The atomic bombing of Hiroshima was decided upon to force a Japanese surrender rather than a prolongation of the war which would entail an Allied invasion of Japan with predictably fierce house-to-house fighting.

Hiroshima and Nagasaki were picked as targets primarily because they had not been heavily bombed in previous raids, so that it would be relatively easy to demonstrate that all the devastation was the result of a single atomic bomb and not from any conventional bombs. Hiroshima was bombed first, and it was hoped that this would be enough to compel Japanese capitulation, but when the Japanese persisted in warfare then Nagasaki was bombed as a demonstration that the devastation was no fluke and could be repeated. If the Japanese had still not surrendered then the US would have been in an awkward situation because it did not have a third bomb ready and there would have been a delay before a third bomb could be dropped.

Originally posted by Bakatono
I have dated girls whose fathers were there when the bombs dropped; we had interesting conversations......She has extensive stories, she is almost 100. However, I am speaking from a position of a little more authority than you in this case. I lived it, you read it. Sorry.

Originally posted by Bakatono
Oooooh, you heard stories, good for you.

Are you being serious? You are going to insult me, after claiming that you "lived it" because you talked with your Japanese girlfriends dad??

Originally posted by Shoonra
Hiroshima and Nagasaki were picked as targets primarily because they had not been heavily bombed in previous raids,

CAN ANYONE READ???

I posted the link to the declassified document. You are spreading false information. Nagasaki was never an intended target, at least not chose by the Target Committee. Why are multiple people repeating this after I have debunked it at least 3 times on this thread, that is only three pages long??

Deny ignorance.

A question:

There's 4 targets listed, but the US had pilots picked up to dropping a 5th atomic weapon.
What was the 5th target then?

1st Lt. Norman Ray was the pilot chosen to drop the 5th bomb, had they used that many.
(sidenote: Ray trained George McGovern to fly B-24s)

Tokyo was dropped from the list due to the Emperors' Palace, and all the historical artifacts there.

EDIT: sorry if I missed another target list, but once I saw 9/11 stuff, I just scrolled past down.....

I am kind of on the fence about the necessity of the Tokyo fire bombings and Hiroshima, I would say that Nagasaki was unnecessary, and was more about terror and vengeance, than trying to prevent ultimately higher casualties.

Looking at "modern" warfare, yes, I think the west has become preoccupied with fighting proxy wars with no fear of loss of life or retaliation, it makes war more palatable, especially to those ignorant or the horrors of war. War is horrific, yes, but that is not an excuse for the abuses and more horrific acts perpetrated in war. The west uses technology to indiscriminately take life, without fear of reprisals, they use it as a tool to instill fear of the west, by patrolling the skies of nations that are not declared enemies, and instilling the constant fear of retaliation by the west for perceived wrongs or insubordination.

Unfortunately, many of the horrors get swept under the rug, the victors after all, get to write the history.

I have followed the entire conversation here on the topic of the Bomb. Much of it was good and rather intelligently presented - BUT - and its a big #####-ing BUT -- 2 of them actually.

Most here actually believe the government version of 9/11 - for this there is absolutely NO excuse. Just plain blind ignorance and stupidity. Be ashamed for that you assholes.

Not one person here metioned the name of the Grand Worshipful Master who was the primary perpetrator of the entire Atomic Bombing event(s) from start to finish. Now - here's the point of the post. If you guys are stupid enough to believe the scumbags in government regarding 9/11 then you surely do not know the name of the most important 33rd Degree Mason who was personally responsible for the slaughter of the innocents at Hiroshima/Nagasaki. He had the final say, and all other meetings and agendas that discussed the best way to go about it were just so much BS - play acting for the public at large and for the historical record.

As far as the Talmudic Zionist's were concerned the guys who worked te Manhattan Project were merely dumb grunts - Goyim - aka "cattle."

The major decisions had already been made by those in the positions of most power - Masonic power that is !!! The manhattan Project was operating under the cloak of the Zionism disguised as the Masonic Order - scum every one of them.

Have you all figured out the name of the son-of-a-bitch evil monster yet??? Probably NOT - you dumb ####'s

Enola gay you should have stayed at home yesterday.

Once the nuclear bomb had been developed it was inevitable that it would be used at some point.

Yes Japan was on the back foot, but the war would have dragged on for years.
Anyone who knows anything about the Japanese psyche etc knows that they would have defended their country to the death and every yard gained would have cost more allied lives.
It wasn't just military expediant to put an end to the war as soon as possible but also politically, economically and dare I say it morally.

And it was a massive lesson to mankind as a whole.

Not that the US could 'nuke' anyone but of the implications of any future use.
Ever since then we have been faced with the MAD scenario, and guess what - it's worked.

Sure as night follows day someone would have used a nuclear bomb at some point.
If it had been later it would have been a more powerful weapon and there would have far likelier been a reciprocal response.

We all spend far too much time looking for someone to blame instead of learning the valuable lessons that history can teach us.
And the most important lesson to be learnt here is that we can not and must not let this happen again.

I have followed the entire conversation here on the topic of the Bomb. Much of it was good and rather intelligently presented - BUT - and its a big #####-ing BUT -- 2 of them actually.

Most here actually believe the government version of 9/11 - for this there is absolutely NO excuse. Just plain blind ignorance and stupidity. Be ashamed for that you assholes.

Not one person here metioned the name of the Grand Worshipful Master who was the primary perpetrator of the entire Atomic Bombing event(s) from start to finish. Now - here's the point of the post. If you guys are stupid enough to believe the scumbags in government regarding 9/11 then you surely do not know the name of the most important 33rd Degree Mason who was personally responsible for the slaughter of the innocents at Hiroshima/Nagasaki. He had the final say, and all other meetings and agendas that discussed the best way to go about it were just so much BS - play acting for the public at large and for the historical record.

As far as the Talmudic Zionist's were concerned the guys who worked te Manhattan Project were merely dumb grunts - Goyim - aka "cattle."

The major decisions had already been made by those in the positions of most power - Masonic power that is !!! The manhattan Project was operating under the cloak of the Zionism disguised as the Masonic Order - scum every one of them.

Have you all figured out the name of the son-of-a-bitch evil monster yet??? Probably NOT - you dumb ####'s

No one figured out who "really" dropped the bomb(s) and why?
I'm not surprised !

edit on 15-4-2012 by Vitruvian because: EDIT

Like the others said, it's most likely to be a big test. I mean what's the point of the bomb anyway? It was called a BOMB for a reason simply to eradicate the enemy and to strike fear to the nation. It's no secret that this bombing run is just to see it's effect and devastation to the enemy. So the next time they use one (ex. in the Future) They will now what payload is enough to use.

@Offtopic: I recall that according to some history books, during those desperate times, when they did the trinity test at Nevada. Some scientists were afraid that they might Lit up the atmosphere into flames and burn the whole Layers, well there was one way to find out...

Originally posted by Infrasilent
You need to verify that the website you are linking to actually contains what you believe it contains before you expect that everyone will believe you.

Seriously? How about actually going ot the link, where that information is presented?

Source: U.S. National Archives, Record Group 77, Records of the Office of the Chief of Engineers, Manhattan Engineer District, TS Manhattan Project File '42-'46, folder 5D Selection of Targets, 2 Notes on Target Committee Meetings.

TOP SECRET TOP SECRET
Auth: C.O., Site Y, N.M.
Initials:
Date: 12 May 1945

This document consists of 7 Page(s)
No. 1 of 4 Copies, Series A
U-13-XIX-1A


DECLASSIFIED
E.O. 11653, Sec. 3(E) and 5(D) or (6)
NND 730039
By ERC NARS, Date 6-4-74

Do you believe it now?

I dont think so. The US was a major player during World War I but I do not think they were willing to sacrifice millions in an invasion of Japan. For Russia to take Germany they lost between 10 and 20 million soldiers and the Germans about 3 Million soldiers. Can you imagine even 1 or 2 million dead GIs in under a decade?

Originally posted by steppenwolf86
Japan would have never given up,

If this is true, if the Japanese were so radical that they would fight to the death, to the last man, and kill their own women before we advanced.....then why did they surrender to the A-bombs? Why didnt they just scream "BANZAI" and start suicide attacking anyway? Because the "fanatical Japanese" myth is a propaganda lie to make Americans feel better about being the only country to ever nuke someone else.

Because they were beaten.

We could have killed more people without the A-bombs, using firebombs and conventional bombing (see firebombing of tokyo). This alone proves it wasnt about numbers, it was an experiment to gauge the effectiveness on structures and humans, and to allow the US to take Japan by itself for its own economic interests. Which shows a great deal of inhumanity basically so we could make more money and kill better.

You are free to believe whatever you want, but facts are facts and what you have is opinions and conjecture.

Originally posted by aching_knuckles

Originally posted by steppenwolf86
Japan would have never given up,

If this is true, if the Japanese were so radical that they would fight to the death, to the last man, and kill their own women before we advanced.....then why did they surrender to the A-bombs? Why didnt they just scream "BANZAI" and start suicide attacking anyway? Because the "fanatical Japanese" myth is a propaganda lie to make Americans feel better about being the only country to ever nuke someone else.

Because they were beaten.

We could have killed more people without the A-bombs, using firebombs and conventional bombing (see firebombing of tokyo). This alone proves it wasnt about numbers, it was an experiment to gauge the effectiveness on structures and humans, and to allow the US to take Japan by itself for its own economic interests. Which shows a great deal of inhumanity basically so we could make more money and kill better.

You are free to believe whatever you want, but facts are facts and what you have is opinions and conjecture.

Then why not surrender after the first bomb was dropped? That alone disproves your claim.
As for the fanatical Japanese being a myth, how do you explain Kamikaze and the plans for deploying many more sacrificial weapons?
Where exactly are these facts you allude to?

Also, was a mostly intact Japan a benefit to the US? YES, obviously. An invasion could have led to a North/South Japan, and because we did it without the Russians, Japan is what it is today.

Originally posted by steppenwolf86

Then why not surrender after the first bomb was dropped? That alone disproves your claim.

There were serious meetings occurring, discussing just that fact. In fact, the Japanese had been sending peace offerings since early 45. We Gave them three days. In three days, they had barely been able to assess the damage efficiently.

By the end of January 1945, the Japanese were suggesting peace terms.[23] These proposals, sent through both British and American channels, were assembled by General Douglas MacArthur into a 40-page dossier and given to President Franklin D. Roosevelt on February 2, two days before the Yalta Conference. Reportedly, the dossier was dismissed by Roosevelt out of hand—the proposals all included the condition that the emperor's position would be assured, if possibly as a puppet ruler; whereas at this time the Allied policy was to accept only an unconditional surrender.[24] Additionally, these proposals were strongly opposed by the powerful military members of the Japanese government.[25]

I am not denying there are lots of military leaders that wanted to continue the fight....but there were also those who realized not surrendering would bring more pain to Japan.

Listen, I am no Japanese apologist.

But the fact remains, we did what we did to 1) test the A-bomb (and scare Russia) 2)secure our financial future in Japan.