Pell says Adam and Eve didn't exist

Originally posted by AQuestion
At a minimum, science currently believes there was an Eve.

Erh, no.

Originally posted by Thain Esh Kelch

Originally posted by AQuestion
At a minimum, science currently believes there was an Eve.

Erh, no.

Er, yeah

Mitochondrial Eve

According to geneticists, everyone on the planet today came from one woman. They say that there may have been other women around; but, perhaps none of their offspring continued procreating. In other words they only have proof that one woman is responsible for all people alive today. This isn't new and has been known for decades.

Originally posted by AQuestion

Originally posted by Thain Esh Kelch

Originally posted by AQuestion
At a minimum, science currently believes there was an Eve.

Erh, no.

Er, yeah

Mitochondrial Eve

According to geneticists, everyone on the planet today came from one woman. They say that there may have been other women around; but, perhaps none of their offspring continued procreating. In other words they only have proof that one woman is responsible for all people alive today. This isn't new and has been known for decades.

Mitochondrial eve does not mean biblical eve.

reply to post by Garfee


Dear Garfee,

I didn't say it did. I find it more amusing that people would bother trying to say that it is not the biblical Eve. What scientific proof do you have of that? The only proof you have is that from one woman all others came. Is that not at least worthy of consideration when the thread began with a Cardinal who didn't believe it? Now what if geneticists could also prove that all people came from only one man? Would you also find that not interesting or worthy of discussion on this thread?

reply to post by AQuestion


I would think it worthy of it's own thread so it might be discussed with less consideration of the fabled biblical eve.

Originally posted by Garfee
reply to post by AQuestion

 

I would think it worthy of it's own thread so it might be discussed with less consideration of the fabled biblical eve.

Dear Garfee.

But that was the issue that was raised on this thread and an answer belongs on this thread. The question the Cardinal was addressing was whether or not the story of Adam and Eve was a myth. The Cardinal said it was; but, if geneticists prove that all humanity started from one man and one woman then the story is not a myth even if the telling is imperfect (and I am not saying that it is or isn't). The only evidence we have says that the story is at least half correct.

reply to post by AQuestion


Although it does go in here, I also suggest a new thread, it'll get more viewers. Lot's more.

Link it back here though.

Originally posted by AQuestion

Originally posted by Garfee
reply to post by AQuestion

 

I would think it worthy of it's own thread so it might be discussed with less consideration of the fabled biblical eve.

Dear Garfee.

But that was the issue that was raised on this thread and an answer belongs on this thread. The question the Cardinal was addressing was whether or not the story of Adam and Eve was a myth. The Cardinal said it was; but, if geneticists prove that all humanity started from one man and one woman then the story is not a myth even if the telling is imperfect (and I am not saying that it is or isn't). The only evidence we have says that the story is at least half correct.

If they ever prove that as a fact, they will also likely prove that we are all related to others who were around even before mitochondrial eve.

A dog breeder can prove lineage all the way back to their first pair but that by no means proves the pair were the first puppy dogs to ever exist.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Dear NOTurTypical,

It might get more views; but, it does not really matter. Notice how they did not even respond to my simple questions. If it could be proven that all humans on earth came from one man and one woman then would the story of Adam and Eve be correct at least in theory? They do not answer it because they do not like the answer. They are more afraid of the answer than the question. They ignore what does not support their wishes because they don't like the truth, they prefer justification. They attempt to separate Christians from science and ignore the science that does not give them the answer they like. They point to false prophets like Harold Camping and compare us to them; but, refuse to be compared to atheists like Mao or Stalin. Current Quantum Physics says there are alternate universes, I ask if Heaven and Hell could be those alternates and they do not answer and then backtrack on there being alternate universes. I respect you; but, I will respond to those who ask as long as I am on topic. Peace brother.

reply to post by Garfee


That's brilliant, then no fossils count as evidence of anything then except that something died. You can't tell if a fossilized animal had offspring.

Originally posted by Garfee

Originally posted by AQuestion

Originally posted by Garfee
reply to post by AQuestion

 

I would think it worthy of it's own thread so it might be discussed with less consideration of the fabled biblical eve.

Dear Garfee.

But that was the issue that was raised on this thread and an answer belongs on this thread. The question the Cardinal was addressing was whether or not the story of Adam and Eve was a myth. The Cardinal said it was; but, if geneticists prove that all humanity started from one man and one woman then the story is not a myth even if the telling is imperfect (and I am not saying that it is or isn't). The only evidence we have says that the story is at least half correct.

If they ever prove that as a fact, they will also likely prove that we are all related to others who were around even before mitochondrial eve.

A dog breeder can prove lineage all the way back to their first pair but that by no means proves the pair were the first puppy dogs to ever exist.

Dear Garfee,

There is no science in place to back up what you just said. There is no proof any woman pre-existed or existed along with mitochondrial Eve. I guess you are just taking it on faith. Your proof would be nice or shall we ignore science? The only evidence we have is that all women came from one woman. If you have some other scientific evidence, please tell us so that we can evaluate it. Perhaps alien storks created us; but, I don't buy that. Perhaps rocks became sentient; but, I don't buy it. Perhaps only you exist; but, I don't buy it. Perhaps only I exist; but, I don't buy it. Perhaps you can answer my question, if it were scientifically proven that all humans came from one man and one woman, would it make you even consider the possibility that the bible might have had some truth in regards to our beginnings? If not, why should I care what some Cardinal said?

reply to post by AQuestion


Well then, it must have been god!

Originally posted by Garfee
reply to post by AQuestion

 

Well then, it must have been god!

Dear Garfee,

Not what I said and not what I asked. What if you actually tried to answer what I did ask. We should be able to ask and answer these questions without emotion or just putting words in other people's mouths. We should be able to ask questions about whether or not we matter. We should wonder how we got here and not just simply try and prove any reason. You seek to prove that we are a fluke, an accident. What if we were not, what if we were an intent? Can we at least consider that as an option?

reply to post by AQuestion


You are putting as many 'words into my mouth', I think.

I believe that while we should discuss the subject, to think that we will ever really know by our own means is not only a wasteful folly, but will always be based upon agenda and bias.

Edit: Each thing is the most insignificant and the most thing significant thing ever created. It doesn't matter how things were created - only that they were.

Originally posted by Garfee
reply to post by AQuestion

 

You are putting as many 'words into my mouth', I think.

I believe that while we should discuss the subject, to think that we will ever really know by our own means is not only a wasteful folly, but will always be based upon agenda and bias.

Dear Garfee,

Someone once said that the unexamined life is not worth living. Your answer as to what is worth our time denies science. I do not call science folly or wasteful, not even when it provides evidence to things that I do not agree with. You do not accept science and you do not accept religion, what do you believe?

reply to post by AQuestion


I believe what I feel and experience - anything more is hope that what I've read or been told is real and true.

Originally posted by Garfee
reply to post by AQuestion

 

I believe what I feel and experience - anything more is hope that what I've read or been told is real and true.

Dear Garfee,

And what you feel and experience is outside of you, it implies that there is more than you. That is the essence of philosophy. Descarte said, "I think for, therefore I am". If I imagine all of this, then I must ask why I imagine such a thing.

reply to post by AQuestion


Yes, but I am not so arrogant to assume I will ever know the origin of the universe or the beginnings of humanity.

Greater men than myself probably spent their lives as crazy hermits trying to figure it out. I'd rather ponder the issue a little but spend my life embraced by the love of my family and friends, enjoying nature and every other wonder available to me.

Originally posted by Garfee

Yes, but I am not so arrogant to assume I will ever know the origin of the universe or the beginnings of humanity.

Greater men than myself probably spent their lives as crazy hermits trying to figure it out. I'd rather ponder the issue a little but spend my life embraced by the love of my family and friends, enjoying nature and every other wonder available to me.

Interesting that you spend a lot of effort trying to spread your biased ignorant opinion about it,on a subject you believe to be all myth and that anybody who believes in God or Jesus is stupid delusional and ignorant.Instead of spending your life embraced by the love of your family and friends, enjoying nature and every other wonder available to you.

Yet when Aquestion posts a link to life starting from one woman backed by science,you can`t even bring yourself to answer a straight question.I guess thats because you have invested so much time and effort in quick one liners of mocking and insults toward anyone who believes in God.

You jumped into this thread (as you do so often) even defending the cardinal as though he is anyone of authority only because it suited your biased opinion(which is sad and laughable)..

This guy is a cardinal - aside from the pop he is as official as it gets.

You think people that believe in God are a/the problem,yet even Christians will say other Christians can be a problem or wrong...

It's not people that don't believe in god that are the problem, buddy.

You must then believe athiests are a special race above all others who do no wrong,would be fair to say.

Perhaps the people that wrote it knew that we would eventually get sick of being stupid and ignorant.

Yep anyone who walks away has seen the light out of stupidity and ignorance.


Your also an authority in your own right of what a Christian is (and a cardinal is an authority in your opinion),yet you think he`s a myth anyway..

I'm yet to meet a single christian who behaves like a 'christian' and even if I was lucky enough to find two, if I locked them in a room together they would disagree with eachother.

Maybe you could become one and show us all the way,if your majesty would do us the favour?

In the mean time I`ll take Jesus and those I hold respect for over you if thats ok.

Other than the topic of belief I like you Garfee,but if you want proof of Gods existence and you don`t have a brain such as Eisteins you have to believe first, being able to humble yourself and submitting yourself before Him (tough I know when we like to think we know it all),then you will get your personal proof,then you will know you have been living in ignorance and good luck with dealing with all the attacks from those who think they know better and that your stupid and ignorant in knowing that He exists.

Some people who attack do so I think just to get their jollies off on trying to destroy someones faith (and really we are all our own worst enemies if that happens),but just like some salesmen who love to get their jollies off by talking someone out of their money and into buying something they know they don`t want,Its a thrill to them,its a thrill also to give a quick mocking/insult directed toward those with belief from an imaginary position of self worth and admiration in threads and get twenty odd stars for it,which only shows ignorance abounds to anyone with belief.

Maybe one day you will get the answers your really looking for,though that built up wall of ignorance and defense would have to be removed and I can`t see that happening any time soon,though forgive me if not, I`m only human dagnabit!

Originally posted by gps777

Originally posted by Garfee

Yes, but I am not so arrogant to assume I will ever know the origin of the universe or the beginnings of humanity.

Greater men than myself probably spent their lives as crazy hermits trying to figure it out. I'd rather ponder the issue a little but spend my life embraced by the love of my family and friends, enjoying nature and every other wonder available to me.

Interesting that you spend a lot of effort trying to spread your biased ignorant opinion about it,on a subject you believe to be all myth and that anybody who believes in God or Jesus is stupid delusional and ignorant.Instead of spending your life embraced by the love of your family and friends, enjoying nature and every other wonder available to you.

Yet when Aquestion posts a link to life starting from one woman backed by science,you can`t even bring yourself to answer a straight question.I guess thats because you have invested so much time and effort in quick one liners of mocking and insults toward anyone who believes in God.

You jumped into this thread (as you do so often) even defending the cardinal as though he is anyone of authority only because it suited your biased opinion(which is sad and laughable)..

This guy is a cardinal - aside from the pop he is as official as it gets.

You think people that believe in God are a/the problem,yet even Christians will say other Christians can be a problem or wrong...

It's not people that don't believe in god that are the problem, buddy.

You must then believe athiests are a special race above all others who do no wrong,would be fair to say.

Perhaps the people that wrote it knew that we would eventually get sick of being stupid and ignorant.

Yep anyone who walks away has seen the light out of stupidity and ignorance.


Your also an authority in your own right of what a Christian is (and a cardinal is an authority in your opinion),yet you think he`s a myth anyway..

I'm yet to meet a single christian who behaves like a 'christian' and even if I was lucky enough to find two, if I locked them in a room together they would disagree with eachother.

Maybe you could become one and show us all the way,if your majesty would do us the favour?

In the mean time I`ll take Jesus and those I hold respect for over you if thats ok.

Other than the topic of belief I like you Garfee,but if you want proof of Gods existence and you don`t have a brain such as Eisteins you have to believe first, being able to humble yourself and submitting yourself before Him (tough I know when we like to think we know it all),then you will get your personal proof,then you will know you have been living in ignorance and good luck with dealing with all the attacks from those who think they know better and that your stupid and ignorant in knowing that He exists.

Some people who attack do so I think just to get their jollies off on trying to destroy someones faith (and really we are all our own worst enemies if that happens),but just like some salesmen who love to get their jollies off by talking someone out of their money and into buying something they know they don`t want,Its a thrill to them,its a thrill also to give a quick mocking/insult directed toward those with belief from an imaginary position of self worth and admiration in threads and get twenty odd stars for it,which only shows ignorance abounds to anyone with belief.

Maybe one day you will get the answers your really looking for,though that built up wall of ignorance and defense would have to be removed and I can`t see that happening any time soon,though forgive me if not, I`m only human dagnabit!

What a nasty and pointless attempt at a personal attack, thinly disguised as clever observation with a little disclaimer at it's conclusion.

I'll have a good go at religion and the religious because they believe I am a filthy sinner who will enter hell, while they will be surrounded by ruby and diamon and pearl gates and be served canapes by winged angels.

Better luck with your next attept to humiliate me, champ.