It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Chemtrails and Depopulation – An Insider Speaks Out

page: 9
18
<< 6  7  8    10  11 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 06:20 PM
link   
reply to post by pshea38
 





Why ATS tolerate these constant barrages of blatant birds**t from obvious government shills is beyond me.



Ah...that old chestnut!......."If you don't believe me....you must work for the government"

Is that the very best you can come up with?




posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 06:24 PM
link   

Originally posted by Argyll
reply to post by pshea38
 





Why ATS tolerate these constant barrages of blatant birds**t from obvious government shills is beyond me.



Ah...that old chestnut!......."If you don't believe me....you must work for the government"

Is that the very best you can come up with?


No - the worst they come up with is - "I don't care if you have FACTS - You must be getting paid by the government....."



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 06:37 PM
link   
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul
 





No - the worst they come up with is - "I don't care if you have FACTS - You must be getting paid by the government....."


Quite so!......But in an ironic twist......the "Mystery Scientist" in the OP also works for the government


You couldn't make it up here sometimes!



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 06:39 PM
link   
 


off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 07:48 PM
link   
reply to post by network dude
 


Really??

I mean.....I respect your posts and opinions, but.....really??


I am sure there are people who get paid to post in these forums.


Huh????


Wellllllllll....listen.......IF you find a source (or company) who is willing to actually pay me to write on ATS????


(PLEASE....send me a U2U.....I will SIGN UP!!)....

(a bit of extra "scratch" is always nice to have.....)......


edit on Tue 17 April 2012 by ProudBird because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 08:41 PM
link   
The people who constantly deny Geoengineering spray activity and those who think that chemtrails don't exist really do make me laugh sometimes. But for the most part they really make me sick and quite disgusted.

Their ever persistent presence in these threads provides additional evidence to the truth behind this conspiracy. No one, ABSOLUTELY NO ONE. Spends this much time and effort trying to refute something they believe is a hoax and doesn't even exist.

I've heard all the excuses for why they do it. None of them make proper sense. The complete and utter arrogance and the extreme narcissism displayed by these individuals doesn't fit with their self proclaimed purpose for why they post here methodically and monotonously day in and day out.

It's quite clear to me that their same old excuses are finally beginning to run dry and they no longer fool anyone with half a conscience or half a brain. I often read through these threads but I avoid posting in them because of the ignorant juveniles who think they own this playground and stalk this forum like some kind of street gang protecting it's turf are either completely blind idiots or are purposefully seeking to boost their maniacal egos by how many people they can convince with their lies. Either way there is no point in debating with them.

That being said, I will state my opinion here and then move forward. I will ignore their egos and their insults in the same way that they ignore the facts and the evidence presented by the myriad of intelligent people who have researched this topic and found that there is a very significant amount of evidence that supports the theories.

Through my personal experiences and real life observations it is quite clear to me that these are not normal contrails. If it were just me or just a few people perceiving these odd details. I might question my gut feelings a little deeper. But it is not just me who is witnessing this phenomenon. And it has NEVER been proven to be a hoax. In fact it's actually the opposite. The further one researches this topic the more the evidence supports the theory. Which would not be the case if it were a hoax or if these were just normal contrails.

I am not a young man. I know what contrails and the skies used to look like in my area. No amount of denying and regurgitating your quoted texts from the weather and aviation goonies is going to convince me that these planes are doing the same thing they always have. They in fact are not displaying "normal behavior".

I really do question the morality of those who deny that something strange is going on in our skies. And they have gaul to call it normal. And proudly insult people as they proclaim to be the voice of reason. There is no doubt in my mind that this is not normal contrails and that the haze in our skies being caused by these planes who are methodically and systematically creating man-made clouds with more and more frequency.

As I stated before, the fact that these deniers feel the need to inject their insults and juvenile opinions into each and every thread posted here is very telling in and of itself. The repetitive rehashing and re-posting of their so called science based logic and the reasons why they believe that these trails are normal is so ridiculous I could stab myself with a fork and still find it hard not to laugh at their grade school attempts to dispel the facts.

I will close by saying that I do not think that depopulation is the intended agenda behind chemtrails. But it very well may be one of the negative side effects that these operations are contributing to. The REAL scientific community (not these web forum wannabees with their psuedo science, believe and do what your told mentalities) are all having their hands full with trying to find ways to understand, control and manipulate our environment and in so doing they also try to control and manipulate the people and society as well.

They past 20 years of shuttle missions and satellite launches have all been working towards a common goal and have a reoccurring theme behind their purpose. They are almost all about the study of our atmosphere and the effect clouds and aerosols have on the climate and weather. It is a common practice to use tracer gases and other elements when trying to observe these systems and learn how they behave. There is a vast array of techniques and methods being used in these studies. One MUST look at the entire picture and not focus just on the chemtrail phenomenon. Once you can grasp upon the heart of this conspiracies agenda it shines some light on who the brains behind this operation is.

The scientific facts available to the public are only as trustworthy as those signing the paychecks. I haven't lost faith in humanity as a whole just yet. But the longer I witness these IMBECILES purposefully denying the facts. The less hope I have that this science project will have a beneficial outcome for the common man.



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 09:15 PM
link   
reply to post by IpsissimusMagus
 





It's quite clear to me that their same old excuses are finally beginning to run dry and they no longer fool anyone with half a conscience or half a brain. I often read through these threads but I avoid posting in them because of the ignorant juveniles who think they own this playground and stalk this forum like some kind of street gang protecting it's turf are either completely blind idiots or are purposefully seeking to boost their maniacal egos by how many people they can convince with their lies. Either way there is no point in debating with them.


Well if scientific fact is the same old excuses and lies then what are the things chemtrail believers keep spouting out?

Here are a few examples...

1. WITWATS
2.News station lab tests
3.Mt.Shasta tests
4. Aluminum and Barium are found in high concentrates in soil samples.
5. Lingering contrails are in fact chemtrails
6. Criss Cross patterns in the sky are chemtrails

I could go on but hopefully you get the point. BTW all those listed above have been thoroughly discussed and debunked. I guess the big question is one that has been asked in about all threads on chemtrails and that would be...

Prove Chemtrails exist and where are the fleets of planes flying out of and how are they loading and spraying these chemtrails?

So if you have any way to even answer one of these questions you could then have a valid argument,but until then you are going to keep hearing the answers that don't agree with your train of thought when it comes to chemtrails.



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 09:19 PM
link   

reply to post by IpsissimusMagus
 

.
.
.
The scientific facts available to the public are only as trustworthy as those signing the paychecks.
.


That's not how it works.

How it works is that the scientific facts available to the public are only as trustworthy as they are reproduce-able.

now that you know that you won't have to fall for the disinfo any more.

Glad to have helped.



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 09:57 PM
link   
reply to post by tsurfer2000h
 





Well if scientific fact is the same old excuses and lies then what are the things chemtrail believers keep spouting out?


Scientific fact? Can you be a little more specific please? You can call something scientific but that doesn't make it a fact. Yesterdays science is in tomorrows trash bin. The FACT is that science doesn't have all the answers they need yet and that's exactly why they are conducting these experiments. Nothing is a FACT in regards to this topic. Your so called scientific facts have been so twisted and distorted from the start that you wouldn't know a FACT if it was floating above your head.




Here are a few examples...

1. WITWATS
2.News station lab tests
3.Mt.Shasta tests
4. Aluminum and Barium are found in high concentrates in soil samples.
5. Lingering contrails are in fact chemtrails
6. Criss Cross patterns in the sky are chemtrails

I could go on but hopefully you get the point. BTW all those listed above have been thoroughly discussed and debunked. I guess the big question is one that has been asked in about all threads on chemtrails and that would be...


This is the kind of ridiculous post that really makes me laugh. You say it's been "thoroughly debunked"

No it has not been debunked in the least bit. But you are entitled to your own opinion. I have no desire to waste my time or energy explaining the obvious to you. When you clearly are blinded by your beliefs and trying to fit in amongst your peers.

The only thing on your list that has been half way debunked is the LA news water tests. But I could argue that someone squashed that announcment and forced them to retract their findings or else face serious consequences. But I guess that would just be a conspiracy theory. MSM always reports the "scientific facts" correctly and if they don't get the official story correct the first time. They just rewrite it.



Prove Chemtrails exist and where are the fleets of planes flying out of and how are they loading and spraying these chemtrails?


The SRM Geoengineering cost efficiency studies have shown that it would only take a fleet of 30 planes flying three sorties a day each to achieve the proper payload for FULL SCALE implementation.

Since in my opinion they haven't begun full scale geoengineering and are still in the R&D phase. It doesn't take a fleet. You should already know this and I expect you do and just pretending to be dumb.

Not very hard to hide 30 planes though is it? Have you seen the papers regarding the proposed plan to increase the amount of sulfur in Jet Fuel? They also propose to run the jet engines with a rich fuel/air ratio.

There are also designs that show how a mixture of chemical agents can be injected into the hot exhaust of a plane. Similar to a smoke generator. As well as the other already existing methods of spraying chemicals from planes.




So if you have any way to even answer one of these questions you could then have a valid argument,but until then you are going to keep hearing the answers that don't agree with your train of thought when it comes to chemtrails.


What questions the ones you invented based on false assumption or neglectful details of the facts?

I can answer all of those questions. But we all know you will just squirm your way out the corner you painted yourself into and deny it anyway. Answer this, why should I waste my time answering your questions?

Your need for someone else to supply you with the "PROOF" is kind of alarming. Especially with what you stated (or actually didn't state) what you think is scientific fact. For all of your proud and arrogant bravado of the scientific facts. Your sure don't seem to understand the most basic FACTS of the subject you're discussing.



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 10:04 PM
link   
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul
 





That's not how it works.


Yes it is how it works. Those that pay for these studies only publish what they want to publish. Who has the power and the means to question the studies or conduct their own independent studies?

Who has access? No one who they do not want to that's who.




How it works is that the scientific facts available to the public are only as trustworthy as they are reproduce-able.

now that you know that you won't have to fall for the disinfo any more.

Glad to have helped.


Oh my, you really are naive aren't you? I suspect that you're just being facetious and argumentative though.

You can't possibly believe that trash talk you're throwing out there can you?

You have helped me understand who you are and what you're all about. But I kind of already knew that now didn't I.
edit on 4/17/2012 by IpsissimusMagus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 10:37 PM
link   
Pseudoscience

Originally posted by IpsissimusMagus
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul
 





That's not how it works.


Yes it is how it works. Those that pay for these studies only publish what they want to publish. Who has the power and the means to question the studies or conduct their own independent studies?

Who has access? No one who they do not want to that's who.


The people who have paid for various analysis around the "chemtrail scene" are generally chemtrail believers.

They get tests done at independent labs and pay for it. They put it up on the 'net - lots of people have access to it - that is who.

you can do the same - if the tests come up the same at various labs then that's a pretty good indication that what the tests show is correct.

Your paranoia is not evidence.

Also your contention that today's scientific fact is wrong tomorrow is glib sophistry.

A scientific theory stops being accepted when something proves it wrong, or a better explanation comes up - in which case it isn't wrong, just applies to a more limited case.

Pseudoscience and woo are rubbish because they are not reproduceable, not evidence based, have no falsefiable theory, etc. And yet should something come along to show they are correct it is SCIENCE that provides the mecanism for that to happen.

The mechanism is this stuff called "credible evidence". It is also what science uses to improve or disprove itself.

So far there's no credible evidence that chemtrails exist, no credible evidence that there's any spraying of anything from aircraft for geoengineering.

In 15 or so years - not one, single bit.



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 11:22 PM
link   
Hypothetically speaking......

Because of the great degree of human health, environmental, monetary and political risks involved and thus the need for discretion (secrecy). The best ways to not only study but also implement a project like the ones proposed in SRM Geoengineering. Would be to test it during a slow gradual process and have it remain a very closely monitored project. To prevent any extremely serious mistakes that might cause catastrophic outcomes.

If they were to just come out and start doing full scale then Geoengineering it would require an agreement among the countries of the World and create political issues. If certain countries don't fair as well as other do, due to bad weather or drought. Then all the other countries might have to compensate that damaged zone.

To avoid Global Governance issues and to allow for plausible deniability in matters of collateral damage. To buffer the public's reaction and perception of the project. To buffer the costs and improve techniques. The FACT is it is the safest and most logical SCIENTIFIC way to approach a problem like this. Scientists do not like to be bothered with politics. They do not like to be hindered by issues of geographic and political borders.

So that leaves the ability to conduct small scale studies within a countries own borders and they can avoid a lot of legal and political issues that arise when done on a large scale. This is sort of like death by a 1000 needles pricks . They slowly will be adjusting the jet fuel. Little by little each year. Increasing the additives as perceived is needed. This is a documented plan. It has scientific merit and credibility. It fits with all the other pieces of this puzzle in place so far.

Aersol Discussion : Alvia Gaskill


Commentary on the Status of Climate Engineering and Discussion of Options for Reflecting Sunlight Using Soot and Sulfate Aerosols Delivered to the Stratosphere by Jet Aircraft


How to Cool a Planet (Maybe)


The stratospheric plan called for fighting one kind of pollution (excess greenhouse gases like carbon dioxide) with another (sulfur dioxide), though it appeared that any increase in sulfur at the earth's surface would be small compared with the tons already being emitted from the smokestacks of coal-fueled plants

In a draft of his paper, Dr. Crutzen estimates the annual cost of his sulfur proposal at up to $50 billion, or about 5 percent of the world's annual military spending.

"Climatic engineering, such as presented here, is the only option available to rapidly reduce temperature rises" if international efforts fail to curb greenhouse gases, Dr. Crutzen wrote.

"So far," he added, "there is little reason to be optimistic."

.



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 11:35 PM
link   

reply to post by IpsissimusMagus
 


They slowly will be adjusting the jet fuel. Little by little each year. Increasing the additives as perceived is needed.


Great - so there will be evidence of those changes then - go buy some jet fuel, get it tested,store the results, do the same in 1,2, 5, or however many years you feel like.....then compare. Voila - actual verifiable evidence!!

the current jet A1 specification is online at www.seta-analytics.com... - it dates to 2008 and is revision 6 - perhaps you can find previous ones and check the differences too.

Let us know what you find.


This is a documented plan.


Where is it documented?


It has scientific merit and credibility.


so there will be some studies and papers establishing that then - can you link to them?



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 12:02 AM
link   
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul
 





Where is it documented?

so there will be some studies and papers establishing that then - can you link to them?


I posted the link to the document in my last post. Try clicking it and actually reading it this time

You must have been too busy looking up links to words like woo on wikipedia.

Oh mighty WOO master

Unfortunately I can not post the entire document in the thread It's about 15-20 pages long. I can only recommend that you read it. The author Alvia Gaskill is a well known climate scientist who has been a consultant to the DOE and others as well. He is the president of Environmental Reference Materials, Inc. and was filmed as a consultant in the documentary "Owning the weather" and the television show "The Best Evidence"

www.imdb.com...



www.realclimate.org...


The House Oversight Committee is having hearings on the possible suppression of climate change science by the administration (streaming from here). Witnesses include Drew Shindell (NASA GISS), Roger Pielke Jr. and R. Piltz. Update: Full hearing video available at C-SPAN.


The author is a credible source and involved in current climate studies as well as the political arenas.

Mr Gaskill has also proposed a Geoengineering plan of his own.

www.global-warming-geo-engineering.org...



www.celsias.com...

A second, more radical idea is the Global Albedo Enhancement Project , which suggests we cover large areas of the earth with white polythene film. According to Alvia Gaskill, the originator of the idea, covering a large enough area of the earth "could be expected to offset some or all of the projected additional radiative forcing and global warming from 2010 to 2070." Prime locations would be the Sahara, Arabian or Gobi deserts, where thousands of square miles of desert could be covered.



edit on 4/18/2012 by IpsissimusMagus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 12:53 AM
link   
Here is a recent report from the GAO

Climate engineering
Center for Science, Technology, and Engineering
United States Government Accountability Office

July 2011

Technical status, future directions, and
potential responses



After asking focus group participants if they were aware of any scientific or technological solutions to climate change, we explained what geoengineering is and gave them information about three different technologies, including CDR and SRM technologies.

We asked participants to discuss their reactions to each technology and whether they supported or opposed it. In addition, we asked them to discuss how the federal government, industry, and individuals should fund and make decisions about geoengineering.

We chose to use “geoengineering” in the information we gave the focus group and survey participants, given that we and others, such as the Royal Society, had used this term earlier. In our focus groups, we found that participants raised concerns about the potential for harm from geoengineering technologies and reacted differently to different technologies.

For example, one participant, asked to react to information about stratospheric sulfates, expressed the view that dinosaurs had become extinct by the Sun’s having been blocked. Another, reacting to the concept of direct air capture, expressed concern about the long-term storage of CO2 .



The public perceptions elicited by this survey are based on limited information about geoengineering and do not necessarily predict U.S. public views. We found that about 65 percent of the respondents had not heard about geoengineering before reading the survey; therefore, responses to the survey are likely to reflect reactions to information about geoengineering that we provided in the survey



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 12:55 AM
link   

Originally posted by pshea38

Originally posted by gemdog
I posted earlier about the chemtrails in the san francisco, east bay area. It started up early morning again today, and they are really pouring it on thick, crisscrossing the whole sky. I looked out my kitchen window and just saw one flying straight up, like a rocket. Kept going straight up, til out of sight (like a rocket launch). and no, it wasn't flying across overhead with the illusion of just flying straight up.


That's weird gemdog. Last week I saw exactly this, a distant object which appeared
to fly straight up (like a rocket launch), leaving behind a thick trail.
I am in the west of Ireland, and there are no military bases (as such) in the Rep.of Ireland.
I tried to capture it on camera but couldn't get a clear shot.

That is the first time I have seen anything like this. It was an isolated occurence
during what is otherwise an extended period of a distinct absence of spraying.


Same here. I tried to take pics and video, but they just didn't do it justice. It literally looked like a rocket launch. Very strange. What time of day did you see it? I saw it midday, early afternoon (when its sunniest/hottest). I wonder if that matters..



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 01:00 AM
link   

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

Originally posted by gemdog
Omg all the arguing about what comes out of the back of an engine seems almost pointless.
if anyone has ever seen a crop duster or skywriting or anything similar, isnt it obvious it's possible to purposely release a spray from a seperate container/dispenser other than the "exhaust" ?


of course it is possible - it's been possible since at least he 1920's, when I think the first such apparatus was designed.

So what/where is any apparatus for doing so on any of these airliners? That would be very good evidence indeed .....if it existed.


I dont think they're on airliners. I don't think it's done with passenger planes.



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 01:09 AM
link   

Originally posted by ProudBird
reply to post by gemdog
 


Oh.....well. Yes, let's DISCUSS this:


Omg all the arguing about what comes out of the back of an engine seems almost pointless.
if anyone has ever seen a crop duster or skywriting or anything similar, isnt it obvious it's possible to purposely release a spray from a seperate container/dispenser other than the "exhaust" ?


The "idea" of adding something to the HOT exhaust, in order to make a "trail" is, basically, what is done in Air Shows.

(Please, just look that up).

BUT......commercial airliners DO NOT "add" something to the engine exhaust......the FACT of contrails is entirely due to the environment.

Period.


Yeah. I AGREE. Thats my point. I don't think it's passenger plane/airliners. I just hate the "it's all non-existent cuz exhaust is clean, etc." argument. Im saying it can come from someplace other than the exhaust, and I believe its a different type of plane (not commercial airliners). I posted that earlier as well.
Period.



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 01:14 AM
link   

Originally posted by ProudBird
reply to post by gemdog
 



I posted earlier about the chemtrails in the san francisco, east bay area......


There are no such things as "chemtrails".

Period.

I could make it in all "CAPS" and 'shout' it....but, seriously....there are NO such things as "chemtrails".

There ARE things called "CONTRAILS"....or (CONdensation TRAILS)...and those are what you see, in the sky......overhead.

Period.

edit on Tue 17 April 2012 by ProudBird because: (no reason given)


Ok, sorry if im using the wrong arguable reference word. You can stop with the Periods.



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 02:41 PM
link   

Originally posted by MountainLaurel
reply to post by gemdog
 


We're in CA too and have also have seen an increase in these "Chem-trails" , they also do it here early in the morning.

I don't know why they are doing it, and we can only speculate since full dis-closure doesn't seem to be forthcoming to the public. Anything this important being kept "secret" in anyway makes me very uncomfortable.

I hope your health improves and you feel better soon
We have also noticed "allegery" type symptoms, my Dad had a terrible cold he couldn't shake for weeks, and my sister got a bloody nose the other day out of no where? Now I have no idea if this is related, but it's strange cause we're typically a "healthy" bunch.

We had some "intense" thunder and lighting storms here over the weekend, again no idea if they are related to this in anyway...but it was scary and POWERFUL...lol, my 21 year old daughter, the 2 dogs, and 1 cat all came and jumped in bed with me so I remained as calm as possible cause they were all so freaked out. I was definately praying......


Thanks for the health wishes. Ditto to you.

Thats interesting you mention the allergy issue, I have allergies but not too bad. But lately its been mostly my eyes- itching, irritated, watering, burning (like when youre really sleepy), etc.. and before that, my asthma. Funny thing is, our cats are having the same problem, wheezing, etc..
And, its Wednesday morning now, and the white planes with the long trails are crisscrossing the skies again already, same region of the sky (plane origin appears to be northeast of Fremont). Its beautiful out now, but in an hour or two, a weird haze will develop, and get super thick by late afternoon.



new topics

top topics



 
18
<< 6  7  8    10  11 >>

log in

join