Is It Ok To Smudge The Truth A Little In Order To Help Awaken Others?

I can imagine some of you people must be real fun....

For example "Sorry, I know it's your birthday and that you'd rather not know, but a lot of people will jump out from behind chairs, etc and shout "Surprise!" when we arrive at your house. Sorry, but you had to know."

Ok, that example sucked, hopefully you realise what I mean slightly though.

If you know whats going on why do you feel you need to "smudge the truth!". Things are bad enough as it is!

Look at all the psychosis that old wives tale of *it will grow hair on your palms* got us.

Honestly...some half truths are beneficial Some are compassionate. Some are all we have to offer due to lack of knowledge.

It's when we knowingly are untruthful, to hurt another person, that is where we fail...

Des

After reading the responses here I think I'm pretty much the same actually, I just wouldn't hesitate to smudge if it was a last resort and thought it'd help.

Originally posted by Destinyone
Honestly...some half truths are beneficial Some are compassionate. Some are all we have to offer due to lack of knowledge.

It's when we knowingly are untruthful, to hurt another person, that is where we fail...

Des

I think you've basically summed up what I was trying to put across a lot easier than I managed to.

reply to post by NoRegretsEver


If your ruse can be revealed, then don't play it. One discovered lie will kill off every truth you try to give them from that point on. If something really is a detriment, then the facts should be good enough. If not, then the person in question isn't going to be scared out of doing whatever it is that they're doing anyway.

When a person starts the brutal transition from childhood to adulthood, they grab onto a human cultural archetype, and that archetype (be in from his/her own family, neighborhood/friends, an institution/like school or church, or a media/movie/music celebrity) is key to what that kid will try to make of himself or herself - basically their own version of that archetype. Their friends will be chosen by how well they fit into the sort of narrative that would natural feature that specific archetype, and of course, you'll be able to easily recognize the archetype by how the kid dresses and presents himself/herself when away from home and in public.

This archetype will control how they care for or disregard their health, and how they choose their paths through life. It generally shifts after the person has gotten saddled down with marriage and kids and debts and all that, but it never really goes away. If you want to affect someone's smaller choices, get to know the archetype they've chosen to emulate, and figure out how to make that archetype do the heavy lifting for you.

As long as the archetype isn't Sid Vicious, and you're trying to get the person to stop smoking, then you might be really surprised at how well this can work. It definitely works on teenagers. Teens still view their archetypes in cartoon detail (very little nuance) so the manipulations are much easier to manage.

Never lie about it though. That'll always bite you right on your *ss eventually.

Originally posted by NoRegretsEver
Ok so as the question states is it ok to smudge the truth a little to get those that believe nothing is going on in order for them to pay attention. I of course dont mean the attention from everyone but maybe family and some people that you may concerned with.

For example, something so simple as the old saying that if you swallow gum it takes X amount of years to leave your system, how this got famous I dont know but it worked. Lets say you know someone that is hurting themselves with chemicals, or additives, etc,. and you know that in the long run this is going to do harm, so you tell them that this may in fact cause them harm along the way, and they dismiss it.


Do you A, bring it up nonchalantly and say here are the medical implications of the long term damage, here is a video about what it can do, and here is the research, which most likely they will ignore...

Or B, you tell them that this will cause something way more drastic then it will actually do, but may stop them from doing it? And just go right for the scare tactic that people seem to be so fond of, like if you do XYZ, you will glow like a lantern and it will cause Nibiru to seek out those that are glowing and destroy you in a wave of utter destruction!!

Yes of course that was a exaggeration, but you get the picture.

Peace, NRE.

I am not sure I would recognise the thruth even if it bit me in the backside. . Jokes aside I try to be thruthful even if I does not work the way I intended. But since thruth is so hard to pin down I am probably lying my ass of without realising it. I also have moments where I make up excuses sometimes for something that is not important at all and you get the thought "Why did I say that". It is not conscious so my unconscious seem to be a liar sometimes.

It is up to you how you wanna be towards others. We are all manipulating/teaching each other and if I was manipulated to evolve extreamly fast would I care that someone had lied to me. Probably not. The problem is that I would probably examine the manipulation to much if I noticed it. Or am I being manipulated now? What are you not telling me?

reply to post by NorEaster


That really makes sense too.

So also at least in relation to that you basically smudge the truth (smudging doesn't have to mean lying, it can basically mean obscuring.) according to how well you think a person can handle said truth. That totally gets me too and is probably why I had a conflict with myself a bit earlier in the thread.

I say NO but the popularity of tabloid journalism, including much found on ATS, speaks volumes. Makes me wonder what percentage of people have ever studied simple logic. My guess is well under 1 percent.

If the truth is 'boring' they have no choice to 'smudge' it and much worse as FEAR is mankind's biggest motivator. If some people are so stupid and out of touch so be it, ignorance is bliss and the world may be better off without them.

Originally posted by oghamxx
If some people are so stupid and out of touch so be it, ignorance is bliss and the world may be better off without them.

I guess at that point I'd try some smudging if I could help, to see if that worked instead.

In my experience, lying or even tweaking the facts a little always backfires. You shouldn't try to put fear in anyone's head, that is just wrong. You can encourage health and positive addictions though, i've been influencing people to do the things that make me happy just simply by making it look fun!

Always truth. I have learned in my old age that my truth may not be others truth, so let them be. If they open a door for your opinion, enter it and speak only your truth.

there us a certain quality inherent in being a "TRUTHER"
TRUTHINESS...
umm:
The not telling of which makes one an OSer


BTW...
According to US Law
assisting in the cover up of a murder(s) makes one an accessory after the fact
you OSers
you know who you are.

"Is It Ok To Smudge The Truth A Little In Order To Help Awaken Others?" Nope. Do NOT underestimate the stupid monkeys, err, humans. Sooner or later they will figure out the illusions of your "playbook".

If your 'smudge' is noted, then your credibility has just bit the dust. They won't believe you on any subject ever again.

reply to post by NoRegretsEver


It's better to tell the truth. But, tell the truth using your own personal experiences as your reason for being concerned.

"Look, I know you like to swallow your gum, but when I was little I got caught chewing gum in class. When the teacher asked me what I had in my mouth, I swallowed it and said I had nothing. She knew I was lying and I got sent to the principal's office. To top it off, I had a stomachache the rest of the day and when I got home, my mom sent me to my room with no dinner. I'll never swallow gum again. Anyway, if you keep swallowing gum, you might end up with a stomachache."

Realistically, you can't make anyone do anything. All you can do is give information. People have to make their own decisions.

And, sometimes, you just have to stand by while people make their own mistakes despite your warnings.

I'm still waiting for proof that such a thing as truth exists, however I wouldn't advise you to knowingly offer up a picture you think is real by changing it. You can't change the truth and the truth, as always, will out. Why would you want to be on the wrong side of the fence?

The ends don't justify the means. The ends are the means.

There is nothing more important than the truth. Nothing. Not a person's acceptance of it, not whether it will make someone comfortable, not whether it will or won't result in personal growth, or whether it will or won't make you popular.

People on this forum can mine my posting history and call me a hypocrite as much as they want; but one thing they should also notice, is that I have never, and will never, even considered attempting to dishonestly deny anything that I have written. I have had similar problems elsewhere as well, even when I did not have a publically accessible record to the same degree that I do here. That is because, if I do not hold myself to any other kind of standard, I am an utter slave to transparency.

Never lie to anyone, about anything. No matter what it costs you. There is nothing morally worse than a lie.

u dont realize the truth while u cant but step above it in order to mean smthg for urself or any about urself

the fact which is true is that truth is always above all, that is why there cant b one, while it is always the truth


so there cant b smudging truth fact, when the most true is what stand as relative as it can knowing that truth is tomorrow and never now

truth is absolute superiority, it is the one that is never one, it is truly the constancy free value, what says constancy is meaning futur being the fact

that is why now is always the evil which exist, the target to abolish since now is opposite to truth

what i say is obviously true, since it explains how evil exist while truth is the only fact

evil is now existence the more it is taken seriously as being the always the more it is forcing the concept of truth being wrong fact

it is also proven of any simplest mind tool,

positively, when truth is freedom then truth is what u will do always and not what u r doing, freedom is the instant before doing and after

negatively, believing urself is claiming u now being the whole truth, then it is absolute opposition assertion to objective now from absolute opposition to everyone else now existence too that u cant never really recognize

now is what u r doing n wat u mean to do and what witness it so the objective, now is one
so any alone totally

u cant mean now as the truth and admit others realities at the same time
that is why surely time is about one past realisation alone about him being the objective fact

while if one is the objective fact then everyone is never of one fact but of another truth that objective one is inherently opposed to

that is how surely too one is always relative so it cant b objective

if one is not the truth then everyone is of the truth, that is why objective plurality is the fact

so now is maximum objectives pluralities resolved in maximum objective freedom value, which is true only in meaning not existing really knowing being relative to truth fact being tomorrow after constancy of now, from a new fresh freedom sense that now would b totally proving the relativity of now being always only one never objective nor real

objective truth is freedom that is why objective is plural, many freedom makes a reality free objective

to get back to the op i would say,

wether meaning being relative or meaning being nothing to truth, both cant b through negative terms

when truth is the better of the best now, being nothing is zero abstraction so never negative and being relative is best of now so relative absolute positive one freedom

so wat use facts to mean smthg are liars

one could be negative right but then clearly one alone meaning smthg from exclusively itself

reply to post by NoRegretsEver


More like baby talk NRE.

You know how when your a child they tell you all a whole bunch of things to keep you from doing something stupid. Like the one you mentioned about swallowing gum.

Really i think this depends on what your lying or stretching the truth about, if its something silly like trying to keep your kid from eating to much cookies or unhealthy junk food, then it's like a whatever moment. If it's something important, then it becomes something else entirely and lying and beating around the bush will not work or be all that helpful in the long run.

I would say if this person is a grown up, then tell him the facts and let him do with them as he will like a grown up, baby talk and exaggerations is for baby's and small children. And by now if he is grown and fully into his patterns it will take a lot more then scaring him with half facts and half truths for him to turn his life around.

Old habits are hard to break NRE. All depends on the situation and person I would say.

reply to post by galadofwarthethird


it is incredible how u love to say nothing just to ensure all what is still as it is perfect for u

how can children concept being related to truth smudge ?

by definition a child is a relative one that has nothing to do with absolute facts nor truth

conscious is exclusively about grown up rotten asses, bored to mean nothing after everything they did got to b forced to sit as conscious a bit