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I know God exists for a fact now.

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posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 05:37 AM
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Originally posted by Lionhearte
You do realize who was saying that right?

Hint: a Jew.
Ah, so this isn't god's word?


Originally posted by Lionhearte
I'll tell you the truth, though you may not believe it - if, instead, God did NOT require a Sacrifice, and simply "forgave" people of all their Sins, you know what you would be saying right now? You would say: "God is Unjust, how can He forgive people of their Sins for NO REASON?" I guarantee you.
You couldn't be further from the truth.


Originally posted by Lionhearte
Again, God is the Judge. When a criminal goes on trial, and they are found guilty of their crimes, the penalty being death - what if the Judge were to say "never mind, this man gets to go free"? He would probably be fired.
God, being a Just and Fair Judge, REQUIRES that the ultimate penalty be dealt - Blood. Death.
This isn't what god does. What he does is punishes some innocent creature for the criminal's wrong doing. It would be like a murderer standing trial, but instead of punishing the murderer, the judge says that a puppy must be killed. How is that just? If we do the crime, WE should do the time. Not somebody else, or some other creature.


Originally posted by Lionhearte
That's a really horrible analogy. Not that it's in bad taste, but completely wrong. What separates us men from children? Certainly we know the difference between right and wrong, do we not? This is also why children are not accountable if they sin. They don't know the difference between good and evil.
Oh, like Adam and Eve before they ate the fruit? Look what happened. They were held accountable. Not only that, but now we all have to be punished because of what they did thousands of years ago. How is that just? Besides, you don't think children know the difference between right and wrong? Then why should they ever be disciplined? It was not a horrible analogy.


Originally posted by Lionhearte
Also, I would like to point out, you have a lot of questions for someone who has apparently been a Christian for 20 years.
I'm not a christian now. But yes, I have tons of questions.
edit on 1-4-2012 by Hydroman because: (no reason given)




posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 06:09 AM
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Originally posted by michael1983l
reply to post by windword
 


Wait one second windword, I have not said that I believe in the Bible or Christianity. That is not true, I think man has had his grubby mits on those and spoilt them. However believing in a God does not mean you have to believe everything that you are told about God. Make your own mind up and you can see the good in people who are good, wether they believe in the organised religions or not.


A stern non-believer having a nervous breakdown yet lands in a church instead of a shrink's office? Hmmm... Seems the non-believer had priorities in seeking a lifesaver. Religious priorities. Lol.

Non-believer, you've just made me one.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 07:39 AM
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reply to post by michael1983l
 


Interesting story but hardly "fact" of any God's existence. No I am not athiest



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 08:10 AM
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reply to post by Hydroman
 



You couldn't be further from the truth.


Socrates understood the paradox of having a just God and Him forgiving sins without penalty.

"It may be that the deity can forgive sins, but I do not see how."



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 08:47 AM
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reply to post by windword
 

But, I have a problem with the personification of god as being a guy who . . .

I hope you don't extend this out to where it makes you not personify God at all.
That would negate the very definition of what a god is.
God is a person, otherwise there is no use for a god, since you are only left with a non-god if you make Him not a person.
You might be worshiping natural forces or something, which is like the opposite of God.
Nature wants to chew you up into tiny bits and spit you out as mulch.
God is who we need to keep us whole.
edit on 1-4-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 08:53 AM
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Originally posted by boncho
reply to post by rwfresh


What are you so confused about? The guy had an experience and explained it fairly well. The source of the experience is what he is calling 'God'. Is there a more scientific word you'd prefer he use? The end result is exactly the same. Pick your word. Placebo? Is that scientific? What is the difference? What is your hang up with the word? Should he put a lab coat on and disassociate all emotion from his experience so that it can be properly evaluated? He had an emotional experience. Is your suggestion that he not be grateful to the source of the experience for the sake of scientific validation? Let it go.

 


So we are basing religious intervention on a feeling now? That's cool.


'We'? Sorry are you assuming you know what I'm talking about? haha cool.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:03 AM
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Originally posted by boncho

Originally posted by randomname

Originally posted by boncho
So it was physically impossible for you to achieve all these things without believing in God?


physically, maybe for the guy, but mentally he was in bad shape.

if you stitch a wound and it heals fine, as it otherwise wouldn't, are you going to claim after that stitches don't exist.

his wounds to his spirit, where grave, God healed them so he can function.



God healed or belief in God healed?


Belief is a word with a meaning. Let me help you out:

"An acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists."

Does belief in gas power a car? If i didn't believe in gas then i might not fill my tank and experience it's effectiveness.. but i would be wrong in assuming it's effectiveness is a result of my belief.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:19 AM
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Originally posted by DuecesxGeneral
reply to post by SisyphusRide
 


king james tounge?


I typed in the verse you posted and began to read a bit online...

it does not compute
maybe we can work on converting the quran to King James Version.(Holy Bible)

their religious leaders won't allow it though and a majority of their population are high on fire, and still quite isolated from the rest of the world.

Saudi Arabia in the background financing terror but they have not and will not help their people in Palestine. I believe if the Saudi's helped starting building play grounds and maybe a civilization for their people in Palestine on their side of the land divisions, it may lend a hand to peace. But the Saudi Pharaohs view their own people in Palestine like kafir (cattle)

the Saudi's send mini AK's and kid size bomb jackets


whats wrong with those people damn! it just seems they have no free will of their own in the least.


edit on 1-4-2012 by SisyphusRide because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:24 AM
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Originally posted by Hydroman

Originally posted by DuecesxGeneral
I don't have an explanation, because i did not create them. That is why i leave these questions, because they are way too far ahead me.
What if these things CAN be explained with natural laws and phsyics, where no god is necessary for explanation?
edit on 1-4-2012 by Hydroman because: (no reason given)


What if God is a bearded Ghost floating around in the sky with a robe?



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:33 AM
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Originally posted by rwfresh

Originally posted by Hydroman

Originally posted by DuecesxGeneral
I don't have an explanation, because i did not create them. That is why i leave these questions, because they are way too far ahead me.
What if these things CAN be explained with natural laws and phsyics, where no god is necessary for explanation?
edit on 1-4-2012 by Hydroman because: (no reason given)


What if God is a bearded Ghost floating around in the sky with a robe?


what if some people actually believe in fairies and ghosts?

when I became a man, I put away such childish notions of bogeyman's and flying spaghetti...

Hydroman is searching for a face for his bogeyman because he believes in ghosts.


edit on 1-4-2012 by SisyphusRide because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:34 AM
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Originally posted by Hydroman

Originally posted by DuecesxGeneral
what made these laws and nature. that is what i would question.
Why does it have to be an entity that made them? That is what I question.

You don't consider for one moment that maybe ancient men could not fathom how this all came about, and they made the same mistake as I mentioned earlier? "I can't explain it, so some god must have done this..."?

And from that, legends and stories developed to explain it, only to be embellished further as things were passed down through oral tradition before the invention of written language developed? And even after written language developed, there's still a language barrier with mistranslations, etc. I mean, it is proved that mistranslations occur today, so why wouldn't it be possible for it to happen back then?
edit on 1-4-2012 by Hydroman because: (no reason given)


You are a perfect example of the mistranslation and misunderstanding. You apply your own elementary ideas of what God is to the people that wrote the bible. You are convinced we are smarter now. I can assure you that the average person reading the bible is not as accurate with their understanding of God as the people that wrote the bible or actually lived the experiences written about. Right? does that make sense?

You think science knows more about the secrets of the universe because the scientific authority tells you so. Not because you yourself are at the LHC colliding particles and experiencing the proofs that might be revealed. You are in the pews of the church of science believing a fairy tale that you know more.

Imagine that the bible, the vedas, the koran are science magazines, or scientific texts. Get over the different nomenclature used in these books. Read with an open mind and acknowledge the depth and insight in them. Or don't.. stay ignorant. Believe what you are told.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:48 AM
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Originally posted by SisyphusRide

Originally posted by rwfresh

Originally posted by Hydroman

Originally posted by DuecesxGeneral
I don't have an explanation, because i did not create them. That is why i leave these questions, because they are way too far ahead me.
What if these things CAN be explained with natural laws and phsyics, where no god is necessary for explanation?
edit on 1-4-2012 by Hydroman because: (no reason given)


What if God is a bearded Ghost floating around in the sky with a robe?


what if some people actually believe in fairies and ghosts?

when I became a man, I put away such childish notions of bogeyman's and flying spaghetti...



What if?? What if?? Maybe some people do! But show me them. Atheists on ATS keep telling me about them but i have yet to come across any on here. Often i see the opposite. Very open minded, well spoken self proclaimed Christians arguing with extremely ignorant Atheists insisting the Christian believes in a bearded Ghost.

It's an atheist straw man. "Christians believe in a spaghetti monster! Look how stupid they are! Therefore 'God' doesn't exist!" It devolves there because of anger and resentment. It's so obvious and apparent.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 09:52 AM
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God (the Creator of the Universe) definitely exists. I can go on and on with examples that defy logic and can only be explained through a loving God who puts rare and extraordinary things in my life to pave the way.

A prior co-worker has no belief system whatsoever. She lost her children to alcoholism when they were young. She had 4 kids by 2 fathers and both fathers raised the kids without her as she continued to choose alcohol over being a mother. Her life spiraled out of control beyond a point of recognition. She lost a great job of 7 years due to alcohol, has been married over 5 times and has zero quality of life. When we talk, there is a void in her soul that is so deep and scary, I had to cut off all communications with her. It's like meeting someone without a soul. I can't quite explain it.

Her sister on the other hand, started a similar life, gave up her kids to the fathers (2 like her sister) and choose alcohol over and over again. Her 4th husband died in their home of an overdose. That is when she choose to start looking for God. She started to go to church, although she wasn't "feeling" it. She continued, met a widower pastor who she married and moved to northern California. She got in touch with her (now grown) children and has a strong relationship with them. She is happy, has needs from a financial standpoint are met and she is the polar opposite of her sister.


edit on 1-4-2012 by curiouswa because: she married the pastor



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 10:06 AM
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The Tao that can be named is not the Eternal Tao.
Nature is god, and god is another name for nature, the nature of everything. Not a he or a she, both and neither, everything and nothing.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 10:10 AM
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Originally posted by OmegaSynthesis
The Tao that can be named is not the Eternal Tao.
Nature is god, and god is another name for nature, the nature of everything. Not a he or a she, both and neither, everything and nothing.


The Tao that cannot be named is often named the "Tao that cannot be named"



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 10:21 AM
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reply to post by rwfresh
 


Touche!



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 10:36 AM
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reply to post by rwfresh
 


they gotta break the chains!

sometimes I feel it's a necessity though, they awaken more Christian probably?

thanks atheist of ats... though I have believed in God always with blind faith since I was a kid.


atheist's please come down off your throne...


edit on 1-4-2012 by SisyphusRide because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 11:58 AM
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Nice story OP, I'm glad everything worked out for you.

But why stop at Christianity? Why don't you further explore your own dogmas. Belief systems are made to be destroyed and rebuilt to suit your needs. Why subscribe to the dogmas of others when you can create an entirely new dogma of your own? You can't take hearsay as fact your whole life, that would be dangerous and willfully ignorant, you need to discover conclusions on your own, separate from the indoctrination of prevailing beliefs at the time.

There's something that worries me about born-again christians. It's worrisome that some can blame their entire sinful life on a devil, but not themselves. It's worrisome that some can pull themselves out of the deepest pits of darkness, but somehow Jesus get's the credit. How much do you have to hate yourself to believe that you had nothing to do with the course of your own life? How disgusted do you have to be with your own life to completely distance yourself from it? You should be proud of yourself. Where you're at in life is your own doing, no matter what you use for inspiration.

The last Christian died on the cross; the rest are people incapable of creating their own values.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 12:03 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by windword
 

But, I have a problem with the personification of god as being a guy who . . .

I hope you don't extend this out to where it makes you not personify God at all.
That would negate the very definition of what a god is.
God is a person, otherwise there is no use for a god, since you are only left with a non-god if you make Him not a person.
You might be worshiping natural forces or something, which is like the opposite of God.
Nature wants to chew you up into tiny bits and spit you out as mulch.
God is who we need to keep us whole.
edit on 1-4-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)


I do not personify god at all. Nobody owns the "very definition of what god is." The bible doesn't define god for me, in fact, GOD is nowhere to be found, in the bible, IMHO. I reject the biblical creator, and believe him to be a fraud.

The bible is no more unique in its teaching of mythology than any other religion of antiquity. If I am to take this jealous god of Adam and Eve and of Moses literally, then I should also find Thor, Zeus, Osirus, Krishna, Baal, etc. also were true gods and existed as a rivals of Jehovah. They still are not gods, in my opinion, but superior to us evolutionary.

My god doesn't have a body of flesh and blood, my god doesn't have emotions. My god is not a personal god, but is the fabric of the universe. I don't worship any god, I am god, part of god, as are we all. I'm just here, surfing the Zavooya, for the ride.

Nature will eventually "chew me up and spit me out." But isn't it marvelous the way we fight her. Hey, Dick Cheney got a new heart. Never the less, his death is inevitable.



posted on Apr, 1 2012 @ 12:10 PM
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Originally posted by curiouswa
God (the Creator of the Universe) definitely exists.


Yes, he exists in the heads of many people. As a matter of fact, I can see him right now, all I need to do is imagine him, and there he is, walking around. I would talk to him if I didn't tire of his presence.

God didn't save your friend, she was inspired to become good. Her version of good just happens to be a christian.



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