The life and death, and rebirth of the universe

The Big Bang occurred from a small, ultracompressed region of matter that later became the universe - The energy still expands today, but what happens when the universe stops expanding from the energy of the original Big Bang? Would a state of retraction to the original point occur, not unlike liquid expanding into vapor when heated, and compacting into a solid when cooled? In a sense, this would create a circular cycle of the universe detonating, cooling, retracting to the original detonation point, detonating again, and et cetera? Since energy is never wasted, this is quite a possibility, no? This is what is called a "cyclic model",

For example, the oscillating universe theory briefly considered by Albert Einstein in 1930 theorized a universe following an eternal series of oscillations, each beginning with a big bang and ending with a big crunch;

Of course, a cyclic model only applies to a closed universe that has a beginning or an end. However, in an open universe, expansion is infinite and unlimited. This seems less likely, because energy albeit never wasted, is still finite. Of course, anything is possible. But if energy is never wasted, would it be localized, or would it be directed outwards creating the theorized "open" universe?


(Thanks to Wikipedia for the quote and pic)

Is our universe just a mere cycle of repeated life, death, and rebirth? Or are we but expanding ad infinitum?

reply to post by Mach5


Dear Mach5,

The evidence suggests both. We are told two things that lead to this conclusion. The first is that the speed of the expansion is slowing. The second is that some galaxies and planets are at the edge of the universe and are exiting it even faster as the universe has less and less gravitational pull on them. Interesting isn't it. What if both were true. Some escaped completely and others returned to the beginning to try again.

reply to post by Mach5


Watch the movie Mr.Nobody, you'll like that. It actually shows the "Big Crunch" happening before the end of the movie which is pretty cool but overall the movie is just a masterpeice.

I often thought of this theory myself and used to believe that the Universe would infact stop expanding and start the big crunch and resulting in a Big Bang starting the whole process all over again. It would explain the Deja Vu feeling many people describe and I had it more then 5x in my life.

I don't know, but the idea of me living the lifre I lived over and over again just bothers me because I have it pretty hard for being someone who is #ing deaf in one year with 80% in the other. It's hard enough to want to keep myself going knowing just what I could accomplish with my life if I had been normal and what's even worse is I can't even be the person I want to be, or seek after the job I want most. But yeah, I guess I rather discard that theory because of that idea but no matter what it's always going to be there. I just want to be in a Universe, where I didn't get sick with mengitits when I was two so I could live the life I was meant to live, OR that my mother made a difference choice and not decided not to give me the trial drug for the people sick with medication at that time. I had a 50/50 chance of survial, the ones who didn't take the drug died while the ones who did lived.

I hate life but at the same time, I just can't help but love it as well. Can't explain it.

Originally posted by AQuestion
reply to post by Mach5

 

Dear Mach5,

The evidence suggests both. We are told two things that lead to this conclusion. The first is that the speed of the expansion is slowing. The second is that some galaxies and planets are at the edge of the universe and are exiting it even faster as the universe has less and less gravitational pull on them. Interesting isn't it. What if both were true. Some escaped completely and others returned to the beginning to try again.

And where would you say these galaxies and planets escape to if you were to make up a theory of your own? I suppose they would cease to exist but what do you think?

Originally posted by AQuestion
reply to post by Mach5

 

Dear Mach5,

The evidence suggests both. We are told two things that lead to this conclusion. The first is that the speed of the expansion is slowing. The second is that some galaxies and planets are at the edge of the universe and are exiting it even faster as the universe has less and less gravitational pull on them. Interesting isn't it. What if both were true. Some escaped completely and others returned to the beginning to try again.

Then what would be outside of the universal bubble? Another bubble, from another Big Bang somewhere else, millions of yottameters away?

Even it it did cease to expand in "our current universe", I think that the number of universes is infinite and never ending. Although the size of one could have an endpoint, possibly other universes branch off where one ends? Sounds crazy but I would "like to believe" this could be a possibility. Of course I could totally be full of **** but I am trying to figure different possibilities.

reply to post by Mach5


Dear Mach5,

It is not a bubble, it would merely be removed from the gravitational effect of the other universe. It might even remain observable. The bubble concept refers to dimensions; but, these would both be in the same dimension. We cannot prove other dimensions nor can we see beyond what happened during this current birth of the universe, light cannot travel faster than itself. Anything sitting beyond the age of the "universe" can never be seen by the younger aspects of the universe.

Let me put it another way. Lets say that we had outliers, parts of the past universe that continued and did not get reabsorbed into the next big bang. Depending on when the next "rebirth" occurred, eventually they would no longer be able to see us and we would never be able to see them. They could keep on evolving while we would need to start all over again, not knowing that some had continued to grow. They would only know that we had been and we would never know that they had been. Sort of intriguing if you believe that the universe and the material world is nothing more than a representation of sentience. Peace.

reply to post by Mach5


The idea that space is expanding is fundamently miss understood,
Space only expands when that which occupies it contracts into itself and there for take up less space

Due to the belief that the matter that composes all we know is stable and constant people think space is growing when in fact space is perceived to be expanding since the observer as well as all observable things appear to be moving away but are in reality shrinking in size expanding the space between objects

So if one can entertain that concept the notion that everything is currently collapsing back to the source is not that far fetched

there is nothing outside of the universe, we could never know of anything outside of our universe because the universe IS everything. and it is expanding, im no physicist but some ppl are

wiki

also the universe is accelerating
this

reply to post by vjr1113


Dear vjr1113,

there is nothing outside of the universe, we could never know of anything outside of our universe because the universe IS everything.

Semantically, the universe is everything. Scientifically, it is all that is observable. The question then becomes, "Is everything in the universe, observable?" If it is not then there can be a universe that exists beyond our knowledge. Not a parallel universe, not one in another dimension. The same dimension, same rules of physics apply; but, we cannot observe it.

reply to post by AQuestion


if we cannot observe it, does it really exist?

Originally posted by vjr1113
reply to post by AQuestion

 

if we cannot observe it, does it really exist?

edit on 17-4-2012 by vjr1113 because: (no reason given)

Dear vjr1113,

If we cannot hear it, it can still can hear itself along with the other galaxies that escaped the repeat. If I cannot see a man in China, does that mean that he does not exist? My observation does not create the world and the observations of all of us do not create the world. You do not see in ultraviolet; but, there is still a world that expresses itself in that form. If you are deaf, that doesn't stop me from hearing.

reply to post by Mach5


Vedic philosophy believes that each expansion and retraction of the universe signifies a breathing divinity or God. With each exhale, the universe expands and with inhaling the universe retracts back to that very dense and compact energy form. (singularity)

This suggests that the universe will reach a point where it will start to retract.

Its interesting to note that historically, science needed a starting point to develop. Philosophy/religion frequently provided this platform and even though they (modalities of philosophy and science) eventually went into very different directions, with each scientific discovery, we progressively find that philosphy and science are essentially reaching the same conclusions.
As science is a comparitively brand new discipline, it just needs time to catch up with philosophy.

reply to post by TheProphetMark


Dear TheProphetMark,

They go beyond the observable, they don't cease to exist. I cannot observe everything in the universe now; but, it is not limited to what I can.

Originally posted by AQuestion

Originally posted by vjr1113
reply to post by AQuestion

 

if we cannot observe it, does it really exist?

edit on 17-4-2012 by vjr1113 because: (no reason given)

Dear vjr1113,

If we cannot hear it, it can still can hear itself along with the other galaxies that escaped the repeat. If I cannot see a man in China, does that mean that he does not exist? My observation does not create the world and the observations of all of us do not create the world. You do not see in ultraviolet; but, there is still a world that expresses itself in that form. If you are deaf, that doesn't stop me from hearing.

alright
i dont like to make up stuff so i cant argue with you much. there's a difference between there might be a man in china (highly likely) and a whole other universe that we cannot observe. you're right that our observations do not create the world but if there are no observations of this other universe, then i could also just make up stuff. we cant see ultraviolet but we cant test it.

i guess my question was the wrong one. i guess im just asking for proof.

so my point is that anything outside of reality (the universe) doesnt exist, so how could we possibly observe outside of reality?


you cant just say there are many universes, if we can observe other universes, then they are in our universe and so part of the same universe

reply to post by vjr1113


Dear vjr1113,

Let me start with this, I am a Christian so that impacts my answer.

i guess my question was the wrong one. i guess im just asking for proof.

You cannot observe what you cannot observe. Some things remain unknown. We don't have all the answers, we will never have all the answers and it impossible to know all the answers. When you absolutely know that with your current level of understanding you cannot absolutely know the answer, that is when you take a leap of faith. Bet on the one that you believe is the best answer for everyone. Bet on free will, that every sentient being gets to determine their own fate. Peace.

Originally posted by vjr1113
reply to post by AQuestion

 

if we cannot observe it, does it really exist?

edit on 17-4-2012 by vjr1113 because: (no reason given)

One can observe death thus knowing it exists, but beyond that a person cannot experience death and live to tell of it
otherwise they wouldn't have actually be said to have completely died since they lived
All matter is living and thus also dieing some things like a tree or a cat live similar yet vastly different amounts of time then say a atom or a star but each share a similarly fated destiny in that being living means eventually they will end their time in this world or plane of existences