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What Happened to the Planes? 911 and Logic

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posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 07:31 PM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by smyleegrl
 


OK, because of your nice response to my sarcasm, I did go read your OP, and I have successfully avoided 9/11 threads for quite a long time now! I put some thorough research and lengthy posts into debunking the notion that fires brought down the towers, and I used the NTSB reports and existing Fire Safety code, and known properties of steel and other things in that research, but it fell on deaf ears and became an exercise in futility.

Still, the question you ask, in my opinion, is one of the least logical and most difficult to answer. There is no way to debate it logically. We can debate the tower collapses logically based on a lot of known science and research and construction techniques, but we can only speculate about what might have happened to those planes, and those people.

It isn't far-fetched to say a faction that would shoot a missile at its own headquarters could also murder a handful of people on a plane and dispose of the plane. Of course, it sounds rather paranoid and crazy, so the topic is often avoided in favor of easier topics. I do not believe a plane hit the Pentagon, but I am certain 2 planes hit the towers.

I know people in Aviation, and in Military, and nobody has any logical explanation for why the Shanksville or Pentagon planes would not have already been shot down anyway. To me, there is no reason to think the Shanksville thing was faked. I think it was probably shot down and not just crashed, and I think the government would have been better off admitting to that, instead of looking so inept in their response. I think the circular hole in the Pentagon, with the workers walking right out of it, and little to no debris in the way is evidence of a missile, not a plane.

The few things I feel certain of regarding 9/11 are this:
1. Airliners hit the towers. I know eyewitnesses that saw this, and I believe them.
2. A missile hit the Pentagon.
3. The towers did not fall from fire alone. I don't know if it was squibbs, or structural cuts, or pre-loaded demolition, or if there was some miraculous explosive aboard the airliners, but I know it was not fire.
4. It was not 11 amateur hijacker/pilots with box cutters. No way the black boxes were destroyed but the passports and boxcutters survived. Just no way.

And, on another note, I know, with 100% certainty, that the TSB and DHS and Airport Scanners, and 4 oz. restrictions have done nothing whatsoever to protect us from any real threat. Sure, they deter the lone nutters and amateurs, but they don't even phase the equipped and educated enemies that we are supposed to be afraid of. Even my FBI buddies laugh and scoff at the notion that those restrictions are anything more than PR stunts. They are there to make the average citizen feel safer, just like the absurd color chart.
edit on 6-4-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)

edit on 6-4-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)

e c
I'm glad you went back and read the post...thanks for that. I'll be combing through your profile later to read your threads that you researched, so thanks for the tip.

If a missle hit the pentagon instead of the plane, where did the plane go? Was it later flown out to sea and crashed into the ocean? Are the passengers on some deserted island as we speak? Why go to such lengths if the ultimate goal is to create a false flag event? Its these questions I think get ignored.

Thank you for your reply (even your sarcastic one,
) and have a great Friday!




posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 07:34 PM
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Need a spare aircraft? Need spare parts?

Why simply and conveniently pop down to your local US military aircraft supermarket!






posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 07:35 PM
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reply to post by smyleegrl
 



If a missle hit the pentagon instead of the plane, where did the plane go? Was it later flown out to sea and crashed into the ocean? Are the passengers on some deserted island as we speak? Why go to such lengths if the ultimate goal is to create a false flag event? Its these questions I think get ignored.


It can only be conjecture and speculation, but if I were the one organizing that stunt, I would have a remote airfield prepared in advance, I would alert the passengers we had to make a brief emergency stop, I would have them exit the plane, kill them, and either incinerate the bodies or pile them into a massively deep grave on a remote installation, and then I would dismantle the plane, drop a few key pieces of evidence from a large crane and later add them to the evidence, and smelt the rest so it could never be discovered........ but that's just me.

ETA:
You'll have to do a search, or look WAY back in my posting history to find my technical posts. Maybe search "Kerosene" "NTSB" and "GetReadyAlready" or some similar combination.
edit on 6-4-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)


Here is one of my more recent recounts, in that thread, I refer back and quote some older posts of mine. Maybe read through and follow the links back to older posts.
edit on 6-4-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 07:35 PM
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Originally posted by fixer1967
I have question for your question. Why "save" the people unless they had plans for them. What kind of sick plans could they have had for the people to make them worth saving? Maybe some government mad scientist experiments? Sending them off world?
If they did not have any plans for them they would not have "saved" them in the first place and just got rid of them in the crash. There is no point in saving them just to take some where else and kill. If they did not die in the crash they may have been better off if they had.


That's my entire point. These passengers were real people with real lives. If their planes didn't crash, then what happened to the people?

In all the threads of read that claim a missile hit the Pentagon, I never see that question addressed. Instead, the arguments focus on the possibility/impossibility of the plane hitting the Pentagon. I don't mean to take anything away from those arguements, because I'm not qualified to do so. But if a missle hit the pentagon, then what happened to the plane?



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 07:41 PM
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reply to post by smyleegrl
 


I was reading something just toady about the planes which said that there were only around 20 passengers on each of the planes that allegedly took off on 9/11... I have no idea if that is true, perhaps someone can correct that?

if it is true then I find that kind of odd!

Why would they not just use the planes? hmmmm Well maybe they didn't hold the power to do what they wanted to do? Maybe they didn't want to risk the possibility of someone overpowering the highjackers? After all they tried to bring down the towers before and failed. So maybe this time they were not taking any chances?

I'm not saying I believe any of that, but possibilities?



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 07:45 PM
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There is a possibility that the aircraft was landed at a remote place. Passengers disembarked. Aircraft then torched (To make it unrecognisable) then smashed up with a salvage tool. All this could have been done by one person.......no team needed. As for the passengers? Mmmm? guess we'll never know. Keeping secrets drives people / Governments to extreme things hey?



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 07:47 PM
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I've never been much to question what happened, at least in NYC, on 9/11/2001. After all, I watched the second plane fly into the WTC. However, it really has started the gears in m mind turning after seeing the wreckage from today's crash and comparing that to what I've seen from the pentagon photos. I don't know, just like the Kennedy assassination, we, the people, will never fully know the truth.



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 07:51 PM
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reply to post by smyleegrl
 


Oh also didn't some of the alleged highjackers turn up alive afterwards? Again I'm not sure it is true, but it's what I've read and seen in documentaries...

What did they do with the planes? Well they could of done anything they wanted to I suppose, if everyone thought they had hit the buildings what would it matter what actually happened to them? As someone else said, if they could kill people in the buildings it's no logical leap to think they could kill the people in the planes at some other location, as far as we were concerned they were dead anyway.



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 07:51 PM
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It is obvious that an airliner did not hit the Pentagon. The lack of debris, human remains and absent impact signature(s) attest to this. Of course, this can be debated; however, for the sake of your topic, let us move forward and speculate about what could possibly have happened to that airliner if it, indeed, did not impact the Pentagon.

I will begin from the simplest to the most complex explanations. Here goes:

1. Airliner lands at an undisclosed/secret location. Crew and passengers executed. Airliner scrapped.
2. Airliner lands at an undisclosed/secret location. Crew and passengers handed-over to secret laboratories for human testing.
3. Airliner lands at an undisclosed/secret location. Crew and passengers become the newest "citizens" of secret government underground cities initially created back in the 1950s and 1960s (google nuclear-powered underground drilling machines). Richard Sauder has done a lot of research into secret underground bases. It is a fact that they exist, and have existed since the 1950s. Who knows how extensive the network of underground bases and "cities" might be, and it is suspected that they are connected by superfast mag-lift "trains." This sounds outlandish, but is very possible, if the government were humane enough to offer them a new life underground versus execution.
4. Airliner lands at an undisclosed/secret location. Crew and passengers become the newest colonists, part of a secret space program that either uses exotic technology for space travel or some form of teleportation (google PROJECT PEGASUS).

All options are scary. Option three at least gives the victims the possibility of continued existence, and is perfect for that purpose because the underground bases/communities would be completely cut-off from the surface. However, the powers-that-be might think this too risky of a prospect, and that is why option one is most likely what happened.

Option four is outlandish, but still possible, especially considering the privatization of exotic technology. Beginning when the government confiscated and classified the remaining works of Nicholas Tesla in the mid-1940s (just prior to Roswell), powerful tech has been developed by the government. Some say this tech already allows us travel into the solar system and possibly to other stars ---already. It is a fact that our government had a secret space program with a separate list of astronauts. How far this secret program has gone (is going) we do not publicly know.

Again, the simplest explanation is most likely option one. However, options 2-3 illustrate ways to "use" victims without killing them in secret/never-to-be-discovered ways.



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 07:52 PM
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Also, "IF" an aircraft flew into the Pentagon.........where were all the seats? A newer 757 has around 200 seats.......surely, even if they "disintegrated" there would be heaps of parts from these seats strewn all over the place.

The whole thing is BS.



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 08:13 PM
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Just to satisfy my curiosity and yours.......................



And here is a great page...........and a load of info

www.serendipity.li...

Notice size of Aircraft (to scale) to wall. Mmmm? Notice altitude of Aircraft to get it in at that angle.......Mmmm? Bull Sh

Enjoy
edit on 6-4-2012 by CaptainBeno because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 08:13 PM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by smyleegrl
 



If a missle hit the pentagon instead of the plane, where did the plane go? Was it later flown out to sea and crashed into the ocean? Are the passengers on some deserted island as we speak? Why go to such lengths if the ultimate goal is to create a false flag event? Its these questions I think get ignored.


It can only be conjecture and speculation, but if I were the one organizing that stunt, I would have a remote airfield prepared in advance, I would alert the passengers we had to make a brief emergency stop, I would have them exit the plane, kill them, and either incinerate the bodies or pile them into a massively deep grave on a remote installation, and then I would dismantle the plane, drop a few key pieces of evidence from a large crane and later add them to the evidence, and smelt the rest so it could never be discovered........ but that's just me.

ETA:
You'll have to do a search, or look WAY back in my posting history to find my technical posts. Maybe search "Kerosene" "NTSB" and "GetReadyAlready" or some similar combination.
edit on 6-4-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)


Here is one of my more recent recounts, in that thread, I refer back and quote some older posts of mine. Maybe read through and follow the links back to older posts.
edit on 6-4-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)


Excellent post. I agree, it's all conjecture.
Thanks for link tips!



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 08:15 PM
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Originally posted by CaptainBeno
Just to satisfy my curiosity and yours.......................



And here is a great page...........and a load of info

www.serendipity.li...

Enjoy


IMO, your posts have been the most intriguing and enlightening I've read so far. Thank you for sharing your experiences with aircraft.

Now that is a picture that raises a lot of questions!



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 08:20 PM
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Originally posted by GhostLancer
It is obvious that an airliner did not hit the Pentagon. The lack of debris, human remains and absent impact signature(s) attest to this. Of course, this can be debated; however, for the sake of your topic, let us move forward and speculate about what could possibly have happened to that airliner if it, indeed, did not impact the Pentagon.

I will begin from the simplest to the most complex explanations. Here goes:

1. Airliner lands at an undisclosed/secret location. Crew and passengers executed. Airliner scrapped.
2. Airliner lands at an undisclosed/secret location. Crew and passengers handed-over to secret laboratories for human testing.
3. Airliner lands at an undisclosed/secret location. Crew and passengers become the newest "citizens" of secret government underground cities initially created back in the 1950s and 1960s (google nuclear-powered underground drilling machines). Richard Sauder has done a lot of research into secret underground bases. It is a fact that they exist, and have existed since the 1950s. Who knows how extensive the network of underground bases and "cities" might be, and it is suspected that they are connected by superfast mag-lift "trains." This sounds outlandish, but is very possible, if the government were humane enough to offer them a new life underground versus execution.
4. Airliner lands at an undisclosed/secret location. Crew and passengers become the newest colonists, part of a secret space program that either uses exotic technology for space travel or some form of teleportation (google PROJECT PEGASUS).

All options are scary. Option three at least gives the victims the possibility of continued existence, and is perfect for that purpose because the underground bases/communities would be completely cut-off from the surface. However, the powers-that-be might think this too risky of a prospect, and that is why option one is most likely what happened.

Option four is outlandish, but still possible, especially considering the privatization of exotic technology. Beginning when the government confiscated and classified the remaining works of Nicholas Tesla in the mid-1940s (just prior to Roswell), powerful tech has been developed by the government. Some say this tech already allows us travel into the solar system and possibly to other stars ---already. It is a fact that our government had a secret space program with a separate list of astronauts. How far this secret program has gone (is going) we do not publicly know.

Again, the simplest explanation is most likely option one. However, options 2-3 illustrate ways to "use" victims without killing them in secret/never-to-be-discovered ways.


Thank you for this post. Very well written!
I hope you are wrong. I don't want to believe any of these scenarios could be possible. How incredibly terrifying.

You've given me lots to consider.



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 08:21 PM
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Thank you, Smyleegrl, for taking a logical approach to this weird and confusing conspiracy that is 9/11.

Maybe I'm getting paranoid in my old age, but my first thought is, HOW do we know those planes and those people even existed? Everything we know about this is from television and the internet. Now, bear with me.....Is it possible that the entire thing is just staged theater? The crying family members, the supposed call from the Shanksville "hero" saying 'Let's roll!"...The whole ball of wax may have been one elaborate staged event. Perhaps those people were paid to say their loved ones were killed....Maybe the whole thing is made up.

Now, the people who lost their lives that were in buildings certainly weren't made up, but I have always wondered, as you are wondering now, where did those planes and people go?

On the other hand, the planes that hit the towers may have been under remote control, which is perhaps why no black box recording were ever released in their entirety. The pilots might have been saying "Mayday Mayday we have no control over the aircraft and are heading for a large building!" or whatever.

Maybe those real flights were under remote control and diverted up into the north Atlantic and blown up so nothing larger than a sheet of paper remains. Maybe they were, as others have said, flown to a secret location and those people were made to "disappear".

I don't believe a plane hit the Pentagon, either. Although a plane was seen, it was most likely a military jet, because it was maneuvering in a way that no passenger jet could accomplish, especially with a few poorly-trained religious zealots. The Shanksville plane was blown out of the sky.

All I know is, this was pre-planned, and this obscenity perpetrated upon the American people was the beginning of the end for this Republic. The evidence of pre-planning shows in the stock market activity. You can lie about a lot of things, but when it comes to money, that never lies.



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 08:37 PM
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It's amazing that even after 10.5 years there are still so many questions about 9-11.

The shills certainly keep busy arguing against even logical and thoughtful questions about the gaping holes in the OS. Gaping holes large enough to fly a 747 through... (sorry)

The families of the victims that are still asking for another investigation aren't shouting conspiracy, they are shouting for answers that make sense.

Personally, I thought the 9-11 NOPLANE / 9-11 in-plane-sight guys did a really good job with their videos. That's the theory that there actually were no planes on 9-11 and the eye witnesses were all paid actors and the explosions were set to mimic the outline of wings/fuselage.

I'm not saying I agree or disagree with the premise, I'm saying that the videos are very interesting and very well done in my opinion. Definitely thought provoking! Tons of good pics and footage.

They talk about the issue of where the people went if the airliner didn't actually hit the building.

Regardless, there are unanswered questions and at the end of the day the people that reject the OS are simply looking to get mental reconciliation of things that just don't add up to them.



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 08:44 PM
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Again, for your viewing pleasure........

911research.wtc7.net...

Rundown: Talks about the pros and cons of alleged 757 hitting the Pentagon.



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 08:55 PM
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I think everything happened as we saw it happen,
the only difference being I believe there was timed explosives or a remote detonator that they primed for the moment the towers were hit, while they were watching live. that would cause the chain reaction for the legitimate fire illusion.

as for the planes that hit in the field and the pentagon, they could've been purposefully low matienenced and easily disintegrated perhaps?

the way I see it, some shady black op organization would claim to be Al-Qaeda (false flag within a false flag attack) and work with them, giving them clearance to the point where they are able to plan this attack and succeed.

then the actual government comes in and acts naturally, enacting defense protocols as they would.
the training excersize on the same day, being a coincidence?



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 10:20 PM
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Theres a connection between Pentagon comptroller (the guy who lost the trillions)
Rabbi Dov Zackeim.....
His company owned some planes they were fitting with remote aircraft controls ...They had some aircraft fitted with remote controls at the time actually, some obsolete US fighter planes i think...or maybe the A4 skywarrior ?
The whole Ysraeli part needs definate investigation by fearless sleuths.



posted on Apr, 6 2012 @ 10:42 PM
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Hi,

I have a hard time making sense of everything, there are so many different theories concerning the WTC buildings that it can get confusing


One of the things i have a hard time believing are the high altitude cell phone calls. I'm not an expert or anything but if i go a little too far out of the city i can barely make a call, so i would imagine that it would be very difficult to make a call at those altitudes. From the conspiracy side of things, i have a hard time believing that what we saw were holograms or real-time animations on live television. There are a few videos out there that make a good case for this hologram theory i guess, but its hard to tell when videos are zoomed in and everything is pixelated.

I really think the key to all of this lies with the Pentagon and WTC7. Take the Pentagon, it gets hit by a plane and they cannot even produce anything better than that 2 frame video that was apparently shot in Morse code and uploaded in the lowest resolution known to mankind.

I'm glad websites like ATS are around though, when i talk about this with friends they automatically clam up. It's like the idea completely shatters their version of reality or something, they just cannot accept that a government could commit a false flag operation on their own people.

Anyways, i'll let the pros take the floor


Cheers~



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