There is NO One-Size-Fits-All religion.

reply to post by pthena

I just got through fleshing out what I was referring to on another thread. In regards to Consubstantiation and Epicurean cosmology: www.abovetopsecret.com...

also on comparing world-views and accepting authority:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by wildtimes
...
One of his main points is that every individual has a unique take on life, on their circumstances, and an emotionality that leads them (if at all) to 'religious fervor.' He discusses how some are "converted instantaneously", and others are "incubators" of things they've been exposed to (and subconsciously considering). Others still will never feel the zealous, passionate depth and strength of 'religious revelation' that some experience.
...

I liked reading the link although I didn't follow all of it. Your comment above matches my opinion. I think this is the Achilles heel of the born-again style Christianity, because the conversion experience and/or the filling of the Holy Spirit may not be possible for everyone due to personality differences, life experience, etc.

I've noticed that many Orthodox converts from Protestantism seem to have a dismissive attitude towards the conversion experience and filling of the Holy Spirit which makes me suspect they were not able to experience these things and simply decided they don't exist. So they focus themselves into a more intellectual or ritualistic type of practice.

I think it's interesting that these types of experiences happen in other religions and also to atheists.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

But that doesn't mean that a hindu cant claim to have a personal relationship with Krishna.

I never said they couldn't claim that.

reply to post by pthena


Thanks for those links! Look forward to perusing them when I have a chance...

hadn't seen that thread either. Looks interesting!

reply to post by Iason321


Bro, if you know so much, why don't you spill it as to how?? You've been asked several times, but refuse to provide your 'credentials' -- whether experiential or via other routes.

Your age would be nice, too...since we know your 'transformation' came at age 20sh. Beyond that, you've provided no reason whatsoever to take you seriously. On the contrary, you keep repeating yourself while dissing other members, slandering them, pointing fingers, and accusing others of insanity.

Discussion -- not to mention persuasion and approachability -- FAIL

Oh, and your manner? Vicious. Really, really nasty and superior. Consistently. Not very Christ-like AT all.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Jesus said to do it to remember Him. Every time I do it I remember what He did for me. His body was broken for my healing and He shed His blood for my sins to be forgiven. (Isaiah 52:7- 53)

Simple as that.

No, it is not that simple, seeing how it never says that in Isaiah, and so then it becomes more complex, involving listening to lessons from your cult leader.

"But he was pierced for our rebellion, crushed for our sins. He was beaten so we could be whole. He was whipped so we could be healed." ~ Isaiah 53:5

edit on 11-4-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)

You were making out that what Jesus was saying at the Last Supper had a corresponding verse in Isaiah which interprets what Jesus said to mean that Jesus' blood somehow causes forgiveness of our sins.
I don't see that being spelled out, and just the enigmatic story of the anonymous Suffering Servant.

reply to post by wildtimes

I bought the Kindle version of Elaine Pagels' new book on Revelation, last Monday. She mentions this book you are recommending.

At the beginning of the twentieth century, the psychologist William James recounted many accounts of spiritual breakthrough, including his own recovery from depression, in his book The Varieties of Religious Experience. James relates some experiences that are strikingly similar to those found in other ancient “books of revelation” not included in the New Testament.

Pagels, Elaine, Revelations: Visions, Prophecy, and Politics in the Book of Revelation

Maybe this is just me, but I think it's sad that some Christians apparently find it necessary to protect everybody from discussing some 100 year old lectures about religion and psychology. Anything that doesn't fit their framework must be immediately attacked as heresy. It's ridiculous because it sounds like they've made up their own interpretation of Christianity which would probably be rejected by most denominations. Yet they feel 100% certain that everyone else is wrong except for them.

BTW: I think it's probably inevitable that each person interprets Christianity in a personal way, but how can that person turn around and force that interpretation on others?

reply to post by cloudyday

I think it's sad that some Christians apparently find it necessary to protect everybody from discussing some 100 year old lectures about religion and psychology. Anything that doesn't fit their framework must be immediately attacked as heresy. It's ridiculous because it sounds like they've made up their own interpretation of Christianity which would probably be rejected by most denominations. Yet they feel 100% certain that everyone else is wrong except for them.

Yep.
Sad AND ridiculous. It isn't 'heresy'...it's 'inquiry', and very important for anyone to do before they decide on any 'stance' at all.

Originally posted by jmdewey60

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Jesus said to do it to remember Him. Every time I do it I remember what He did for me. His body was broken for my healing and He shed His blood for my sins to be forgiven. (Isaiah 52:7- 53)

Simple as that.

No, it is not that simple, seeing how it never says that in Isaiah, and so then it becomes more complex, involving listening to lessons from your cult leader.

"But he was pierced for our rebellion, crushed for our sins. He was beaten so we could be whole. He was whipped so we could be healed." ~ Isaiah 53:5

edit on 11-4-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)

You were making out that what Jesus was saying at the Last Supper had a corresponding verse in Isaiah which interprets what Jesus said to mean that Jesus' blood somehow causes forgiveness of our sins.
I don't see that being spelled out, and just the enigmatic story of the anonymous Suffering Servant.

No I didn't. I said "Whenever I do it, I remember..". The "suffering Servant" is Jesus. lol When the Eunich was reading about Jesus he was reading Isaiah 53. And in Matthew Jesus said His blood would be shed "for the forgiveness of sins".

reply to post by NOTurTypical


I believe he said how we are forgiven...

his blood was Gods sacrifice... To show us how we are forgiven...

I don't see how you can associate his "death" with forgiveness of sin

reply to post by jmdewey60


Would that be the same Pagels who is a Gnostic and worked with Dan Brown?

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

I believe he said how we are forgiven...

his blood was Gods sacrifice... To show us how we are forgiven...

I don't see how you can associate his "death" with forgiveness of sin

I agree, I don't think you can see how. You refuse to take His word for it, He's the ultimate Truth.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

I believe he said how we are forgiven...

his blood was Gods sacrifice... To show us how we are forgiven...

I don't see how you can associate his "death" with forgiveness of sin

I agree, I don't think you can see how. You refuse to take His word for it, He's the ultimate Truth.

You're right i can't see it from your perspective....

But its quite easy to read for myself...

12And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.

13And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.

14For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

15But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by jmdewey60

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Jesus said to do it to remember Him. Every time I do it I remember what He did for me. His body was broken for my healing and He shed His blood for my sins to be forgiven. (Isaiah 52:7- 53)

Simple as that.

No, it is not that simple, seeing how it never says that in Isaiah, and so then it becomes more complex, involving listening to lessons from your cult leader.

"But he was pierced for our rebellion, crushed for our sins. He was beaten so we could be whole. He was whipped so we could be healed." ~ Isaiah 53:5

edit on 11-4-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)

You were making out that what Jesus was saying at the Last Supper had a corresponding verse in Isaiah which interprets what Jesus said to mean that Jesus' blood somehow causes forgiveness of our sins.
I don't see that being spelled out, and just the enigmatic story of the anonymous Suffering Servant.

No I didn't. I said "Whenever I do it, I remember..". The "suffering Servant" is Jesus. lol When the Eunich was reading about Jesus he was reading Isaiah 53. And in Matthew Jesus said His blood would be shed "for the forgiveness of sins".

You ought to read the link in the initial post by wildtimes. I'm assuming you didn't read it, because you don't seem to be talking about anything from that link. I'm sure you would find parts of it inspiring and it isn't very long. Just a suggestion.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

Would that be the same Pagels who is a Gnostic and worked with Dan Brown?

What if it is?? Is that a problem??

reply to post by wildtimes


Congratulations! You have discovered the ancient tradition of passing along knowledge , traits , and beliefs to one's young!

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Would that be the same Pagels who is a Gnostic and worked with Dan Brown?

What if it is?? Is that a problem??

Depends.

reply to post by cloudyday

You ought to read the link in the initial post by wildtimes. I'm assuming you didn't read it, because you don't seem to be talking about anything from that link. I'm sure you would find parts of it inspiring and it isn't very long. Just a suggestion.

That was probably good advice for me 3-4 years ago, been here a long time and I've been taught that people rarely look at others links and read/reflect/respond. I'm jaded to it now. It's just not the way everyone does things here, we just read the title and start firing from the hip.

I appreciate your concerns though.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Would that be the same Pagels who is a Gnostic and worked with Dan Brown?

What if it is?? Is that a problem??

Depends.

Those are diapers...

Wut... its true