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Argentina is likely to reinvade the Falklands once Britain drops its guard

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posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 04:39 PM
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Originally posted by Germanicus
And I am more worried about some Chinese person reading this. Seems you are allowed to say whatever you like about the Chinese here on ATS no matter how stupid. Yet if its other people you cannot utter a negative word. Do you know any Chinese people? They are cool. People on here act like they are scary aliens or something. Scared scared people. Thats what you all are. That is why you cling to the tired dying Imperialism that will destroy you.


Ok, I'll be a good doggie and have one more bite.

I have nothing against the people of any country, and I'd be a complete idiot to think Chinese people were at fault, or the populations of any other country for the crap their governments have done.


Originally posted by Germanicus
Thats what you all are. That is why you cling to the tired dying Imperialism that will destroy you.


And this is where you totally fail. Saying that's what we all are. No, there's different people all over the site, many of us different in our beliefs. And if you go back through the thread I was actually going on about the mess my own government and the Argentinian one is making of all this, so if that's clinging to Imperialism that will destroy me I may as well be from Mars. I loathe Imperialism. If you went through most of our posts you'd probably see us talking about the UK and US governments in a negative way too, so you're not making any sense.

And yeah, I'd love for our governments to fail and BRICS save the world, seriously! I've even been reading Fulford knowing that he's almost definitely wrong and hoping, so thinking I'm against everything you say also fails. But on the other hand thinking that BRICS is going to save us all seems way too optimistic and probably something else that fails too. Especially considering we have no evidence that they're actually trying to do that, and if you also add in what the Russian and Chinese governments are like, well they're like most other governments, bad at doing their job of serving people like they should be doing.




posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 04:40 PM
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Originally posted by ollncasino

Originally posted by Germanicus

Originally posted by ollncasino

Originally posted by Germanicus
Does China use its military to invade lands like the Imperialists? No.


Invaded Vietnam in 1979

Border war with India 1962

Invaded Tibet in 1950

Border war with Russia 1969

Threatens Taiwan with war in 2004


What peaceful people these Chinese are...



All on their borders and hardly black and white.



Oh, I forgot Korean war 1950-53.

And Vietnam in the 1960s. The Chinese had soldiers in combat during the US vs. Vietnam war.

What peaceful people those Chinese are.

But apart from Vietnam, Korea, Tibet, India, Russia & Taiwan, the Chinese are a peace loving people...


Note that during all of this period, at no point was Chinese territory attacked by anyone.


One more for this guy
academic.evergreen.edu...
Compre to America. Their list just keeps going and going. What nice people these American's are



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 04:41 PM
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reply to post by Germanicus
 




Sorry again for getting off topic.


We all do it at times.....certainly me more than most.....it's hard sometimes no to get carried away when we are passionate about something.

Why not discuss the points raised with you that are more relevant to the topic under discussion?



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 04:46 PM
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reply to post by Germanicus
 


No probs, I do it myself sometimes too. At least you apologised too instead of just getting wound up, so nice one.



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 04:56 PM
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reply to post by Freeborn
 





Why not discuss the points raised with you that are more relevant to the topic under discussion?


I concede. You guys are right about Argintina. Or more right.

Two more posts. Now Im wrong and a liar


I stand firm on my hate for the Imperial Empire though.



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 04:58 PM
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Originally posted by Germanicus
America,Britain and the Imperial Empire are dying.

The BRICS rise. The BRICS are not your friend.


You do realise that the USA has a bigger economy and military than all of the BRICS put together?

You do realise that 100 years ago, Argentina was in the top ten of the world's richest nations?

Since then it has all been downhill...



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:00 PM
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Originally posted by Germanicus
I stand firm on my hate for the Imperial Empire though


Few Europeans, including British people, support the concept of imperial empires either.

Make no mistake though. The Chinese do.

Be careful of what you wish for.



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:07 PM
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Originally posted by Germanicus

I hope Argentina does invade. What right do the British have?

Imperialists.


The Falklanders have the right of being the VERY FIRST humans to settle those islands and they have the right to choose to be under Great Britain's sovereignty.



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:17 PM
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Originally posted by ollncasino

Originally posted by Germanicus
America,Britain and the Imperial Empire are dying.

The BRICS rise. The BRICS are not your friend.


You do realise that the USA has a bigger economy and military than all of the BRICS put together?

You do realise that 100 years ago, Argentina was in the top ten of the world's richest nations?

Since then it has all been downhill...




Well one more wont hurt.

No thats wrong. China alone will take over the US within 5 years as the worlds largest economy.

They are all on the up. America and friends are al bankrupt. They will be lucky if they can pay their soldiers in 5 years time.

America is also a joke. They havent really won a thing since WW2. They get beat by Koreans and Viet Kongs. They cant even deal with a bunch of Taliban on dirtbikes in Afghanistan. All they have under their belts is Iraq and thats hardly a success. America is over-rated and soft. And they know it.

And all their technology is over-rated. China can land their drones in Iran if they want to. China can hack into their electric grid and shut off power,crash planes......

While America makes military cuts and pulls back due to their unpayable national debt China is increasing Military spending and has been for years. And you knowthey are spending more than the official figures that are released.

China is just playing with America right now. They are already at war with America asforas economics goes. Its just not total war yet.

And you know China will play it smart. They wont start anything. They will swoop in when the time is right just like America did in WW2. America has the smell of death. We all know it.

China will control the Reserve currency within our lifetimes. There is no stopping it.

China also knows History will judge them so even though they will write the history they wont want to make it too hard. They will strike when America is on one of its conquests in the middle east. They will write themselves as the saviours,saving the world from the evil Imperial Americans. They wont be wrong.

I think it will be soon. Before Way before 5 years.

America is a dead man walking.
edit on 12-4-2012 by Germanicus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:18 PM
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will never happen



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:26 PM
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Hi, Argentinian here.
The guy in the interview is speaking BULLSH-T.
We *WONT* try any militar action unless attacked, we are not morons, despite what you were led to believe.
Cameron has been yamming about how they will respond to any militar action but choose to ignore countless request from our gov't to at least SIT AND DISCUSS PEACEFULLY as peers.
(BTW, to the brittish here: THEY ARE USING YOUR NATIONALISTIC SENSE TO DEFLECT YOU BEING PUMPED IN THE BUM BY THEM EVERYDAY
)
We DO NOT believe in WAR, the 1982 conflict was started BY A DICTATOR as a means to deflect attention from the flagrant violations of human rights.
After the dictatorship fell and we reinstated a democratic gov't we NEVER acted as a moronic monkey-like warring nation.
We will recover the Malvinas, and it will be by peaceful means, it could take 5, 10 or 50 years, but it will happen.

And FYI, before any english settlement was established THERE ALREADY WAS AN ARGENTINIAN SETTLEMENT which was expelled BY VIOLENT MEANS.
They took it, as any other imperialist nation, because they could.
They were and are stronger in a military sense, but they are wrong, and that is what prevails sooner or later.
If you need more, the islands lie within our continental shelf:


I am NOT interested in a nation vs nation chest beating, we do NOT believe in the "right of force", we do not want to expell any population, we do not want to force them to change their language, or lifestyle.
Our quarrel is not with the "kelpers", we would be happy to welcome them, but we will never stop trying to restore our sovereignty over our lands


I hope my post is taken in the spirit it was written
Peace

Drakus.

edit on 12/4/2012 by drakus because: (no reason given)

edit on 12/4/2012 by drakus because: (no reason given)

edit on 12/4/2012 by drakus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:31 PM
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I won't comment on the dire ignorance or lack of any historical knowledge presented by a few members, but ultimately the islanders WISH to remain British.

The British had those Islands before Argentina was even a country.

Facts are facts. It's not about colonizing , it's about defending people and installations that are British, welcome to the 21st century, do you need a hand stepping off your plague filled boats of ignorance?

On topic - It would just be sensible to keep it guarded and in the mean time continue reasonable and mature dialogue between the countries.



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:34 PM
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reply to post by drakus
 


Ha!

I predict crickets after that.
edit on 12-4-2012 by Germanicus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:42 PM
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Originally posted by woodwardjnr
reply to post by DarthMuerte
 


THe BRIC countries are not a coalition, it's just a handy name to give to countries that are developing at a similar rate.

Argentina would not rely on Russia China or India. It's not like NATO.
Actually, they are. I do not mean they are a military coalition or alliance. They are an economic/political coalition. Several of them do cooperate among themselves in military/space research, most notably Brazilian/Chinese cooperation is widely known/acknowledged.


BRICS is an international political organisation of leading emerging economies, arising out of the inclusion of South Africa into the BRIC group in 2010. As of 2012, its five members are Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa.[2] With the possible exception of Russia,[3] the BRICS members are all developing or newly industrialised countries, but they are distinguished by their large economies and significant influence on regional and global affairs. As of 2012, the five BRICS countries represent almost half of the world's population, with a combined nominal GDP of US$13.6 trillion,[1] and an estimated US$4 trillion in combined foreign reserves
In 2010, South Africa began efforts to join the BRIC grouping, and the process for its formal admission began in August of that year.[12] South Africa officially became a member nation on December 24, 2010, after being formally invited by the BRIC countries to join the group.[12] The group was renamed BRICS – with the "S" standing for South Africa – to reflect the group's expanded membership.[13] In April 2011, South African President Jacob Zuma attended the 2011 BRICS summit in Sanya, China, as a full member.[14][15][16] The BRICS Forum, an independent international organisation encouraging commercial, political and cultural cooperation between the BRICS nations, was formed in 2011



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:44 PM
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Originally posted by Germanicus
The BRICS rise. The BRICS are not your friend.


Not wishing to stray off topic too much, but...

The BRICS are just the major developing economies. Apart from that, they have little in common except they rely on the advanced industrial nations for markets. For example, India is the world’s biggest democracy and China the biggest (er) dictatorship. India and China are direct economic competitors and have a history of animosity and distrust.

On topic. The Falkland Islands and the other territories in the South Atlantic which Argentina claims are not exactly geographically close to their shores, so distance is a moot point. The history of the Islands is convoluted, but the Argentinean claim is comparatively recent having let it lapse for many decades in the past. The British claim to the uninhanited Islands predates the Agentinean claim by quite a long way.

This is about crass politics and not imperialism. Crass Argentinean politics and their policy of not wanting to take the views of the indigenous population into account i.e. the Falkland Islanders. The Argentineans do have a history of imperialism themselves of course – inherited methinks from their Spanish/European forebears – such as the 1870 Patagonian genocide aka “Conquest of the Desert” and numerous examples of squashing the natives because the land "was theirs".

Militarily, Argentina has no hope. However, the future world may surprise us yet.

Regards



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:48 PM
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Originally posted by drakus
And FYI, before any english settlement was established THERE ALREADY WAS AN ARGENTINIAN SETTLEMENT which was expelled BY VIOLENT MEANS.

They took it, as any other imperialist nation, because they could.


Actually the Falklands were discovered and claimed by the British before Argentina even existed and the first very short lived Argentine colony was expelled by an American whaling boat!

Apparently the captain didn't take kindly to a bunch Argies suddenly deciding they owned the Falklands and trying to tell the American captain what to do.

The Argies were so weak that they couldn't even stop an American whalling boat from turfing them out.

They probably don't teach you that in Argentina.



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:52 PM
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Originally posted by drakus
Hi, Argentinian here.
The guy in the interview is speaking BULLSH-T.
We *WONT* try any militar action unless attacked, we are not morons, despite what you were led to believe.
Cameron has been yamming about how they will respond to any militar action but choose to ignore countless request from our gov't to at least SIT AND DISCUSS PEACEFULLY as peers.
(BTW, to the brittish here: THEY ARE USING YOUR NATIONALISTIC SENSE TO DEFLECT YOU BEING PUMPED IN THE BUM BY THEM EVERYDAY
)
We DO NOT believe in WAR, the 1982 conflict was started BY A DICTATOR as a means to deflect attention from the flagrant violations of human rights.
After the dictatorship fell and we reinstated a democratic gov't we NEVER acted as a moronic monkey-like warring nation.
We will recover the Malvinas, and it will be by peaceful means, it could take 5, 10 or 50 years, but it will happen.

And FYI, before any english settlement was established THERE ALREADY WAS AN ARGENTINIAN SETTLEMENT which was expelled BY VIOLENT MEANS.
They took it, as any other imperialist nation, because they could.
They were and are stronger in a military sense, but they are wrong, and that is what prevails sooner or later.
If you need more, the islands lie within our continental shelf:


I am NOT interested in a nation vs nation chest beating, we do NOT believe in the "right of force", we do not want to expell any population, we do not want to force them to change their language, or lifestyle.
Our quarrel is not with the "kelpers", we would be happy to welcome them, but we will never stop trying to restore our sovereignty over our lands


I hope my post is taken in the spirit it was written
Peace

Drakus.

edit on 12/4/2012 by drakus because: (no reason given)

edit on 12/4/2012 by drakus because: (no reason given)

edit on 12/4/2012 by drakus because: (no reason given)


A reasonable post. You would appear to have more sense than your government.

As I alluded to earlier all Argentina needs to do is play it smart and long.

Drop the threats and cajoling. Join forces on the oil and make everybody rich. In about 50 to 100 years sentiment on the islands may be for either independence or joining argentina. At that point the UK wouldn't stand in the way.



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:53 PM
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Originally posted by drakus
Cameron has been yamming about how they will respond to any militar action but choose to ignore countless request from our gov't to at least SIT AND DISCUSS PEACEFULLY as peers.


Sit and peacefully discuss giving the Falklands to Argentina even though the people who live their want to remain British and the British had to liberate those people by force at the cost of hundreds of British lives?

How does that work?

You guys seem to think everyone else is stupid.



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:55 PM
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reply to post by ollncasino
 





first very short lived Argentine colony was expelled


Too small to add up to a solid case for national self-determination?


We could say the same right now.



posted on Apr, 12 2012 @ 05:57 PM
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reply to post by drakus
 




I am NOT interested in a nation vs nation chest beating, we do NOT believe in the "right of force"


And that is good because believe it or not neither do the vast majority of Brits.



we do not want to expell any population, we do not want to force them to change their language, or lifestyle.


But that's just it, nations are forged and bonded by people of common cultures and heritage.
Argentinians and Falkland Islanders share none of these.

And whether you agree or not it's irrelevant, you seek to impose your will and dominion etc on a group of people who don't want it.



Our quarrel is not with the "kelpers", we would be happy to welcome them,


But they don't want you.

The Right To Self-Determination is a right enshrined in the UN Charter.
Kirchner arrogantly stated that the islanders have no right to self-determination or anything else.
How provocative and imperialistic is that?



but we will never stop trying to restore our sovereignty over our lands


It has never been Argentinian soveriegn land and there has never been an Argentinian settlement there.

Kirchner would have been far better served agreeing to the oil sharing deal offered to her by the UK.
That would have provided jobs for the Argentinian people, generated large amounts of money and been a massive boost to the Argentinian economy.
In addition it would have instigated far closer relations between the islanders and Argentina and thus a breakdown of the mutual mistrust and developed an inter-dependant relationship.
Who knows where that would have led to in the future?

I have absolutely no respect for Cameron but the vast majority of Brits support his stance on this.
There will be no negotiation on sovereignty unless the islanders themselves desire it.

Kirchners sell out of the Argentinian people is classic deflection tactics aimed to divert attention from her domestic problems and to highten her own personal international reputation.

I appreciate your contribution and input and sincerely hope that politicians from both our countries never mislead us into another confrontation ever again.
edit on 12/4/12 by Freeborn because: grammar and clarity



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