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If you're not guilty of a crime you will be punished for using your rights.

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posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 05:46 PM
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Today in court I was found not guilty of OVI/DUI by a duly appointed jury of my peers. However the ALS driving suspension has not been lifted. I must refile and appear once again before the judge to have my driving privileges restored, even though I had been given driving privileges pre-trial. My attourney warned me that there would be "jury trial tax", in otherwords, the court will punish you for asserting your right to trial by jury.Some of the bright spots of my "not guilty package" today, even though I was found not guilty I was charged for some court costs, witness fees,etc.,to the tune of about $200.00 : then I had to refile to appear in front of the judge again(for just a few dollars more) for restoration of privileges ;but wait,there's more! My driver's licence has not been returned to me and I absolutely had to have an I.D. to file the motion! But they have a solution for that as well, for just a few more dollars they will sell you a copy of your mug shot that they will accept as I.D. If I didn't know better I might suspect our whole justice system is a huge scam.




posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 05:57 PM
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reply to post by abe froman
 


LOL. You don't know better, yet??? It's all a scam, I'm afraid. Sorry just my take on it.
tenth
eleventh
and I can't spell the next one

Oops. I should say I am certainly aware of lots of horrible and tragic deaths due to people drinking and driving, but I sincerely think there is a lot more to this, too. Unfortunately, once we have built all the facts we know on a non-sequitoir or any other fallacy of logic, everything remaining is illogical, and just plain problematic.
edit on 19-4-2012 by tetra50 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 06:03 PM
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so did you refuse the breathalyzer when/if the cop asked you to take one?



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 06:03 PM
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reply to post by abe froman
 


So, did you drink and drive. Enquiring minds want to know? Did you scam the system after failing a breathalyzer? Fess up now?



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 06:06 PM
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The system sucks dude. Its all about the $$$$. I understand though. It is a vicious cycle.
2nd



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 06:08 PM
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reply to post by Blaine91555
 


if he still has his license suspended, it prolly means he refused to take the breathalyzer test in the first place, It'll keep the points off your license, but you still loose your driving rights for a year because of it. Least thats how it works in Ohio lol



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 06:21 PM
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Once the ticket book comes out, or the handcuffs, it's automatic $$$ in their pockets, regardless of your guilt or innocence. I won my first couple of appeals for traffic violations, but after age 25 or so, every time I got pulled over cost me money, even if I was doing nothing wrong.

Eventually I had to move to another state because the police, on their quota hunts, ruined my perfect 17 year driving record in the span of 1 year. I bought a black pick up truck, that was like a beacon to them and I would get pulled over every month or so for something I wasn't doing.

When they approached my car and asked if I knew why I was being pulled over, I always said the same thing.... "It's because my truck is black isn't it?"



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 06:51 PM
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reply to post by abe froman
 

I don't know about the whole system being a scam, but I'd say as is, you may have gotten off fairly easy. I make no judgements about DUI in saying that. However, when I was in traffic school a few years back "learning" my way out of points on a trucking ticket, the instructor was also the one who gave DUI classes for our county. He'd told the class then that for those stopped and arrested for a DUI, one can expect $1,000 in costs to be spoken for as the cuffs lock into place. Once the process starts with the charge filing and everything else...His statement from being a part of that system was to expect a minimum of $10,000 out of pocket between attorneys, lost work, fees-fines-costs and class charges as well as the actual damage done by the time in a cell and damage to the record.

So.... Ouch.. It sucks that they hit you in all three areas at once. Civil, Criminal and Municipal, but DUI sure is one of the worst things to ever be stopped for. As you learned the hard way......innocence of criminal charges means little or nothing for civil issues. I'll bet your lawyer wasn't entirely helpful explaining that right from day 1, either...

Here is hoping you get through it all and never get back into the system for one of those 'super-charges' as I think of them...where they dump the whole truck load onto a person as a standard procedure.



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 06:53 PM
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reply to post by Blaine91555
 
When I was finally taken back to the station the state trooper was unable to operate the machine. After his 7th or 8th time trying to swipe his card I said "I think there's something wrong with the machine." He said "The machine is fine, It's my card", then he switched to manual keystroke entry and the machine continued to fail. Keep in mind however that I was not allowed to bring any of this up in court, as the court deems the failure of the machine as a refusal to blow, even though I was never even given the opportunity.



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 06:56 PM
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reply to post by roaland
 
I am indeed in Ohio. Also of interest, on the video of my stop,before I begin the field sobriety tests I ask the state trooper "Do I have to do this?" He replied "YES". Turns out I don't have to perform those tests at all, he just straight lied.



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 06:59 PM
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reply to post by abe froman
 

What was the logic, if I might ask, for not allowing evidence of the fact a test was physically impossible for lack of equipment to perform it? Seems that would be a gem of a point to really raise hell about if an attorney had the skill on your behalf. Interesting..There is certainly more to all this by the sound of it.

They called it refusal though?? Oh ouch... At least on my CDL, refusal to submit is automatic determination of guilt for the civil purposes of revoking the license. That really hurts if you got jammed into that situation because a cop couldn't make the gizmo work.



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 07:02 PM
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Welcome to the hoops of justice.

Make sure you play the game right or lose big time.



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 07:06 PM
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reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 
Well as i state in the OP you will be punished for asserting your rights. You have a legal right to refuse a breathalyzer test if you've never had a DUI/OVI conviction. However it seems that if you assert your RIGHTS there is a punishment for it. (I'm pretty sure that's EXACTLY what our founding fathers had in mind when they were framing our constitution and bill of rights)



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 07:17 PM
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Originally posted by abe froman
reply to post by roaland
 
I am indeed in Ohio. Also of interest, on the video of my stop,before I begin the field sobriety tests I ask the state trooper "Do I have to do this?" He replied "YES". Turns out I don't have to perform those tests at all, he just straight lied.



Technically you don't have to take the test, ya your right. But as a consequence of not taking it, you forfeit your driving privileges for one year. But i am surprised you weren't allowed to bring up he told you, you had to take it and the part about his card not working, in court though. Who told you not to do that and what was their reason for it?
edit on 19-4-2012 by roaland because: additional

edit on 19-4-2012 by roaland because: spelling



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 09:33 PM
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reply to post by roaland
 
the court decided it was off limits because I signed the refusal form (under false pretenses, or legally speaking: coersion by the state trooper)



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 09:37 PM
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reply to post by roaland
 


Also there are NO penalties for refusal of the field sobriety tests, only refusal to blow.



posted on Apr, 20 2012 @ 12:24 AM
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Originally posted by abe froman
reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 
Well as i state in the OP you will be punished for asserting your rights. You have a legal right to refuse a breathalyzer test if you've never had a DUI/OVI conviction. However it seems that if you assert your RIGHTS there is a punishment for it. (I'm pretty sure that's EXACTLY what our founding fathers had in mind when they were framing our constitution and bill of rights)


Oh, on that, yes I do agree. In trucking or for anyone with a CDL it's a little more serious but the same basic thing and a fairly regular issue for random alcohol / drug tests. Even there, no one could force us, as drivers. That is certainly true and thats a big check in the Constitutional Box. The Government logic I heard explained in orientation and safety refresher courses countless times over my career was that giving a sample or blow is optional, but so is society giving us the CDL license.

Hence... Refusal = Everyone's Right. Driving = Everyone's Privilege they remove.

So,,, criminal works, civil is still a game over. Sucks huh? I absolutely agree it's a crappy system for how it plays out...but then again, there is that little factor of what the testing is for. That is why I asked about the logic behind pushing it as a refusal when a machine simply didn't mechanically function. That at least adds an element I can root for seeing you fight and win... Err... I have to say, I've seen so many drunks over the long years of driving a truck that without that mechanical issue thrown in, well..



edit on 20-4-2012 by Wrabbit2000 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2012 @ 12:37 AM
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You will find the amazing part to all of this is that Ohioans will know just by reading that this took place in Ohio.

Ohio will suspend a license for any reason at all. And when you can't work or earn an income...you don't qualify for any assistance because having your license suspended is "your fault"

All I have to say is that karma is coming one day and a good number of Ohioans will be laughing their butts off at these pathetic scum that run this state we they ask for help.



posted on Apr, 20 2012 @ 12:44 AM
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reply to post by abe froman
 


Well if you play their game then you might as well bend over and spread your ass cheeks and grit your teeth.
You live in a corrupt and crap country......NOT GUILTY should automatically restore your life to pre-charge. But its obviously has not and being a nobody you have no way to act upon this.

You need to join a group of like minded people. They are around. They take matter seriously and rectify situations. The law must protect the innocent at all costs.



posted on Apr, 20 2012 @ 12:52 AM
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This same thing happened to me as well here in Texas.......

I was not given the opportunity to do a breathalizer , instead the officer told me he was taking me to get my blood drawn.......i was not even offered an alternative.....

I told him i wasnt going to consent to a blood draw........they surrounded me with 6 cops after waiting 2 hours in the hospital for the procedure, and told me that if i did not they would taze me , strap me down and take it.....

I told them i would not fight the nurses, but i was not consenting.........

Had i thought it wouldnt have gotten me caught up in the extra charge of resisting arrest or some other charge, I would have let them do so.....and seen them in court


After i got out of jail, i found the paper.........under breathalizer he checked "refused" and where i was suppose to sign my name he wrote "Did not ask" and signed his name at the bottom......

Im pending court proceedings now........
edit on 20-4-2012 by ManBehindTheMask because: (no reason given)



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