Vitamin C is Above Top Secret: We all have a MAJOR genetic disease! Three grams of Vitamin C a day

reply to post by Aleister

I admire your interest and grouping of threads for easy reference but would like to add a word of warning.

We all know what drugs are and what they do, especially in the wrong doses. Think of vitamins as body drugs rather than the conventional and illicit kind. Vitamins are powerful things and too much of the wrong ones can kill you. In other words, you can O.D. on vitamins too. I'm not saying C is like that but I don't profess to know either. Adjust dose gradually, please.

I think it is vitamin A that is toxic in high doses. Don't ask me how or why I know but there is an article on the web that warns of the danger of eating the...liver or kidney (I always get the 2 confused but cooked in any case) of an old dog I believe and I happened to stumble upon it. I don't usually eat dog liver or kidney, I'm a vegetarian. Anyway, this liver apparently contains so much of said vitamin (A or D?) that it is toxic to the human body upon ingestion due to dosage, unlike that of whatever other animal it is that people eat the liver of.... I might be wrong on the animal too but I thought it was aged dog.

reply to post by LightSpeedDriver


Agreed, there is trouble in taking too much of a good or bad thing. I think C is safe in that respect, while taking it after some food, etc. I take a multi for the other things right now, but know enough not to include iron in the mix (I think I've often heard or read that too much iron isn't safe, if I may go into my not-a-doctor mode again).

A fellow vegetarian here. I "hung out" with two activists vegetarians for almost five years before I gave up meat, thinking that I would never enjoy food again. Then, when I got rid of meat, every meal from then on has been a feast. Probably because the taste buds "heal" once meat is no longer considered food. Related to your post and my response though, people who eat red meat get large amounts of iron in their diets, and maybe should avoid adding more via supplements.

Originally posted by Aleister
reply to post by AuranVector

 

What good information from you and the other posters. From what I've learned here I'm increasing my C intake to 4 grams a day, and maybe 5. Thanks for all the data!

I'm going to link some of the other threads ATS has on C, most of them from several years ago:

[www.abovetopsecret.com... Vitamin C prevents radiation damage]
[www.abovetopsecret.com... Vitamin C conspiracy]
[www.abovetopsecret.com... How Vitamin C affects the eye and the brain]
[www.abovetopsecret.com... Vitamin C, Teeth, and Dentists]
[www.abovetopsecret.com... Vitamin C and Astral Projection]
[www.abovetopsecret.com... High Vitamin C level linked to decreased stroke risk]
[www.abovetopsecret.com... Vitamin C and cholesterol]
[www.abovetopsecret.com... Vitamin C and avian flu (plus additional data)

Thanks for all the links. Didn't even occur to me to search ATS for Vitamin C info.

Originally posted by LightSpeedDriver
reply to post by Aleister

 

I admire your interest and grouping of threads for easy reference but would like to add a word of warning.

We all know what drugs are and what they do, especially in the wrong doses. Think of vitamins as body drugs rather than the conventional and illicit kind. Vitamins are powerful things and too much of the wrong ones can kill you. In other words, you can O.D. on vitamins too. I'm not saying C is like that but I don't profess to know either. Adjust dose gradually, please.

I think it is vitamin A that is toxic in high doses. Don't ask me how or why I know but there is an article on the web that warns of the danger of eating the...liver or kidney (I always get the 2 confused but cooked in any case) of an old dog I believe and I happened to stumble upon it. I don't usually eat dog liver or kidney, I'm a vegetarian. Anyway, this liver apparently contains so much of said vitamin (A or D?) that it is toxic to the human body upon ingestion due to dosage, unlike that of whatever other animal it is that people eat the liver of.... I might be wrong on the animal too but I thought it was aged dog.

Years ago, I had read that polar bear liver is so high in Vitamin A that it's toxic to humans.

Where would that knowledge come from? Eskimos maybe?

As for Vitamin C, the human body cannot store it. Excess C is eliminated quickly -- often in the form of loose stools.

Someone here just posted that:

It's a good way to judge how much C you need. Cut back on the C until your bowels normalize.

reply to post by Aleister

I'm the pickiest person I know. I only like what I like. Eating out can be a problem, unless it's Indian. That's always a winner for me. Meat replacement products don't seem to have quite caught on yet in the restaurant trade, unfortunately.

I just say I'm a vegetarian who doesn't like vegetables which isn't that far from the truth really. But I persevere. I hooked up with a Dutch girl years ago and she had 2 pans and made 2 meals. Even the most senseless and unfeeling of males (myself) eventually saw that cooking like that was a joyless affair and "converted". Meat replacement products (in particular one made by Tivall) have kept food possible, along with 15-20 organic herbs and spices. I like it herby, spicy, weird, normal, salty, peppery.

For example, I have an organic black pepper here, the kind you grind at home. It really is like a fine wine, there are hints of fruit and sweetness in it, along with tones of ...sandalwood (?) and pine, aromatic and musky.... I can't buy that in the supermarket, they just have the commercial stuff. All fire and no tone. And this from a smoker, somebody with apparently no smell and seriously challenged taste buds. Uh-huh...

Peace

reply to post by AuranVector

See, there ya go, maybe it's Polar Bears but my point was there is an animal out there that after having eaten it's liver, you will die. Indeed if it's a Polar Bear I would guess Eskimo's but then again, I think Seal is probably more likely to be on their menu.
ETA And I think I did state that Vit C is easily excreted but there have been a couple of threads on this lately, or maybe I'm just unsure but did want to reinforce the fact that not all vitamins can be played with dose wise and they should be treated with respect.

reply to post by LightSpeedDriver


Since this thread is in a lull period, talking vege food for awhile. Indian restaurants, I totally agree, the buffets are where food goes to heaven. I don't go for the hot spicy, but love and use seasonings, especially in my signature lentils and rice dish. But I've seldom used and fell in love with pepper, and maybe this is one seasoning I should get to know better. Can you give me a brand name for the pepper you like, the one you grind (I've never done that), and remember, I don't enjoy hot spicy. Thanks for any lead to a great new seasoning!

Originally posted by starchild10

Originally posted by newcovenant
If you only take one vitamin it should be a multi vitamin but I also urge you to take extra C followed in importance by Vitimin E and Selenium as prescribed by Dr Andrew Weil.

Dr Andrew Weil as in Quackwatch? www.quackwatch.com...

Yeah...that same guy. I never looked at the link but you really don't need to be a rocket scientist to tell if something makes you feel well. In case this is news to you - the "modern" medical field is at odds with the alternative and herbal practitioners. So probably why you have someone with even less credentials making a claim about Weil who is a highly respected doctor. Modern medicine doesn't even recognize chiropractic, homeopathy or acupuncture. If you are not on board with all the prescription drugs and cutting operations and procedures that are recommended you are not part of the club.
They will try to drum you out of your alternative medical practice but it's all BS. You can pay attention to what they are telling you. You don't really need half those body organs so yeah go ahead and have them removed and by all means... take the prescriptions. I'll stick with the C

What I was told by a relative in the alternative/wholistic medicine field has held true for me. Vitamin C is naturally acquired from natural foods but that's always in association with many obscure compounds like bioflavinoids etc which help your body process the C far more effectively. Those compounds are absent in bottle types of C sources so no matter how much you take in pill form, most of it goes straight through you and gets wasted IE you could be taking 3000mg daily and only making use of 100mg or less. A solution to this is to eat a good cheap natural source of C like oranges regularly while taking C supplements to make your mega-doses more mega-effective.

A good balanced diet based on natural foods including some meat & fish is the best source for all vitamins as it always was and with the right diet & lifestyle, you don't need supplements.

Originally posted by newcovenant

Yeah...that same guy. I never looked at the link but you really don't need to be a rocket scientist to tell if something makes you feel well. In case this is news to you - the "modern" medical field is at odds with the alternative and herbal practitioners. So probably why you have someone with even less credentials making a claim about Weil who is a highly respected doctor. Modern medicine doesn't even recognize chiropractic, homeopathy or acupuncture. If you are not on board with all the prescription drugs and cutting operations and procedures that are recommended you are not part of the club.
They will try to drum you out of your alternative medical practice but it's all BS. You can pay attention to what they are telling you. You don't really need half those body organs so yeah go ahead and have them removed and by all means... take the prescriptions. I'll stick with the C

I can't believe someone put Dr. Andrew Weil on QuackWatch. His MD is from Harvard Medical.

Too bad there aren't more medical doctors like him -- open to the holistic approach to healing, alternative remedies and disease prevention.

It's not surprising he would be persecuted -- he's a threat to establishment medicine & Big Pharma.

Originally posted by demongoat

...also vitamins don't come from the ground...

Ah, that's not what I said.

Originally posted by demongoat
...they invented crop rotation to let the minerals in the earth replenish and they planted things or used manure or compost to renew the land.

That's what I said (in part).

Originally posted by demongoat
i'd like to see proof that fruit doesn't have vitamins we need in them, because if you produce the same nutrients plants need, the plants shouldn't have issues with growth.

The details of the study escape me at the moment, but there was one done in '99(ish) that compared the level of Vitamin C found in oranges purchased through supermarkets with what was the figures that were considered to be canon from the study done in the 20's (ish). They did find that the levels were significantly below what was previously recorded. The study suggested that modern agricultural methods may be related to this.

The RDI of vitamin levels (which is supposed to be the baseline need) has also increased over the last decade or so.

I'm not claiming Vitamin C is the sovereign specific. I'm simply pointing out the "apple a day" philosophy has numerous issues.

(I am glad to see you agree with the importance of crop rotation, however. Shame that as a practise it's dying out.)

reply to post by Aleister

I can't help you out I think because I order my herbs and spices from a small independent Dutch retailer who sells them online. The only tip I could give you would be to buy organic as they usually contain more flavour than the regular kind. And if possible, try to buy them from someone specialised in herbs and spices. I can get organic stuff at the local supermarket but it is nowhere as good or as cheap as where I get it now. I usually try to buy 50-70 euros worth at a time to make the postal costs worthwhile. (7 euros for delivery). Hope it helps.

Originally posted by Pilgrum
What I was told by a relative in the alternative/wholistic medicine field has held true for me. Vitamin C is naturally acquired from natural foods but that's always in association with many obscure compounds like bioflavinoids etc which help your body process the C far more effectively. Those compounds are absent in bottle types of C sources so no matter how much you take in pill form, most of it goes straight through you and gets wasted IE you could be taking 3000mg daily and only making use of 100mg or less. A solution to this is to eat a good cheap natural source of C like oranges regularly while taking C supplements to make your mega-doses more mega-effective.

A good balanced diet based on natural foods including some meat & fish is the best source for all vitamins as it always was and with the right diet & lifestyle, you don't need supplements.

Ahh those were the days.

Increased exposure to harsher sun, electricity, TV radiation exposure, now we have sources of pollution we never heard of in the good old days. Indoors, outdoors and in the car. There's oil balls that travel microscopically and you inhale them along with many other pollutants you have never heard about because global warming is not real (ahem) bits of tires, in the house you have sometimes worse pollution that travel in the stagnant air off fabrics, and fibers off carpets and paper towels. Wave a tissue in a sunbeam and see a large part of it drift into the atmosphere right there in front of you. You need the C as a fighter for the attack of the modern world and it's thousands of invisible pollutants, toxins and poisons. That orange stopped working for you around noon.

”Frederick Robert Klenner, (October 22, 1907 – May 20, 1984) was an American medical researcher and doctor in general practice in Reidsville, North Carolina. From the 1940s on he experimented with the use of vitamin C megadosage as a therapy for a wide range of illnesses, most notably polio. He authored 28 research papers during his career. He was one of the originators of orthomolecular medicine, but his work remains largely unaddressed by established medicine.[1] Klenner is the subject[2] or mentioned or referenced in a number of orthomolecular medicine related papers and articles. A recent book[3] broadly updating Klenner's cumulative vitamin C work is dedicated to him and he is profiled in Medical Mavericks

I had a close friend with polio in the 1940’s who suffered daily, along with his family, while the criminals in the corrupt medical “profession”, then and now, criminally disregarded this seminal scientific discovery on the cure to polio by high dose vitamin C therapy.

The time is long overdue to begin jailing some of the so called doctors at the FDA for scientific misconduct, fraud and crimes against humanity.

Just read this fascinating case history of a 4 year old bit by a dangerous poisonous snake in the yard, cured by vitamin C injections while waiting for the anti venom profile to be obtained!

www.3quarksdaily.com...

This seminal paper on nutrition, vitamin C and medicine was published in 1971 and fortunately is available for free on the internet at the click of a button: www.orthomed.com... While the great scientist Linus Pauling, Ph.D. made great contributions to the understanding and elucidation of vitamin C, the real pioneer was Fred Klenner, M.D.

reply to post by newcovenant


Fred R. Klenner, I'd never heard of him - thank you for bringing his work up here. His wikipedia article has lots of links to papers, mostly under the reference section (some of those should be duplicated in External Links for people looking too quickly and missing those papers). I was going to link more here, but the paper you link in the post above is very good, and will do for his link.

Klenner should be in the Hall of Fame of Wow
.

reply to post by newcovenant


It's not so much the vitamin C in the orange that you need, but the associated obscure compounds that can dramatically improve the way your body actually makes use of ascorbic acid. IE eat an orange every day and take your supplement as well. I've been doing that for years and the general health improvement including higher resistance to common diseases has been distinctly better. I take a 'Berocca' (vit B + 1000mg C) daily and always keep a stock of nice oranges on hand as well. Of course there are even better natural sources of C like blackcurrant, rosehip etc so whatever's in season/in stock/most affordable is my supplement to the supplements.

It also helps that I live in the place with some of the cleanest air on the planet (the clean air standard is sampled at Cape Grim)

reply to post by Pilgrum


This isn't true. Bioflavinoids have been shown to increase absorption by up to 30%. So if you take 3000mb from a pill, it's equivalent to ~2300mg from oranges. My pills have rosehips and citrus bioflavinoids added, so this isn't an issue.

wow, 10 pages of info and not one person has mentioned the one fruit/nut that is the richest in vitamin C and has been used for generations, long before any pharmacrap came about.
may i introduce ... Acerola
www.webmd.com...
here's another reason the pharmacrappers dont' want you to know about it

Acerola is also used for preventing heart disease, “hardening of the arteries” (atherosclerosis), blood clots, and cancer.

can't have something so natural and available diminishing the profits of their greatest drug supply ... heart meds.

need more ?? www.bewellbuzz.com...
nutrition info --> 100 grams (3.5 oz) serving = 1300mg --> 2 servings is more than enough for daily intake.
pills ?? yeah, if you must but there are plenty of better ways to get what our bodies need.

Since I started this thread, and because of it, I went from three grams of ascorbic acid a day to four, and then to five. That should be a good place for awhile. I read that Linus Pauling started out with three grams and worked his way up to sixteen. Wondering if he took tablets or liquid.

reply to post by xstealth


I sat in the sun a lot this past summer but just had Vit. D3 tested and it was only 37. A reliable source says one should get it up to 70 or 80 to prevent cancer. If one has cancer, this person said, she would get it up to 120! One should avoid the hottest parts of the day of course if sun gazing. Vit. D3 should be taken with the meal that has the most fat.

One cannot get enough Vit. C from an orange a day, only 50 milligrams. I do not like to chew tabs cause I think it can hurt enamel on the teeth. I take EmergenC but does anyone have a better idea? SInce it is 1000 milligrams, I take half package in one part of the day, half in another part of day.

BTW, even Dr. Oz has said that he often takes part of his vitamins in the a.m. part in p.m.
and body assimilates it better.

One can also get Vit. D3 drops that go up to 28,000 IU! My drops are 2,000 IU from a vegetarian source, lanolin, and I take 8,000 IU a day, 4 drops. One should have vitamin K with it - BTW, I hear that butter has that but I do not eat butter daily.