. Their "I don't know" stance means they see it as a possibility for a creator, or that there is a possibility the bible is true. Believing that, also means believing that they think there is a possibility every other religion is true, which contradicts itself.

Atheists do not see this as a possibility at all.

Originally posted by SisyphusRide
An atheists pleasure is to inflict pain on theist... be it mentally or physically.

edit on 25-4-2012 by SisyphusRide because: (no reason given)

I would appreciate it if you would stop trolling and emotionally provoking those who choose to read and participate in this thread.

The only pleasure an Atheist gets is by using his/her brain to form logical conclusions.
Once again, you are the one creating multiple threads attacking the idea of Atheism.

This hypocrisy seems to be the norm of religious folk.

Originally posted by Barcs
Agnostics and most atheists would believe if the evidence was there. Agnostics are atheists, but not all atheists are agnostic.

Atheist's know god can not be proven or dis-proven.

An honest legitimate atheist would not say 100% there is no god.

Therefore - - every honest legitimate atheist - - is also agnostic.

What each individual atheist believes is called: atheist philosophy.

If asked directly if god exists - - the answer could be from an individuals "atheist philosophy" - - "I personally do not believe a god exists - in any form. However - I can not say factually 100% - - because god can not be proven or dis-proven".