Zimmerman's attorneys: 'We've lost contact with Zimmerman'

Originally posted by nightstalker78

Every one of your points are laughable because the evidence suggests otherwise.There was a fight.Witnesses have stated they SAW Trayvon on top of Zimmerman.As for your fourth point.Look at the enchanced video.You can clearly see him bleeding on the back of his head.And as for your fifth point,again,as I've already stated,you can get into a fight and not have any marks.And I've read nowhere where zimmerman has claimed it was a "violent struggle"

There are many reasons to disbelieve some of the eyewitness evidence in this case. Some witnesses also put GZ on top of Trayvon, which is a much more viable report.

As to the physical evidence, common sense will tell you that if Trayvon was on top of GZ and was shot at close range, there would be blood all over the place. GZ's clothing would have to bear some evidence of this happening, but it didn't.

The video does NOT show GZ bleeding, but a mark near the crown of his head. It was probably there previous to that night, because if someone is bashing your head on the concrete, the injury will not be to the top if the head, but to the lower part, closer to the neck.

The evidence clearly supports the scenario that no fight occurred. And I'll keep reiterating that the LEAD DETECTIVE DID NOT BELIEVE GZ's STORY AND WAS GOING TO ARREST AND CHARGE HIM!!

As to your point about the struggle possibly not being "violent", that's just ignorant. If it wasn't that way, what would justify his killing of an unarmed person?

Originally posted by nightstalker78
I've already stated,you can get into a fight and not have any marks.And I've read nowhere where zimmerman has claimed it was a "violent struggle"

Sounds good to me.
How many years do you feel he deserves then?

See, you just killed his entire defense.

Originally posted by shepseskaf
Why don't you use the Internet and do your own research?

I have and from what I have seen in conjunction with how their law works, I am leaning towards Zimmermans actions being justified. However, as I have stated many many many times before this case, should it go to trial, is to be argued and decided in the court of law and not the court of public opinion.

Secondly, and I have stated this before as well, is we dont have all of the facts. There is information / evidence that will not be released to the public if its integral to the case. As we have seen we have media outlets doing creative editing along with people repeating or stating something as fact when its anything but.

Until the prosecutor decides to charge or not, is when we will get the info.

Originally posted by shepseskaf
Also, note that the LEAD detective on the case DID NOT BELIEVE GZ's story after interviewing him, and was going to arrest and charge him with manslaughter, at least.

Again Law Enforcement in the United States does not charge anyone. If we make an arrest, regardless of infraction / misdemeanor or felony, our reports go to the PA's office who reviews the reports / info / evidence. The PA is the i[]final authority on whether charges are filed or not. Law Enforcement can make all the suggestions they want but in the end they do not charge people.

Originally posted by shepseskaf
This fact is conveniently ignored by GZ's deluded defenders. The killer would have been charged that very night by the recommendation of the lead detective, if it hadn't been vetoed by the political hack who ran the State Attorney's Office.

Please learn how the judicial system works, specifically the roles of the Police (part of the executive branch) and the Prosecuting Attorney's office (part of the judiciary).

The entire Sanford police department could take a vote with a unanimous conclusion to submit PC against Zimmerman and it still will not matter. The discretion to charge and prosecute and individual belongs solely to the PA's office.

Again, court of law and not public opinion.

Originally posted by LErickson

Originally posted by nightstalker78
I've already stated,you can get into a fight and not have any marks.And I've read nowhere where zimmerman has claimed it was a "violent struggle"

Sounds good to me.
How many years do you feel he deserves then?

See, you just killed his entire defense.

You're good at taking quotes out of context.Keep it up

Originally posted by nightstalker78
Every one of your points are laughable because the evidence suggests otherwise.There was a fight.Witnesses have stated they SAW Trayvon on top of Zimmerman.As for your fourth point.Look at the enchanced video.You can clearly see him bleeding on the back of his head.And as for your fifth point,again,as I've already stated,you can get into a fight and not have any marks.And I've read nowhere where zimmerman has claimed it was a "violent struggle"

You just killed Zimmerman's defense.
I am not sure what you thought saving people the trouble of going back a page was going to do to help your argument but here you go.

You just killed Zimmerman's defense.

Happy?

ATS has rules about quoting things excessively and on an internet forum, my reply does not erase your original post.

reply to post by LErickson


Uh yeah sure.They should also have rules about posting the samething but worded slightly differently.Like you just did

Here we go again. It's painful to see how much back and forth there is on this case when the situation seems painfully obvious to me-- Zimmerman killed a teenager and rather than address his highly questionable story, the police simply let him off the hook. As shepseskaf stated, the lead investigator didn't even believe the story but had to follow orders from above (maybe Zimmerman's father being a retired Supreme Court Magistrate Judge and mother being a court clerk helped him?). I'm not sure how members of ATS can speculate on all sorts of systematic corruption throughout our government and financial leaders, yet corruption on a much smaller level that is far more immediately tangible is quickly dismissed. The very fact that we can go back and forth about this all day and night proves the necessity for the further investigation that they weren't bothered to deal with. They didn't even test Zimmerman for alcohol, which is standard for this kind of thing-- oh, they tested Trayvon's corpse, but Zimmerman was okay. Now we'll never know. It's the same story that's happened many times before-- Oscar Grant in Oakland to name one-- however one major reason this case went national is because Trayvon's parents and others took it upon themselves to raise awareness about it (if the MSM has an agenda in mind that's another story, but I digress). If they didn't do that, this would've just been another name on that list.

In my opinion, however, people are completely ridiculous to be smearing the dead boy and saying nasty things like he deserved to be shot-- not that this viewpoint is prominent on ATS, but it is certainly a popular sentiment online and in some cases here that sentiment is implied. Here are some points I want to make:

1. The MSM was, is, and always will be exaggerating and twisting stories possibly for an agenda, but most likely simply to get more viewers and higher ratings. To cite this as a reason Zimmerman is innocent, however, is essentially a straw man.

2. Trayvon may have been older and taller than the picture the MSM uses, but really now, he does he look THAT different? He's obviously older, but people act like he grew to become incredibly hardbodied and muscular. Even if he grew a few inches, he was still 140 lbs and his nickname was "Slim." His face barely looks any different. Gold teeth does not give you superior fighting ability.

3. Who the hell cares if there were traces of marijuana in Trayvon's backpack. How many people smoke weed? How many brilliant thinkers, scientists, political leaders, artists and educators smoke? Just yesterday wasn't everyone trying to legalize it? I'm not trying condone the behavior here, but I don't hardly think this makes Trayvon a "drug dealing thug," and more importantly, this has nothing to do with what went down that night. Not to make this a racial thing, but would people have said the same if he were white and caught with weed?

4. A random tweet might raise questions about Trayvon's history of violence, but his teachers all said he never had any issues. I'll leave that one in the air, although I doubt it and wish his bus driver would just speak out about it already. Zimmerman, on the other hand, has a clear cut documented history of violence, including assaulting a police officer and domestic violence. Given we know nothing about who started what when they finally bucked heads, which evidence is more convincing?

5. A lot of nasty crimes happen all over the country that don't make national news, and while it is incredibly sad, you can bet the majority of these cases will properly use the systems in place to look for the alleged criminals and investigate ALL of the evidence rather than jump to conclusions based on word.

6. Again, I don't want to make this a racial thing, because it's primarily about justice regardless of whether they were purple or orange, but I seriously wonder how the bitter debates back and forth would have played out if we weren't even given their races. If people heard the same exact story, except their names were Joe and Bob, and it was up to everyone's imagination to see what colors they actually were, how would people's opinions have changed? I can't help but imagine that it would have been a similar thing like the response to the Hunger Games movie once people found out the main "loveable" characters were black (google "racist hunger games" if you don't know what I'm talking about).

Originally posted by Xcathdra
Please learn how the judicial system works, specifically the roles of the Police (part of the executive branch) and the Prosecuting Attorney's office (part of the judiciary).

The entire Sanford police department could take a vote with a unanimous conclusion to submit PC against Zimmerman and it still will not matter. The discretion to charge and prosecute and individual belongs solely to the PA's office.

I understand quite well how the judicial system works. The State Attorney's office is responsible for charging a suspect, but a smart, ethical prosecutor will place great weight on the evidence presented to him by the LEAD detective on the case.

After all the LEAD detective is the one who has questioned the suspect, and examined the scene of the crime to determine the veracity of the suspect's version of the events. He, or she, will then present their findings to the prosecutor.

In this case, Chris Serino, the lead detective was so emphatic in his disbelief of GZ's story that he reportedly filed an affidavit stating his reasons for desiring to charge the killer, and his disagreement with the decision not to do so.

All of this will come out in time, as will the autopsy report. If GZ is not charged, as I suspect he will not be, it will be as a result of a blatantly biased, political calculation; not based on the evidence presented.

Again, and I'll keep repeating, the lead detective who interviewed GZ after the killing, did not believe him. That should really tell you all that is needed to know about this case.

As corrupt as the Sanford Police Dept. has proven itself to be over the years, one of the leading figures clearly wanted to do the right thing. If his recommendation had been followed, none of this circus would have ensured.

reply to post by JayFlores


Since there is a pending murder investigation Zimmerman cannot leave Florida per law, so this is a bit alarming if he left the state.

reply to post by DavidWillts


Can't leave the state because he is involved in a pending homicide investigation, it's the law. So technically this does hold some wait especially if he left the state. So put one point on the side of the liberals I guess since he already is confined to the state!

Also for all the Zimmerman supporters here a link to the article about his lawyers LEAVING his case because he's gone MIA. So if the lawyers are stepping down how long till he's behind bars.

www.clickorlando.com...

Originally posted by bknapple32
Very Very weird. Dont know what to make of this. Any thoughts?

He's having a stress disorder related to the fact that he has had a massive upheavel in his life during a very emotional time. His very life is in danger ... a 'wanted dead or alive' has been issued by The Black Panthers. He's getting virtually no help from the police to protect himself. He is in the news constantly with negative press. (and if he's innocent that has to be extremely frustrating). He wants it over and his life back .. and it won't ever be back to normal.

He's going through the five stages of grief for his life that is gone.
He's dealing with massive stress.
He's dealing with the very real threat that someone will murder him.

Considering everything ... any sane or normal person could easily snap from reality.
Considering everything ... any sane or normal person would consider 'going underground'.

Originally posted by NoJoker13
reply to post by JayFlores

 

Since there is a pending murder investigation Zimmerman cannot leave Florida per law, so this is a bit alarming if he left the state.

Can you link the law that prevents a person who is not charged with a crime from leaving the state. Ive dug around in Florida statutes and im not finding it.

reply to post by Southern Guardian

Yes the media has had a field day with this incident, but it still doesn't change the fact that the police department attempted to sweep this incident under the rug by merely taking Zimmerman at his words.

Except that according to a Miami Herald article the PA said the police had filed the paper work for him to investigate it as a manslaughter charge. The Public Attorney was in the process of gathering evidence and putting together a grand jury. Yet the media originally came out and said Zimmerman had never been taken downtown for questioning and the matter had been dropped.

Zimmerman was checked by EMTs and determined fit to be taken in to custody. He was then taken down town and questioned. The police investigated and passed it on to the Public Attorney. The system was working the way it is designed to work in Florida. Yet the process was derailed and forced to start over with a special investigator. Now the investigator is working under severe time limits and political pressure the original prosecutor wasn't. So, now the chances of getting the full story are even slimmer.

The large media outlets have lied, manipulated audio recordings, and selectively presented photos to further their narrative. It has been shown time and again. An NBC producer was fired for editing the 9-1-1 tape to take the "he looks black" quote out of context. Yet, it had been presented that exact same way since day one.

I don't know the whole story. I do know that since it hit the MSM everything has been distorted and manipulated. They have been caught in out right lies and called on it. Yet people keep parroting what they hear.

At first I thought it was an open and shut case. Now I really wish everybody would have staid out of it so that the Public Attorney could have concluded his inquest and gotten to a much less questionable conclusion. At this point we will never know what happened and regardless of his intent that night Zimmerman will never be able to live a normal life again.

He's having a stress disorder related to the fact that he has had a massive upheavel in his life during a very emotional time. His very life is in danger ... a 'wanted dead or alive' has been issued by The Black Panthers. He's getting virtually no help from the police to protect himself. He is in the news constantly with negative press. (and if he's innocent that has to be extremely frustrating). He wants it over and his life back .. and it won't ever be back to normal.

He's going through the five stages of grief for his life that is gone.
He's dealing with massive stress.
He's dealing with the very real threat that someone will murder him.

Considering everything ... any sane or normal person could easily snap from reality.

Oh, poooor, poooor George. General rule: if you don't want to experience a life "upheaval" then don't kill an innocent person in cold blood.

How much of an "upheaval" has there been to Trayvon's life? Oh well, he can't tell you because he's dead.

Had GZ made the rational decision not to pursue Trayvon, which he had no right to do in the first place, then his life would have been just the same as it had been before. However, with his unstable personal history and love for guns, something bad would have happened sooner or later.

Originally posted by shepseskaf
Oh, poooor, poooor George. General rule: if you don't want to experience a life "upheaval" then don't kill an innocent person in cold blood. How much of an "upheaval" has there been to Trayvon's life? Oh well, he can't tell you because he's dead.

:shk: OY read and learn .. young grasshopper ...
ATS Thread - A lesson in jumping to conclusions

Not talking to your lawyers is a pretty damning sign...but yeah, innocent till proven guilty. This entire case stinks though, so I wouldn't be surprised if he came out with a confession eventually.

"Against their advice, the attorneys said Zimmerman contacted special prosecutor Angela Corey, who will decide if he should face charges, but prosecutors in her office refused to talk to him without his lawyers present."

It seems like Zim has not learned his lesson. He will not take smart advice from 911 operators or his attorneys.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
:shk: OY read and learn .. young grasshopper ...
ATS Thread - A lesson in jumping to conclusions

Read and learn what? Excuses and lies from a thread full of GZ apologists like you? I'll pass.

It isn't "jumping to conclusions" to posit that an innocent young man is dead because GZ refused to obey directions from the police.

It isn't "jumping to conclusions" to state that its completely against the neighborhood watch rules to physically confront anyone, especially when the situation clearly involved no initial risk to one's personal safety or property.

It isn't "jumping to conclusions" to note that neighborhood watch volunteers should NEVER be armed.

Therefore, it isn't "jumping to conclusions" to say that if GZ had followed the rules and done what he was supposed to, Trayvon would be alive, and the would-be killer's life would not now be unraveling.

Let's stay on focus.

Everyone is talking about the "MSM is making him out like this" and "we don't know that", "everyone wants to be the juge" wah wah wahh..

Hello ..he CONTACTED the MSM to "say his piece"- Hannity , within those "2 business days" that he just merely out of contact with his lawyers he posted his OWN site as with a pay pal donation button as to "cut out the middle man" for his supporters and fans ...

the cherry on top is the picture of a graffiti tag on a black youth center as to show the public that "people really DO love him"

HA!


HELLO people. The guy is insane , stop trying to sugar coat this thing.