“If you’ve done nothing wrong you have nothing to worry about.”

if i've done nothing wrong then don't surviel me i have the right to my own thoughts and as to weather or not who i am and what i do personally has very little to no relevancy to wheather what i think is right or wrong or how i express myself. if a musician can have a persona, then why can't somebody detatch from their physical being to convey a message in their own fashion?

reply to post by miniatus


EXACTLY! Last summer I was stopped for running a red light. The officer had me get out of the car and kept asking me why I was nervous. I didn't feel nervous (but I do have my ears and eyebrow pierced). I just told him if I was it was because I didn't want to pay for a ticket. Then he surprisingly told me that because I seemed to be acting suspicious that he would like to search my car. I told him that if he felt like thats what he needed to do to go ahead and do so and was completely cooperative.

After combing my car for anything he could pin on me, he actually walked over to me and handed me $50 that he had found somewhere in the mess that is my car and let me go. That's what you get for profiling you jackass!

Law enforcement makes people nervous naturally. I remember being pulled over when I was younger and visibily shaking while signing tickets. It's just beat into us from the time we're young that the police are the authority. What's scary is that they really seem like they can do whatever they want and get away with it. Not all police officers are like this I know, but it just seems that way to me sometimes.

Think about how many millions and millions of people have volunteered all the information that the Government could ever want about them by creating a Facebook account. These morons have saved the Government alot of man power. Before, they didn't know who your entire family was, or who all your friends are. Movies or music that you like. How about political party? I see so mnay people announcing to the world that they are going away for the weekend or going on vacation for a couple weeks. Why not just put a sign on your front lawn that says "on vacation, feel free to rob our house". Talk about stuck on stupid. = $heopleNation!

As far as one not having to worry if they have not done anything, well that's a weak arguement. The recent Law that allows the masters of puppets to throw you in Jail without a trial gives them the power to label you a terrorist if you are not happy with the Government. It's come down to being about what you think, not what you do. That is very dangerous. ~$heopleNation

Also computer surveillance linked in with Echelon. It's not just the data they are extracting from your PC, it's what they are able to send to your PC. Personal information they can extract from your computer to sell on to the highest bidder. Think your firewall protects you, think again and explain that to the 10 million AOL users who are part of a private corporations network. AOL Staff have full, unlimited access to your PC, without your consent.

Also Zonealarm a popular free/paid firewall downloaded over 100million times. A popular firewall indeed from an Israeli company.

You dismissed "if you haven't done anything wrong then you have nothing to worry about" in the first paragraph. But in reality, if you haven't done nothing wrong then you have nothing to worry about. If you don't want people stalking your facebook or twitter profiles TAKE THEM DOWN, you know their traceable but yet you're complaining about it when you're not being forced to have one. To be completely honest I was walking by the YMCA next to my house a couple hours ago and the street lights outside of it have cameras all over them, I've never noticed and thought it was weird but hey I kinda like it, if anything goes down in my neighborhood that's illegal at least it's on camera. I don't do illegal activity so I have nothing to worry about.

reply to post by Intelligence101

You dismissed "if you haven't done anything wrong then you have nothing to worry about" in the first paragraph. But in reality, if you haven't done nothing wrong then you have nothing to worry about.

The right to privacy does not extend to criminal behavior. What this means is that criminals cannot claim a right to privacy if their criminality has been recorded in some way as proof. However, criminals do have a reasonable expectation of probable cause. If the state or federal government charges someone with a crime and is seeking conviction, they are obligated to show that their evidence was obtained through due process of law. More importantly, anyone who has nothing to worry about has the exact same right to due process of law. Placing cameras all over a city is not due process. The logical argument to placing cameras all over the city is that all people are suspect until proven otherwise. This is not due process of law.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


But I'm not a criminal so how does this effect me and why should I care about it? Why would I give two ***** about the legalities of criminal activities if I'm not a criminal, a judge, an attorney or a DA? It's irrelevant to me.

Originally posted by Intelligence101
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux

 

But I'm not a criminal so how does this effect me and why should I care about it? Why would I give two ***** about the legalities of criminal activities if I'm not a criminal, a judge, an attorney or a DA? It's irrelevant to me.

The moment you are unjustly charged with a "crime" and find it difficult to get any due process of law, you will care. You will care profoundly so, and chances are you will make your lamentations similar to many in this site who declare that "What happened to our rights? We just don't have rights any more".

Originally posted by Intelligence101
But I'm not a criminal so how does this effect me and why should I care about it? Why would I give two ***** about the legalities of criminal activities if I'm not a criminal, a judge, an attorney or a DA? It's irrelevant to me.

That's your problem. Your brain can't comprehend that you thinking that you're not a criminal doesn't mean that those who watch you believe the same. Just as you seem to ignore that a recent law was passed where they can put you away without trial for what you say online, or even think. Yes, you can be labeled a terrorist for what you think these days. Say like, not agreeing with Obama's policies, or anyother sitting President. Or maybe you don't believe in the War on Terra. Maybe you think Israel is a terrorist nation. I dunno, but I do know that you need to educate yourself about the facts.

Oh but hey, it's "irrelevant to you" right? Well my friend, either you're a payed yes man, or you just fell off of the stupid truck. People like you are never concerned until it's way too late. ~$heopleNation

Originally posted by SheopleNation
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux

 

If they can throw you inside a cell without a trial, which is exactly what that recent passed Law allows, then how the hell would you or anyone else know what you were charged with or where you have been taken? Seem's to me you have alot to think about before your next response. ~$heopleNation

It seems to me that you have a lot to think about and should have thought about it before even posting. There is case law all ready existing that counters your assertion that there is some kind of "law" that can lawfully do what you are claiming it can do. Consider the matter of Rumsfeld v. Padilla where Jose Padilla was held as an enemy combatant. This case may arguably be what the NDAA 2012 is attempting to harmonize with case law. Padilla was detained without any charges ever brought against him until this ruling which ultimately had the case sent back down to the U.S. District Court for the District of South Carolina who demanded the federal government either charge Padilla or release him.

However, following this the Fourth Circuit of Appeals ruled that President Bush did have the authority to hold an enemy combatant without charges. In the meantime there was the matter of Hamdi v. Rumsfeld, and while the SCOTUS did hold that the government did have the power to hold enemy combatants it also held that those held who are U.S. citizens must have the right to challenge their enemy combatant status before a judge (presumably an impartial one). Ultimately Jose Padilla was indicted and his indefinite detention became moot.

Citing case law takes work and effort. Had you done that work yourself instead of pretending your own paranoia is more than enough "proof" of non-existent rights, I wouldn't have had to do that work for you, but this is the way it goes with victims, even those who have not yet even become a victim. Ignorantia juris non excusat! Negare ignorantia!

Thanks for the continued interest, everyone.

A propos of or discussion, here's an item guaranteed to make outrage a number of women among us. The article below describes a creepy smartphone app called "girls around me." when a male user (read "stalker") runs the app, it opens his smartphone map and pinpoints the "hotties" who happen to be nearby at the moment in realtime. Anywhere. A map of the surroundings pops up with photos of girls nearby (photos culled from their facebook pages). Just think about this tool in the hands of a an aspiring rapist. He can select and pinpoint his victims in realtime.

Read it and shudder, women and men with daughters/sisters:

www.cultofmac.com...

Originally posted by silent thunder
Thanks for the continued interest, everyone.

A propos of or discussion, here's an item guaranteed to make outrage a number of women among us. The article below describes a creepy smartphone app called "girls around me." when a male user (read "stalker") runs the app, it opens his smartphone map and pinpoints the "hotties" who happen to be nearby at the moment in realtime. Anywhere. A map of the surroundings pops up with photos of girls nearby (photos culled from their facebook pages). Just think about this tool in the hands of a an aspiring rapist. He can select and pinpoint his victims in realtime.

Read it and shudder, women and men with daughters/sisters:

www.cultofmac.com...

edi t on 4/11/2012 by silent thunder because: (no reason given)

Let me just expand on this a little more because I think it is an important example of the way this kind of tech threatens people. As described in the article (for those who can't be bothered to read it) a user or this app can be walking around the street and suddenly turn it on. He spies an attractive girl on his smartphone map. The girl hasn't opeted into this service; she has no idea her photo and exact location is being pinpointed by a horny stranger. The man can then pull up her Facebook profile and perhaps see other photos of her. He can learn where she's from, where she went to school, what her interests are. Armed with all this info, he can then approach her on the street, pretending to be an old classmate from the same school, say. With knowledge of her interests he can then chat her up with the oldest of male seduction techniques - lies. If he charms her into an intimate encounter, it may not technically be rape, but it's sleazy as all get-out.

Now, I'm no feminist but even as a man, this is way, way over the line as far as I am concerned.


Any ATS women want to weigh in on this?

Originally posted by miniatus
The argument that if you've done nothing wrong you've got nothing to worry about is the worst argument for eroding our civil liberties I've heard.. it always disgusts me ..

Give an inch, they'll take an arm later.

reply to post by silent thunder

Here is a woman's take (pro) on that app.

The reaction to girls around me was far more disturbing than the creepy app itself

For one, how do we know that the women who could be found on this map did not want to be visible in this way? A recent Pew study found that women are the savvier sex when it comes to privacy settings, visiting them and ramping them up at much higher rates than men. Those Bostonians who popped up on Brownlee’s map may want to be publicly broadcasting where they are. There are, after all, dating apps, such as Blendr, that do offer exactly that to both men and women. Sometimes we can be found because we want to be found.

Originally posted by silent thunder

Let me just expand on this a little more because I think it is an important example of the way this kind of tech threatens people. As described in the article (for those who can't be bothered to read it) a user or this app can be walking around the street and suddenly turn it on. He spies an attractive girl on his smartphone map. The girl hasn't opeted into this service; she has no idea her photo and exact location is being pinpointed by a horny stranger. The man can then pull up her Facebook profile and perhaps see other photos of her. He can learn where she's from, where she went to school, what her interests are. Armed with all this info, he can then approach her on the street, pretending to be an old classmate from the same school, say. With knowledge of her interests he can then chat her up with the oldest of male seduction techniques - lies. If he charms her into an intimate encounter, it may not technically be rape, but it's sleazy as all get-out.

After reading your post, I really had to stop and think.

After careful consideration I've decided that while I think it's a great idea and I wish I had thought of it, I'm still not getting a smart phone or a Facebook account. It's just not worth it.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


It seems to me that in your haste to retort my response to you, you spent so much time attempting to create a masterpiece which epically failed, that you missed the fact that I was responding to Intelligence, and not you. Check my edit, and while you're at it, you might want to study the law that was just recently passed that allows the government to lock up anyone worldwide without a trial. Apparently, you seem to have missed that ball.

So, While you ponder that, just try to control your next condescending response so that you don't continue to make such a fool of yourself here at ATS. ~$heopleNation

reply to post by SheopleNation


If you look at my post you will see that I quoted your original post and not your edited one, which I suppose is why you are now castigating me for being to hasty in reply. I am not aware of any etiquette that requires I wait a certain amount of time to reply to a post that is quite obviously made to me. Further, while you now argue - apparently - that even your original post was made to Intelligence and not to me, you cannot help but undermine that claim by then insisting I check out and "study the law" you cannot even be bothered to name. Presumably you are speaking to the NDAA 2012 but if you cannot even bother to name the legislation you expect someone else to "study", why should anyone believe you really know anything at all about this nameless "law" you are bandying about?

reply to post by silent thunder



I did not have Facebook until recently when I got an account to link it to a blog I started. While I have no pictures of myself on Facebook, who is to say they wont create an application that will make me a target because I am Muslim, or because of my political views?

maybe not today... but if they are GPS locating you on your cell phone (which Facebook asks for) and selling your physical location complete with pic... then it is not far fetched to say that soon they will create one and sell based on your views or religion

this is frightening, in my honest opinion. very frightening. I have already deleted my Facebook account because of this I am planning on informing my friends at Uni also so they too can simply delete Facebook.

This is too far, we did not sign up for Facebook to have our pictures and the GPS location of our cell phone sold.

reply to post by silent thunder


About ten years ago the NSA began contacting psychologists who had been employed by the us gvt in some capacity. March of 2000 is when a couple of us heard about it. It was a $96,000 a yr part time job. Doing what you ask? Creating psychological profiles based purely on internet usage. The pilot program started with families that were us military. Public information and reasonable private info. You determine who uses at what time and what their habits were. Bill clintons Carnivore program scanned emails for keywords. Then you track the users posts and what websites they visited and email content. Even back then you could create a profile that was about 95% accurate. Carnivore made it too easy.

Fast forward to today. Smartphones and geotagging always on. Consolidation of almost all usage to google or apple. Internet, phone, text and locations all consolidated in real time. Could you imagine the profiles now? Cake.

Email, text, search, gps, shopping all available instantly and real time with no fuss and no muss from google and apple, blackberry not so much but available. Why do you think google accts are mandatory on droid? Why are google and apple allowed to have a semimonopoly? Consolidate intel gathering. On your cell, tablets and any verizon broadband on laptops every bit of data is compromised. Secure search engines, proxys are all irrlevant on mobile devices. Cloned phones are irrelevant if you keep them on. Same with anlny prepaid that geotags. Remote access and takeover are easy. Duckblinds are easier.

Cells without heavy mods and viable alt id setups and careful habits regarding when to take the battery out are just like giving them all your info. And wait until google wallet gets popular. Proxys and secure search engines which are not secure dont help if you are flagged. And i would guess and this is far from a fact that you have about 30 million americans flagged and about 5 million under heavy monitoring.

Safety tips. Avoid smart phones and tablets. Find a nice bootleg app that shows processes constantly. Realize if it isnt being monitored real time that your data gets stored post mortem. In front of your camera mask appearance. Batteries out on normal travel routes or in places you frequent and anywhere you have crimecams and such. Never share location and again there are certain things you can do to bounce your location and its easy to confirm on google earth or maps. Dont use anything on your phone or tab for driving directions and dont synch devices. Just a few tips. Be paranoid. Or not. Just helpful hints. And dont ever think your identity is safe it isnt. Carnivore is obsolete now. They can identify you off writing stile. Everything you type post or send on the net is easily readable no matter how secure u dream you are. Antiestablishment tweets conspiracy sites browsing survival sites gun trader etc... they are looking. And now its the AI profiling you.

Sleep tight.

the good thing about being survieled by the control grid in an ugly culture, is that finally you are out of the closet, have nothing to lose, and can fight against the elitist hoebags toward a beautiful culture without fear of being discovered, since you are already known..

thank goodness for survelience. its like a gay guy being forced outta the closet. now its time to dance. beautiful culture here we come, war pigs will fall before our warrior's swords.

heh.