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Rapture vs NONE rapture (dialogue to all christians)

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posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 10:35 AM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

I agree, when it begins it whill shortly come to pass.

I don't know who or what you agree with since you are the only one saying that.


John was "in the spirit on the "DAY OF THE LORD". That's an OT metaphor for the Millennial Kingdom read Ezekiel sometime. The naming of Sunday as "the Lord's Day" wouldn't come for several centuries. John was taken into the future to a vision of the Lord's day, the Millennial reign.

He was told to write what he had seen, (the image of Christ and the stars and candlesticks), what is (the letters to the 7 churches), and what shall be "here after" (meta touta in the Greek, which begins at 4:1). He was in the spirit watching a vision of the 70th week of Daniel and the Millennial reign and watching it from the throne room in heaven.




posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 10:36 AM
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reply to post by SimonPeter
 

He dates this event by saying that the Lord will save Israel

There is no Israel now, if that is what you are getting at.
There is spiritual Israel, the church.
As for a physical thing, Israel, then that is just a group of people who decided for some reason to call themselves, Israel. That does not magically mean they are figures in prophecy.
All this tribulation quizzing is meaningless to me since I interpret it to have already happened, which is clear from Daniel and Matt. and Mark.
edit on 28-4-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 10:40 AM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by SimonPeter
 

He dates this event by saying that the Lord will save Israel

There is no Israel now, if that is what you are getting at.
There is spiritual Israel, the church.
As for a physical thing, Israel, then that is just a group of people who decided for some reason to call themselves, Israel. That does not magically mean they are figures in prophecy.
All this tribulation quizzing is meaningless to me since I interpret it to have already happened, which is clear from Daniel and Matt. and Mark.


The Ekklesia was a mystery hidden from the OT prophets, that would include Daniel. The 69th week stopped at the diaspora and the 70th week of 7 years is the 7-year tribulation, the time of "JACOB'S (Israel)" trouble.



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 10:47 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

You have no room to talk, you go to the most liberal Agnostic scholars on the planet to remove ENTIRE books from the canon of scripture that you don't care for. Instead of letting the Word of God define your theology and alter your theology so it aligns with the Word of God you alter the Word of God until it aligns with your theology.

You do understand that you are following an invention of the Catholic Church, right?
So do you define the Word by your "theology"?



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 10:52 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

John was "in the spirit on the "DAY OF THE LORD". That's an OT metaphor for the Millennial Kingdom read Ezekiel sometime. The naming of Sunday as "the Lord's Day" wouldn't come for several centuries. John was taken into the future to a vision of the Lord's day, the Millennial reign.
You are a natural plagiarist, meaning you like this "prophet" aura about you so you say things as if you came up with them on your own and will leave off citing sources when you feel you can bluff your way through.
Seeing this as another example, your argument falls on its face before it can speak.
edit on 28-4-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 11:05 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

The Ekklesia was a mystery hidden from the OT prophets, that would include Daniel. The 69th week stopped at the diaspora and the 70th week of 7 years is the 7-year tribulation, the time of "JACOB'S (Israel)" trouble.

You mean hidden from the church itself until it was "discovered" by John Nelson Darby.
I think what you are talking about is the theory about how time is stopped, like God hit the PAUSE button on "prophetic time" to fit this odd anomaly, the church, in there, which of course needs to be eliminated by the rapture in order for time to continue on for the Jews.



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 11:44 AM
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reply to post by SimonPeter


If you knew that you will have to go through the 1st half of the Tribulation and that you would die in one of those FEMA Concentration Camps for declaring Jesus to be your savior , would you ? Or would you say why, He's still going to let me die anyway ? This is a question for every one .

I remember way back in the 70s, after hearing a sermon about terrible things that would happen to Christians in the U.S. after the U.S. government adopts an official religion, against the 1st Amendment. I know now that the sermon was designed to make me and the other congregants become very self-centered, so as to think only of our selves.

"Oh no!", we were to think, "What about me? How can I be saved? What will I do?"

And all these years, people have been already suffering all over the World. "What about them? What have I done to save them?" The tribulation has ground on year after year, decade after decade. Maybe we should do more to stop the tribulation.

And just so you aren't confused about who the tribulation has been hurting, I'll give you the clue: It's not the people who own the corporate media, and the banks, and the politicians, it is the voiceless people who get shut out of the back-room planning sessions, the people who are killed with impunity, because there is no capital or political profit to be made by seeking actual justice for them.



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 12:58 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

The Ekklesia was a mystery hidden from the OT prophets, that would include Daniel. The 69th week stopped at the diaspora and the 70th week of 7 years is the 7-year tribulation, the time of "JACOB'S (Israel)" trouble.

You mean hidden from the church itself until it was "discovered" by John Nelson Darby.
I think what you are talking about is the theory about how time is stopped, like God hit the PAUSE button on "prophetic time" to fit this odd anomaly, the church, in there, which of course needs to be eliminated by the rapture in order for time to continue on for the Jews.


JND didn't write scripture, I told you I get my theology from the Word of God:

ROMANS 16:25-26 ~ Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began, But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith.

EPHESIANS 3:1-8 ~ For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles, If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward: How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power. Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ.

ROMANS11:25 ~ For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.

EPHESIANS 3:5-6 ~ Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit; That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel.

1 PETER 1:20 ~ Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you.



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 01:12 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

John was "in the spirit on the "DAY OF THE LORD". That's an OT metaphor for the Millennial Kingdom read Ezekiel sometime. The naming of Sunday as "the Lord's Day" wouldn't come for several centuries. John was taken into the future to a vision of the Lord's day, the Millennial reign.
You are a natural plagiarist, meaning you like this "prophet" aura about you so you say things as if you came up with them on your own and will leave off citing sources when you feel you can bluff your way through.
Seeing this as another example, your argument falls on its face before it can speak.


Go see if the phrase "Day of the Lord" appears anywhere in the OT prophets, especially Ezekiel. Go for it. And tell me if Sunday being made the "Lord's Day" happened before Constantine made the edict.


"For the day is near, Even the day of the LORD is near; It will be a day of clouds, A time of doom for the nations." ~ Ezekiel 30:3


Btw, you said you're an SDA correct?


Seventh-day Sabbatarians hold that this means he was brought by the Spirit into an eschatological vision of the Day of the Lord (cf. Is. 58:13–14, Mt. 12:8, etc.), interpreted as a seventh (Sabbatical) millennium. Both parties accordingly use this verse to lay claim to the name "Lord's Day" for their Sabbath.


Lord's Day ~ Wiki


Your own SDA denomination agrees with what I just said. Get a clue.



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 01:15 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

You have no room to talk, you go to the most liberal Agnostic scholars on the planet to remove ENTIRE books from the canon of scripture that you don't care for. Instead of letting the Word of God define your theology and alter your theology so it aligns with the Word of God you alter the Word of God until it aligns with your theology.

You do understand that you are following an invention of the Catholic Church, right?
So do you define the Word by your "theology"?


Right, Irenaeus lists the epistles the early church accepted and also made not of books or letters that they rejected during his time.



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 01:34 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

Go for it. And tell me if Sunday being made the "Lord's Day" happened before Constantine made the edict.
Your theories seem to rely a lot on the Catholic Church.

Your own SDA denomination agrees with what I just said. Get a clue.
You need to get a clue about the SDA church before talking about it.
It is not dogmatic like your cult, and is open to individual interpretation.
edit on 28-4-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 03:31 PM
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reply to post by jmdewey60
 



Your theories seem to rely a lot on the Catholic Church.


EZEKIEL 30:3. Read it. Read Acts chapter 2 about the "Day of the Lord".


20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and notable day of the Lord come: ~ Acts 2:20



3 For the day is near, the day of the Lord is near, it will be a day of clouds, a time of doom for the nations." ~ Ezekiel 30:3


"The day of the Lord" begins when he comes back to Earth, judges the nations, and rules from David's throne in Jerusalem fulfilling the promise made to Mary.



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 03:32 PM
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reply to post by jmdewey60
 



Go see if the phrase "Day of the Lord" appears anywhere in the OT prophets, especially Ezekiel.


*waiting*



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 05:54 PM
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reply to post by pthena
 

We can and should not try to stop the Tribulation . It's Gods Plan and he will see to it .
I remember back in the 50's and have no memory of persecution . I had no idea of a plot to suppress anyone until the JFK murder . Then is when I became aware that all was not above board in America . At 13 years old that coverup was evident to me . From there it has only gone down hill . Then I learned that the Ultra Rich Globalist dream was real and a lot farther advanced than I could have ever dreamed . And the NWO agenda meant doom for me and mine .
Yes the common man will feel the effects of the NWO suppression more than the ultra rich. But more than the common man the Christian will feel it more when he can not use the Mark of the Beast (only money system going at that time ). The old Japanese camps of the 40s have been expanded for Christians who will reject the Mark of the Beast . The NWO will have to deal with them harshly . The Christian will be the most dangerous enemy of the NWO . The Christian will not be able to own property as they will be alien to and unregistered in the new system . Therefore the ownership of the Christians personal properties will revert to the STATE unless they reject Jesus and take the Mark
I'm not quite sure what your point was except that some Christians basically are using Jesus for fire insurance should they find that the bible is right .A real Christian has repented against this evil world and the workings of the dark side sickens him . When I see all of the Tattoo's and body mutilation along with the Goth , I know that Satan is responsible . The fire insurance christian serves 2 masters .



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 06:13 PM
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reply to post by jmdewey60
 


Israel does exist today legally and will rebuild the Temple at the behest of the Antichrist . And he will sit in the seat of God . Then I believe that the Jews ( that you say are not in Israel just like the Arabs say ) will rebuke him as an imposter. I can see where the Antichrist will seek to wipe Israel off the map for raining on his parade .That is when JESUS the LORD will come to save Israel from total destruction . IF YOU REMEMBER among one of the reasons the Jews rejected Jesus was because he didn't save Israel from the Romans . Ezekiel tells in chapter 38 that He will come back and save Israel and that has not happened at any time . But it will .








0 will rebuke him



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 06:58 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

"The day of the Lord" begins when he comes back to Earth, judges the nations, and rules from David's throne in Jerusalem fulfilling the promise made to Mary.

You mean that's your theory.
It doesn't actually say that anywhere.



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 07:03 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

*waiting*

For what?
And what is that line in the quotes supposed to be?
It is not a quote from me, if that is what you are implying.
Are you trying to be deceptive?
It looks like it to me.
Is this your new tactic, right in your face lying?



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 07:16 PM
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reply to post by SimonPeter
 

The Christian will be the most dangerous enemy of the NWO
You should read the book, The Wandering Who (now available in Kindle format for $7.95) and you will find out that the NWO has a Zionist agenda.



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 07:34 PM
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reply to post by SimonPeter
 

Israel does exist today legally and will rebuild the Temple at the behest of the Antichrist .
It (a group of people only calling themselves Israel) is illegally occupying Jerusalem.
All this theory is based on a single line in a forged (meaning it pretends to be by Paul but was written after he was dead) book, 2 Thess.

And he will sit in the seat of God . Then I believe that the Jews ( that you say are not in Israel just like the Arabs say ) will rebuke him as an imposter. I can see where the Antichrist will seek to wipe Israel off the map for raining on his parade .That is when JESUS the LORD will come to save Israel from total destruction . IF YOU REMEMBER among one of the reasons the Jews rejected Jesus was because he didn't save Israel from the Romans . Ezekiel tells in chapter 38 that He will come back and save Israel and that has not happened at any time . But it will .
Ezekiel was written in Babylon, so has nothing to do with events that happened 400 years later (or whatever). It was about current events, the destruction of the 1st temple, and not the destruction of the second or third (or whatever).
edit on 28-4-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 28 2012 @ 07:39 PM
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reply to post by jmdewey60
 


I'm quite a bit more informed than you think ! I know that the Fed Reserve is a privately owned sreies of 12 banks that has no allegiance to America . They are Ashkenazi Jew owned by 13 Jewish families . The core is the Rothschilds and our Rockefellers are Americas thorn in our side . The Global Bankers , the same families that owns the Fed have propagated the whole NWO and supporting agencies. Moses Almshel Bauer now Rothschild strategized the world takeover by controlling all currencies . The collapse of economies around the world has been caused on purpose by them . It's just business to them . I also know that a 80 to 95% population reduction is in their plan as well .
The Jews were chosen to carry out Gods plan on both sides of what we see as good and evil . Case in point Jesus admitted that he chose Judas a Devil to betray him .
I also know that you read too much literature not inspired of God and it has compromised your faith .



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